Ryanair Dispatches

[XLBOY]

Wow now when know how ryanair makes its money!! Putting our lives in danger, shows the type of airline it really is now. What u guys think??

[justwannabeapilot]

Well guys and gals time to set the cat amongst the pigeons.

Having watched the Dispatches programme tonight I thought it only fair, if only for my own curiosity, if I posed the questions below.

Was this a case of proving that you "getwhat you pay for!" or sensationalist journalism at its best.

Discuss ..............

I would be interested to see CC, PAX, etc etc all having a say.

For now I am sitting on the fence. :ok:

[Lets Get Wasted]

found it extremely shocking.I wonder if they're skimping on tech issues ?

[TURIN]

Looked like they found one little issue and the rest was fluff.

How many CC check the life jackets before flt? As an engineer I do it on a weekly or monthly basis, and it takes an age.

As for the slide bottle pressure, they can and do change as the bottle warms up or cools down so it could easily change from a no-go to a go in a few minutes.

I'm glad we never had cameras in our training classes, tall stories fly around all day, the instructor does it to relieve the boredom!

As for the 'Ryanair don't care about their passengers' line. Well, we knew that didn't we?:ok:

[straightnotlevel]

very predictable, is anywhere any different?? i wasnt surprised at all, wat do people really expect??

youre not gonna get scheduled service on a low cost carrier ffs!!!

[XLBOY]

I agree to that straightnovel but safety should always remain at a high standard. especially in this day an age even if they sell a flight at £1.

[SallyEZY]

How many CC check the life jackets before flt?

I do and all my colleagues too. It's part of the preflight checks and my as the purser take an eye that that procedure will take place every turnaround, before the first and after the last flight........:ok:

[OzzieO]

I found it ok to watch but hardly think there was anything on it that was shocking or terrible.

I can see Ryanair management are going to have a shake up with the way they train cabin crew but thats about it.

[XLBOY]

also think they need to work harder and alongside with the BAA airport security, and make there turn arounds more longer even an extra 10 minutes would help ,

[angels]

Speaking as SLF I was surprised that the pay was only 14 quid a sector. Take away tax, NI, uniform (!!), travel etc and that must leave bugger all.

How do CC do it? Why? Is Ryanair seen as a stepping stone towards something more pleasant and profitable??

[XLBOY]

Ryanair dont care who they take cause there gettin money from anyone and thats all they seem to care about like any other airline you get ya training paid for and that shows the loyalty of the airline and just shows the difference of quality from crew to planes.

[VIKING9]

Speaking as SLF I was surprised that the pay was only 14 quid a sector. Take away tax, NI, uniform (!!), travel etc and that must leave bugger all.
How do CC do it? Why? Is Ryanair seen as a stepping stone towards something more pleasant and profitable??

There are lots of girls and boys coming from the former Eastern Europe and thus the poor salary offered at RYR is actually a big increase on what they would get at home, and they tend to share flats/apartments with 3, 4 or 5 others and thus keeping the individual rent down. Having seen sectors cheques from some RYR crew, I can say that the sector pay is not always as bad as it seems on the surface.

[Gatwick07]

I just think that any company should show respect to their employees. The Ryanair crew on last night's programme seemed to respect their employers highly....... unfortunately the respect didn't seem mutual. I felt sad that the Captain didn't have the power of most Captains in any other airline. Whilst I understand all airlines make mistakes and crew members become complacent, I've never known any airline to prioritise boarding passengers over security checks!!! Shocking!!

[Transat Hostie]

Hey, we've all been there. The Captain's on your back to get away again and you've no time to do everything on turnaround. I don't know how the FR guys and gals do it on 25mins, or the EZY crews too!

However, did find the training clips a bit shoddy. There's no point in showing how to pass something without actually remembering it! I think the training is outsourced to other companies though if I'm correct?

I wonder if we'll see any differences in the whole FR approach now that programme has aired?

[TURIN]

SALLYEZY

You and your crew must be a minority. In 22 years in line maintenance (hovering for a brew) I have never seen CC get down on their knees and individually check the lifejackets under the seat. That's on a number of airlines from as far afield as Australia, Far East, Middle East, USA, Northern and Southern Europe and the UK!

Not doubting you Sally, just never seen it meself.:ok:

[tart1]

It's 22 years since I stopped flying and we used to have to thoroughly check the lifejackets before every flight.

It is quite hard work getting down to see all of them and it would probably take 5 minutes or so. Obviously, time which could not be spared on a 25 minute turnround.

We didn't check them on turnround, the theory being I suppose that if some were missing, there wasn't a lot we could do about it!! :D

[XLBOY]

some airlines do check life jackets and i do and all the crew on the aircraft do, we check so many per sector depending on longhaul or short.. were meant to do it and are told in training so its the crews responsibility and if they dont its the individual not performing safety euipment check properly, then it comes down to a different matter.

[Turkish777]

What was that crock of s.... about seat 1A??? Anyway one heard that one before??

And to be fair as much as they got put down you must admit they do have an excellent safety record, I mean the amount of sectors that airline does each day (must be hundreds for the total fleet) and not one accident in 20 years...not bad...:ok:

[XLBOY]

But if there was an accident things wouldnt run smoothly as equipment ie slide wasnt pressurised and there for take longer to evacuate if they can. its the after effect of the emergency that arisen concern too, pilot fatigued isnt good and crew fatigue is also not good for such arising situations. things need to be eliminated before they happen not to increase chances

[flight_for_life]

The checking of lifejackets isn't just to check they're actually there and serviceable, but to check that something else more sinister isn't there.

[6chimes]

I wouldnt want to argue the rights and wrongs of how Ryanair do their business, all i would say to you folks that use the fact they have not had any incidents in the past 20 years.....................a good past safety record is no guarantee fo.......................................................... ..................(yawn).

tighter profit margins, what is left to give?

6

[Farrell]

This might need to be merged with the R&N thread

[Kosher Class]

Checking of lifejackets depends on an individual airline's SEP. Some airlines require crew to check seat pockets and lifejackets, others don't.

[EI-CFC]

However, did find the training clips a bit shoddy. There's no point in showing how to pass something without actually remembering it! I think the training is outsourced to other companies though if I'm correct?

So it seems. And while what we say may not have been perfect, I'd be hesitant to judge the whole 5 week course on 5 minutes of footage.

[VIKING9]

Oh 20 years flying, now about 100 B737's, perhaps roughly 7-800 flights per day, thats a lot of flying, and no accidents! You decide! :ok:

But plenty of incidents and ongoing investigations :rolleyes:

[hostienomore]

Thats totally untrue about cc only earning £14 per sector! They also get a basic pay on top of that! The cc can easily come out with between £1000 and £1600 per month, depending on how many sectors were worked.

[tart1]

Well, that was a question I asked on the thread in R&N but it went unanswered among all the other comments and arguments.

I could not believe that they only got the 'sector pay' that was mentioned.

I know people are desperate to become cabin crew but surely nobody would be so desperate that they would pay whatever it was (£1400?) to train for an airline which only paid £14 to £18 per sector. :oh:

[XLBOY]

I think its because they cant see themselves getting into another airline, also whats with paying for the uniform for wearing it lol, it takes the p**s, its a load os crap. hehehe printed ryanair on it lol

[DUBXH]

Looked like they found one little issue and the rest was fluff.
How many CC check the life jackets before flt? As an engineer I do it on a weekly or monthly basis, and it takes an age.:ok:


Actually... I had an off base crew member working one of my flights recently and she managed to haul something like 20+ expired life jackets out in an hour turnaround... I was impressed..

ANything that Dispatches exposed was either hear say, what we already knew or what we already know goes on.... I was looking forward to some juicy in flight scandal ! I was sadly disappointed...

[thunderbird-1]

Hello,

I would like to know how does it work for the Crewlink Recruitment of Cabin Crew for Ryanair. If some one know about that and can help me. Thank's

[sukigirl]

I didnt see this documentary but flew Ryan Air last week and once again when boarding the crew were to busy on the phone haveing a gossip with back galley to monitor the pax or boarding cards. Also we sat at an over wing exit but were not at any point breifed on procedures or asked if we aware it was an exit, which of course being crew i was but they didnt know that and most pax arnt realy aware of procedures. I think Ryan Air may also be skimping on their customer service training to!

[DUBXH]

I think Ryan Air may also be skimping on their customer service training to!


I'd rather not enter into a "Bash Ryanair Thread" hpwever I would like to highlight that while it is nice to receive good Customer Service from a service provider that you have paid money too is it really critical that you receive a smile and a wink after stropping out minimum funding for your seat ?

Maybe I am alone but to be honest I dont really care how I am treated as long as I get to the place I wanted to be without the assistance of a body bag... Easily pleased I suppose... :)

[sukigirl]

Should probably add that i paid almost £180 inc taxes and fees for a ticket to austria, it was a typical offer of £35 but over treble that for the return home, and not forgetting that they charge for being over your measly luggage allowance of 15kg. I think its a myth that Ryan Air always dish out cheap flights. I dont call that cheap for a less than 2 hour flight.
I think the point is that they are making millions in profit a year and still they skimp on the basic requirements.

[DUBXH]

Not wanting to seem as if I am gearing for an argument here and most likely soon to be slandered for taking this off topic but Why did you choose Ryanair if they werent the cheapest ?

[sukigirl]

Yes you are taking this off topic DUBXH, there were reasons but why is that so important to you? its not relevant because its not the point i was making.

It doesnt change the fact that it wasnt that cheap and if you look into the prices past the initial offer of 'wow we can offer you a ticket to x for £35' You are very likely to find its misleading. It sounds like we are talking about a budget airline on this thread that makes hardly any profit therefore they have to cut back on other areas such as proper checks on turnarounds, training crew efficiently etc. However thats not the case, This is a company that is probably making more profit than the major airlines such as BA, Virgin, BMI etc, Airlines that dont cut back in these areas because they wouldnt get away with it, so why is Ryan Air?

[DUBXH]

Should probably add that i paid almost £180 inc taxes and fees for a ticket to austria, it was a typical offer of £35 but over treble that for the return home, and not forgetting that they charge for being over your measly luggage allowance of 15kg. I think its a myth that Ryan Air always dish out cheap flights. I dont call that cheap for a less than 2 hour flight.
I think the point is that they are making millions in profit a year and still they skimp on the basic requirements.

Well you are as guilty as I...

The point I was trying to make is that you travelled with a LCC and paid a reasonably high fare, I was merely asking why you did that...

The fact of the matter is that Ryanair do not receive any preferntial treatment over other Airlines, such an allegation is ludicrous.

[sukigirl]

Sorry DUB but im not getting where your going with this at all and i dont think your getting what im saying. I dont know what im supposed to be guilty about and I dont want to know, please can we just leave it there now.

Just wandering if there will be more of an investigation into FR now or if the dispatches programme will even stand as any evidence. I didnt know they had to pay for thier uniforms, how much do they have to pay? Do they really have to pay for their training?

[DUBXH]

Yes you are taking this off topic DUBXH, there were reasons but why is that so important to you? its not relevant because its not the point i was making.
It doesnt change the fact that it wasnt that cheap and if you look into the prices past the initial offer of 'wow we can offer you a ticket to x for £35' You are very likely to find its misleading.

My response...

Well you are as guilty as I...

The point I was trying to make is that you travelled with a LCC and paid a reasonably high fare, I was merely asking why you did that...

they have to cut back on other areas such as proper checks on turnarounds, training crew efficiently etc. However thats not the case, This is a company that is probably making more profit than the major airlines such as BA, Virgin, BMI etc, Airlines that dont cut back in these areas because they wouldnt get away with it, so why is Ryan Air?

My reponse...

The fact of the matter is that Ryanair do not receive any preferntial treatment over other Airlines, such an allegation is ludicrous.


In my opinion The Dispatches programme could give no evidence.... Very much of it was "hearsay" They were short of Michael O Leary standing in front of the camera saying "It is company procedure to have crew fake their refs..."

The fact that there were blank BAA Temporary passes lying idle around the STN crew room would prompt one to question BAA's security procedures... However I could see no actual fault by Ryanair crew at any time through the program... Just a lot of pi$$ed off staff...

[tart1]

I think the point made by sukigirl is a valid one: flying Ryanair is not always the cheapest option.

I made this point early in the Ryanair thread on R&N. If you book your journey late and close to the departure time, you may end up paying as much as the full-service carriers. Also, if you have to change your details or departure date in any way, it will cost you mega bucks. :p

[DUBXH]

Eh ? That's the point... Dont book late and dont make changes.

[tart1]

Dont book late and dont make changes.

Well if you have such a perfect life that you never find yourself having to book a flight just a few days before departure or having to make a change to a long-booked flight, then you are truly blessed, and Ryanair is the perfect airline for you!! :)

[DUBXH]

Thats just cool... :)

[terminal2]

Wonder if anyone can assist. Trying to find an editorial regarding a leaked management document that describes various ways to encourage a higher staff turn-over.
Does anyone have the link for this?

[737ng]

I've worked for RYR for almost 3 year and i say that it was hard work but dispatch can find crew sleeping in the Jumpseat and security check on turnaround not done properly in the majority of airline. Avery time i've called for cleaners to clean sick from the seat they've always done it without problem. The breafing compared to the one i have now in the major uk airline i work for was very hard, every little problem from a bulb in the cabin or a minor problem in the flight deck has been always been sorted out from the engineer very quickly and efficently. The way we secure the cabin for landing and take off is one of the best i ever seen flying with lot of different airline. We always had on a % of flight a day mistery pax onboard to check for the job done properly includind safety issue like toilete check and cabin secure. I could go on with other example .. Just think that around there are so many airline wich are really very dangerous and dont point to RYR just becouse is Ryanair. I thank them for having given me the chance to learn the job quickly and be able to work now for a major airline.
20 years around and never had an incident !!! this means something. Not even a major airline can show this record.

[EI-CFC]

Wonder if anyone can assist. Trying to find an editorial regarding a leaked management document that describes various ways to encourage a higher staff turn-over.
Does anyone have the link for this?

I have a vague feeling you may be thinking of Aer Lingus

http://www.rte.ie/business/2005/0720/aerlingus.html

[terminal2]

Stand corrected....
Cheers!

[scobie]

With regards to the not being briefed at the o/w exit...
It is only a requirement of the UK CAA that pax at exits are briefed prior to departure... as FR falls under the IAA they are not required to do so (anyone from excel who was around last year or so would know that FR crew who were operating on excel 800's on behalf of FR were re-trained and licensed to operate on the 'G' reg and hence did brief pax on those flights!)
With regards to the allegations made in that programme, I have been with the company for just under 5 years and would not be here if there was a problem! I know that when i am flying, my crew follow SOP's 100% and give 100% customer service (I'm a CSS and i wont have it any other way!) because even I have been 'stung' at a ticket desk for €200 after forgetting staff travel, so i know not everyone is a '£1' pax! Once again, the few ruin our reputation!
And yes, we check life jackets... though again, IAA require only 15% of capacity on 1st sector and 5% on t/arounds not an entire a/c check as perhaps other authorities require! Check 4 rows on the t/a and it's done!
The training is one of the best programmes around... I can guarantee this first hand... (can't reveal too much!) I know of people from other airlines who have been shocked at the amount of information FR crew have to assimilate before flying! It is tough.. that i can guarantee!
The people in the programme are exactly as we have heard of in any company; people bitching about work! We all do it! These poor saps got caught! Again, the attitude of a few crew ruin it for the rest of the company! And if all they can get is that in 5 months with the best edditing available... it's a poor show!
The bottom line is, FR are a success because they set the tune and everyone HAS to dance to it... it's the only way to KEEP them successful!
So please can we put this to bed? FR is not the big bad airline treating the staff like slaves... that's just the crap from ex employees who didn't want to dance to the FR tune!
Safety is not comprimised! The cabin staff are some of the hardest working in the industry (no diss to other crew - lets face it, we all do the same job... different uniform and paint job on the a/c!) and the training is some of the hardest in the industry!
Just to rekindle an old memory: BBC... undercover 'employee'... secret filming at Manchester... "Shock-horror major security breaches at bmi security!!!"... Yeah, exactly... how many of you decided not to fly bmi afterwards???
Now, off the soap box!

[DUBXH]

Good response.....