Afrikaans Professional Pilot [Archive]

Gunship

3rd Feb 2006, 06:42

I would like to share the following with you (as my time here is running out).

The World is small.... very small ..

26 years ago I met a great guy.

I was as Afrikaans as a boertjie you can be and get. From the West of Pretoria oke's ...ok well towards the North -West (just a little bit better) ;)
The only English I knew was to tell the Rooinekke and Soutpiele they are sheit. Yes my parents and all still came from the era of English vs Afrikaners ... consentration camps the lot.

He was from Durban. Needless to say he did not know what Afrikaans was :E

We clicked from day one in our own way.

We agreed to helpeach overcome this "burdon" by him speaking Afrikaans and me helping him and vice versa.

This changed my life and outlook that I had re Soutpiele.

Over the years we split apart but started making contact again about 10 years ago ... it so happens that he helped me getting a business up and running via a good referral.

The same Soutie is now coming up for us Afrikaners ...

Thank you 4HP Thanks for the past 9 years (first two on different names ) :E Also for the past 26 years ... hope to see you in December for the reunion. :ok:

The Wheel turns. Thanks mate. :ok:

God Bless you.

Gunsss

M. Vietze

3rd Feb 2006, 08:11

Count me in as well !!

Viva Afrique!

3rd Feb 2006, 09:07

This reminds me of the time they were telling us all Neil Robertson was really a GOOd GUY! Some really controversial language removed. Guys, by all means voice your opinion but keep it nice please. 4HP

Gunship

3rd Feb 2006, 10:10

Today 46 years ago ... looks like history took a turn today... :E

3 Feb 1960 - British Prime Minister Harold Macmillan delivers his "winds of change" speech to members of both Houses of Parliament in Cape Town, condemning apartheid.

barryt

3rd Feb 2006, 10:57

I wholeheartedly support my Afrikaans compatriots here. I think the owners of this site are missing a small but very significant point. It is not THEIR site, it is the USERS and POSTERS on the site, who OWN it! Mess them around, and well, you'll just lose "customers"....me included...

Solid Rust Twotter

3rd Feb 2006, 11:20

Errmm.....

Barryt, you may want to rethink that. The site belongs to one D. Fyne. As has been seen on JB on more than one occasion, the final say belongs to him. I'm getting the feeling this thing is being blown out of proportion somewhat and a request to start a purely Afrikaans forum should not have been a major problem. I don't think chucking one's weight around is going to solve anything, whereas reasoned debate and negotiation may go a lot farther.

The actual reasoning behind the move would be interesting, though. Any chance of a debrief, 4HP?

Viva Afrique!

3rd Feb 2006, 11:37

Some really controversial language removed. Guys, by all means voice your opinion but keep it nice please. 4HP
Dont you mean to say voice your opinion provided we agree with that opinion.......otherwise we will suppress your aforesaid opinion?

Viva, you made a personal attack on the owner of this site which was way out of line. I just saved your butt. (I think) Take it easy; it's not worth it. 4HP

4HolerPoler

3rd Feb 2006, 11:44

I've put the debrief on Campfire - where it belongs. It's exactly as SRT says; this is Danny's site and it's not up to us as the users to be telling him what he can & can't have here. Certainly we can motivate or make requests but it's his decision.

Please all take a deep breath on this issue; motivate or make proposals but avoid making rash statements which you may later consider were OTT.

Fly safe & take it easy. This thread has no aviation bearing but is topical so I guess we'll leave it here for a while.

4HP

George Tower

3rd Feb 2006, 12:14

Afternoon all,
To ban Afrikaans is in my view a very sad development for Pprune. I'm sure that 99.99% of all posting is done in English so I fail to see a problem.
As a pommie living in SA, after 10 years I can still only manage 3-4 sentences however, I'd hate to see you guys unable to post in Afrikaans. Although its all double dutch to me never once do I feel offended and excluded as a result. Its part of the culture of the country i love - simple as that.
Although I respect that Pprune is owned and run by Danny, it's priceless assest is the openness, experience, enthusiasm, encouragement (mostly) and passion for all things aviation of the people that contribute - particularly a certain chopper jock with a penchant for cheap red wine.:ok:
Lets hope that all is resolved soon and this proves nothing more than a storm in a teacup

Viva Afrique!

3rd Feb 2006, 12:44

Viva, you made a personal attack on the owner of this site which was way out of line. I just saved your butt. (I think) Take it easy; it's not worth it. 4HP
You made an attack on my opinion too! Dont save my butt you dont even know me. Let the Owner (or you hiding behind him) ban me he will just prove the fact that he his discriminating against a minority groups language for some unexplained reason. Is Hebrew banned too?

cavortingcheetah

3rd Feb 2006, 15:19

:uhoh:

I have copied the following from the moderation rules in the Cabin Crew Forum, posted on November 1st, 2004. I trust that this will not wobble wings.

...and if anyone has a problem with the way the moderators apply their editorial control over the forums that they put so much time and effort to look after on my behalf, then I will just apply my own personal rules and methods - which give a lot less feedback.

PPRuNe is not a free speech site. Never has been and never will be. It is MY site and I allow discussion of many aviation and even a few non aviation related topics. If I don't like something then I reserve the right to move it, delete it or edit it. PPRuNe membership now numbers over 80,000 people and is a testament the fact that neither I nor my moderators actually edit anyones post except to remove anything that is likely to cause PPRuNe harm, and rarely so at that.

Each forum is given autonomy by me for the moderators to control as they see fit. They work to a loose set of guidelines and in the case of this and a few other forums they are published as you can see above. Personally, I am not as kind and forgiving as the moderators of this and some other forums. I prefer to just wade in and if I find something is out of place or just a total waste of my and in my opinion the rest of the readerships time I will even just delete it. Anyone who has taken the time to type a long post whose content was maybe a rant or an attack or whatever, but was either a divergence from the topic or just a repeat of what had been mentioned earlier my have noticed that their handiwork had just disappeared. If so, it was probably because I decided that it wasn't worthy of a place on PPRuNe. Normally, I try to wait a bit and see if there is any merit on something before I delete a post, especially if it is obviously someone who is new to the forums. In the case of old time regulars, there is much less leeway. Funny thing though, most of the old regulars soon realise that their diatribes, if not suitable for PPRuNe, are removed and the lesson is learnt.

Anyway, enough of my 'hot air'. Each forum is moderated by one or more moderators who have been chose for their intellect, expertise and common sense. They provide their time and effort as volunteers as and when they can find the time to do so. There are always a few posters who either are not aware of this or choose to ignore the reality of the facts that this is a private website where editorial control is applied to a certain although limited extent. All I ask is that the posters and readers remain aware that the reason this website is still so popular amongst those of us who work in the industry is because of the dedicated moderation that prevents it all becoming one big flame war. If you are not happy with any aspects of the moderation, I suggest you use the 'Contact Us' link at the bottom of every page on PPRuNe or the 'Report this post' link on every post to make your views known and we will endeavour to see what can be done.

It would seem therefore, following a reading of this reminder that the hands of those who support the Afrikaans tongue are rather tied. I am not going to delve into my encyclopaedic knowledge of medieval English in order to establish that the roots of much of that language can be traced to a common thread with the now proscribed African one.:sad:

I think that we owe 4 Holer Poler a vote of thanks for fielding a tricky curved ball, which I very much doubt was of his choosing.

In as much as the damned thing is by now probably a fait accompli, I hope, speaking personally, that those amusing correspondents whose first language is now prohibited will continue to delight the pages of Pprune albeit in a tongue which they may feel inferior to their own.:D

birdlady

3rd Feb 2006, 15:44

George,

Could not agree with you more. Summed up what I had to say very nicely. :ok: :ok: Like you, Ive been living here for quite some time and I dont speak it very well but am trying to learn. Incredibly discriptive language and some things you can say far better in Afrikaans than you can say in english so I dont see why the odd sentance can't be used like it has been in the past. Politics perhaps........ :E :E :E

BAKELA

3rd Feb 2006, 21:24

From The Campfire...Afrikaans : So how many of us around ? Three less. Just read the post from Towers on the other Afrikaans thread on The Campfire and decided I'm not welcome here.
Signing off from PPrune now. 121.5. Good day!:(

Viva Afrique!

3rd Feb 2006, 21:35

The MY in capitals says it all ...........arrogant bigot.

Viva has left the building - permanently. 4HP

Africa Dog

3rd Feb 2006, 22:41

Boy's let me put my penny worth in, as a soetie totally hated having to learn afrikaans at school but even as sh:mad: t as my afrikaans is nowdays it is always good to be able to read some of the post's in Afrikaans, it is one of our mother tounge's, Boy's upstairs jy se pos.:ok:

Africa Dog

3rd Feb 2006, 22:50

4HP i am not taking a dig at you boet, higher up:)

B Sousa

3rd Feb 2006, 23:11

I was wondering how long you guys would go before the Pprune owners caught the threads. Same all over and a long thread in the caribbean and latin America forum.
As has been said take a deep breath, relax and get some Tassies for Guns.
Look, I hate some of the rules also and have been bounced a couple times for my lack of compassion for some who stepped on things I live for.
Bottom line is it aint my website and if I dont like the rules I have to go away.
So be creative, it gives 4hp something to do, besides if guns leaves who will cut and paste........

Gatvol <<<< before you edit that, its my Nevada license plate.

Spetsnaz

4th Feb 2006, 12:14

Somehow I feel like I'm standing inside a dingey nightclub and the bouncer is being unreasonable?

Shrike200

4th Feb 2006, 12:49

^^^ Yeah it does kind of feel like that, doesn't it!

The Claw

4th Feb 2006, 15:38

Listen to the wind...........watch the tumble-weed! :}

Reach out to your local customers with PPRuNe targeted advertising.

Would do, but where have they gone :confused:

SASless

4th Feb 2006, 15:40

Is this the forum for "jokes" now? Seems the Campfire went out...thus no other place to tell humourous stories of Africa flying.

SHARALUMI

4th Feb 2006, 15:48

The (camp)fire is no more. Time to move camp. Spot you oaks on the flipside.

Van 'n pi:mad:ed off koekie!

Guns, Bakela sê hy sal jou 'n mail drop. Hy wil nie eers lees wat hier aangaan nie.

Claw, read you a lot..."Would do, but where have they gone"...to another fire that has some character maybe?

Anyway, did not post a lot but read and was read to a lot. Cheers from Sharalumi...may peaceful waters flow...bungieeeeeeee!!!!!...

BRAKANJAN

4th Feb 2006, 15:56

Het my slippertjies. Nee, ek kom nie saam nie, ek gaan saam. Totsiens!

glimmerman_alpha

4th Feb 2006, 16:14

Seems like the mods/owners felt the heat so all they do is close down Campfire.

Some okes you know....:mad:

Thats me signing off permanently.Over.

Fly safe:ok:

chopper-wrench

4th Feb 2006, 16:20

SHAME!!:(
And here I was just rubbing my hands together, preparing to indulge in some good banter in the old mother tongue and now it is gone.:{
So! I also leave you with the following parting procedure which for those who do not understand the Afrikaans language is a direct translation:
"With my fore pull leave I a great stink hope and scream ANTELOPE SEW as I hole clean make so that the k@k so white stand":E
Spot you all manne!

BAKELA

4th Feb 2006, 17:24

From Jetblast, the forum "where everything goes". :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: It also says "Stay out if you are faint hearted". Well, apparently it did not "GO" in this case! I am so wound up after reading the "Could one ban a language?" (now closed...shame :p ) thread that I decided I have to break my silence and beg for a ban from PPrune!!! PLEEEEAAASSSE?!!!!!

MysticFlyer
the answer is NO, and it's been explained to you in plain English why.
If you are not happy with this decision, you are welcome to start your own website and make your own rules. With this, please stop posting whining posts on every available Forum on PPRuNE on how bad are the Mods on this site. Grow up and live with it.
Thank you

Well, well, well, either the owners and the mods are sh!tscared of something or they are being blatently racist and non PC. Whiping The Campfire, closing threads, not the way to make money is it...like we were told on The Campfire. Maybe that's why Towers closed The Campfire...were they "faint hearted" or "faint minded"? Were they embarrased by their own post(s)...missed the last bit and did not have the non-Afrikaans password (met koekies nogal!) as required by The Campfire! I think they are :mad: stupid with this stance.

MF, tien uit tien vir "posts on every available Forum on PPRuNE" en as ek nie uitgeskop word nie mag ek dalk ook daai metode volg tot ek moer toe is!

Moenie die Leeu se bal krap nie, hy gaan spyker net op 'n ander plek!

Translated specially for the English Only mods and owners : Don't scratch the balls of a Lion, it will only go f:mad:k elsewhere, and kill the pups!:E

Gunship

4th Feb 2006, 17:34

I pressume this will also be deleted.

So those that see my last post.

I am busy creating a new home.

It will be free !

It will contain ANY language.

It will be friendly.

It will be out of my own pocket.

I can not drop freinds like this ...

Jsut give me time to do the final settings ... the trimmings will come tomorrow ... my engineer in Finland is offline and out for a beer ... :{

Danny

4th Feb 2006, 17:45

OK, so some of you want to throw your toys out of the pram. Go ahead.
As for the rest of you, if you are not happy with the decision I have made about what I do and do not allow on PPRuNe then feel free to find another website that will accommodate you.

PPRuNe is PRIMARILY a professional pilots website. I have nurtured it and watched it grow over ten years and not charged anyone a penny to access or use the site. As it has grown the demands on processing power have increased exponentially and I have to watch the costs very closely now as it all has to be funded somehow. In my case, I charge for advertising and if anyone wants to help out with a personal title then thanks. However, a single, plain word personal title will cover exactly 0.1% of the monthly running cost of this privately owned website. Thank you to those of you who have helped in a small way but it is not going to keep PPRuNe afloat.

The problem I have with the Campfire forum is that it is, apparently, just a version of Jet Blast in Afrikaans. Now, whilst I appreciate the offer from some of you to moderate the forum as you are fluent in Afrikaans, the point is that this is primarily an ENGLISH language website. The Jet Blast forum is the ONLY place where I will allow banter that is not directly related to anything that isn't connected to Professional Aviation. Even in JB, ENGLISH is the only language I will allow.

Now I hear some of you yelling "what about the other foreign language forums?". THose forums were set up as a trial to see if they could be supported and the condition was that they were used SOLELY for discussion of PROFESSIONAL AVIATION topics and as far as I am aware, they have not strayed from their remit. Those forums also cater for a few of the other majority languages in use. If I EVER get a complaint about the content of any of those forums and because I can't understand those languages then they will go too.

For a forum to be productive then it needs a minimum number of readers and the typical ratio of readers to posters is 1:20. Even for a private airline forum to work I make sure that there are a minimum of 100 users/readers which only gives about 5 posters. For a non-private free forum I would expect at least 5 times as many readers. Now, if I thought there were 500 regular readers of the Campfire forum who were conversant in Afrikaans then I might consider a specialist forum for PROFESSIONAL AVIATION discussion in Afrikaans. Judging by the numbers I see that have been involved in that forum over the last few months, I doubt you'd have anything near the numbers required. However, I will set up a simple poll in this forum over the next 10 days and the number of Afrikaans speakers who want a dedicated forum devoted to discussion of Professional Aviation issues can make their mark. I will monitor the number of people who bother to register so that they can vote and I will be able to see if someone is deliberately registering from the same location to try and falsely boost the figures.

If I think there is a need for a dedicated Afrikaans forum for professional pilots then I'll consider setting one up. If there isn't, I suggest those of you who are not happy with the situation go and PM each other and set up your own website or just swap MSN or Skype names and for your own group.

P!ssing of me or any of my moderators is not going to do anyone any favours and I suggest that those of you who may wish to reconsider your statements on this thread make use of the Edit and delete features.

So, a reminder... PPRuNe was originally set up to cater for the needs of AIRLINE PILOTS. As it grew and demand increased I included various ancillary professions that were associated with our jobs as airline pilots and it encompassed all legitimate professional pilot and associated trades and professions and jobs. I also catered for the enthusiasts and the passengers and I even included the Jet Blast forum where users could hopefully relax and banter. What I never agreed to was providing some kind of safe haven for refugees and strays who, whilst maybe connected to aviation in some way or another, only wanted the comfort of having a moderated forum for their own small group. It isn't going to happen unless the numbers are there and it is cost effective for PPRuNe as a whole. :*

PS. And why on earth should anyone think that I'm going to allow anyone to use my website to advertise their own website for free? I have sweated and toiled to get this website to where it is today and anyone... and I really mean anyone, tries to use this forums or any other forum on PPRuNe to advertise their own website without my permission or helping to cover some of the costs of running this website will find it a very cold palce out there if I have to ban them from here.

Danny

4th Feb 2006, 18:11

This is purely a poll to gauge the number of potential Afrikaans speaking members there are on PPRuNe.

Exhaust Manifold

4th Feb 2006, 18:37

Danny although I don't agree with the closing of campfire and banning afrikaans, I thank you for the chance to prove how many afrikaans readers there are.

Come on guys we've been complaining and now we've got the opportunity to prove that we deserve our own forum.

I for one will be registering :ok:

bendix

4th Feb 2006, 18:47

campfire just been restricted:uhoh: :uhoh: :uhoh:

bendix:(

SHARALUMI

4th Feb 2006, 18:51

Quoted from Danny's post "...refugees and strays..." . Now if that's not insulting nothing is! Viva Afrikaans and South Africa. Name already on MIA list, probably confirmed now. BTW, mail me on [email protected] to get the gaff.

SHARALUMI

4th Feb 2006, 18:54

Exhaust, ya sure "I for one will be registering", except the poll is closed before it was even opened!

Maxbert

4th Feb 2006, 19:12

Oh come ON, Shar- :*

Danny did say:
...However, I will set up a simple poll in this forum over the next 10 days... just a few moments ago...:hmm:

Give the man a chance, willya? :rolleyes:

Mungalui

4th Feb 2006, 19:20

Hoe register ons?Was weg vir n rukkie?
(How do we register?)
Nice to read your own langauge out here now and again.:sad:
Iemand pm my asb.

Mungalui

4th Feb 2006, 19:25

Ok,cool,sorry.
Sal wag vir poll.

Exhaust Manifold

4th Feb 2006, 19:39

SHARALUMI ja I only noticed after I posted :uhoh:

SHARALUMI

4th Feb 2006, 19:40

Maxbert, obviously around by invitation from up top are ya?

The point being - Don't advertise it, sell it, put it on the floor and pretend it's going to work before you can proof it's working. The thread is up - is it a poll or a poof? Most Afrikaans PPruners are going to laugh at the feeble attempt to proof a point anyway after a backlash of some sorts was sufferred by the owners. Anyway, who cares about PPrune, it died in the hearts of many. From you, somebody who, according to the mods should be associated with "Professional Aviation" I think the aforesaid should be natural.

The Boss's of this site (including the mods) did say a lot of things...most of which I don't want to elaboratre on...but bless their pure bred pureness in insulting so called regfugees and strays. Did not take the "pure-breds" long to step in did it? By invitation I guess...to make the African forum "look" alive!

By the way, my name is SHARALUMI and not Shar (or Char from Charmaine like the one who does the beat on the street corner close to your place it seems).

Maxbert

4th Feb 2006, 20:13

YE GODS! :*
I WILL apologise for the incorrect use of your name, Sharalumi-
I won't qualify the rest- I'm outta here.
BTW Ik ben geen Afrikaner, ik praat wel Nederlands, dus ben ik niet helemaal out of order hier...

If you can tweak a website / forum at the drop of a hat, then I take my hat off to you!

Dct no speed

4th Feb 2006, 20:49

I have this to say: Even the souties in the middle east speak afrikaans to each other this is a lekker way to communicate without being understood by the rest of the crowd, sort of our little secret ! Afrikaans bo!:)

PAXboy

4th Feb 2006, 23:47

Danny,

Fair enough. Thanks for setting it out. I am not an aviator and if the Afrikaans forum does not meet your requirements then it must go. The greater good of having PPRuNe, must win.

Thanks as always.

Propbrake

5th Feb 2006, 01:05

I'm sure old PAXboy would'nt say that so easily if it was English being banned.
Imagine if I said, for the good of the world or so and so, English has to go.

What "Koning Rose Toring" doesn't seem to understand is that the being able to communicate in Afrikaans is a very emosional issue to most Afrikaans speaking people especially since we also have a goverment that is hell bent on tying to eradicate it from history. The English tried it once and failed and now our affirmative goverment is giving it a try. They will all fail. Afrikaans will never lie down and die.

To the man in the tower, it would be wise to treat this issue a lot more delicately as you cannot imagine or will ever understand how sensitive an issue it is.

Shrike200

5th Feb 2006, 04:04

I was going to say, this issue is quite emotional because it mirrors certain aspects of our country. I'm not Afrikaans (although my better half is), but I empathise with them on this one, and tend to stand with them on many other issues as well.

To the similarities: This vote, while noble and democratic perhaps, mirrors the 'democracy' in South Africa, ie there just aren't enough Afrikaans voters to make a difference! Hence the seeming apathy regarding voting both here at home, and perhaps on this forum.

Secondly, as mentioned above, this isn't the first time somebody tries to get their language banned/squeezed out - only those who have had this happen to them can perhaps understand.

Like many African species though, Afrikaaners are a hardy bunch. I have no doubt they will survive.

Aviator609

5th Feb 2006, 05:04

Goed gesê maat - well said mate!:ok:

Gunship Jnr

5th Feb 2006, 06:34

Uncle Danny this is from my father. he is banned and askd me to post this for him.

bye guns jnr

Danny you did not give me a chance to respond before banning me. I therefore make us of my son.

The thread that remains on Africa Aviation was threre in anger after PPRUNE TOWERS (Rob Llloyd) behaved badly and made us to feel inferior humans speaking a different language on the Campfire.

His arrogance against our language was and will not be taken lightly.

I have and never had any problem with PPRUNE until the stupid idea was taken to ban Afrikaans.

Instead of telling us - slow down or whatever - just a tad more diplomacy would have been nice.

So Jetdriver feels inferior because he can not speak the wonderful language and report this to the superiors.

Instead of getting a capable person you chose just to ban us. At least two of us has offered our services to help you out and we would have done it with pleasure.

To make matters more confusing you start a poll that was closed (just opened now) 280 hits and now it is only open ... so possibly 280 people trying to vote and it is closed. So much for democracy ?

I just voted (you did not ban me completey I see) and as it is now 10 is Professional Afrikaans Aviators and 9 is English ... makes you think doesn't it ?

Danny you banned me because I put a link on your web site re mine ...YOU and ROB said search for another one ... I just made it easy for you to get rid of us and for your failthful PPRUNERS to make an easy exit to another home. That is all.

Last but not least : If memory serves me correct : We only had THREE - yes THREE to a maximum FIVE threads on The CampFire ... 2 of them Afrikaans jokes and the other the Afrikaans kakpraat thread (talking sheit around a fire).

The latter thread was mostly about recipes of barbeques ... mate I am sure you where ill - informed by the " I feel inferior jetdriver" .

4 HP is and was a regular poster their and enjoyed it as he understands our culture and beliefs of sitting around a fire and talking k@k.

I say again : The arrogant post(s) of Rob led to some people feeling like they feel and therefore the responses you got on African Aviation after the Campfire was closed.

You will also find a thread with 55 posts of people regular readers that gave a thumbs up for Afrikaans.

Have a look at my PM's and you will find 4 from your own moderators giving us a salute ... makes you think hey Danny ?

We are not here to fight - we are peaceloving beerdrinkers. What we do not like is the absolute arrogance of people like Jetdriver and PPRUNE TOWERS for degrading our language and our people. We do not like that.

Go well and enjoy PPRUNE without my 8-9 years of contributions and cut's and pastes. For those that remain - please give them a little pleasure on PPRUNE - they are after all by far the most that grace the skies over Africa ! And a lot of them know what they talk about !

Cheers,

Gunsss

Propbrake

5th Feb 2006, 08:33

Well said Gunns. Well it looks like I'll be able to remove PPRuNe of my Favourites list and replace it with a Forum more suited to my needs.Thanks for putting it out there Gunns. I was getting tired of the "twee gatgeid" of the Tower Man anyway. Screams fairness and tolerance when it suits him and but has no problem discriminating when he wants to. Looking down on a person (and this really seems to be his attitude) because of his/her language is not different to discrimination because of race. "Wat die hart van vol is. loop die mond van oor" What's really in the heart of a man is what comes out of his mouth, or fingers in this case.

Let the "Holier than Thou" man in the Ivory Tower think about that one while he drinks his tea.

lionco

5th Feb 2006, 09:36

Guys

We have all enjoyed the privilege, and it is a privilege, of useing this forum. Now that the rules are being changed :{ it is clear that a new African site need be formed.
So we must do that and not go on about it here. As many of you have stated, no one knows what it feels like to be discriminated against until it actually happens to you!:sad: Believe me I know what that feels like:yuk:

The greatest man who ever walked this planet said "Forgive them for they know not what they do"

I will be staying on Pprune, if I may, but I will also be joining you on the new site when I find you

Cheers and go well to you all
Lionco:sad:

PAXboy

5th Feb 2006, 10:07

Prop BrakeI'm sure old PAXboy would'nt say that so easily if it was English being banned. Imagine if I said, for the good of the world or so and so, English has to go. You have missed the point: PPRuNe is run by a man who has chosen not to have languages other than his own.

If he spoke Spanish and chose not to have Afrikaans or English, the result would be the same. You must consider that this entire system exists due to goodwill. If the site was run for purely commercial grounds - then all languages could be accomodated. However, the readers and posters of PPRuNe have made it clear that they would not pay the £30 or so per annum that would then be required.

The point of discussion is not that Afrikaans is being removed because it is Afrikaans but that languages other than English - and that are not heavily related to aviation - will be closed.

If this site was run by an Afrikaans person [on goodwill not commercial grounds] and they decided not to have English - then I would certainly accept that.

Danny

5th Feb 2006, 10:40

I'm sorry but not one of you has explained why I should allow any of you to have your own private forum on my website so that you can enjoy your Afrikaans culture when I have explained that this is The Professional Pilots RUmour NEtwork. What on earth has my website, aimed at professional pilots, got to do with Afrikaans?

Unless there is enough intelligence out there to get this thread back on track and have it relate in one way or another to professional aviation then it is out of here and I will bid goodbye to those of you who are unhappy at losing so much of your hard earned cash and time to set up, run and make a success of this website! :hmm:

Exhaust Manifold

5th Feb 2006, 10:56

Just wanted to point out the fact that many of the afrikaans members have been banned, so how can they contribute to the poll :confused:

This all seems like "ethnic cleansing" with a poll to make it seem diplomatic :suspect:

nugpot

5th Feb 2006, 11:15

Danny, you are completely right. I guess that the boys over-reacted to Tower's post and that all the acrimony came from an escalation in insults.

I will, if allowed, continue to use this forum. I have been a member for a long time and find the aviation side of things informative and interesting. I was never a contributor to the Campfire, but found Towers's post really got under my skin (perhaps it is in the genes). I hope that my posts were not seen as inflammatory.

There is now an alternative to the campfire. If you are particularly charitable, perhaps you can point the boere in the right direction. I believe that the new site will not be a threat to PPRuNe, but rather will keep the dangerous posts away from your pride and joy.

We owe you a huge thank you for your vision and hard work to bring this site to us in its current form. I truly believe that it was a lack of information in the announcement of the ban, that caused all the trouble.

To my Afrikaans and like-minded brethren. Please let this issue die now. Perhaps Danny will tell you where to find the new campfire. I don't want to hijack his site to advertise it.

Nugs

Danny

5th Feb 2006, 11:46

Before this degenerates into some sort of conspiracy theory, no one is banned because they speak Afrikaans. Just the suggestion smacks of lunacy and to suggest such appears to me to be some sort of inferiority complex.

Please give me a list of everyone who you believe is banned because they speak Afrikaans. A definitive list would be appreciated so that these stupid and pathetic allegations can be paid to rest.

If there is anyone banned for a different reason such as being abusive, breaking the rules or something similar then that is a different matter and I will review the bans, if there are any.

What irks me the most is the totally immature thinking that goes into some of the posts on this thread. If it is inconceivable to some of you that I'm not a charity and this is a website PRIMARILY for professional pilots to discuss matters that involve our profession, then wailing and crying at the loss of your own little private campfire where you could use my bandwidth to have your private little club is just plain insulting. I challenge you to invest your own money to provide a platform for others to insult you and use my goodwill for your own amusement. It reeks of an arrogance that makes mine pale into insignificance.

The next neanderthal who cannot grasp the concept that this isn't a piece of common land where you can do and say what you like needn't bother with the insults or bad mouthing as your efforts will be wasted as they are trashed. Get used to the concept that this website is a benign dictatorship and that the benign bit can wear very thin at times. Digest that and understand it you will have no problems. :rolleyes:

B Sousa

5th Feb 2006, 12:08

Hey, maybe we can take the heat off my SA friends and get a cartoon thread up and running..Seems to do better than Smart Bombs lately......
Besides one does not have to speak a certain language to understand.

Aviator609

5th Feb 2006, 12:50

I said earlier:

I agree with you that it is Danny's site and he has full authority over it.

I also know "The Campfire" has become a controversial issue with Afrikaans being used, but traditionally a campfire has always been a place where people in just about every country around the world ended up at some stage in their lives to shoot the breeze (chat and banter), relax, share experiences and jokes and chat about everything, not just flying issues.

According to me "The Campfire" gave us that VERY good balance in PPRune, where one could have forums where serious aviation matters would be discussed, the work hard part of our daily lives, but "The Campfire" afforded us the play hard part of our lives where one could relax and meet up and do the "shooting the breeze" thing and have a quiet laugh, before moving off to sleep.

Africa, being a third world continent, has many campfires and "The Campfire" forum being under the Rest of the world & non- English forums, just lead to a natural progression of speaking in Afrikaans, not on purpose to exclude anyone. It is as a matter of fact the only forum to my knowledge the guys have used to speak Afrikaans in, and in so doing respected the other users in other forums.

Being an Afrikaans speaking individual touring into Nigeria, I find many South Africans and Afrikaans speaking people of all professions scattered throughout Africa and also the rest of the world.

Afrikaans is our mother tongue, which has been said is very descriptive and colourful, as is the characters that speak the language, albeit a minority of your users.

Work hard, play hard is an international concept and your website has had all the right ingredients and that is why it is the best aviation forum based website on the internet and thus so popular.

I ask you please to rather increase your website, to include a "Die Kampvuur" for Afrikans users or allow us to continue in our mother tongue on "The Campfire" forum, than chase us away. I bet your decision wasn't based on the guys being malicious on the forum.

I am sure that just about every person involved in the global aviation industry has dealt with a South African professional pilot or engineer, either Afrikaans or English or Zulu for that matter, somewhere in his career and had many experiences and many things to say about us, albeit good or bad.

We are a fun loving nation, we are definitely colourful and we have made our mark in the aviation industry worldwide.

Your favourable consideration will be highly appreciated, regardless of what results you might find on the poll.

Much later....:

I see the Campfire has gone out and it's a cold place to be with an unwelcome atmosphere as the forum seems to be deleted.

I will not post on PPRune anymore. I know it will not affect your life in the slightest Danny or anybody elses for that matter, as it seems you have already made up your mind and the poll actually means nothing.

Sadly, even in Africa, dictators, benign or not, aren't really liked. :(

By the way, Professional pilots usually have more to talk about than just work and work related issues, no matter what the language, race or creed. Balance is a good thing, you should try it.

Enjoy your throne while it lasts and by the way, sarcasm is the lowest form of wit....:rolleyes:

Tot Siens

B Sousa

5th Feb 2006, 13:45

Roger Copy Charlie

5th Feb 2006, 14:04

as any charter, contract, regional pilot in Africa can tell you: Aviation in Africa and Afrikaans go pretty much together... whether you like it or not, you run into the boere boneheads everywhere!
Just as one learns to say Jambo in East Africa or salaam aleikum in the North, it is inconceivable that Afrikaans is erradicated from any forum that discusses Aviation in the continent of Mother Africa.
The moderators and owners of the site should realise this fact.
(professional pilot in africa, afrikaans speaking, but not a bonehead myself)

Teignmouth

5th Feb 2006, 15:35

I find some of the obsequious grovelling ("thanks so much for letting us participate in PPRUNE, Danny") only slightly less nauseating than Danny's vaguely arrogant "this my MY website and I am the all-seeing, all-thinking God of your universe when you want to visit it".

Of course, readers from South Africa will be familiar with the concept of banning individuals that dare to criticise the government. Pity, though: I though that dictatorial attitude, "benign" or not, disappeared years ago, about the time that a certain indivdual walked out of Pollsmoor Prison.

V1 Rotate

5th Feb 2006, 17:01

Now I am really p:mad: d ! I speak English primarily and use the Campfire all the time...now it has gone on the basis of discrimination against Afrikaans speakers.
Maybe Pprune does belong to the owners (thank you) but what would it be without us ppuners?
V1:confused: :confused: :confused:

The Claw

5th Feb 2006, 18:15

As these complaint threads drag on, it seems many of the lengthy responses are from some who still didnt get the message.
1. Site is OWNED by someone who wants it kept in English.
2. Campfire is only down temporarily
3. Afrikaans can be used in conjunction with translation into English.
4. Newsclips are acceptable, with an English synopsis.
5. There are other forums/websites
Is there something I missed as I dont think PPrune has yet to be designated an Afrikaans Heritage site........
Lets get back to Aviation throughout the world (includes SA).

Maybe it is you who is still missing the point? Campfire is only down temporarily........really? Afrikaans is not the "big" issue for all of us. The point is despite Danny and more so Rob thinking that Pprune revolves around them, it doesn't, it is the Ppruners that make it what it is. They expect us to dip our hands into our pockets, but are not prepared to consider our views. Tell me, does Gunss get a refund for his banning? Do the advertisers get a discount after many potential customers are told to Foxtrot Oscar? All you ever hear is if you don't like it Foxtrot Oscar, never any effort to explain or discuss anything. (Unless very belated!) This has led to interesting forums with a wide diversity of opinions becoming one sided boring affairs. Prime example being the Military Forum becoming a private little RAF club. (Funny they are allowed one :E ) In the old days this was a great source for useful information, now it is just a site for inferior people to blow their own trumpet. My concern is by chasing more knowledgeable people away, yet another forum will become boring and one sided. Maybe you don't care Danny, but I do. Danny you have something great, don't blow it by treating people like dirt.
You need us more than you give us credit for.

Bert get your head out of the sand:rolleyes: One day it just might be little old you.........and then what?

B Sousa

5th Feb 2006, 18:41

The Claw

5th Feb 2006, 19:40

Claw
Whether you like it or not it MAY revolve around them as it is their site. What part of you being unnecessary to the forum dont you understand. If they banned you or me or guns, this site would continue along the rules that they made........
Guns obviously has not been banned, but also off temporaily, (read 4hps comments) If he were banned all his threads would go with him.......
As for it being little old me, it has been .TWICE, because I didnt abide by THEIR rules......Not happy about that, but have to live with it or find another forum.
Its basically work with it or go away........
Besides if you paid money for anything here, your dumber than I am..

So with just Danny and friends posting and no diversity this site will continue to flourish.........yeh right :rolleyes:

If Guns has not been banned "temporarily" or otherwise then why is he posting via his son? The point is as a "paying" customer he didn't even warrant a series of warnings or maybe removal of a post. Just cut him off because his views differ? Then moan because more of us don't pay to be treated as being insignificant individuals?

surely not

5th Feb 2006, 20:02

Surely the point is this is the African Forum................... not specific to any one language of Africa. It is viewed and participated in by people of many diverse nationalities and mother tongues, therefore for the topics to make sense, and for it to be inclusive for all, there has to be a common language and like it or not that language is English.

The French, and other language specific forums cater for a far larger number of people than those who understand Afrikaans. It isn't an attempt to discriminate against Afrikaan speakers, it is simply acknowledging that there are a lot of other countries in Africa than just South Africa , and those countries do NOT have any ability to speak Afrikaans and would be excluded from topics in Afrikaans thereby weakening the forum as a way of debating topical issues. How annoying would it be if all the contributers used their local tongues, Wuluf, Yuruba, Igbo etc? They reckon there are 240+ individual languages in Nigeria alone!!!

Gunnsss I have drunk beer with you and like you as a guy, but I think you and a couple of the others are cutting your noses off to spite your faces. That won't stop me having a beer or two with you when next I see you:) :)

If you guys leave the forum will survive, but not be as alive as with you. Spare a thought for the legal aspect to this. You guys don't hang back on your views when posting in English so goodness knows what you could do in Afrikaans, and Danny and the crew wish to stay out of the libel courts and jail. Afrikaans, like Gaelic is a minor world language and there isn't an auto translator available. I think it is fair that those legally responsible for the site understand what is being posted so that they can take action to protect themselves from potential lawsuits.

So stop the sulk guys and come back

south coast

5th Feb 2006, 20:36

i cannot speak or understand a word of afrikaans, and i dont even mind seeing the odd comment or posting in afrikaans, but what does annoy me is when the claw says, 'as a paying customer of pprune' didnt realise there was such a thing, just perhaps people who were good enough to donate towards the running costs of the site...

i have many great friends in sa who are of afrikaans origin and it is their first language and i will tell you something which in my short time living in sa i found to be true of afrikaans people. they are great fun, very loyal and decent people, but the minute there is more than one afrikaans speaking person the language changes to afrikaans even when there are people present who cant understand it...i used to find it quite infuriating and just down right rude, i wonder if the same is happening on pprune, considering the party has been organised by an english speaking person?

like i said, i have no problem with guys starting a topic in afrikaans, but when people start becoming righteous with talk like we are being discriminated against because of our language it becomes a little pathetic, this is a site for fun, it is not a slur against anyones human rights.

when you pay your money to go and watch an english film in the cinema, guess what, they speak english, and you accepted they would when you decided to watch an english film, are we not all agreed that this is an english website...

in conclusion, i really enjoyed the campfire forum too, i liked posting/reading about cricket on there and hope it comes back soon, but lets not turn something fairly trivial into something which it is not...

being angry is a waste of energy...

The Claw

5th Feb 2006, 21:42

i cannot speak or understand a word of afrikaans, and i dont even mind seeing the odd comment or posting in afrikaans, but what does annoy me is when the claw says, 'as a paying customer of pprune' didnt realise there was such a thing, just perhaps people who were good enough to donate towards the running costs of the site...
i have many great friends in sa who are of afrikaans origin and it is their first language and i will tell you something which in my short time living in sa i found to be true of afrikaans people. they are great fun, very loyal and decent people, but the minute there is more than one afrikaans speaking person the language changes to afrikaans even when there are people present who cant understand it...i used to find it quite infuriating and just down right rude, i wonder if the same is happening on pprune, considering the party has been organised by an english speaking person?
in conclusion, i really enjoyed the campfire forum too, i liked posting/reading about cricket on there and hope it comes back soon, but lets not turn something fairly trivial into something which it is not...
being angry is a waste of energy...

South coast

You miss my point entirely. If someone asks for a donation and then you tell him to Foxtrot Oscar because you can't be bothered, then don't be surprised if nobody else is bothered either! To invite someone to "the party" and to just ignore his/her wishes because he is "insignificant" is just darn right rude.
In order to have "fun" everyone should be invited to take part. If you go to an English movie which says it has Spanish subtitles then you expect to see Spanish subtitles! Likewise if an English website, says "Other Languages" then you should see "other" languages.:E

A fairly "trivial" explaination would have avoided the heat. I think it is known as common courtesy:ok:

B Sousa

5th Feb 2006, 21:55

Claw, maybe I should speak more S l o w l y.........If he is posting through his son, its because he has been shut down T e m p o r a r i l y. (That means he cannot post using his sign on name.....) Again the Mods probably turn a blind eye.
Others here just gotten new names.
Guns will be back Im sure, after he sucks down a couple truckloads of Tassies. Hes a good dude, just needs to take a break.
I dont know but I think this has gone way overboard.......... Surely not covered it better than I can........
Where were you guys when I got bounced for being critical of the Taliban..

SASless

6th Feb 2006, 00:51

Bert,

How can one possibly get banned for dissing the Taliban? Having seen videos of them shooting the young woman at the soccer field and the destruction of the Budda seems to put them in line for some criticism it would seem. Would any benefit been gained from having character witnesses stand up for you?

Beta Light

6th Feb 2006, 01:51

Ja...............

tic

6th Feb 2006, 02:02

Danny. Do praat die taal. What's the point asseblief ?

The Claw

6th Feb 2006, 07:45

[QUOTE=B Sousa]Claw, maybe I should speak more S l o w l y.........If he is posting through his son, its because he has been shut down T e m p o r a r i l y. (That means he cannot post using his sign on name.....) QUOTE]

Ban is to forbid officially........."Temporarily" or otherwise...........:rolleyes:

ie. He is at this moment banned from posting as Gunss ! Suspended if you prefer!

Should we draw you pictures Bert :confused:

surely not

6th Feb 2006, 08:16

south coast

6th Feb 2006, 08:38

i totally agree...although i didnt mind the afrikaans posts in the campfire, i could never understand nor comment...but hey, not the end of the world, as i am sure most non- afrikaans-understanding people thought...

but at no time did it ever say it was an afrikaans forum and thats the bit which i do find slightly annoiying, the fact that some believed it was their RIGHT to speak it...

it was never your right as a name on pprune, but i think it was quite cool that you guys could discreetely chat in your mother tongue there...but i think you have made a huge fuss and went about what you want in the wrong way...

a guy from our company is trying to set up a forum dedicated to our company, and he is asking if people would be prepared to contribute towards are own dediacted forum...why didnt you guys offer something like that?

oneeyed

6th Feb 2006, 09:00

...but I can read and understand it!!!
I have so far also enjoyed most of the Afrikaans contributions and surely never felt offended by any.

If this poll is supposed to make any sense then the question should be asked if the members of the forum are against it - I for my part think a bit of common sense and tolerance should prevail !!!

The Claw

6th Feb 2006, 10:08

Well I have received a PM from him as Gunsss since this all kicked off, but in it Gunnss said he was banned.
Question: If you are banned can you still send PM's??
Now Claw, the title of the forum wasn't 'Afrikaans Aviation' it was 'African Aviation'. That is why English is the language to be used, it covers aviation over ALL Africa.
The French and Spanish Sections cover aviation issues in specific French and Spanish speaking areas.

No the title of the forum was "Campfire" and the forum was set up at the request of South Africans! Afrikaans is an African language, so why shouldn't it be accepted? There are South African and British Aviation companies in Spain and these pilots don't speak Spanish, English is the "accepted" language of the air, so your point is?

I'm not suggesting that there should be an Afrikaans only forum, never have done. I'm suggesting fair play. I'm suggesting that if Danny objects to foreign languages then get rid of the foreign section. Then we can all be one "happy" family and post under the section of "aviation" that we are talking about rather than to have our elite section of the site.(ie. Not African or Spanish but as a fellow airline pilot or whatever.)

Further I'm suggesting that in my opinion things wouldn't get so ugly if the moderators showed a bit more consideration and understanding. (ie, Involve people, make them feel wanted rather than to alienate them!) This is the way forward in my opinion.

B Sousa

6th Feb 2006, 11:36

Claw
I would much rather be stacking empty Castles Cans with you than continuing to explain what I think is the problem......
We agree on Suspended, lets leave it like that. Banned, means no PMs, threads disappear etc......BTDT
Also, Yes, Afrikaans is an African Language, I dont see many sites that use Xosha or Zulu, albeit a few of you guys speak it fluently.. Yes, I understand not as many frequent this site as do those speaking Afrikaans. Obviously to me the use of Afrikaans soley , was meant to exclude all non speakers. That does not bother me as its probably a subject which I have not any interest. I can only assume that the Owners thought that since nobody knows, by their rules and the rules YOU agreed too when registering, they can say stop.
***Consider this, instead of moaning about the situation why dont you try working with the owners and see what can be done to allow Afrikaans in some fashion. I certainly dont have the answer, but Im sure there is some mutual ground.**** The Campfire, as I understand it, was to take NON Aviation threads and put them into a site that still pertained in some fashion to Africa.
Sasless, dissing the Taliban/"Mid-Easterner" types here offends the ********** that frequent this site. They whine as if I were doing cartoons of whats his name and of course the Towers in their non offensive mode will slap your hands..
Back to square one, like it or leave.....

Dct no speed

6th Feb 2006, 13:30

Question:

Seeing that freedom of speech is a rather hot topic at the moment. Don't you think that the poll you put out is a bit one sided ? What about:

I am a profesional aviator and don't mind afrikaans on this site
or
I am a not a profesional aviator and don't mind afrikaans on this site
or
I am not a aviator and don't mind afrikaans on this site

You know, almost like the freedom of speech in Zimbabwe!:cool:

B Sousa

6th Feb 2006, 13:40

After a couple PMs from others, I agree. Some just dont get it. There is only freedom of speech if its within the guidelines of the forum which you do not own..
You want freedom of speech, start your own website.....
Im out of this one......Must be the folks at Helibase are laughing their collective asses off as no new postings on the mess from there. This has taken up all the heat.....

Mama Mangrove

6th Feb 2006, 13:41

I really do think some of the posters here need to grow up. Danny has said that it's his website and he makes the rules. If all you can contribute in return is that you will leave, you are doing nothing positive. Look at the results of the poll. There are 86 people there who say they speak Afrikaans. There were more pilots than that just in the last company I worked for in 1 African country. One of you can surely just set up your own website for an Afrikaans campfire if you feel so strongly about it - like Helitorque and other websites have been set up in the past by people who thought they could do better than Danny. You can then have your campfire and still contribute here. You only have to look at the numbers at alternative websites and at this one to see how popular PPRuNe is. If you leave, it will still be popular, but missing something from a few guys whose posts have occasionally kept us amused and occasionally made us mad. Just PM each other, set up an Afrikaans campfire, use the opportuity to slag off Danny in Afrikaans if that's what makes you happy, and then come back to PPRuNe to post on African aviation topics. What problem do you have with that? Show people that you really are just a fun-loving, beer drinking bunch of good-time guys, put it behind you and get on with life.

V1 Rotate

6th Feb 2006, 15:30

Maybe the Taliban don't speak Afrikaans!
V1:8 :8

PPRuNe Towers

6th Feb 2006, 15:40

Still rumbling on I see. Jolly good - do carry on.

Please remember to capture any particular favourite threads as Campfire is amongst several forums being closed down.

Rob

PPRuNe Towers

6th Feb 2006, 15:49

Precisely Bert,

Lot's out there enjoying the break from having to look over their shoulder.

Rob

B Sousa

6th Feb 2006, 16:51

Mr tower
I do hope that you will allow some of the threads in the Campfire to come back to African Aviation or find a place for them.
Sasless mentioned the closing of forums is based on the cost of running the site, so be it.. It has gotten pretty big, so its understandable. Just Helicopters. com was the same way, started off for Helicopter Stuff, then became a comodity and now just another useless site.
It certainly has been a good ride, but I guess the potential for money was always out there.
Sort of hate to see PPrune go Away, but at least once you start charging for services, most of us cheap morons will leave anyway. makes it more Professional.
Good Luck and Thanks

ScrewyRabbit

6th Feb 2006, 17:24

Been in the bush a while and was quite surpised to find this controversy raging. I read, write, speak and spread the love in Afrikaans and English and would dearly like to see Afrikaans continued on Pprune. This forum has by far been the most enjoyable and engaging forum I have ever participated in.

I understand the outcry by the Afrikaans community but feel the hysterics are a bit much. Come on ouens, put your money where your mouth is and claim your place on this excellent and highly professional website by voting now. It's in our hands, if we don't earn our place here we only have ourselves to blame.

Vat so!:ok:

SASless

6th Feb 2006, 18:08

Towers (OIC for Lavs and Dunnies)...since you are in charge of some fun jobs....pray tell which forums are going/have gone the way of the Buffalo?

Since this is a professional pilot's web site by admission...does that mean the non-pilot related forums are up for the chop. Since Rotorheads by admission is not related to Airlines....is that one going away as well.

If final decisions have been made on these changes....or when final decisions are made....could they be advertised in advance so we don't get a great big surprise one day?

I sure hope this all settles down and we can get back to "normal"....but it seems some mob mentality is beginning to show itself. Next thing you know we will see news wire photos of flaming prunes being stomped into the pavement by enraged crowds of pot bellied bus driver hat wearing guys swearing in a polygot bunch of languages.

118.9

7th Feb 2006, 10:07

Classic case of a rampant cumulonimbus in a tea cup.

The Afrikaans speakers are right to feel picked on, but hey, the rules of any website are the rules.....

Danny is right that it is his site, but he also knows that those companies buying advertising on pprune will not like to see these types of squabbles affecting any part of their target audience.

Let's put the cup in the dishwasher and move on.
:rolleyes:

PPRuNe Towers

7th Feb 2006, 11:07

Hi SASless,

First off helo is totally safe as is Africa. Both are required reading for anyone with any gumption and a spirit of enquiry.

Forums bowing out will include Non Air Transport Issues, SLF and the Campfire. There are opportunities to pass their collective histories onto other forums. Same idea could apply to the Campfire - JB comes to mind. Overall theme is get back to pro aviation rather than the gargantuan ghettoised mess we have now.

Safety and CRM gets another year to see if it hits critical mass. 'Where are they now' has jumped that hurdle and quietly become a huge success but 'nightstop' just never cracks it - great when you need it but do any of you ever go there on a regular basis? Wannabees will probably move back to a single forum to retain focus on training and first jobs as a single aim. Big changes for Far East with Fragrant Harbour uniting but due to the immense and growing size of the market from the Indian sub continent to Indonesia there will be a seperate wannabees forum.

Other than that 3 or 4 other forums will combine and some private forums will quietly disappear as soon as I remember to do it and I've managed to stop Danny frigging around with the colours:E

Rob

SASless

7th Feb 2006, 15:10

I would strongly suggest JB is one of the forums that could go....just how many inane recipe threads...where were you last night....mornington crescent threads are needed? If we are going to see a return to "professional pilot" forums....if Nightstop is considered of little use....certainly JetBlast as it is....has no value. As you state...Nightstop has its use when one is doing an RON or similar.

Over 5000 views of the poll....and 177 votes....would be interesting to see the stats on how many visits...how many posts...how many repeat posters on the site to compare the activity at the poll against the site in general.

AAL

8th Feb 2006, 06:20

Without wanting to take sides in this screwball argument it is however worth noting how dull, boring and un-interesting the Africa thread has become without it's characters and regular contributers.

At this rate it appears that it will only be a matter of time before it can permanently be removed from the forum.

What a waste!:(

4granted

8th Feb 2006, 12:56

It has become quite boring must say.. There is of course this nice African Site just over........

Te Hee

Bye guys

4G no longer....

:cool:

south coast

8th Feb 2006, 16:00

yes, i agree my boy...quite boring now.

are you leaving too?

when you coming to get a job with me man?

Exhaust Manifold

8th Feb 2006, 17:26

Goodbye i'm leaving the FIR. Found an airspace with friendlier, more accomodating ATC's :ok:

GRpr

8th Feb 2006, 17:55

Well, I have to put in an alternative view. I now find the African Forum is, at long last, looking like an Aviation Forum again... and not before time! The point has been made, on many occasions, that Pprune is a Professional Pilots' Rumour Network. The African Forum had degenerated into a site where pretty much anyone who wanted to while away a few hours would post on matters with virtually nothing to do with aviation. Cut and paste merchants would fill the forum with voluminous threads on pretty much any topic only remotely related to aviation - it seemed the more remote the better. Threads always seemed to get on the subject of the unfairness of 'affirmative action' in South Africa end up with a thumbs up and 'boet', and run for pages with various people exchanging pleasantries along the lines of ' have a beer for me' when private messages would have done just as well....and not plugged up the forum. It seemed that many posters were just in it to see how many posts they could get against their name. And while many will prefer not to anger the Afrikaans posters... recent posts have shown just how abusive and unpleasant some of them can become.... I am happy to say I am more than glad that Afrikaans has finally been dropped as an acceptable posting language. What a joy to run an eye down the current forum threads and see aviation topics. What a joy to open a thread and read posts related to the topic. What a joy not to read abuse and petty grievances. What a joy to see that new topics 'today' don't run off my screen, again. That is the alternative view, and I know that I am not alone. So, all the posters who say they are off to pastures new.... enjoy, you won't be missed by as many as you think.