Drunks and corporate flying

[TheFlyingSquirrel]

You have a VIP or corporate flight booked. Maybe the guy is important or a big spender. He turns up by himself or with a tribe and they're clearly intoxicated. You know they're going to be a handful and refuse to fly with them. Would you be fearful of your position or would your employer respect your decision, like in the FW world ? I'm interested to see what the concensus is here. Thanks.

[mrwellington]

In a perfect world with management of the highest moral fibre, they will of course back you up 100%. Profit means nothing, only their employee’s safety at all costs.

In real life…….: You would be sacked in a heartbeat if your without union protection. Find something wrong with the machine quickly (MEL would be a good place to start).

[Agaricus bisporus]

Just use the words "flight safety hazard" in the FSR you send personally to the CAA. How can even two pilots control a bunch of drunks when he lands at the destination? check the book, "it is an offence to be drunk on board an aircraft." End of.

If the company tried to sack you for that you shouldn't be working for them in the first place.

And don't imagine this doesn't happen in FW too. You'd be amazed at how hard it is to persuade ground staff to stop obvious drunks getting onto your airliner. They just want to get rid of them, and the aeroplane is the easiest place that they will go to voluntarily.

[Helinut]

Pax who have been drinking is a fact of life really, in the UK ad-hoc game anyway. Mr W paints a very black picture - like most things it is not quite as clear cut as that, in my experience anyway.

How much alcohol do they have to consume before they are really a problem? Not an easy one to judge sometimes. I am always VERY wary, if they bring alcohol onto the aircraft.

How does the excess alcohol manifest itself? Boisterous and noisy: just separate your headest from theirs on the intercom. If it gets to leaving their seats then that is too far. Are they far enough gone to be stupid enough to fiddle with doors? You can usually get one of them to be sensible and control the others. The problem is that you need to make your decision before the flight starts.

The one who paid for the flight thinks he owns the helicopter and the pilot, of course. You may need to fend him off from instructions to land at unplanned sites, for example. This is a CRM issue never discussed one training (to my knowledge) but it would be interesting to raise it. (Never met a "her" yet who was paying and drunk).

Dealing with THIS flight is the problem. In my experience, most operators are prepared to ban people from future flights, if the pilot raises the drunken behaviour after the flight has been completed. Most of the operators I have worked for would decline to take their business next time or warn them off from a repeat of the behaviour. There are a number of notorious "C" list celebs who find it very difficult to get anyone to fly them, as a result of past behaviour, mentioning no names of course.

However, I have never refused to take a set of pax yet. I have wanted to on a couple of occasions, but I do believe that if I had tried I might well have had pressure applied to "take them this time". The direct MOR to the CAA route, or calling for police assistance would be an option, but it could have repercussions on you. AB's view is a bit black and white, but in the end he is right that if the operator would not back you, you shouldn't work for them anyway........

[mrwellington]

HN…..As you stated, you would probably be pressured into taking the flight. When alcohol and corporate people mix, common sense is not an issue, since it’s equal to the amounts consumed by the paying customer. Operators try to have a hardcore attitude, but to paraphrase the yanks, money talks, bs walks. You, as an employee, are at the bottom of the feeding list, and therefore expendable. Not saying they don’t need your services, but at any given situation common sense will only kick in later rather than sooner. Corporate people didn’t attain their position by being nice people, so proper attitude isn’t the first thing that springs to mind in their dealings with proletarian scum like us, when it doesn’t suit their needs.
Hollywood people are much more fun. Just look at Mr. Costner :}