Advice for a new ME CPL

[captain cumulonimbus]

Hi all.

Just a quick opinion-seeking exercise here,promised i'd get some input for a friend of mine who is in this position.Scenario is this:

A newly qualified Multi Engine IF rated CPL in South Africa,220 hours TT plus or minus,with around R80 000 available for a decent rating.Firstly,what rating would be best? Apparently he's happy working for free for a while,perhaps right seat on a twin turbine,paying his own rating.

Input here? who would be best to approach in SA if anybody?

In your knowledge are there any Kingair 1900 operators who would accept him?

regards,
Cb.

[reptile]

I'd tell a 1Time hostie I'm a pilot.....and then spend 80Gs' to wine dine her. Right down your alley, hey Cb!:ouch:

[reptile]

How do you spell L O S E R ?

[Cessnafan]

There's a sharp and likeable chappie who has just above 1500TT with us who did his ATP test and BE20 P2 rating all in one with a reputable DE(lots of moolla later), sorry we cant use him, as much as we'd like to let him fly he has no hrs on type, Our clients demand hrs on type even for co-joes. Dont spend that cash unless someone guarantees you the job!

[Shrike200]

Apparently he's happy working for free for a while,perhaps right seat on a twin turbine,paying his own rating.


....must...control.....fists....of....death.. :mad: :{

[Stan Schroeder]

Ahmen Shrike......que starts behind me:mad: :mad: :mad: :ouch: :ouch:

[B200Drvr]

If he is willing to fly for free, then maybe he is willing to pay to fly.
Companies that do contracts dont care if he is willing to fly for free, in fact that is worse because they have no control over him, he can just adopt the "well I dont get paid for this" attitude.
The best thing your friend can do is throw his money at an instructor rating with multi engine and build the hours and gain experience before jumping into a B200 or 1900. With no disrespect, a co-jo with 200 hrs total time is more a hinderance in a King-air than a help when things get busy, you have to do his job, your own job and make sure that he isnt c#cking anything up at the same time. Contract flying is alot of fun, but it is not the best place to learn to fly.

[Dammit]

Some guys get a few hrs in a BE20 and the next thing you know they are G-Ds. Its a lite twin!!! Its laid out in such a way that you can fly it single crew. Its even legal to do so. You boys need to get a life. I have flowen with low houred co-jos in BE20s and they were better then some of the cpts I have seen. Just because your a contract jock dosen't mean your out there doing a job no one else can do. Next time keep quiet if you don't want to help and only want to stroke your own ego.....

[strong medicine]

:ok: i couldnt agree more dammit.... ive got some time on the 200 myself and think its a pleasure to fly and favours low time guys. recently flew with a 200 odd hr copilot who deserved to be in the aircraft more than some guys ive flown with who've been in the machine for years. ultimately the quality of both the conversion to type and the commitment of the guy receiving the rating will determine his skill in the aircraft. if things start hotting up in there i'd rather have 2 proficient pilots than just me and my overinflated opinion of myself (- wow, would that be CRM?!).... just a thought.... use it, dont use it!

[Solid Rust Twotter]

It's an open forum, mate. As long as we remain within the forum rules we can pretty much post what we please.

As for not helping, anyone who is willing to pay for a rating and fly for free is denying a job to those of us who have no option but to earn a living the usual way. A good co-joe is an asset but one who isn't keeping up can get you killed, even in a single crew certified aircraft. Certain NGOs have requirements which restrict crews to those with experience levels above what a new hire low time CPL has. They pay the salaries at the end of the day so their rules are the ones that count as long as they don't conflict with CAA regulations.

[Dammit]

Shrike 200. What on earth are you going to do with your "fists of death"? Either daddy paid for your rateing or you have just forgotten what it is like to start out in this game.

[Shrike200]

Relax, Dammit. Be calm. I was referring to the fairly commonly held view that we as pilots tend to shoot ourselves in the foot by offering our skilled services for free, or even worse, paying to do so. My tongue was mostly in my cheek, hence the (obviously) comical response. Or maybe it wasn't so obvious.

Myself, I sweated in the instructors role for 1000+ hours before getting a decent break - I had no cash to pay for a rating. I learned a lot, and it wasn't so long ago that I've forgotten what it was like, so calm down. Watching guys get ahead by offering to fly for free and pay for their ratings was mildly irritating at the time, but I knew it was the industry reality, and still is. I had a family to feed, homeloans to pay etc so that option was not available to me, but like everyone else here I still managed to progress. In retrospect, I feel I got a better deal actually.

I hope that was serious enough for you. I understand your point of view, and I hope you understand mine.

[B200Drvr]

Dammit,
The 200 might be a light twin, it may also be a single pilot aeroplane, but it is right at the top of the food chain for light twins, and if we are to believe what you are saying, then why cant he just go and fly as P1 in the thing, after all its just a light twin!!!!
Some people are just so full of cr@p, what I was saying is that he would be better served getting more experience in a familiar enviroment.
We all started somewhere but contracts require high minimums, is that because they dont know what they are talking about and you do? I doubt it Rocket Scientist, it probably has something to do with the experience level required in the theatre we fly in.
If you want to fly with him go ahead, thats your decision, I would rather be flying with the guys I am at the moment, thanks.
As for my posting, that is my point of view, as for my experience, dont make assumptions, rather keep the trap shut, you just making a d!ck of yourself.
You have a nice day now!!
FURTHER TO THIS, READ MY POST AGAIN, I DID OFFER ADVICE, WHICH IS THE ROUTE I TOOK.

[Dammit]

Shrike200. Point well made and sorry for any offence. You have to admit though when you read these threads that some of the contract boys make a big deal out of there job when infact its just another flying job.

B200Drvr. You seem to be a classic example. Dude I know all about contracting. I got a few hrs in a 200 in Africa and other places. Don't be silly now about the P1 thing. He wants a job as a co-jo and why not. If you are half as sharp as you make out you should be able to fly the plane and teach the fellow a few things at the same time. The rest is then up to him. It is a rather different kind of job but the challenges are just as real as they would be in any other sector of aviation. If I was still on 200 he would be welcome to come fly with me.
Your posting is yours and mine is mine. You are so right and I am fully intitled to wind you up. I will have a great day thanks.:ok:

[strong medicine]

what amazes me is how some guys seem to develope an ego in direct proportion to their experience!

ive seen guys with 200 odd hrs to a gear up and ive seen guys with 10 000 plus do the same thing.
same goes for all other aspects of flying.

me, id rather be flying an instrument approach into kabul with the 200 hr guy who knows his limits and still applies himself diligently to his procedural flying than the guy with the inflated ego and a bit of time on type who has already become complacent and mistakenly thinks that numbers alone in the 'ol logbook is enough to carry him.

[B200Drvr]

Now where did "ego" and "complacent" come into it??
Those are individual traits that can occur in anyone and have no place in aviation in a 200 or 10000 hr pilot. However, they do occur, in 200hr and high time pilots, flying time does not dictate this, the personality does.
Once again I would rather be flying down an ILS into Kabul or anywhere for that matter with a guy who has 1000 hrs with some instruction time, maybe a few hundred hours of Senenca time and some charter time than a 200 hr pilot who paid for a King-Air rating straight after his comm.

[napoleon]

Send me a PM and I'll put him onto a job flying a LET 410 for a year and he will get paid.

[strong medicine]

ego - says ive got a couple of hundred or thousand hours on a 200 and im that good that i think i need to spend more time making sure the guy next to me isnt coc#ing up rather than concentrating on doing what im supposed to do (that last bit- complacent... im not gonna whip out the oxford but if i got a guy watching every move i make in an aeroplane it tells me hes complacent about doing his own job!). if the new guys training is thorough and complete and he knows whats going on hes fine.
dammit had a point earlier- contract flying isnt some special type of flying that requires the "right stuff" and years of experience. its a flying job where you happen to live in another country where the language is probably different. sorry to burst your bubble ..... MAVERICK.... fade to sunset scene, motorbikes on runways and porno 80's music

[Dammit]

Nice one strong medicine. I have to wonder if B200Drvr can actualy ride a bike. Its clear he has spent all his time mastering the art of flying to very complicated BE20. If I was this guy I would take up the offer on the LET410. Twin turbine time:ok:.

[Desperate Wannabe]

Hey Napoleon
Who do I need to kiss up to to get on that Let410 list:)

[napoleon]

send me a PM

[captain cumulonimbus]

hi there.

what are your requirements then? where is it operating?

cheers,

Cb

[squeekybrakes]

Hi Cb

I am in the same situation as your friend except i only have a single comm I.F.

Ive sent the c.v's out everywhere aswell and gone to visit quite a few places with no luck at all!! :hmm:

I have now resorted to doing my Instructors to get the hrs ticking aswell as the experience.
Qualifiying as an instructor has its advantages and should make you more marketable in future.:rolleyes:

Anyway thats the path im taking at the mo, cant sit and wait for forever!