Help me please!

[shinners]

I read this article in internet and I'd like to know if it's true or false (to me seems false)

Airline bans Bibles to avoid offending Muslims
Carrier to Saudi Arabia also precluding crucifixes, teddy bears
© 2006 WorldNetDaily.com

A British airline banned its staff from taking Bibles and wearing crucifixes or St. Christopher medals on flights to Saudi Arabia to avoid offending the country's Muslims.
British Midland International also has told female flight attendants they must walk two paces behind male colleagues and cover themselves from head to foot in a headscarf and robe known as an abaya, the Mirror newspaper of London reported.
Teddy bears or other cuddly toys also are not allowed.
Airline officials, who have sparked outrage, the paper says, explain the Islamic kingdom's strict laws – enforced by religious police – prohibit public practice of Christianity and figures of animals.
BMI spokesman Phil Shepherd said: "In providing air services people want, demand and use, we have an obligation to respect the customs of the destination country."
An airline employee who asked not to be named told the Mirror: "It's outrageous that we must respect their beliefs but they're not prepared to respect ours."
The employee said his grandmother gave him a crucifix shortly before she died that he wears at all times. "It's got massive sentimental value and I don't see why I have to remove it," he said.
The airline's staff handbook says: "Prior to disembarking the aircraft all female crew will be required to put on their company issued abaya. It will be issued with the headscarf which must be worn."
The employees' union wants staff members to be able to opt out of the flights, but the airline says the only option is to transfer from overseas staff to domestic flights, which could mean a loss of about $30,000 a year in wages.
About 40 staff members have filed complaints since the route began in September.
Some of the male members who are homosexual have called in sick, because they are afraid of traveling to Saudi Arabia, where homosexual activity is punishable by flogging, jail or death.

[striparella]

VS were interested in flying this route til they said we'd have to cover up the 'naked lady' on the front of the airfcraft.

I think the airlines response was something along the lines of 'F**k off'

I don't think western carriers should fly there if they impose those restrictions.

[powdermonkey]

In a sense, I can understand that one must respect the local customs, HOWEVER, what if we applied the same mentality to them? We would be branded as racists, and denying them their human and religious rights.........funny how it works one way only.
Time to stop being so bloody soft.
When the Saudi Government asked the Greeks if they could build a mosk in Athens ( think it was Athens) the Greeks replied " Sure, as soon as you let us build a Christian church in your country!" ......and that was the end of that!
The crews should be entitled to wear what they want, maybe not display them in public, but what harm in wearing a crucifix around your neck under your shirt? It is an absolute disgrace, what about our religious, moral and human rights?

[charlie_vb]

Powdermonkey,

I couldnt agree with you more!

[6chimes]

More to this than meets the eye guys.

Its fair to say that the company has taken a pretty hard line with crew who expressed serious doubt over being forced to go to Saudi regardless of fears for their own safety. We all know Saudi is not the safest place on earth...there is a tank outside the compound we stay in! So why is it there if the place is hunky dory? The company know there is a massive desire to get on the long haul fleet to get away from the mess that is short haul so they can threaten you with the offer of going back onto it with the pay cut that comes with it. Most of the crew accept it and put up and shut up in the hope that they will stay safe. Lets hope it doesnt come back to haunt us.

6

[sexy siren]

hi..
the said article is true... air india flies there and believe m,e its bad... we as in females have to sit at the back in transport ... once in the hotel if we get out we have to wear an abaya... not only that one cant have a meal with a male collegue if one doents have a marriage certificate... they would go thru our bags to check for magazines, snaps, etc... which is all banned... its a different thing that the 1st thing they do when they get on board is take all the magazines on the racks for their reading.... one just cant argue... a male collegue was put behind bars for 3 months coz he was outside the hotel to buy a cigarette ... and no question asked or heard they put him behind bars and no one knew where he was ... not only that they take your passport on arrival... and at times tear off the US visa... they are pits...
and this is true:(

[fernytickles]

"female flight attendants they must walk two paces behind male colleagues and cover themselves from head to foot in a headscarf and robe known as an abaya"

What about female pilots? Are they made to fly that route, or banned from it?

[powdermonkey]

Silly question maybe but, what if you refused to do the route because you felt YOUR rights were being impeded, would you have a case against your employer should there be reprisals? Sorry if this is a dumb question but firstly I am male and as such never been subjected to such unbelievable descrimination and secondly have never visited such strict places.
Whole thing is sickening to be honest, must be like stepping back in the dark ages :yuk:

[TightSlot]

What a depressing read! Does anybody know if there are any unions involved in this, and if so, what their position is? Presumably, other carriers must operate to this area, and will have had some prior experience?

[sixmilehighclub]

I cant go anywhere without a collection of teddybears so thats me out.

[girtbar]

"No teddy bears allowed"

So what happens to the flight deck they stay on the a/c? :E


But seriously if i where to be asked to fly that route, love nor money would get me on that plane. People of my kind are thought of as animals or lower, why should i be forced to operate a flight to a country that persecutes/imprisons homosexuals, thats why i count my lucky stars i live here with relative saftey and accceptance. How can BMI justify sending crew to this country when the home office would likely say you shouldnt???

GB

[Gatwick07]

The whole wearing crucifix thing. In the past I've done regular trips to Bahrain. In that country you respect their values because it's their space. But I feel on board an aircraft, making non-muslim BMI crew wear headscarfs, and standing a certain distance behind a man is nothing short of ludicrous! Who's to say that a certain crew member isn't Christian, Jewish, Hindu, Sikh etc..... the act of having to comply with Islamic rules could offend them!

[girtbar]

Gatwick how could you say something so non PC!!!! Wash your mouth out! ;)

The PC brigade will be spitting into their coffee reading that.....

[flapsforty]

Errrmm... I think I might be missing something here. :confused:
Did anybody force these people to become FAs?
Were they forced to apply to Long Haul?
Was BMI forced to start flying on Saudi Arabia?

When you decide to start working as international aircrew, should you really expect that the whole world adapts itself to your British customs? Or is it reasonable to accept the fact that countries and cultures differ, to accept that you make your money by flying to those countries and that you will have to adapt to local custom rather than the other way around?
They didn't invite you, YOU choose to become an international FA.
The world is different from the UK. If you can't hack that, get another job.


The Saudis don't want figures of animals & public practice of Christianity.
BMI has translated that into no crucifixes and no teddy bears. Probably to make sure there will not be any problems due to people like the one quoted in the article above. Smart BMI.I used to frequently fly the Jeddah route. Our company just quoted the general rules to us, so there was always at least one Fa who felt the need to let her abaya slip off her hair, wear a bare bellied Teeshirt at the hotel restaurant or any other form of childish rebellion, claiming that that was how SHE understood the rules. :rolleyes: Which invbariably led to the kind of trouble BMI want to avoid.

And then that other old duck: "It's outrageous that we must respect their beliefs but they're not prepared to respect ours."
What the heck does that mean? BMI wants to make money by flying to Saudi. Saudi has rules. So to make the money, BMI requires its crews to stick to the rules.
Nobody forces BMI t fly to Saudi, but if that's what the company wants to do, they have to make sure their crews stick to the local rules & regs.

The UK rules requires foreign airlines crews to fill out a ridiculous and never looked at customs-form. Since my company wants to make money by flying to the UK, we fill out the blasted form on the 35 minute hop over the channel.

We use metal cutlery fleet wide. The USA and the UK require us to use plastic knives. The pax dislike it, so do we, it costs the company extra money, but because we want to make the money flying to those countries, we comply with their (in our eyes stupid) rule.

After most trips, we have a drink of wine or jungle juice or beer in the crew bus. The rules in the USA forbid that, so we don't. Because we want to make money, we stick to the local rules.

In Northern Europe, women are used to sunbathing topless. We don't like 'headlights', so sue us. But in most countries of the world, this is an unacceptable custom. So at the pool in LA and on the beach in Ghana, we wear bikini tops and get on with life.
We adapt to local custom, even if we find it silly and restrictive.

I am pretty sure that Saudi airlines fill in the same silly UK customs form we do, and use the same stupid plastic cutlery.
They do it because it's the UK rule and they want to make the money.

What's this about the Saudis not respecting 'our' rules?? What rules don't they respect? The fact that the British Government does not impose any particular rules on Saudi crew's behaviour and dress, is hardly the Saudi's fault is it?

And as for people who can't do without booze or a shag for the few days of a lay over; why not take a long hard look at yourself and figure out why you are so needy and so little flexible?

If you want to be an FA on Long Haul, how about giving up your provincial tunnel vision? You want to fly, you gonna slip in countries that have different rules. They haven't invited you, YOU make money by going there.

If you can't live without wearing your crucifix for a few days, and can't sleep without your teddy bear, perhaps it's time to re-assess your priorities in life.

[fernytickles]

While I don't disagree with you on some points, FF, I still hark back to my previous post "What about female pilots? Are they made to fly that route, or banned from it?"

Also, just as a pot stirrer, what if the country's customs said remove, not clothe? Would women, or men for that matter, be as willing to accept their customs? If guys had to abide by these rules, would they be acceptable? I do have to wonder..........

[Gatwick07]

If you can't live without wearing your crucifix for a few days, and can't sleep without your teddy bear, perhaps it's time to re-assess your priorities in life.

Thankyou FlapsForty. That's exactly what I've done and I'm about to start with another airline doing shorthaul only. Due to your wonderful advice, I've just received a payrise! :) Maybe you should re-assess your priorities in life and become a careers advisor.

[flapsforty]

Bwahahaha Gatwick07 excellent comeback there. ;) Good for you.
It takes guts to put ones money where ones mouth is. Especially going back to SH when everybody's always raving about LH.
I hope you'll enjoy your new job & lifestyle, and congratulations with the pay rise. Respect to you! :ok:

Ferny, can't say what BMI's policy is on this, but ours I do know. When South Africa still had apartheid, black crew members were not exempt from getting rostered there. And when we slipped in Jeddah, female pilots flew it like everybody else. They got an abaya and we all played penguin to go shopping.

As to your hypothetical: having to conform to current Saudi rules is an annoyance but it doesn't conflict with our morals the way 'remove clothes' would, so I don't think it holds water really.
And yes, men also have to conform to Saudi rules. They can't go about in public wearing short sleeves or short pants. Which at Saudi temps, can be quite uncomfortable.
If men in general would stand for being made to walk around in the sweltering heat covered in restrictive black stuffy rags, I very much doubt.

[TightSlot]

Thank you Flaps. In future, when we want your opinion, we'll give it to you and then ask you to repeat it.

Until then, just keep 10 paces behind, there's a good girl :E

[sinala1]

As a result of TightSlots post, his funeral is being held this weekend. All prooners invited to pay respects...


:E