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View Full Version : EZY7116 Alicante to Liverpool? (Merged)


masalaairlines
13th Feb 2006, 11:15
Does anyone know what delayed this flight by more than 4 hours? Apparently the original outbound a/c developed problems on push back at LPL and by the time the spare got to ALC it had problems too. They had blocked off seats at the centre of the aircraft saying they would be "noisy"??, and then strange vibrations on the way back. (Felt like we were dragging a rope! ;) ) Flight took longer than normal, and by the time we were back (0250) LPL was closed so diverted to MAN.

GBALU53
13th Feb 2006, 12:26
The long time could it be the flight had to operate with undercarrage down??

If so the aircraft is restricted in cruising speed so taking a lot longer for the sector.

If the middle of the aircraft was blocked off this is the area where the undercarrage would be??

masalaairlines
13th Feb 2006, 17:08
Would be logical I guess. Though it somehow didn't sound like that characteristic gear down sound though. Then again... I'm no expert. They had many panels down under the fuselage before we were allowed on.
Well handled by the crew though :ok: You can imagine how irate passengers who have been sat around for over 3 hours (without refreshments and courtesy phone calls) will take everything out on the cabin crew as soon as they board the a/c! I don't understand how these new EU passenger rights are so blatantly ignored by so many airlines!

Mouser
13th Feb 2006, 18:04
Liverpool at present closes at midnight due to runway repairs.

Getoutofmygalley
13th Feb 2006, 18:06
I don't understand how these new EU passenger rights are so blatantly ignored by so many airlines!

I am sorry masalaairlines but you are talking complete rubbish. If you go to easyJet's web site and look at their 'Carrier's Regulations' you will see clearly that easyJet state that in the event of a delay of more than 2 hours, you will be entitled to a refreshment voucher and two free of charge telephone calls.

Handling in Alicante is contracted to Ineuropa, and they are responsible for ensuring that your EU rights are met. If you were not offered your two free phone calls and refreshment voucher, then you need to complain via easyJet.com to inform the company your basic EU rights were not met!

Assuming you knew you were entitled to refreshments and phone calls before you got back to LPL, why didn't you say anything to the Ineuropa staff?

I can assure you that when flights are delayed, refreshment vouchers are handed out - And I know this because I am cabin crew with easyJet!

red 5
14th Feb 2006, 08:01
Original aircraft G-EZJX went tech at lpl on pushback with a hard fault latched on the pseu and an idg fault. After return to stand and some t/shooting carried out it was decided to transfer the pax to another aircraft to minimise delay. G-IGOR was used however it was apparent that it would not make it back to lpl before departure due to runway closure at night therefore manchester was planned before departure to alc. The vibration in flt was due to the l/h pack turbofan being noisy and was replaced last night, hope this all helps.

daveandferdy
14th Feb 2006, 09:00
Travelled as a pax on Sunday night from Alicante to Liverpool. Due to depart at 21.00hrs. Arrived at airport and checked in 2hours before scheduled departure time. Had wife and two kids (age 2/4) with me. Nothing mentioned at check in regarding whether flight was on time. I went to the Easyjet office and asked. I was told that the flight would be 30 mins late, but outbound a/c had departed Liverpool.

To cut a long story short, we left Alicatnte at 01.00hrs local, having all been boarded by by 12.30hrs and sitting on the apron/ threshold.

At no time during the evening were we given any update about the whereabouts of the a/c or estimated departure time. The office had closed and there were no easyjet representatives anywhere to be found. At the gate, whilst waiting to board while the a/c is having a tech fault looked at, the easyjet rep is beind a glass door and refuses to come to the door when i request to speak to her. She simply waved me away with a look of contempt.

After we had boarded, the captain requested that passengers refrain from making comments to the crew about the delay. It appears the outbound a/c had gone tech on the runway and had to return to the gate, and everyone offloaded while a replacement a/c was sourced.

I accept that this is a totally valid reason for the delay, and in my view, a more than acceptable one.

The flight was 2hrs 30 mins. Some 2hrs 10mins into the flight, the capt comes on agian and announces that we are diverting to manchester as the runway at liverpool is closed for essential maintenance. We will be bussed from Man to Liverpool. Everyone goes bananas. Captain says he has been hoping Liverpool would be kept open and they were keeping it open as long as possible for us but unfortunately could delay the maintenance no longer.

At Manchester, coach driver and Servisair rep state that they have known for 7 hours that we were going to Manchester. It would appear that a long time before the a/c left Alicante, they knew they were going to Manchester. Arrived at Liverpool at 04.20hrs, i got home at 05.10hrs. (with departure to work some 2 hours later and some very tired chidren)

The point is, the delay and diversion were unavoidable and were not the fault of the airline. They have however no doubt been left with a large number of very unhappy passengers simply because of the way in which the matter was handled. They should know what is happening with the a/c and tell people. They can state that they are unable to commit as to when the flight will depart, but will let people know as soon as they do. They should have announced as soon as they knew they were going to Manchester that that was the case to allow people to make arrangments, as apposed to many having to make frantic calls at Manchester to get people to collect them there.

Instead, we were faced with no information, no courtesy, and what would appear to be deception regarding the trun situation. Did the Capt honestly not know when we left Alicante that we were going to Man? I suspect he did. If he did, he should not have pretended that it was only 20 mins from landing that he was made aware of the change of destination.

If airlines did not panic and stick their haeds in the sand in such cicumsatnces, they would not be left with disgruntled passengers. Delays happen, and most people accept this and if they don't then they are unreasonable. However, the manner in which the airline dealt with the delay was unreasonable. Before anyone starts, i don't accept that ethos that if you fly no frills you should expect a no frills service. You are entitled to common courtesy and to be kept informed. If we were told about the true extent of the delay and the eventual detsination, we could have made arrangments and found somewhere quiet to lay the kids down for a sleep. However, when you believe you may board any minute, it is impossibe to do this.

Don't hide from your passengers............ apply some basic customer service and courtesy and tell them the truth. In the longrun, this can only benfit the airlines reputation and pacify your fare paying passengers.

p.s. respect the the captain for standing where the coaches were due at Man and phoning Servisair and telling them in no uncertain terms to pull their fingers out and get the coaches sorted. Also respect to the co-pilot who had to deal with a particularly stupid female passenger who alleged that 'everyone knows you can't fly to Liverpool at night' and they therefore had been lying all along. He was very patient and calm.

Also, in climb out and for first 30 mins of flight, very disconcerting vibration/ creaking noise and shuddering from aircraft, coming in 'waves'. I am a frquent flyer and never heard it before. WOuld have to admit it was making me nervous.... any ideas?

masalaairlines
14th Feb 2006, 09:06
I am sorry masalaairlines but you are talking complete rubbish. ....
Assuming you knew you were entitled to refreshments and phone calls before you got back to LPL, why didn't you say anything to the Ineuropa staff?

Ofcourse I spoke to Ineuropa, or I wouldn't have a leg to stand on would I? They told me they had had no authorisation from Luton. I instisted they phone Luton to get the telex but they refused. I'm sorry, but I'm not talking rubbish as I do know my rights on this one, (and knew them at the time). To be fair to you, I did know that the EU law actually states that when the flight is over 1500 km, (as only marginally so on ALC to LPL) it states that refreshments are only necessary after a 3 hr delay (and 2 hours if less than 1500km). As management might have initially anticipated a 2hr 40 min delay (flight had been rescheduled to 23:35), legally speaking they may have been in the right (even though they were contravening their own Service standard as quoted by you!). Someone else in Luton had obviously done the distance calculation too!
However, in the end it turned out to be an almost 4 hr delay anyhow. We boarded at approx 00:30. Funny thing is that when the 3 hr margin on the ground had been crossed there were conveniently no catering facilities open!
Sorry, if I offended you as a CC for Easyjet, but as I mentioned earlier, my complaint was not with the cabin crew who did an excellent job when we were finally on the a/c, my frustration was just with the coordination between Ineuropa and Luton, to not be bothered to meet our basic rights, even after complaining!

masalaairlines
14th Feb 2006, 09:17
it would not make it back to lpl before departure due to runway closure at night therefore manchester was planned before departure to alc. The vibration in flt was due to the l/h pack turbofan being noisy and was replaced last night, hope this all helps.
Thanks Red 5. :ok: It's good to know what was happening. It's a pity Easyjet didn't tell us earlier that LPL closes and the flight was going to MAN (we were told 20 mins before landing!). If an announcement had been made whilst still on the ground at ALC, it would have allowed people to phone those picking them up to redivert! Then again that may have triggered a small riot amongst the PAX :D so tactfully handled I guess!

Stockpicker
14th Feb 2006, 09:20
Sounds more like one for AA&R, mate, but wouldn't argue with the need for more communication. The only thing I would disagree with is to say that the captain "knew" he would have to take you to MAN. Given that it was a strong possibility, they would have to have organised all the necessary backup well in advance. Doesn't mean he might not have lucked out at getting into Liverpool after all.

Tolsti
14th Feb 2006, 10:36
This flight/diversion is currently being covered in SLF... and the reason for the noise is also explained.

Navajo8686
14th Feb 2006, 11:34
Unfortunately airlines are no different to any other company despite what their mission statements about customer care may say!
Returned from Cancun on Thomson Saturday and ended up stuck at Manchester due to some problems caused by the check in agents at Cancun. That was not what upset the 120 of us flying onto Birmingham on the same plane - it was the total lack of any care towards us!
The initial problem was not apparently of Thomsons making but Thomsonfly had the perfect opportunity to do a couple of simple things which would have made us feel really good about them - instead we were treated poorly and advised by the captain not to get to angry.
We couldn't get drinks because the trolleys had been locked up but even if not unlockable (which everybody would have understood) surely someone could have appeared from the terminal with some cartoons of fruit juice.
A little touch would have made a big difference! Still at least they all followed the company rules so three cheers for that!

They never learn :(
Nav

daveandferdy
14th Feb 2006, 11:44
Red 5,

could you explain your comments re: the noise a bit more. As a pax i don't quite understand. It almost sounded as though there was a heavy load in the cargo hold, restrained by rope that was being pulled tight. It was a combination of vibration/ creaking. Quite disconceritng really. I fly regularly and this was the first time in years i have actually questioned a noise to myself and been left concerned. The capt had already reassured pax that there was no engine problem. If they knew what it was, perhaps they could have warned us regarding the noise and calmed any fears the passengers had. I certianly heard a number of comments about the noise during the flight.

thanks for your help

frostbite
14th Feb 2006, 12:11
Could it not also be that the Captain was kept in the dark about the destination change, and only advised when airborne?

G-CPTN
14th Feb 2006, 12:15
I haven't (yet) watched the Horizon Ryanair programme, but as I was checking the video, there appeared to be a similar incident, where a delayed flight was too late to reach the original UK destination, but the Captain (FO?) wasn't going to break the news to the pax before t/o.
One could say that it was inevitable and therefore not worthy of upsetting the pax before, thereby upsetting their flight 'humour', however, it does seem 'mean' though almost certainly not the fault of the crew (cabin or flight deck). What would pax do/feel if their coach was re-routed due to road closure?

daveandferdy
14th Feb 2006, 13:15
Thanks for the response so far.

I am being critical of the decisions that easyjet made vis a vis the flight or where they landed, the whole point is the manner in which the situation was handled.

I cannot prove whether the capt knew or not before we left. I am not in the industry and cannot access the information suggested above. I am not in the industry, if i can get this info, please let me know how. I have a suspician and that is all. Other pax knew before we left that we were not due into Liverpool until approx 04.00hrs which tie in with the diversion via Man. This info was shown on teletext.

I am not critising the crew at all (unless the capt did mislead us). The company would do better to be open in these situations. There would not have been a riot, yes moaning, but not as much as there was after the way they handled it. I am certian there was more damge done to their repution by the manner in which it was dealt with.

masalaairlines
14th Feb 2006, 19:52
For those who may be interested in further details of the topic brought up in this thread there is a thread in SLF:

PPRuNe Forums > Misc. Forums > Passengers & SLF (Self Loading Freight) >
EZY7116 Alicante to Liverpool?

From what I quote from Red 5 in that thread "G-IGOR was used however it was apparent that it would not make it back to lpl before departure due to runway closure at night therefore manchester was planned before departure to alc".

So it could have been told to us whilst we were still on the ground in Alicante! Would have at least allowed us to make alternative arrangements. I agree with the earlier post that this was deliberately not disclosed in order to pacify irate pax.

I may be harsh but I also suspect that as soon as EJ realised the eventual delay could be more than 5 hours (the point where you are entitled to a full refund should you wish not to fly AND a free flight home at a later stage).. this may have triggered a mass walkout, and indeed been a costly affair for Easyjet!

jettesen
15th Feb 2006, 11:50
Excuse me for being thick, but what alternative arrangements could you have made at midnight and no other flights departing alicante till the morning???? You still arrived back in the UK the quickest time possible.

Beleive me that if the capt had told the pax before, there would most definately have been roits! Been there before, and it is not pleasant for the poor cabin crew who might i just add are also delayed, and want to get home!!!! Everyone seems to forget that the crew too also have lives outside work, and want to get home just like everyone else

masalaairlines
15th Feb 2006, 16:21
What I obviously meant by "alternative arrangements" was that we could have at least phoned people who were waiting to pick us up in LPL, to come instead to MAN. (or called for taxis etc.) Fair Point eh?

If you read a bit higher up the thread you will see I mentioned this earlier, and also your point of them being tactical to not start a Riot. You see I do agree with you on that one, but a bit of a balance is required!

Droopy
15th Feb 2006, 17:32
It would seem that this flight isn't blessed - I was on board last night when it was diverted for a medical case to Brest...

masalaairlines
15th Feb 2006, 17:41
Sorry to hear that Droopy. I was chatting to someone else I met the other day who said they were on it a while back when it was also delayed and it was diverted to East Midlands as LPL was closed (and I guess MAN could not be arranged!) Did you at least make it into LPL before it closed down?

daveandferdy
16th Feb 2006, 07:42
Jettesen

You seem to forget one thing.......... the crew are paid to be there, it is thier job and upon accepting the job, they would be aware that delays would form part of their working day. The passengers however have paid to be there. They have paid to be provided with a service, which include the crew treating them accordingly. You say the crew have a life outside work..... they will do, but at the time they were at work so your comments are misplaced.