Piloting in USA

[davepearsall]

Excuse my ignorance in the subject but here it goes.

It may sound nieve (spelling) but my dream is to do my APP at OAT and eventually emigrate from the UK to live and work as a a first officer/ pilot in the USA.

I was wondering if anyone had any information which could be of use to me on this matter. Do airlines such as AA, Southwest or any of the United States based airlines recruit pilots from other countries or are there too many in the USA training as it is.

Many thanks. Any information in this general field would be much appreciated.

[boogie-nicey]

first off, if you want to fly in the USA you really need to think more about VISA rather than flying as a first port of call. You may realise that it's no easy task to just get into the USA, however in the short term there is the J-1 Visa scheme but I'm no expert. This will allow you to stay and study there , leading perhaps to some restricted work as a instructor or something similiar upon which you might be able to extend it.

Also you don't need to spend all that money and grief training at OAT in order to fly in the states. For the pirce OAT charges you can train in the states and get a type rating on the NASA Space Shuttle :) If you want quality schools why not try Flight Safety (now there's a flight institution). They are a heck of alot cheaper and if you decide or cann ot get to stay in the states then at least you have something that you can return to the UK/Europe with and convert it.

[davepearsall]

great info. thanks very much

[scroggs]

You will need the right to live and work in the USA. That's not easy to come by if you have no US relations. Have a look at the US Embassy site for further Visa and immigration information. You'll find the whole subject is a lot more complex and involved than you think.

Scroggs

[davepearsall]

Yeah I know it is hard. Maybe we (united kingdom) should take a leaf out of their book!! But thats just my opinion.

Luckily my long term girlfriend is a qualified nurse and would also love to live in the states. So maybe somewhere down the line if we were married I would be able to live in the states.

Might not mean working as a pilot for a while but at least I would have my foot in the door.

[A320rider]

if you marry a US girl, you can ask for a temporary work permit the same day you go out of church and apply for a residence permit (green card).
process time is 6-12 months, but during this time, you can work in the US.

[LAX]

davepearsall

I think you wiil find this subject has been done to death on pprune if you do a search. With low hours the JAR and FAA systems are completely different when it comes to getting your first job, the JAR system based on quality hours, the FAA on get as many hours as you can. A JAA (f)ATPL with low hours is useless to you in North America and vise versa. If you want to go do the equivelent US Integrated progam try, flight Safety (As mentioned), Pan Am Acadamy, Comair etc and a whole bunch of other Schools for example based at Deer Valley Airport in Arizona.

Bear in mind when you search these forums there are many threads on guys\gals from the US and Canada wanting to convert to JAR. The Job market for even experienced pilots sucks big time over there never mind wannabes. Thats why many are jumping at the oppertunity to work for the likes of Ryanair, Thomas Cook etc.

If you marry your girlfriend its definately a way (a great way) in to get your green card and probably the best lifestyle and standard of living in the world:ok: . Immigration to the USA is very complex and you will need a good Immigration Lawyer.

I have heard rumors that the US Airlines are reluctant to employ pilots resident on Green Cards? I would be interested to hear from anyone who can confirm or deny this?

Good Luck

[Acomabird]

davepearsall

I have heard rumors that the US Airlines are reluctant to employ pilots resident on Green Cards? I would be interested to hear from anyone who can confirm or deny this?

Good Luck

I work for a "legacy carrier" and have flown with many foriegn pilots. Most end up getting married in the states or get residency. Not sure where things stand now. It all depends on the hiring cycle, i.e., need for qualified pilots. But the fact is we haven't hired for a least 7 years and have 2000+ on furlough.

[davepearsall]

thanks. I would also be intrested to hear any information to do with this matter.

[A320rider]

I know that in the USA, they do not pay very well.
1500$/month for a regional copilot(1500-2000h before to start to aplly), based in LA or New York.
how can you make a living with that?

you can still work in a blockbuster shop or in a shoping mall for a minimum wage...(5,25$/hour??), or flip burgers in a mac do! so you wil get a taste of the american dream!:yuk:

[wesp]

By the way he didn't say his girlfriend was a US citizen, he only said she would love to live in the US. Now that's a different story. She is a qualified nurse here, the same with JAA and FAA that doesn't automatically qualify in the US. She has to take exams etc etc etc. (more difficult than getting FAA licenses).

Second even if she would get a H-1B visa you are not allowed to work as her partner/spouse.

I've been there, seen, tried it and there's only one way to do it, marry an american girl. As a pilot you can forget getting a H-1B anyway.

[LAX]

Wesp

Im not sure where your coming from here? As they are short of nurses in the US it is a profession that is sort after and you can be considered for a Green Card. As was being a truck driver at one time.

My sister is a nurse and went through the process. You get taken on my an agency who then take care of all the filing of all the docs with the then INS for the Green card (no visa = streight to Green Card process) You have to pass a fairly strict medical. After initially applying she waited in the UK for her Green Card to be issued for approx a year then got placed in a hospital in PHX. As for conversion of the nursing qualification there wasnt any?

On the subject of Visas............I was working on an L1 visa at one time. Partners initially couldnt work on it, just be resident, then about 4 years ago they changed the rules so they could apply for work authorisation. As I have said many times the Immigration process is complex, there are many types of visa and ways to qualify for a Green Card. Granted, the easiest way is to probably pay off a Mexican and get married.You need to discuss your individual case with an Attorney to get any definate answers they change the rules all the time.

[HillerBee]

As you say they change the rules all the time. What I'm saying is it is just not that easy and straight forward and definitely not done like that.

By the way I don't want to live in the States anymore, I'm very happy over here in the UK.

[ALV2500]

All airline applicants must provide a 10 background history. I'm not sure if a US airline would be willing or able to verify the history of someone who has not been in the US for 10 years. This rule came about just after 9/11.

On the subject of pilot jobs and greencards, it is against US law for someone to be refused employment on the basis of having a greencard only. Either you are legal to work or you are not

AL

[stefair]

Another option to gain legal residence status in the US is to win the greencard in the lottery. The great advantage is it would prevent you from getting scamed by those divorce loving US girls! :}

Bear in mind that you have to be married for a minimum of 5 years I think it is to be allowed to apply for the US citizenship. If your sweetheart decides to leave you before that day has passed you are very likely to be kicked out of the country. Don't know this for sure though and stand to be corrected.

I don't know whether it's true but I have read that folks holding UK citizenship are not permitted to participate in the greencard lottery for whatever reason?!

davepearsall,

If you want to become a pilot in the US go to America to one of the FTO's and obtain your FAA PPL, IR, CPL, MEP as well as your CFI ratings before starting to work as a CFI. While over there find yourself a woman who wants to marry you (might be more of a realistic route than the lottery ;) ). Furthermore bear in mind that the majors in the US require their pilot applicants to hold a college degree. This is absolutely compulsory! So if you are serious about flying professionally in the US you might want to get this out of your way first.

Good luck!

[BigGrecian]

Another option to gain legal residence status in the US is to win the greencard in the lottery.
UK citizens are not eligible for the Green card lottery.

As a pilot you can forget getting a H-1B anyway.
Not true - as long as you can prove your special skills, could be JAA licences etc and meet the other relevant requirements there should be not problem - a good immigration lawyer would help you out with that assuming you had a sponsor.

Process time is 6-12 months, but during this time, you can work in the US.
We have someone where I work who got married last year and still can't work flying over here until his green card arrives.

davepearsall - you will be wasting a huge amount of your time and an even bigger chunk of your money doing the APP at Oxford if you want to fly in the US.
Look into a degree scheme which includes the FAA rating over here - probably based on a J1 visa - if you find an employee which finds you valuable enough than an H1-B visa is probably the way forward - who should put you in touch with a relevant lawyer.
Either way you do your training if you first undertake JAA training you will have to convert to FAA, and vice versa! Most are training as required which is probably around 5-10 hours from JAA to FAA but most people for an FAA IR to JAA IR take 10 sim and 10 in the aircraft - possibly more.
Its an expensive and bureaucratic process. If I were you I would really question why you want to work in the US so much?
Good Luck.

[davepearsall]

Hopefully by the summer I will hold a degree: BSc (hons) Environmental Science. Not exactly what they would probably be looking for.

It is always an option to go and do my flight training in the USA but what is the point in doing so when I would not be able to live there. Also I understand that I would have to take further study after training in the USA to then become a pilot in the UK. :ooh: :ooh: :ooh:

[stefair]

UK citizens are not eligible for the Green card lottery.Isn't this exactly what I said?! :confused:

Stefair - you will be wasting a huge amount of your time and an even bigger chunk of your money doing the APP at Oxford if you want to fly in the US.Erm ... BigGrecian ... maybe you have missed out on some of my post? It's not me who would like to train with OFT, as I never would!!! It was our fellow davepearsall who said he wanted to train with them but live and work in the US as a professional pilot. :* Thank you though for your concern.

Hopefully by the summer I will hold a degree: BSc (hons) Environmental Science. Not exactly what they would probably be looking for.Any degree would do just fine. Know someone who is a Financing graduate and minored in French. After college she was working as a CFI before embarking on corporate flying. Whether she has already made it into a shiny airline jet I can't say.

In general any degree will be OK as long as you complete your studies. Obviously, an airline would choose an Engineering over a Sociology gradute, provided both applicants are of the same age and hold identical flying qualifications.

[cosworth211]

Sorry to drag it to the depths, but dump the lady, come and train in the US. Find a lovely US girl (130 million women+ out there), very easy with your english accent (trust me, from experience ;) ), marry her, how much do you want to realise your dream?

By the way, Hi Matt!

[night mission]

I tend to agree with Cosworth211, but a little off topic. Are you sure you really want to come to the states?? If you have only visited, or not even that, you should consider visiting and checking out where and how you would live, once here (irrespective of the VISA issue). And consider the advice about how hard it is getting flying jobs in the USA. Lot of Sh**y flying for Sh**er pay:{ . Something to think about.

[davepearsall]

The whole topic has shined a lot of light on the situation of flying in the states.

Through my niavity I presumed that the pay would have been roughly the same area as over here.

Thanks for all the information, much appreciated!

[night mission]

I don't have a good feel, re: pay in Europe vis USA. I know the entry level pay in the states is considered poor, sometimes ridiculously so. But maybe by European standards, not so. Oh course, cost of living and taxes need to be considered to properly make an apples to apples comparison. Need to do your homework on the BB and ask if you can't find it!:}

[ant1]

:hmm: Take a look at H-1B Frequently Asked Questions (http://uscis.gov/graphics/howdoi/h1b.htm)

As a CFI/II on a J1 visa I once contacted a lawyer and asked him what were the chances of getting one of these coveted visas. He told me my chances were slim and insisted on the specialty occupation issue.

He also told me that the position had to be advertised and no suitable US candidate found.

IMHO not so easy to get the H1B :(

[BigGrecian]

True for a FAA CFII etc
However, imagine being JAA qualified to teach multi IRs, FI(C) etc etc - that's a speciality skill over here....and I know people here who have achieved such a visa...

[fernytickles]

There seems to be a lot of speculation and misinformation on here with regard to visas. Try going to the USCIS website - all the correct and up to date visa info is on there, as well as info on the green card lottery and who can or cannot apply for it each year. It will also give you accurate info what is required for nurses to work here.
I doubt very much you will get a flying job with an H1 visa (been there, tried that). It is almost impossible to prove that no one else can do the piloting job for which you would be applying, based on the fact that there's an awful lot of American pilots trying for that job too. Now, should your girlfriend get a job with an H1 visa, and you marry her, you will be allowed to stay in the country, but you still will not be allowed to work. The advantage of the H1 visa is that the two of you can start the process of applying for a green card while you are living there and she is earning. On average, that takes about 3 years. Our work authorization card was issued 2.5 years after the process was started and the green cards arrived a year later. If she is working and you are learning to fly, around the time the work permit arrives, you should be all set to start looking for work... in a perfect world ;)
You can get a flying job with a green card (been there, doing that too), but there's a good chance the employers will take an American over you if there's more than one equally qualified applicant. Also, be aware that a lot of the airlines like their pilots to have a university degree at the moment.
Try the website for ALPA (US version of BALPA) to see if they give an idea of salaries for the airlines. To give you an example, I met a charter pilot the other day who flies a Piper Navajo. He had resigned from American Eagle after 7 years, mostly as an FO, with a short time as captain, to take this job. His lifestyle had improved 100%, no commuting, most nights at home and, so long as he was getting a minimum of two trips a week he was breaking even on his previous salary. The salaries for charter pilots are not usually anything to get excited about.
The good thing about flying here is the variety of opportunities that are available. Whether you want to fly for the airlines, fly charter, fly corporate, ferry aircraft, fly medical flights, fly float planes, bush flying, instruct, fly for the DNR (count wolves, bears and forest fires), fly water bombers, fly freight, fly warbirds, etc, etc if you put your mind to it, you should be able to do it.
If you look at the visa section of http://www.british-expats.com/ you will find a lot of informed advice on there, not speculation based on goodness only knows what.