Pilots Sunglasses

[fullforward]

Is there any source were we could see some comparison tests etc on this subject? I would like to see scientific, unbiased data.

Cheers

[Bad medicine]

Sunglasses are a topic dear to the heart of aviators. There are a number of factors which determine the suitability or otherwise of sunglasses for use in the aviation role.

Narrow frames that carry large lenses are the most desirable from a field of view standpoint. The most critical problem with frames arises from the presence of wide sidearms which can significantly impair the peripheral visual field.

Lenses should not be too dark, and should transmit at least 15% of incident light. The tint used should be "neutral density"
(N.D.), that is, a greyish tint that does not distort colour perception. Much has been written about the perceived benefits of various coloured lenses, especially in regard to contrast and perceived brightness. Coloured lenses have been shown to reduce the colour information received, and to have a detrimental effect on both perception and reaction time.

Lenses of polycarbonate material are preferred because of their impact-resistance and ability to absorb ultra-violet and infra-red rays. However, these lenses can scratch easily. Harder materials may be suitable, however these may be more prone to shattering in an impact.

Different jurisdictions and countries have standards to which sunglasses are manufactured. Sunglasses should be chosen which conform to the appropriate standard. For example, the current Australian Standard ensures that sunglasses meet acceptable standards for lens quality, frame strength and lens retention and also ensures that sunglasses provide adequate protection from solar radiation.

Polarising sunglasses should not be used when flying. The polarising filter interacts with the cockpit transparency to produce a distorted and degraded visual image. This effect can also be seen with laminated car windscreens. Better keep the polarised lenses for fishing.

Pilots who wear prescription spectacles can choose from a number of options for glare protection. Prescription sunglasses with N.D.15 lenses can be obtained, or N.D.15 clip-on or flip-up sunglasses may be worn over prescription spectacles.

Back to the original issue of photochromatic lenses. Photochromatic lenses have several disadvantages that render them unsuitable for use by pilots.

Firstly, their transition times are relatively slow. Photochromatic lenses take about five minutes to increase their density to the level of sunglasses, but more importantly, the bleaching time from maximum to minimum density can be as long as 30 minutes. Although there is a rapid lightening of the lens in the first five minutes, this may be too long when there is a sudden variation in light during a descent into or under cloud, or because of a rapid change in cloud cover.

Their second disadvantage is that, even when fully bleached, photochromic lenses still absorb slightly more light than untinted lenses. Since vision is critically dependent on ambient light levels, even this small decrease of light reaching the eye through photochromatic lenses is undesirable, especially at night or in low light levels. The inherent degradation of these lenses with time causes them to progressively become darker, as they become unable to reach the fully bleached state. This effectively prohibits their use in flying or controlling air traffic.

I hope that "sheds some light" on the subject. Not much scientific evidence unfortunately, but the principles are pretty well established.


Cheers,

BM

[cortilla]

personally i swear by oakley minutes. i know not very scientific, but just shedding my two pence worth. Reduces the glare to an absolute minimum, yet still let more than enough light through. I find they are especially good when the sun is very low on the horizon. Use them for flying all the time even when there is minimal sunlight they help me see better and spot many features (when flying vfr) that i couldn't possibly see when i lift them up. (except when there is no sun). I even use them when driving. Oh and they look good too:O

[Onan the Clumsy]

Unscientific, but I love my Serrengettis. Comfortable, good depth perception and something to do with the blue end of the spectrum that I've forgotten.

Just one thing though, don't wear them and then stick your head out of the window of a 182 - at least, if you do...don't turn and look behind you :(

[BlueEagle]

Another good thing about Serengeti's is that they don't distort the colours of the various displays in a Glass cockpit aircraft.

[Backwater]

My latest pair of Serengettis have a titanium frame and are darker at the top than the bottom of the lens. Ideal in the Airbus. But I've been thru a few pairs as the frames are a bit on the light side - easily crushed (even with the most careful handling).

[PPRuNe Towers]

Used Serengetti's for ten years now. I'm in the enviable position of being able to try them all.

Strip flying, gliding and flying a glass cockpit with HUD - I stick with them after trialling all the others in the aircraft for extended periods.

That said - we all know many reading will be more interested in fashion:{ :{ :{

Regards
Rob

[Anchorman]

For fifteen years I have sworn by Oakleys, who have consistently had a clear lead in lens quality and UV A/B and IR cancellation scales. I lost my last pair sailing in an almightly wipe-out on a 14 foot skiff, and found my new pair at Sunglass Hut at Denver. They are by Maui, model MJ408-02, fully polarized with a polycarbonate frame that I can bend inside out and sit on in the cockpit without worry of damage. Whatsmore, they fit incredibly well under the earcups of the headset, being flexible, and the vision change from panel to the real world is painless due to the correct tinting (for my eyes anyhow). If it hadn't been for a delayed flight I would have stuck to Oakleys (which I still wear when sailing and skiing due to the close face fit)

Hope it helps

:ok:

[777AV8R]

I swear by my Serengetti glasses as well. Mine are expensive corrective lenses. The tinting is excellent and cuts the UV haze and are a real 'plus' when flying approaches down to minimums.

Polarised lenses do not work in Boeing airplanes as the windshields are polarised. The combination of polarised lenses and the windows creates 'black spots'.

[Silver Tongued Cavalier]

Serengetti's with the Drivers gradient lense are brilliant on EFIS aircraft.

I've got the Lassen frames which have a wrap around shape which prevents light entering in at the sides, unlike the flatter Aviator frames which were designed to be worn with helmets.

Got them off the internet for $115, best buy I've ever made!

[fullforward]

I stick on my big, blueish Revo. Very expensive, but for what I am concerned, the best lenses available. Lost the first pair, found the same in Verona for E170, it was a steal of USD 275 at Sunglass Hut in Miami, some months ago.
Anyway, a hard to find item.

[Stop Stop Stop]

If I may add my 'two penn'orth' to this now unscientific debate, I have to agree with several of the previous posters regarding Serengeti Eyeware.

As a previously 'died in the wool' Ray Ban user, I was given the opportunity to try a pair of Serengeti Lassen sunglasses belonging to a colleague, and I was hooked. I now own a pair of Serengeti Velocity Titanium glasses, with Drivers Gradient lenses. These are photochromic (go lighter and darker with less or more light), graduated so that the bottom portion is lighter...excellent for glancing at the instruments, wrap around so avoiding light leakage at the side (a problem with my Ray Ban Aviators) and coated with a filter which removes the nasty part of the light spectrum that causes damage.

Since using these glasses I have been really impressed with them and find myself squinting less at altitude above cloud and it is so much easier to read the EFIS screens. Colleagues of mine have tried them and bought some (I wish I had shares!).

They come with a beefy case which can withstand most of what hits it at the bottom of my bag. The downside is that they aren't cheap (RRP £170 ish) but try them out in a High Street chain store like Sunglass Hut and then buy them online for big savings (particularly from the States). I bought mine from E Bay. Ultimately, what price do you put on your eyesight? These are good enough to be NASA's official sunglasses of choice, for astronauts.

Have a look:

http://www.serengeti-eyewear.com/drivers_gradient/drivers_gradient_1.htm

[gingernut]

Fullforward, didn't I read somewhere that choice of suglasses, is like choice of dog food.....quality isn't actually related to price.

I'm no expert, but I've got good vision and a fat dog.

Is their any science behind the choice of sunspecs?

[newflyer]

Stop Stop Stop - thanks for the advice will ditch Ray-Ban and have just ordered a new pair of Serengeti Lassens! Will post my verdict in a couple of days. At least there is always plenty of sunshine here in the "sunshine" state!

Update - the Serengeti's work very well in the aircraft, all instruments remain very clear and the harmful rays appear to be blocked out nicely. Out of the 'office' the tint does not seem dark enough for the Florida sunshine. (This may be due to being used to much darker Oakleys - which are not a lot of use in the aircraft!) The build quility is excellent and the storage case is very smart and offers a great deal of protection. I would definitely recomment the Seregeti's for flying.

[AlphaCharlie]

Lots of people have been posting on this and many other sunglasses discussions that Serengetis are an excellent brand for the cockpit. However, I am struggling to find a shop in the UK that stocks them. Like suggested, I shall probably buy them over the net from the states to save a few pounds but would prefer to try on a few pairs before shelling out for a pair.

Does anyone know of anywhere that stocks them on the UK high street?

[sparks-flying]

Sunglass hut found at most UK airports stock Sereneti glasses.

Hope you locate some

SF

[AlphaCharlie]

Really? I was in a Sunglasses Hut the other day and was told that the UK stores no longer stocked them. You know of anywhere else? Guessing a trip to Central London is on the cards to find somewhere.

[sparks-flying]

I definately saw a selection of Serengeti sunglasses in Sunglass hut in Glasgow Airport no more than 10 days ago, but not anywhere else!
SF

[CosmosSchwartz]

Private Pilot magazine from Sep 2003 did an independant study to find the best sunglasses based on various tests showing prismatic power, refractive power, definition etc. Oakleys came out well in front, Serengeti were 7th.

I can't remember the web link but I do have a copy of the .pdf file if anyone can make sense of it. It's light reading for an optician but mostly gibberish to me;)

[soggyboxers]

The supposedly bulletproof lenses on my Oakleys broke twice (once just from being hit by my car door when I closed it. I changed to Serengetis in February and find them the best sunglasses I've tried in 40 years. I bought them in Sunglass Hut and then wore them for extended periods every day when I was ferrying a helicopter from Europe to Nigeria. I found them very comfortable and can thoroughly recommend them. I also had a pair of Vuarnet's (bought in France) for many years and found them very good.

[Farrell]

Serengeti are the BUSINESS! bought oakley a-wires before i came out to florida for ppl..........someone loaned me their Serengetis for a flight and i was straight down to the mall!

120 dollars! - very restful on the eye, colour true and traffic is easier to spot!

[Gillespie]

Hello,

I'm looking to buy myself a new of sunglasses for the cockpit. It's a great coincidence that this topic is current. So far I've been looking at the Classic Aviators from Ray-Ban. Someone earlier has already advised against Ray-ban, why is this so?

I've looked at Serengeti's and they look great, but at the moment I can only really afford £100 tops.

[Kerosene Kraut]

Why not try those cheaper USAF-Sunglasses if you don't mind looking a bit topgunish?

http://www.armynavysales.com/Merchant2/merchant.mv?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=01&Product_Code=CA162&Category_Code=SUN

just $ 40

-bayonet temples (will fit under heavy headsets)
-grey lenses (for true colours)
-heavy duty metal frame (but slightly heavy to wear)

found them in the UK too:

http://www.flightstore.co.uk/search.by_supplier.html/use.id.6.item_id.162/

[Hairyplane]

I bought mine at The London Airshow last year. I think I paid seventy pounds for them.

HP

[Piltdown Man]

Serengetti Drivers were the best glasses I've ever used. The gradient lens allowed a takeoff into sun and then once into a positive climb go staight onto the clocks (well EFIS). Unfortunately, I left them on the plane one day and nows there's a Ginger with a nice pair of...

Where can you get Serengetti Drivers at a resaonable price?

[Carrier]

This issue was very fully explored under the thread “Sunglasses” originated by vaqueroaero on 28 Nov 2002 in the Non-Airlines Forums - Rotorheads forum. To return to the original request, I presume Fullforward has long since bought some sunglasses but for anyone else interested Hidalgos, Inc of Wimberly, TX has some useful technical data on their website. This gives the pros and cons of various lenses, how to select sunglasses for various uses, and a Lens Light Transmission Chart. They state:
“For the technical folks, we use a Hoya ULT-2000 Universal Light Transmittance meter to make our measurements. This instrument measures visible light levels in the 400-760nm wavelength range, the ultraviolet light in the 310-400nm range, and the infrared light in the 760-1200nm range. The wavelength of the light is measured in nanometers (nm).”

Having mentioned Hidalgos, Inc, does anyone know their current status? I recall that a few years ago the owner was considering retiring because of ill health. However, the website seems to have been updated since then so perhaps they are still as active as ever. I have since early March emailed them four times to ask for a paper catalogue. I have not received any response or a catalogue. It will be appreciated if someone would confirm whether or not they are still in business. I hope they are. Thanks.

[Spektor]

Fellows,

Lets settle this once and for all, shall we? The only shades that combine both the great lens technology, AND don't make you look like a 1980s LAPD motorcycle cop are OAKLEYS. If you can't look cool in your shades, then what's the point?

Wouldn't you agree? Thank you.

Spektor. :cool:

[swish266]

I used to own a pair bout 5 yrs ago until I left them behind at the BRU Hilton and the nice housekeeping mngr said they were never dere...
Any way, I hav greasy skin and the Ser used to slide down my nose all the time... More so in chop. To me dey were on the heavy side.
I am back to RB (wit the new Italian lences, not old B&L), bluish shade lite metal frames. Happy. Only have to use CRTs at 90% brightness.
But I am tempted to get some new lighter Sers...:ok:

[captainkangaroo]

I have had my Serengeti 555nm - VELOCITY TITANIUM with the graded tint for three yeard now and love them! You have to carefull with the frames as they are Titanium and if you bend them they are done.

I plan on buying them again when the time comes.

[fullyestablished]

I certainly love my Serengetis but I have found that for the GA environment Shields are a great solution. They have an elastic strap not arms so that my Dave Clark noise cancelling headphones are comfortable for over 5 hours. The lenses provide 180 degrees of distortion free vision and they do a huge range of lenses including prescription.

I have just seen on www.shieldseyewear.com that they have downgraded their lifetime accidental damage guarantee to two years, but is still good.

But the best feature is the float on the back of the cord. So in the event of my ditching my aircraft in the North Sea at least I will still have my sunglasses.

They claim to be the only polycorbonate lens that is Optical Class 1. Don't be put off by the $50-80 price tag.

[Bravo73]

re Serengetis in the UK

The 'Driving' section of the Sunday Times has recently been offering a very good deal on Serengeti sunglasses (30% off the RRRP, if I recall correctly. More if you buy more than one pair).

I've had a quick look and, unfortunately, I can't find an online version of the offer.

For the record, go for the 'Drivers' or particularly the 'Drivers Gradient' lenses. I've been using them for the last couple of years and they are very good at improving the contrast, particularly in flat light conditions. Highly recommended.


B73

[richarjm]

I wear Oakley WHY™ 8.1 which are superb for GA under the DC headset. Very light, barely tell you're wearing them, superb lenses and cover the entire field of vision brilliantly. Will definately be replaced by same glasses, indeed already have been once!
I swear I don't work for oakley:D

[slim_slag]

Go onto ebay and get them shipped over from North America, serengetis should cost no more than £65 including postage.

[Farrell]

Still using my Serrengheti's........great!

Also use Oakley A Wires for a change, but still prefer the others!

[Halfbaked_Boy]

I use a £6 pair from Matalan's ;)

[bladewashout]

I wish I could chop & change, but as I need prescription lenses, Oakleys come in around £230, and the frames kept breaking, which was fine while they replaced them under warranty, but now the new 'fives' frames are a different shape! I had prescription serengetis about 15 years ago, they were great but staggeringly expensive. Plus when your prescription changes you have to buy new standard glasses *and* new sunglasses! My Oakleys and Serengetis now sit gathering dust in a drawer.

Flip-downs over standard glasses are just too uncool to think about.

A helmet with tinted visor only costs about the same as a few sets of sunglasses and will last several prescriptions-worth, but can cause some unwanted attention when worn around the pool or in the car, so it's not a real substitute for general use...

Just another expense to add to a pilot's list!


BW

[pilotbear]

regarding prescription lenses, I bought some 52mm Randolphs and just had prescription lenses fitted at my local optician :ok:

[gingernut]

Poundstretcher- £2.99

No less effective in preventing eye damage than any others.

[TyroPicard]

Gingernut

I've always been wary of cheap sunglasses - your iris opens wider with shades on, and if the lenses are not very good at blocking the UV rays then you can get serious eye damage (over the long term). It is well worth paying for good lenses.

Cheers, TP

[wondering]

Randolph Engineering, Concorde Model with the grey/green lenses. Imho colors look very natural. I neither like the greenish color feel of Ray Bans nor the reddish one of Serengetis.

Oh and the other day, I was using my EUR 4 sunclasses from the discounter. Seemed to work almost as good. They have this 400% UV protection as well. :ok:

[gingernut]

It is well worth paying for good lenses.


Sorry, not an expert, but is price related to protection ? Seem to remember some UK consumer study from years back suggesting that it is not.

Cheers:cool:

[stellair]

Oakley Minutes fitted with a black iradium lens, you will never look back. Oakleys best UV protection, very light, covers the whole field of vision and fits nicely under headset.

[benou]

For strong light environments (above cloud layers, ...), we recommend any Julbo (see julbo.fr) sunglasses model with Alti Spectron x6 glasses, it has flash protection and anti-glare, tunes down any excess of light, still allowing to see in high resolution at extreme distances.

[JAF0]

Would these be any good?

http://www.serengeti-eyewear.com/products/metals/humberto.cfm

Whats the difference between drivers and 555NM? Which is better for flying, (helis, not way up in the heavens like some you :) )

I have rayban predators but after wearing them a while get a little heavy on the nose and start to irritate you.

Thanks

[Farrell]

I have a new pair of Serengetis that I got as a present!

My other Serengetis are now looking for a new home.

[Bravo73]

JAF0,

Go for Drivers (or, ideally, Drivers Gradient) lenses. See my post above.

And, FWIW, I also only fly helis.


Regards,

B73


PS Your link didn't work.

[JAF0]

Thanks Bravo, ill have a look and see what I can get.

these were the ones that the link posted to (dont know why it stopped working)

http://fapomatic.com/58/gg6860_1.jpg

Model# Frame Color
lens color Size Information:
6852 Henna Drivers Base Curve: 8 Rx
6853 shiny Black Drivers Temple Length: 135mm/Spring Hinges
GG6860* Gunmetal 555nm Lens Size: 51.0 x 29.9 x 52.2mm, DBL 18mm

[Fingersmac]

Lots of praise for Serengeti's found in this thread.

Rather confusing though since i've read a few articles that say photochromic lenses are not suitable for flying.

From an article on Transport Canada's site:

Photochromic lenses that darken with increasing UV light are good for driving, but polycarbonate aircraft canopies shield out much of the ultraviolet rays and may interfere with their proper darkening. Additionally, going from bright sunlight into cloud the glasses may take several minutes to lighten

From an article by a FAA Vision Research specialist:

Glass photochromic lenses (PhotoGray(r) and PhotoBrown(r)) automatically darken when exposed to UV and become lighter in dim light. Most of the darkening takes place in the first 60 seconds, while lightening may take several minutes. Although most photochromic glass lenses can get as dark as regular sunglasses (approximately 20% light transmittance in direct sunlight), their darkened state may be lighter due to the reduced UV exposure through the windscreen. In addition, the faded state of photochromic glass lenses may not be clear enough to be useful when flying in cloud cover or at night.

[kaepa]

am not scintfic about this but stay away from polarized lenses for glass cockpit

[Airbus Girl]

I find Cebe Athlon ski glasses with brown-orange lenses are fantastic for both keeping the strong sunlight out of my eyes and for the comfort of the frames. The frames are comfy with headset on and also mean that the sunglasses never fall off, whether skiing or flying.

[oojamaflip]

For those still looking for Serengeti's in the UK - as has been said, Sunglass Hut no longer stock them.

If you google it, you'll find shadesaver.com and you can get them shipped from the US.

The ones I just ordered were $109 + p&p which was about $50 cheaper than the serengeti website. Seems like a good deal.

[kestrel539]

Cloudmaster are a very good make, relaxing on the eye, and give a good contrast to clouds. Cheaper than Serengeti, but the lens are prone to scatches. Avaliable from AFE in the UK, along with Serengeti's

[Rubençito]

I swear silouette sunglasses since 1 year,they're extremely lightweight,clear lenses in all wx conditions,I camefrom oakleys but those seems good

[Fingersmac]

Fingersmac, you are welcome to give an opinion, or refer readers to further information. A post that only contains a link to a commercial site is not acceptable.

Cheers, BM

[Terryble]

can anyone clarify, whether polarised sunglasses are allowed in the cockpit while flying?

looking to buy a pair to start my flying soon, and would like to know whether to pay a difference of 100 for the polarised lenses

[teghjeet]

I would not advise Polarisd glasses. One one flight I found that I could not read the FMS panel at all and the EADI/EHSI also appeared very strange. It so turned out that the FMS Panel has horizontal lines which were illuminated and my glasses let in only vertical light hence the inability to read the displays. The ac is ATR

[Terryble]

teghjeet : Thanks for your advice. I guess I would be better off with a pair of non-polarised then...

[Gonzo]

If anyone's interested, Sunglasses Time (there's one at Bicester Village, and one at MacArthur Glen Village Swindon) have an offer at the moment of buy one, get one free on Serengetis.

I just bought two pairs for £63.

[avi8ors]

Well, seein' as we're all bein' unscientific an' unedumacated about it ..... when I wanted an answer for this in the '70s, I went to an optometrist who fitted me out with Carl Zeiss lenses (http://www.zeiss.com/41256820002524A3/Contents-Frame/AC94E29BA0C4621985256E600070BDA5). Yup, the same mob that make, amongst other things, the lenses fitted to professional cameras. An' das good enough fer me.

The beauty of having sunnies made up is that you can pick whatever frame you want. Sometimes, I'd get a cheaper frame, such as a Rodenstock, but hell, you can get any sort you want.

As was mentioned earlier: what price yer eyes?

An' das ma 5o cents worf!

[criticalmass]

For the last 30 years I have used only Carl Zeiss Dark Umbral sunglass lenses, set in aviator teardrop frames with very thin side-wings so they don't become uncomfortable under a headset.

They'll see me out for the rest of my flying. They are optical glass and quite soft, so handle with care.

[Scube3]

Just wondering.....

If photocromatic lenses are not good because they don't get lighter fast enough when encountering cloud layers....how about the rest of regular sunglasses that don't change at all....Would those be better? :confused:

Serengeti's also have a what they call gradient lenses in which the bottom part of the lense has a lighter tone than the top improving your instrument view in this type of situations...

.....just my 50 cents.

Scube
:cool:

[Scube3]

I just read this on a web page. This seems to give pretty accurate info about this topic.


Here it goes:

Relay-Version: B 2.11 6/12/87; site scorn
Path: uunet!clyde.concordia.ca!news-server.csri.toronto.edu!cs.utexas.edu!wuarchive!julius.cs.ui uc.edu!apple!voder!pyramid!leadsv!claude
From: [email protected] (Claude Goldsmith)
Newsgroups: rec.aviation
Subject: How Should Pilots Select Sunglasses?
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
Date: Thu, 08 Nov 90 08:32:21 PST
Reply-To: [email protected] (Claude Goldsmith)
Distribution: na
Organization: LMSC-LEADS, Sunnyvale, Ca.
Lines: 110

The newsletter published by USAIG in August has an interesting
article dealing with sunglasses for aviators. Since I don't have a
scanner handy and I'm a 2 finger typist, I'm not going to copy the
whole thing here. However some of the data and conclusions are
interesting and useful, so I'll extract a few things.

>From Aviation Insurance News; volume 21; number 4.

"There are several excellent reasons to wear sunglasses. It is
generally accepted that glare is harmful to the eye, and that
protection from glare is therefore therapeutic, even though studies
show that only 22 percent of the population reacts adversely to
glare."

"The older eye compares unfavorably with the younger one. Since
visual performance is directly related to image luminance, it follows
that the older eye, which is less responsive to changes in light
levels, is at a disadvantage. There are several reasons for this.
First, there is less increase in pupilary size with decreased
luminance. Second, changes in the lens and vitreous humor make the
older eye more sensitive to glare. Third, there is an overall
reduction in the transmission of light. This translates directly to
a need for more light to be able to see, and to age-related problems
with visual acuity in diminished light... Older pilots, therefore,
should wear sunglasses that allow the passage of more light to the
retina. It has been reported that to obtain the same contrast
detection performance as a 20-year-old, a 40-year-old needs 40
percent more light, and a 60-year-old needs 100 percent more light"

"A high-level light source, such as glare, causes pupilary
constriction. The smaller the aperature through which the eye must
see, the darker is the immage created on the retina... "

"The amount of light blocked by sunglasses is the key to how much
decrement takes place in visual acuity while the glasses are actually
in place. This adverse effect exists only while the glasses are
actually in place, and does not persist after the glasses have been
removed. Generally, the darker the lens, the larger the loss. This
is the reason why baseball players delay flipping down their
sunglasses from beneath their cap visors until they have located the
arcing ball."

"...A lens that darkens or lightens according to the intensity of
ambient light, or truly photosensitive lens, would appear to be the
most desireable, especially since the pilot needs metered light
abatement that is based on the severity of the exposure. However
those lenses that require UV-B to make them darken will not darken
when worn inside the airplane since UV-B does not penetrate the
canopy or windows. Thus, what appears to be the best answer to the
changeable needs of the cockpit, photochromatic lenses, turns out not
to be an answer at all."

"The amount of light that passes through a lens is the most critical
factor in selecting sunglasses to effect a compromise between visual
decrement, color distortion and glare or high ambient light
protection. Lenses are catagorized as being between a one and a four
according to percent of light transmission and it's basic color.
Thus, you can have a brown 3, gray 4, yellow 1, green 2 or any
combination of a color and a number. A number 1 lens cuts 20 percent
of available light, barely enough to be noticed, and except for
yellow, useful only in the world of fashion. A number 2 lens blocks
70 percent. A number 3 lens blocks 85 percent and a number 4 lens
blocks 95 percent. There is no place in aviation for a number 4 lens
of any color because of the severe decrement in visual acuity,
(though such lenses are available). A pilot with 20/20 vision
wearing number 4 glasses has a visual acuity between 20/40 and 20/60
while airborne in the cockpit, even though he could be a comfortable
20/20 on the sunbathed ski slopes using the same glasses."

"A Number 3 lens has utility only in unusually high light situations
such as flying into the sun, or flying VFR just on top in bright sun.
Interestingly, it is Number 3 lenses that are in common usage without
regard for whether acuity suffers. Visual acuity while wearing
Number 3 lenses can be degraded to an average of 20/30."

"The Number 2 lens should be the aviators friend, and then only when
judiciously worn. A 30 percent light transmission presents the world
with the same amount of light as that found in a 70 percent eclipse
of the sun. That is what these glasses do. Subdued light is the
result. Visual acuity is reduced minimally. Wearing Brown 2
glasses, the 20/20 pilot remains almost 20/20. Looking for traffic,
the pilot should remove them. As soon as meteorological conditions
permit, they should be returned to the case or pocket. Wear Yellow 1
glasses in haze or in the soup, and then only if they improve
vision."

"The effect of even a small difference in acuity on visual performance
is commonly underestimated." So say the investigators at the U.S.
Naval Aerospace Medical Research Laboratory in their December 1986
report on the use of sunglasses and visors by U.S. Navy fighter
pilots. Visor wearers were at a 1.8 nautical mile disadvantage in
sighting a target compared to those not so encumbered."

"Sunglasses should not be worn merely because they are available.
Ambient light translates directly into visual acuity. Losses in the
former impact the latter."

"Aviators sunglasses should be glass or polycarbonate; should transmit
not less than 25 percent of available light; should not distort
colors, distances, or shapes; should nullify the bluring of shortwave
reflected blue; and should increase contrast without
misrepresentation. Their adverse effect of visual acuity must be
known and they should not be worn during conditions of diminished
light. There can be special times when an adjunct pair of Yellow 1
glasses (that are not sunglasses) can improve vision..."
--
note: photochromatic lenses would enter a number 2 type lense in their lighter tone stage but it seems that cockpit glass will affect the photochromatic ability of the lenses to get darker, to some point.

[pontius's pa]

I want no unseemly mirth at this very informative posting.

Many years ago on Hong Kong TV there was an advert featuring a now long retired CX very senior pilot, (CXVSP)

The ad went something like this.

CXVSP, seated at the controls, turned round to the camera behind his seat with his hands raised and said something like

"I fly hundreds of thousands of passengers every year and their safety is in these hands. I need the best protection for my eyes I can get and I use Zeiss," (puts on sunglasses).

"Zeiss for my eyes!!"

There you have it ladies and gentlemen from the most impeccable of sources.

Remember now, no laughing (choke)

[Mama Mangrove]

I always wore Raybans, tried Oakleys and various other types at various times, then just a few years before I retired I discovered Serengetti Velocity sunglasses with titanium frames and drivers gradient lenses and wished I'd found them 20 years before. When my original pair were stolen I went straight out and bought an identical pair. I had a look in Sunglass hut today and they still sell them there. They're not cheap, but worth every penny in my opinion.

[321 Flyer]

Thanks for sharing the article. It was most informative. :8

[brianh]

Only just noticed this thread and had a quick read.

Being in Australia and travelling Outback the topic of glare and sunnies is very topical for me. It's 42 degress here today and extreme UV.

One point that does not seem to have been stressed is the long term implications of glare. Answer = cataracts and vision deterioration. (And no laser surgery). Direct quote from a medical vision site - "Most cataracts occur as a result of ageing and long term exposure to UV light. Making sunglass wear very important as preventative measure."

Pilots are exposed to significant UV, with far less atmosphere layer protection, and the wearing of good sunglasses is vital to good vision in old age - particularly as life expectations are longer now. My father, aged 92, spent much of his life at open sporting functions without sunglasses - after several ops including large $ expenses he has peripheral vision but little else.

I wear Randolphs, purchased from the USA. Dropped and damaged my first pair, their response was top class. They have the flat sections sitting nicely under my headset and soft seats on the nose bridge. I wear them driving, flying, drinking. Only trap is the flat sides allow them to fall off if you bend over quickly - they are best worn with one of those grandfather cords arouns the neck, particularly as I have to revert to my prescription glasses about 5 minutes before landing to get my long distance vision spot on.

Main reason for this post is that anyone reading this thread who does NOT wear good sunglasses - not just in the cockpit but anywhere in the sun - needs to be aware that it can catch up in our grumpy old age.

[LGB]

I have had Srengettis recommended before, also this thread indicates they are a a good choice.

I am slightly nearsighted, enough for it to be in my medical. So where can I get a pair of Serengettis with prescription glasses? Just to find the glasses themselves seems to be a problem, when I finally found some, they only had a small selection.

[Dozza2k]

well the title says it. I currently have a pair of ray bans with perscription lenses from my local optician. But, since I am about to take to the skies once more, I think i can treat myself.
I know Oakleys do there own perscriptions, anyone know if serengeti does or any other good makes? Its just I think mine are not dark enough.
cheers
d2k

[Altimeters]

I have the prescription Ray Bans, but before I got them I was wearing a pair of Serengeti's. From what I was told, you can't have lenses that are too curved to be prescriptions because they'll just warp everything you see. But also with Serengeti's you probably don't wanna take those lenses out. That's what makes the glasses so good. I've just gotten my Ray Bans tinted to a darker shade.

Hope that helps! :ok:

[Cosmo]

If you look at the different threads dealing with sunnies you'll notice that Serengeties are recommended more often than not. Serengeties are available in prescription lenses even for their more curved frames (such as the Lassen frame).

http://www.serengeti-eyewear.com/support/rx_program.cfm

It did take some hunting on my part to find that authentic Serengeti lenses could actually be fitted to the more curved frames; one of the main dealers around here insisted that they cannot supply authentic lenses to, for example, the Lassen frame. I think you'll find that you have to locate a dealer that gets their lenses supplied from the States as the more curved lenses do not seem to be manufactured in Europe. Another alternative is to order them online.

http://www.athleticoptics.com/default.asp?Action=GetSports&MfgrID=60

On a personal note, based on all the discussion here, I'll definitely be ordering authentic prescription Serengeties for my next pair of sunnies.

Cosmo

[Fingersmac]

i posted this earlier in the thread but was modded. i'll try again.
private pilot magazine did a study a little while back on the best sunglasses for aviation. oakley came out on top for each category.
you can check out the results of the study here:
http://oakley.com/private_pilot/
obviously the results are on the oakley site seeing as they did very well. please keep in mind the original study was performed by private pilot magazine NOT oakley.

[The Greaser]

These guys are excellent if you need any prescription sunglasses including serengeti.

http://www.opticsplanet.net/sunglasses.html

[wingman863]

I have lost a fantastic pair of ray-bans that I had. Don't know what model but they were the ones the guys had in men in black if thats any help. Was very sad to lose them but am looking to replace them. Oakleys are the current favourite for both their technical value and the nice design. Thinking a pair of wires 2.0 with either blue or fire lenses. Anyone have any experience of this model?

[Scube3]

Anybody knows about the difference between serenguetis made in Italy and Japan?
Are Japan's Serenguetis fake? It seems weird but sometimes I check on a website and the same internet shop has serengetis made in both countries and the price doesn't vary. Anybody knows?

Scube.

[1972]

Ray-Ban’s ‘Sidestreet - RB3183’. Colour Code - 014/73 (Frame – ‘Brown’, Lenses – ‘APX Brown’)

Metal, frameless lenses. Really thin arms so headset stays nice and snug (mine are David Clarke 13.4’s) and keep outside noise to an absolute minimum. Not a big fan of Ray-Ban till now, when I realised they did some nice sets, unlike those awful 70’s style Aviators! These are well made, light, really comfortable & wrapped to avoid light leaking into your peripheral vision. Non-polarised variety of course, and rated category 3 on Ray-Bans tint rating. (Darkest is 4, which RB do not recommend for driving or flying). I find the brown lens makes it much easier to see the instruments and makes the outside seem a shade lighter compared to Cat. 3 lens with a green or grey tint. Still dark enough to take the sting away from that harsh WA sun.

Would’ve loved titanium, super-thin armed Maui Jims, but these were way out of my budget. Sertengetis come highly recommended too, but again too pricey for me. Pooh. Killer Loop did some incredibly thin-armed frameless, good looking sets at a great price, but all the ones available to me had mirror lenses which are apparently not recommended.

Ray Bans have great lenses, great fit, take good care of your eyes and whilst they still cost a pretty penny, they’re a good choice for people without copious amounts of money to burn!

AUS $179.95. From Sunglass Hut – have 14 day return policy if you don’t like them or work as well as you’d expect. 1 year guarantee. If broken (I was told ‘I don’t care if you sit on them or run over them deliberately with a truck’!), they’ll give you a brand new replacement pair at half the price. Sweet. :ok:

[cjd_a320]

Its been a while since I last graced a cockpit but I always used Randolph Aviators.

I'm amazed that so few have mentioned them?? The Randolph Aviator standard issue sunglasses for U.S. armed forces pilots, Top Gun Flying School and NASA.

Things mush of change since I've retired ;) :)

Info
http://www.avidaviator.com/randolph_sunglasses.html

www.randolphusa.com

[Cruise Alt]

Had 1000 hours of GA instruction time using some nice REVO polarized wraparounds which were fantastic, I only wish that I had invested as much on protecting my ears. However now fly A320/1s and the polarized sunnies cause distracting discolouration effects through the windshield and also completely black out the LCD display on the radio panel. I changed to some trendy narrow Revos but they let too much light in around the side and were soon disgarded. I still swear by the Revos and have some non polarized wraparounds which are great but pricey. In summary - Polarized are not helpful in an airliner!

[Suvarnabhumi]

For Jet EFIS there's only one must have:

Serengeti's with Driver Gradient Lenses.

And they are NOT polarised so no probs there!!!

[toomuchradiations]

hiya!,
i understand polarising corrective lenses SHOULD NOT be used....but does this mean they are banned???
my back up spectacles are of this type and i was wondering whether it is fully legal!

thanks very much,

tmr

[welliewanger]

I don't think they're banned, but they definitely aren't recommended for flight. Many aircraft have polarised windscreens. If you add polarised sunglasses to the equation and you get very dodgy vision!

[rubber]

does the colour of the lens tint matter?

comparing a brown lens and a gray lens.

assuming both are Number 2 lens, non polarised with 20-30 percent light transmission, which is more suitable for use during flying?

[rubber]

For Jet EFIS there's only one must have:
Serengeti's with Driver Gradient Lenses.
And they are NOT polarised so no probs there!!!

the driver gradient lenses are photo chromatic so does it cause any lightening / darkening problems as mentioned in the posts before this?

[The Greaser]

No there are no such problems with the serengeti drivers gradient lenses and I agree wholeheartedly with Suvarnabhumi - they are outstanding.

[rubber]

looking to get either the 555nm lenses or drivers / driver's gradient.... undecided though cos of the lens colour (grey vs brown). Serengetis are costly so don't wanna make a wrong purchase :cool:

[Wise Monkey]

Try this test:- put on your Polarised Glasses and look at a digital clock by tilting your head to the right...and you will see the screen go completley black. This will also effect your instruments when flying.

Tried and testd:- Polarising sunglasses should not be used when flying. The polarising filter interacts with the cockpit transparency to produce a distorted and degraded visual image.

[Wise Monkey]

US airforce made Aviators compulsory for years. + They have been around since the 30's.
http://www.ray-ban.com/

[TheFlyingSquirrel]

I'm about to buy some perscription sunglasses and have a lens choice delema. I have a pair of Sarengetti Aviators which give superb vision inside and out the cockpit, but they've never been comfortable for long periods. Should I go for polarized lenses ? The optician says that polorized lenses are not suitable for inside and outside cockpit vision although I never had any real problems with the Sarengetti brand lenses. Does anyone have any advice on tints etc ?

TFS:cool:

[mongoose237]

Might be worth reading (http://www.2020mag.com/index.asp?page=3_479.htm)

[g-mady]

TheFlyingSquirrel,

Dont know if its the same reason but I had to try 4 different pairs of sunglasses as I could not get a good seal around my headset and they were uncomfortable...?

Think thats why good old tom cruise style aviators were made with very thin wire arms (not that I wear any!) but that is what I found I needed...

MADY

[Bravo73]

Bottom line: Polarised lenses are good if Tuna Spotting in a 500 (because the polarisation works by removing the reflections from the water). Not so good if the aircraft has glass screens (the polarisation filters out many of the onscreen colours).

My recommendation: Serengeti Driver's Gradient lenses in whatever frames have the thinnest arms. These lenses improve contrast in almost all light conditions (except at night!) Particularly good during 'flat light' conditions as often found in the UK.

Prescription Serengetis will cost you several hundreds of pounds/dollars though and will probably have to be sourced from the USA.


HTH,

B73

[Limpopo]

I think it depends on the type of flying you will be doing. I fly offshore and I tried Serengeti Drivers but found that the gradient lens was not good when a lot of reflection from the sun was coming off the sea. I instead love the pair of Serengettis I have which do not have the gradient lens. They are not polarised but they cut down on glare as good as polarised glasses. I have also found no problem looking at the screens with them.

However, using with a headset (especially as mine is an ANR set), means that I have to make sure that the headset and sits properly with the sunglasses on, as otherwise the ANR doesn't work so well.

I cannot remember the name of the model but the number is 6535.

Hope that helps?

[NickLappos]

Frankly, I have never seen the need to spend the money dictated by "designer" glasses. The money you spend on them is not necessarily needed to get good quality, frankly.


I found that brown #3 lenses on good quality basic sunglasses works very well, and polaroid glasses should be avoided because of effects from plastic windows and poor visual cues near water.

This place has excellent glasses at good prices, and is the "secret" of many US pilots. They do excellent prescription word, including custom bi-focal segments at the top of the lens for reading overhead switches. I have no interest in this company, this is not a "plug" I am just a satisfied repeat customer:

Hidalgo's (http://www.hidalgos.com)

[TiPwEiGhT]

I wear Oakley Why 8.0 frames, they fit like a dream under my headset and are very comfortable.

TiP:ok:

[malabo]

I like Revo. The "blue/purple" lens (with white shirt and bars) seems especially helpful for getting waved by military checkpoints - but in Africa only, in the US they just tell you to take them off ;-(. Note that the weird color is just the outside coating - the lenses themselves are kind of a brown.

I've found the Serengeti's a little on the light side for the glare of offshore flying and glacier work, even the IFR when you're in the sunshine on top of white cloud.

It's going to be a compromise for the darkness of the instrument panel going from out to in. Maybe if everyone painted them light grey it wouldn't be such a black hole of contrast.

Wearing comfort is a major consideration. The bayonet type (Randolph?) seem OK for helmets, though my HGU-55 came with a visor anyway. Normal headsets need a pretty good seal to keep the noise out and therefore have a lot of "clamp" force. Purpose built ANR's, like the Bose, don't rely on a seal and have far less clamping force, and therefore are more tolerant of different sunglass arms.

Malabo

[SirVivr]

I completely agree with Nick.

The man running Hidalgos has worked offshore.

I called him, Skype, and had a long conversation with him about what I needed and he delivered. At a very good price.

He has glass lenses which most claim not to be available. Use a nose bridge. He will explain all.

Charlie Alexander

[IntheTin]

I use a ENC headset so my glasses have to be snug on my head otherwise they don't work correctly.
I found a set of Oakleys called 'Crosshair' which are real comfy and the arms are shaped to the headset cups. Bit pricey but worth it!

[Devil 49]

If you're not certain what you want, try a few clip ons, available, inexpensive. They work very well, and you can try a lot of different colors, shading, gradients, and polarized. I especially like the flip-ups, quick change capacity. I prefer a medium brown, polarized- gives a little better vis in precip.
You may have issues with helmet visors (diffraction color bands, distracting), the occasional plastic windows (twice in 20 years), and gauge face glass. The biggest issue is LCD displays- polarized lenses will conflict with the LCD polarization at some point, or all the time. I carry an extra pair of cheapo non-polarized clip ons.
And a pair of collectible frame RayBans with scrip lenses, when I gotta look like Joe Cool, pro pilot. But not to work in.

[Stan Switek]

Maui Jim. www.mauijim.com

[LUXSTAR]

www.Dior.com....you might like the glasses....i have a male dior, has aside triangle glass piece...slide like a old fasion us randolph...silver frame..at least enjoy the clothes....

[GLSNightPilot]

I've tried lots of sunglasses over the years, and most of them came from Hidalgo's. He has good products at a good price. For years I used glasses with the thinnest temples I could find so I could get a good seal with my headset, and the best I found were some I got from Hidalgo's, Carlo Bellini brand IIRC, and I don't think they're carried any longer. Now I'm using a set of Randolph Engineering glasses I got free from Professional Pilot mag for returning a survey. I've discovered lightweight in-the-ear headsets, which use foam earplugs, and I can use whatever glasses I like, because there is no heavy, hot dome over my ears. I get better noise reduction than what is advertised by ENC headsets, with Howard Leight Laser Light earplugs giving a NRR of 32. They're light, cool, and quiet, and I don't have to take the button off the top of my cap. There are at least 3 brands available, and Google should turn them up for you.

[FMC OVERHEAT]

555nm or driver's gradient ? which one is better ? I m thinking about velocity titanium matte black (mod #6691 ) or lassen titanium (mod #6698) pretty expensive though (270 euros)

[Hawk]

With Moderator Bad Medicine's permission a post from 2003.

"Sunglasses are a topic dear to the heart of aviators. There are a number of factors which determine the suitability or otherwise of sunglasses for use in the aviation role.

Narrow frames that carry large lenses are the most desirable from a field of view standpoint. The most critical problem with frames arises from the presence of wide sidearms which can significantly impair the peripheral visual field.

Lenses should not be too dark, and should transmit at least 15% of incident light. The tint used should be "neutral density"
(N.D.), that is, a greyish tint that does not distort colour perception. Much has been written about the perceived benefits of various coloured lenses, especially in regard to contrast and perceived brightness. Coloured lenses have been shown to reduce the colour information received, and to have a detrimental effect on both perception and reaction time.

Lenses of polycarbonate material are preferred because of their impact-resistance and ability to absorb ultra-violet and infra-red rays. However, these lenses can scratch easily. Harder materials may be suitable, however these may be more prone to shattering in an impact.

Different jurisdictions and countries have standards to which sunglasses are manufactured. Sunglasses should be chosen which conform to the appropriate standard. For example, the current Australian Standard ensures that sunglasses meet acceptable standards for lens quality, frame strength and lens retention and also ensures that sunglasses provide adequate protection from solar radiation.

Polarising sunglasses should not be used when flying. The polarising filter interacts with the cockpit transparency to produce a distorted and degraded visual image. This effect can also be seen with laminated car windscreens. Better keep the polarised lenses for fishing.

Pilots who wear prescription spectacles can choose from a number
of options for glare protection. Prescription sunglasses with N.D.15 lenses can be obtained, or N.D.15 clip-on or flip-up sunglasses may be worn over prescription spectacles.

Back to the original issue of photochromatic lenses. Photochromatic lenses have several disadvantages that render them unsuitable for use by pilots.

Firstly, their transition times are relatively slow. Photochromatic lenses take about five minutes to increase their density to the level of sunglasses, but more importantly, the bleaching time from maximum to minimum density can be as long as 30 minutes. Although there is a rapid lightening of the lens in the first five minutes, this may be too long when there is a sudden variation in light during a descent into or under cloud, or because of a rapid change in cloud cover.

Their second disadvantage is that, even when fully bleached, photochromic lenses still absorb slightly more light than untinted lenses. Since vision is critically dependent on ambient light levels, even this small decrease of light reaching the eye through photochromatic lenses is undesirable, especially at night or in low light levels. The inherent degradation of these lenses with time causes them to progressively become darker, as they become unable to reach the fully bleached state. This effectively prohibits their use in flying or controlling air traffic.

I hope that "sheds some light" on the subject.

Cheers,

BM"

[rubber]

Back to the original issue of photochromatic lenses. Photochromatic lenses have several disadvantages that render them unsuitable for use by pilots.
Firstly, their transition times are relatively slow. Photochromatic lenses take about five minutes to increase their density to the level of sunglasses, but more importantly, the bleaching time from maximum to minimum density can be as long as 30 minutes. Although there is a rapid lightening of the lens in the first five minutes, this may be too long when there is a sudden variation in light during a descent into or under cloud, or because of a rapid change in cloud cover.


I think the latest generation of photochromatic lenses have much faster response time, not sure how much though

[scruggs]

What's the best Serengeti frame for flying? I've decided on getting the Drivers Gradient lenses, but I'm undecided on the frames. Any thoughts?

eP

[pinkhyppo]

Most sunnies have a coated layer of UV ray absorbtion material which fades over time.
As far as I know only Oakley and Serengeti has this UV ray absorbtion material built into the lens, i.e. no degradation on UV ray absorbtion.

And only Oakley lenses claims to eliminate 100% of UVA, UVB and UVC rays, while Serengeti only claims to eliminate 98.5% UVA and 100% UVB and no mention of UVC.

So it is a no brainer for me, been Oakley or nothing for me for as long as I can remember:ok:

[Mandenbar]

I was a sunglass dealer way back in the day for a few years, so here's my $0.02.

You *may* want to stay away from polarized lenses if the instrument panels on whichever aircraft you fly are polarized... To see the results of two polarized materials, put on the glasses, take out your cell phone, and start to turn the cell phone sideways.. the screen completely dissappears. It doesn't happen on all aircraft however, but it is something that you should check out beforehand.

If you go the polarized route, I blindly recommend anything by Revo or Maui Jim.. two of the best possible lenses ever made. Ray Ban's are very nice as well, but I put them slightly behind Revo's and Maui's.

For the not polarized route, Serrengetti's (possibly not spelled correctly) would be a good bet. They have several lenses available that are photochromic, meaning when exposed to bright light, they darken automatically, when it gets dim (IE clouds, etc) they lighten.

Also, make sure there is an antireflective coating on the inside of the lense, which prevents light from behind you from hitting the glass and bouncing into your eyes.

Not all people enjoy this one, but some lenses are bi-gradient... darker tint at the top and the bottom of the lense. Helps while driving, keeps the sun out of your eyes a little better.

Ok, done boring everyone :)

Cheers,
Mandenbar

[RHCP]

I'm currently trying to decide between the following

1) Oakley CROSSHAIR™ ACTIVATED BY TRANSITIONS.

2) Serengeti Velocity Titanium with drivers gradient lenses

Any advice would be great the new transition lenses from oakley are relatively new to the market does anyone have an opinion on response time to light changes etc.

[scruggs]

I was dead set on the exact pair of Serengeti's as you've stated RHCP. I didnt know about those Oakley CROSSHAIR™ ACTIVATED BY TRANSITIONS you've listed - I've just checked them out and they look great! Choices Choices!

For looks, its the OAKLEY's, but I'll hold off on a purchase to see what peoples opinions are of the OAKLEY transition lenses.

[flyboyike]

These are the ones I went with:

http://cgi.ebay.com/NEW-RAY-BAN-AVIATOR-POLARIZED-SUNGLASSES-RB3025-014-83_W0QQitemZ8281888503QQcategoryZ79732QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ 1QQcmdZViewItem

Feel great and no EFIS problems even though they are polarized.

[RHCP]

I think i'll stay away from polarized after all the warnings on this forum just in case.

[yowie]

Try optics-online.com.au,got my Serengeti's about $100 bucks cheaper than sunglasshut,delivered within 2 days.(latest look had them at $231AUD for the Velocity) .Heaps of other brands,or they will get it!

[7gcbc]

This is all very well and aside from looking cool, can anyone recommend a pair of durable, comfortable, light, non polarizing grey-tint glasses that don't cost a fortune and don't end up on your forehead during aeros ? and will survive at least a 30 second window with a 2 year old ?

Pinkhyppo is correct , my raybans are currently in the process of peeling, which is rather satisfying considering I've had them slightly over a year.

[Hand Solo]

If you can get them to fit your head (they're a bit small) try a pair of Oakley Fives. About £50 in the UK and should meet all your criteria. I was very impressed when I accidentaly dropped them off an 8 storey building, breaking them into the 5 component parts, then found I could put them right back together again as good as new!

[Inverted81]

Hi all...
in a previous life i used to sell oakley in the outdoor activity industry in the UK's largest oakley retailer.
I've used serrengetti's ray ban etc, but without a doubt Oakley's did the job for me and i haven't looked back!

As others have said, Oakley do claim (and i've seen it proven) that UVA, UVB and UVC are blocked 100%. So you all know; UVC is the "blue light" reflected of snowy surfaces. so ideal for skiing etc.

They use a molecule called iridium which is imcorporated into the polycarbonate, to remove the glare. All UV and IR is removed by the lens material not the "iridium" so if the lenses get scratched, you will still be covered.

They also offer a wide array of lens hues to choose from. my tips for the cockpit would be gold iridium, black iridium (for particularly bright cockpits) and my personal fovourites emerald or Ice....

I haven't read thro all this thread but Oakley have done many comparisons between many manufacturers and surveys have been done in the states i believe for pilots. last time i looked details we're on their website... :cool:

[scruggs]

Who is the largest UK Oakley retailer? If you can't advertise, can you PM me please.

Cheers mate :ok:

eP

[shelgason]

As others have said, Oakley do claim (and i've seen it proven) that UVA, UVB and UVC are blocked 100%. So you all know; UVC is the "blue light" reflected of snowy surfaces. so ideal for skiing etc.


Actually, UV-C (100 to 280 nm) is totally blocked by the ozone layer. So unless you do alot of skiing on the poles, you don't need UV-C protection at all. Seems to me like it's just to make them sound better.

I recommend Skylet lenses from Carl Zeiss.

You can get them framed from Zeiss or you can buy only the lenses to be mounted in any frame you like. I have mine in a Silhouette Minimal Art. Excellent comfort while wearing a headset.

Regards,

[captain_murray]

Hi,

does anyboday have and info on rayban lens, I like rayban glasses and i want buy a pair, with G-15xlt lens, i have a job sailing in greece for the summer so what a pair that are good for that but with a view to using the for flying aswell. thats the dilemma, i dont want to spend a fortune on a pair of polerized for sailing that i cant use for flying! so are G15 good? i hear they are a good alrounder but waondered if any had any experience on the water and in the air?

thanks

[soggyboxers]

Oakleys - wouldn't touch them again. The lenses kept breaking in the only pair I tried to keep. After 4 pairs of lenses and 400 excuses I threw them away. Used raybans for over 30 years with no problems and currently the best I have ever had are Serengetti drivers glasses with the gradient lenses and titanium frames. I have no interest in their looks; only that they're comfortable for up to 8 hours a day, tough and do the job.

[RHCP]

Oakley offer a million and one different lens tints and colours which would people recommend for up in the skies? bearing in mind i'm based in the Uk...sun cloud sun cloud sun cloud you just never know!

[TheFlyingSquirrel]

I finally bought some new sunglasses ! How much you ask ? FA ! I bought a new pair of perscription glasses from Boots, and got a free pair of Boots brand perscription aviator sunglasses absolutely free ! I am 100% pleased with them as they do not have those obtrusive nose pads, and instead have continuous,thick plastic plastic V, to mount pressure free on your nose. No need to spend a fortune on sunglasses, as My Lappos advised. My Sarangettis have now been thrown to the back of the drawer.

TFS:cool:

[Gomer Pylot]

Brown lenses, not too dark. They are very good for filtering out blue light and increasing contrast. No need to spend a fortune on sunglasses, cheaper ones work just as well.

[TheFlyingSquirrel]

I agree Gomer - just got a free perscription pair with my new perscription glasses - Best I've ever owned ! I wouldn't consider expensive glasses again.

[Epiphany]

Can anyone recommend a good pair of sunglasses for use in the 139?

[griffothefog]

Silhouettes without a peer....
No ear pain from frames :ok:

[Bravo73]

Any Serengeti frames with their Drivers Gradient lenses are highly recommended.

Brilliant in all light conditions, even flat 'grey/white' light, and work fine with glass cockpits.

[Piltdown Man]

I'll give the same answer as I did some time ago: Serengetti Drivers, "Velocity" frames because of the wraparound with the "gradient" lens. These are without a doubt the best glasses I've ever used.

PM

[Zeflo27]

I always go for graded lenses, you'll see why once you try.

[criticalmass]

Zeiss Dark Umbral. Optical glass, therefore soft. Use a good quality case. Don't drop them.

[JohnMcGhie]

When I got my Student Pilots License in New Zealand in 1966, my instructor was emphatic on the subject: Polarized Lenses were illegal in aviation, he said.

He pointed out that at a critical angle to the sun, the wings of another aircraft become completely invisible if you are wearing polarized glasses.

We went out to the airfield and he demonstrated it by rotating my glasses while watching a light aircraft on approach. At a certain angle, the aircraft vanished. That convinced me...

[Dani]

My personal opinion is, that you need sunglasses in the "wrap around" style, i.e. that they cover your eyes also from the side. Never use polarized, lenses which changing gradient or adjust their brightness.

I always prefered Oakleys, because they where the first to have optical abberations under control in curved lenses (especially important with corrected lenses), but Serengeti and others also seem to have caught up.

Always be aware for what you are using your lenses, and check the optical properties of your favorite: dark black for strong sun (tropics, deserts), yellow for haze or light sun. Oakleys always come with an extensive test protocol, so you can check how many percent of the light gets filtered. Don't forget to check the blue part of the sun light (that is the frequencies just above 400 micro). These tints are brownish.

Dani

[halas]

Ten years with the Seringetti drivers and haven't had to try anything else. Just fantastic shades with the graded lenses. Even in dark cloud, the obvious grades of protection are obvious, as the cloud thins and then into bright daylight. May as well be a non-event.

Did use the Revo blue shades, but that just p!ssed off the other driver looking at themselves in blue!

halas

[R.Barry]

We were told that "G15" was the best shade/ strength

[slamer.]

Under certain lighting polarized will give an "oily film" appearance to windows and displays.

If using EFIS at certian angles some of the display may appear to momentarily blank.

Something that has a snug fit across the top and around the sides will help reduce momentary dazzel as you manoeuvre.

Oh and make sure they look cool....!

[toolowtoofast]

I've owned/used RayBan green lens exclusively. I prefer a narrow lens so I can see under the glasses into the cockpit when transitioning from outside to instruments (suits the flying I'm doing). I had Aviators but the teardrop shape didn't suit me. I have tried the Serengetti graduated lens and they were very good, but I wasn't a fan of the amber. Found Oakley were too dark - again when transitting from outside to inside the cockpit on a very sunny day

[thunderjet01]

I've found the V: ONE sunglasses very good. The lenses are just the right tint and work really well on a hazy day. The arms fit well under headsets so not increasing the noise.

[D O Guerrero]

Whatever you get, make sure they fit comfortably under your headset. Oakleys are not usually that good in this respect, in my experience.
Personally, Serengeti titanium Velocity with the brown drivers' gradient lenses are the best I've ever had and I would find it hard to use anything else now.

[mixture]

If using EFIS at certian angles some of the display may appear to momentarily blank.


If you don't have ready access to an EFIS (e.g at the opticians where you are buying the sunglasses) and want to see the effect slamer is talking about, just ask to have a quick look at their TFT computer screen.

[Tasslehoff]

Randolph Engineering "AVIATORS" work very well for me (grey lens)

[gchangflyer]

I have a pair of Oakley Fives, great great lenses (dark gray tint), but they are SO uncomfortable over the nose bridge after an hour or so...which I couldnt pick up when I was trying them on before buying:bored: Make sure you buy ones that fit really comfortably!

[Zeflo27]

No polarized sunglasses for pilots - AviationKnowledge (http://aviationknowledge.wikidot.com/sop:no-polarized-sunglasses-for-pilots)

[Heliport]

Serengetis are on sale this month at a well known on-line flight store @ £100 + £5.99 delivery (UK).

[SoCal92057]

If they are good enough to go Mach II they are good enough for me. I buy them at the below link. It appears to be something of a factory outlet. The prices are low, low.

www.AOEyewearOnline.com (http://www.AOEyewearOnline.com)

[Flying Bull]

Hi,

you can take a look at
Caruso Freeland Sonnenschutz Produkte (http://www.carusofreeland.com/)
Switzerland, lenses to prtocr from UV and blue light, protect from strylight, changeable glases ....

Greetings Flying Bull

[mrskytec]

A wide range of Pilot eyewear at (deleted by Mods)

:8

Recommend Randolph Grey Lens sunglasses- perfect all-rounders. Or, if you don't like the style- try a green tinted lens from Ray ban- non polarised of course.:cool:

Please feel free to Advertise your company and sales via our Advertise (http://www.pprune.org/rotorheads/220987-pilots-sunglasses-7.html?nojs=1#advertise) button at the top of every page :ok:

Senior Pilot

[EN48]

Any Serengeti frames with their Drivers Gradient lenses are highly recommended.

Brilliant in all light conditions, even flat 'grey/white' light, and work fine with glass cockpits.


I am also a fan of Serengeti Drivers and have used them for years after trying most everything else. However, I have noted one possible issue. When doing recurrent training at Bell in B407's equipped with night vision compatible instruments, the readability of the instruments is impaired by the the sunglasses apparently due to polarization of the Serengeti lenses. Not a factor in my routine flying, but may be for some.

[Bravo73]

I am also a fan of Serengeti Drivers and have used them for years after trying most everything else. However, I have noted one possible issue. When doing recurrent training at Bell in B407's equipped with night vision compatible instruments, the readability of the instruments is impaired by the the sunglasses apparently due to polarization of the Serengeti lenses. Not a factor in my routine flying, but may be for some.

You must have the 'Drivers Polarized' lenses. I suggest that you change these to 'Drivers Gradient' (which are not polarised).

[EN48]

You must have the 'Drivers Polarized' lenses. I suggest that you change these to 'Drivers Gradient'


Didnt know that this choice existed. My current Drivers do have gradient type lenses, but apparently they are polarized as well. So, apparently, choosing Drivers Gradient eliminates the polarization? :confused:

[Gomer Pylot]

It's becoming hard to find non-polarized sunglasses. Serengeti does sell non-polarized lenses, but you have to look carefully. The photochromic lenses work fairly well, not getting really light in the cockpit, and the driver gradient work very well in early and late sunlight, when the sun is low and cockpit light is rather dim. Polarized lenses are a problem with LCD displays, and if you ever expect to fly a glass cockpit, stay far away from them, because you won't be able to see any of the displays. NVG filters can make it hard to see the instruments behind them even without polarized lenses. I've never seen the point in requiring filters, because they really don't have much effect. You can't read the instruments through the NVGs anyway, because they can't focus at that distance, and you can dim the instruments enough so that they don't bother you under the goggles. Just because you have difficulty seeing through the filters doesn't necessarily mean your sunglass lenses are polarized. The green filters block a lot of the light you normally see through brown lenses.

[Bravo73]

Didnt know that this choice existed. My current Drivers do have gradient type lenses, but apparently they are polarized as well. So, apparently, choosing Drivers Gradient eliminates the polarization? :confused:

Yep, as far as I'm aware, the 'Drivers Gradient' lens doesn't have any polarisation at all. I fly a completely glass cockpit aircraft (EC225) and have never had any problems with any of the screens from either seat with the Drivers Gradient lenses.

Maybe have a look on the Serengeti website where they outline the differences between the 3 types of Drivers lenses: Drivers, Drivers Gradient and Drivers Polarized. Unfortunately I can't link directly to the page because their website is Flash based. :mad:

[TTFD]

I also fly EC225s and wear Seregeti Drivers (non-polarised). I tried the gradient versions but found them to be not too good when sun was reflectiong off the water during offshore approaches due to the lightening of the lens towards the bottom. Great for driving but not so good for looking out hovering over water. The Drivers are perfect. No problem with seeing any of the screens or the radios with their LEDs.

I also have tried Silhouette sunglasses (polarised) and again no porblem with the screens, but did have problems seeing the radio frequencies as they were blanked out by the polarisation of the lenses as my head turned to look down.

I have found the Seregeti Drivers (non-gradient, non polarised) to be the best sunglasses for me for flying.

[EN48]

Serengeti website

Is here:
Serengeti Eyewear (http://www.serengeti-eyewear.com/index_en_na.cfm)

This seems to imply three brown lens choices (for Drivers): 1) non gradient, non polarized; 2) gradient, non polarized, and 3) non gradient, polarized. If I have this right, all gradient lenses are non polarized. But, not sure that I have this right! :sad:

[Bravo73]

Yep, that's obviously the website but unfortunately it's not possible to link directly to relevant page (due to the flash).

Click on 'LENS' (at the top of the page) then 'Glass Lenses' (on the left menu). Then you can click on the individual lens types: Drivers, Drivers Gradient ('Ideal for Pilots', apparently!) and Drivers Polarized. It's only with the third type that 'you get the added protection of the Serengeti polarizing technology'.

[EN48]

It's only with the third type that 'you get the added protection of the Serengeti polarizing technology'.

Did all that and my take is that if your Drivers have a brown gradient lens, they are not polarized. Right? :cool:

[Bravo73]

Did all that and my take is that if your Drivers have a brown gradient lens, they are not polarized. Right? :cool:

Nope. Drivers Polarized have a 'versatile brown lens' but they are, surprise, surprise, polarised. :ugh:


Actually, I've just re-read your post above:


This seems to imply three brown lens choices (for Drivers): 1) non gradient, non polarized; 2) gradient, non polarized, and 3) non gradient, polarized. If I have this right, all gradient lenses are non polarized. But, not sure that I have this right! :sad:

Why do you think that the '3) non gradient, polarized' lenses aren't polarised?

[EN48]

Why do you think that the '3) non gradient, polarized' lenses aren't polarised?

What we have here is a failure to communicate. I said " if your Drivers have a brown GRADIENT lens then (apparently) they are NOT polarized." This would be 2) in my list. For 3) the Serengeti web site clearly describes these as having brown polarized lenses, but says nothing about GRADIENT, suggesting that polarized lens do not have a gradient tint, and implying that Drivers with a gradient tint are not polarized. Is that perefectly clear? :E

I am belaboring this as all the Drivers I have owned have a gradient lens and are hopefully not polarized. Trying to put this to rest once and for all. Thanks for your patience! This has been a challenge to pin down as the Serengeti web site doesnt seem definitive and the online merchants who sell these seem to be even less infornative (Amazon).

[Bravo73]

Enough. I'm out. :rolleyes:

[EN48]

Enough. I'm out.


You give up too easily! This is an issue right up there with solving world poverty or bringing about world peace. Inquiring minds want to know! :ugh:

I will call Serengeti/Bushnell tomorrow and will post what they have to say.

[Gomer Pylot]

I think the gradient lenses are non-polarized, at least mine are not, but I wouldn't be willing to bet the rent money on it. If the lenses are polarized, there should be a notice on the glasses somewhere. Buying them online, though, makes that hard to determine in advance. I don't buy sunglasses online, because I want to try them on and see how the world looks through them before buying. YMMV.

[EN48]

I think the gradient lenses are non-polarized


I now think so too. After poking aroung on the Serengeti web site some more, I found a link to their catalog and this seems to make it pretty clear that the model 5222 Large Aviator Gradient (and other Drivers gradients) are not polarized. I am still going to call the company tomorrow for a hopefully definitive answer.

[EN48]

Drivers Gradient - Non-Polarized



Talked at length today to two different folks at Serengeti/Bushnell. The tech rep said that in the current product line of Drivers brown glass lenses (shown in the catalog section of the Serengeti website) , if it is GRADIENT, it is NOT POLARIZED. The Large Aviator 5222 model is GRADIENT and is NOT POLARIZED. He could not be 100% certain that there are no previous models which are both gradient and polarized.

Now that this is put to bed, we can turn our attention to lesser issues such as reducing the U.S. budget deficit. :cool:

[FlyingCarpet]

Going on holliday to Fort Lauderdale next week and one mission was to try and probably buy a pair of Serengeti sunglasses. Sunglass Hut does not have them in any of their stores in Fort Lauderdale. Neither the store at Heathrow or Vhicago O´Hare which I am passing on my trip.
Sports Authority might have the Aviator modell, but I am looking for the Velocity.
Any advise? They are kind of expensive not to try out first.

[Bravo73]

The US Serengeti website has a dealer locator:

Serengeti Eyewear (http://www.serengeti-eyewear.com/sales/dealers/index.cfm)


There would appear to be 4 Serengeti stockists in Fort Lauderdale.

HTH

[FlyingCarpet]

Thanks, I had a look at the Store Locator earlier, but the smaller Optical shops are closed on Sundays so I need "mall size" locations.
On my way home I got one day in London as well. Any suggestions where to find Serengeti dealers near central London?

[Bravo73]

On my way home I got one day in London as well. Any suggestions where to find Serengeti dealers near central London?

Yep, the dealer locator! :rolleyes:

EYE CONTACT
UNIT 2 THE ARCADE, LIVERPOOL STREET
EC2M 7PN CENTRAL LONDON
UNITED KINGDOM
0207 626 7232

EYELINK
11 LUDGATE BROADWAY
EC4B 6DU CENTRAL LONDON
UNITED KINGDOM
0207 329 4462
Eyelink - Website coming soon... (http://www.eyelink.co.uk)

GREGORY & SEELEY
63 FLEET STREET
EC4Y 1HT CENTRAL LONDON
UNITED KINGDOM
0207 353 1408

OPTIX AT BROADGATE
2 EXCHANGE ARCADE
EC2M 3WA CENTRAL LONDON
UNITED KINGDOM
0207 628 0330

[FlyingCarpet]

Thanks!
Stupid me could only see the first four countries in the roll menu!

[andrew172]

Hi guys!

I would like to know what do you think about these RE RAPTOR (http://www.randolphusa.com/product-categories/sunglasses/#raptor) glasses? Is there a better choice at this price? (about 100 €) Do they offer optimum protection? I want to buy glasses for protection in flight, not really for style or others. Can anyone tell me what is the difference between rounded-shape and this narrow style glasses from this point of view? Which is better?

Also, they come in grey true color or green lenses and, as I know, I can't switch between them after buying, so what to choose?

At the moment, I'm a student pilot, so I fly VFR small planes but I would not mind to use these glasses in the next flying years.

Thank you very much!

[Peter3127]

Good enough to go on the moon ....

And they don't have the current contract with USAF so the are cheap. Bayonet type temples are great under headset.

A bit heavy on nose but optics are great and cheap ....

AO History (http://www.aoeyewear.com/documents/history.html)

[SASless]

The Classic Aviator's were standard American Military issue for years and years...and were the best overall Sunglasses I have ever had. Ray Ban's were good but expensive and not very durable.

The Bayonet ear pieces are great....very comfortable and long lasting.

Replacement parts are cheap....and available.

Very good value for money!

[Snarlie]

A friend of mine got some very good Ray-Bons from the second street trader down from Starbucks in Glyfada a few years ago. He swears by them and they cost him 6 Euros. I expect the guy is still there.

[HueyDog]

Was just in Glyfada and got a pair. Liked them so much I bought two extras. Much better when I walk away and leave a set of 6 Euro sunglasses on some restaurant table than a 150 Euro set and they work just as well.:ok:

[Urshtnme]

Maui Jim's Peahi's

These things are awesome. Try them.

[Um... lifting...]

If you fly a glass cockpit, Maui Jim and all other polarized sunglasses are worse than useless.

[soggyboxers]

The FAA has advice for pilots on sunglasses
Sunglasses for Pilots: beyond the Image (http://www.faa.gov/pilots/safety/pilotsafetybrochures/media/sunglasses.pdf)

Polarized lenses are not recommended for use in the aviation environment. While useful for blocking reflected light from horizontal surfaces such as water or snow, polarization can reduce or eliminate the visibility of instruments that incorporate anti-glare filters. Polarized lenses may also interfere with visibility through an aircraft windscreen by enhancing striations in laminated materials and mask the sparkle of light that reflects off shiny surfaces such as another aircraft’s wing or windscreen, which can reduce the time a pilot has to react in a “see-and-avoid” traffic situation.

If you're flying a helicopter, it's likely that the cockpit will be a fairly high noise environment, so it's also a good idea to have sunglasses with close-fitting arms which are not too thick so they still allow a good seal for the headset. Most helicopter headsets apply enough pressure to distort the frames, so a fairly sturdy frame is also sensible if you want your glasses to last.

Neutral grey lenses cause less colour distortion, though when I was flying in dusty or hazy conditions, I preferred a brown tint. I always liked Serengetti, Randolph or Ray Ban when I was flying. It's always a matter of personal choice and I have a few different pairs for different things - very dark lenses for Africa, polarised for use in or near water.

[garretdalton]

I am looking for advise on sunglasses. I have been told by my company that I need to fly with ANCI approved safety glasses. I don't wear regular glasses (reading, driving or flying) but I do were regular rayban non polarized sunglass when I fly.


Money is not an option as the contract will pay for them. I an thinking that transition sunglasses would be nice but not sure if they work in S76 with regular windshield. I also like wrap around style so light doesn't get in at the side. I also like thin frame / arm for better noise canceling and of course light weight.....an I asking too much???


Any and all advise is greatly appreciated.

[John R81]

Oakley do a very nice safety spec - full safety marking on the lenses / frame so no arguments with management. Good wrap-around style with no wind / light leakage, impact resistant & high-velocity impact resistant. The brown tint gives great cloud definition I find it easier to spot other aircraft VFR.

The arm is straight - does not bend around your ear - but the arms are flat against your head. I use Bose NC headsets and first time I used them there was slight sound leakage. Some adjustment was needed to address this.

Although you don't need them, they are available in prescription and variable bifocal. For the latter, they have a design for golf which gives a very small reading strip at the base which is enough to read a map / checklist, etc but is out of line of site for departure / approach.



I recently paid £450 for mine in prescription bifocal. Also use them for shooting (as safety glasses) and motorcycle.

[bvgs]

I ordered a pair of Ray bans and got my vari-focal prescription in them and got them with a grey gradual tint. Have to say I'm delighted with them, whether they will help me with my training on my new (new to me) helicopter without a governor, time will tell haha.

[Count von Altibar]

Sunglasses hut at Heathrow stock a reasonable lineup of Serengeti and give an aircrew discount I believe around 10%. Alternatively flightstore.co.uk have a good selection to order online. Best place to get them is the USA like most things they're much cheaper.

[jayteeto]

Aldi, 3:99 with interchangeable lenses. I have worn them for years

[Modtro]

Got a pair of Arnette's 4139 a few years back and had the lenses replaced to brown color and level 4 for those days with extrem light and the other one with a yellow tint. All have a scratch resistant coating and are not polarized. I love that plastic frame as it is very comfortable with headsets or a helmet. They are sturdy as hell.