Logging P2 in Police Helicopter

[Garfs]

Hi All

I was just wondering, in a Police Helicopter here in the UK, lets say the EC135for example:-

Providing the Captain has an instructor rating, and IF the police observer (in the left seat) has either a PPL(H) or CPL(H), can this time be logged as P2, or PUT even?

Thanks in advance

[Helinut]

The short answer to your question is, I believe, no.

[Floppy Link]

99.9% of the time the dual controls are not fitted, and when they are, it's 'cos there's some training going on with two pilots up front...
Ours has P2 instruments removed to make way for telly screen and other kit.
So...no controls, no instruments, no logging the time :(

[Letsby Avenue]

You'll be logging time sat on the bog on the way to Florida next :}

[Garfs]

99.9% of the time the dual controls are not fitted, and when they are, it's 'cos there's some training going on with two pilots up front...
Ours has P2 instruments removed to make way for telly screen and other kit.
So...no controls, no instruments, no logging the time :(

If Hhowever on the offchance there are controls fitted, would you be able to log the time then?

Thanks

[Whirlygig]

No.

If you do not have the rating in the police aircraft then you cannot log time as Pu/t since a type rating has to be part of a recognised course.

If you do have the type rating, you can't log co-pilot time as there is no co-pilot and, presumably you would have to be part of the police pilot team for insurance purposes etc etc.

I'm sure the Police operating manual would spell it out.

Cheers

Whirls

[jayteeto]

Whirlygig is right. If the sortie was operated as a police flight then you are an observer not a trainee 135 pilot (remember that observers are passengers, not crew). The PAOM pretty much covers things and the 135 is a single pilot operation. Now if you could get the UEO to get the duals fitted and authorised as a training flight for you, then you might get away with it.

[thecontroller]

i think the heli has to be operated via a TRTO. (type rating training organisation)?

[Thomas coupling]

IF you are as you say you are - a PPL or CPL then you should know that "P2" doesn't exist:ugh:
Secondly, you have to physically fly the a/c using the invisible dual controls that have been inadvertently left in place after training and manouevre the a/c around the sky. Could you confidently fly the 135 around the sky in between police jobs with no previous experience on type? Or are you going to become one of those people who 'technically' log everything possible and amass a 1000+ hrs in your gilt edged leather bound log book and brag to everyone about your "experience" as a mature aviator...only to find that you don't really have any quality time at all??????

Concentrate on your role as a police observer - it's a busy and challenging environment as it is without messing about in another area outside your remit.

Whatever next.............................

[Garfs]

IF you are as you say you are - a PPL or CPL then you should know that "P2" doesn't exist:ugh:
Secondly, you have to physically fly the a/c using the invisible dual controls that have been inadvertently left in place after training and manouevre the a/c around the sky. Could you confidently fly the 135 around the sky in between police jobs with no previous experience on type? Or are you going to become one of those people who 'technically' log everything possible and amass a 1000+ hrs in your gilt edged leather bound log book and brag to everyone about your "experience" as a mature aviator...only to find that you don't really have any quality time at all??????
Concentrate on your role as a police observer - it's a busy and challenging environment as it is without messing about in another area outside your remit.
Whatever next.............................

Hi TC

This was just posted as a passing thought as it came up in discussion one day between me and some mates.

I am not a Police observer either and I agree with what you say, i.e. people shouldnt just try to log everything possible.

Thanks for the views
P/S Plus I never said I was PPL or CPL :)

Garfs

[lartsa]

surely the easiest way is to log p2 when you are flying p2 [and contributing legally ]
not when you are just sitting there doing something else