Oxford (OAT) assessment day - a review

[DrRedHead]

I had noticed previously that a lot of people were wondering what was going to happen during the assessment process and so I thought that it would be a good idea to give a bit of a description of what happens over the two days and what the place is like.

The Oxford Aviation Training Assessment Process

I am from Chester le street (Durham) so it was a bit of a voyage down to oxford but this time on the train gave me time to prepare. If you are thinking about getting the train down then be prepared for a five hour journey, at a rough cost of £83 return booking late it is quite expensive compared to the cost of the car. However with the car you do have the problem of trying to find the place and you may not be familiar with the area so hopping in a taxi is quite nice (£20 inc tip from train station).

I arrived the night before the test process began so I wouldn’t be rushed in the morning, this gave me time to look around the halls and see what the atmosphere is like. I was in the older side which is cheaper, I had a look at the refurbished side and it wasn’t worth the extra money. There was a TV room vending machines, internet room, laundry room and a study room. The room was what you would expect and was fine for the two nights that I was staying; there was a single bed wardrobe and a sink. Showers and toilets are both communal and there was no rush for these facilities in the morning.

Day One of the assessment I woke up bright and early ready for the day a head hopped in the shower and stuck on my suit (you’re asked to wear something of this attire). I had purchased the option which included all of your meals but I didn’t find that food that nice and the portions were too small with what you got included. You get 4 items (1 slice of bacon, 1 slice of toast, 1 tomato, beans or any combination), lunch was also similar and evening tea being the same just with different selection of foods. You can however for lunch buy a sandwich meal (any sandwich you like and double the size of a Greggs) for about £2.50 which included a can of pop and a packet of crisps; you do however have to order this at breakfast so they can prepare it.

After breakfast we are told to go to reception and are then lead into a room where everyone else who is taking the application process is sent. I had met two guys the night before hand so it wasn’t total silence but it was a little more relaxing. We were then lead into the room where the seminar takes place (one with projector) and a lady called Emily introduced herself and explained what was going to happen over the next 2 days. We were slip into two groups with three of us in one and two in the other, I had the compass tests first which consist of hand eye co ordination tests

Test 1: using a joy stick, keep a lever within red square
Test 2: keep lever within red bar using rudder pedals
Test 3: Slalom keep blue triangle between red and green moving triangles
Test 4: Maths (Multi Choice)
Test 5: Physics (Multi Choice) you must get 10/15 or better to pass
Test 6: Memory remembering information from one area and sticking it in another
Test 7: Multi tasking cancelling a red light while changing data
Test 8: Compass using instruments locate which one related to aircraft (multi choice)
Test 9: Personality questionnaire (choice between strongly agree, agree, disagree, and strongly disagree) not a deciding factor in allowing you on the course.

Note: These tests are in a random order except for 9.

After you have finished this you walk out (you are allowed to walk out in between for a break). This process takes around 2 and a half hours so by this time you’re hungry and want lunch. We all went as a group for lunch where we chatted and got to know each other better and talked about what we put for each question etc. You get an hour for lunch and then the two groups swap activities. The other activity is a simulator ride, which is so much fun (not in like a 737 just a smaller one). You are given a briefing before hand which lasts about 30 minutes where you asked a few simple questions which if you have done some flying you’ll find incredibly easy but if you haven’t then you’ll be able to get most of them. Your then given a time to go to the simulator and it lasts around 30 minutes. You do simple things like climb 1,000 ft descend, left turn to a heading. Then you may do a climbing turn to the right, during these processes the guy sitting next to you will set the power however you call for climbing, descending or straight and level. He will ask you questions about your family to make sure then in real life if a captain is asking you something your able to multi task, the questions will be like do you have any siblings, how old are they and what is your families age combined and so on.

That’s it you’re done for day 1, me and a few other guys got together and decided to go to a local pub for something to eat considering how bad the food was in the canteen, the local pubs are nice and friendly and offer the usual pub food. There wasn’t a great deal for us to do that night so we chatted to some students for a bit asking what life was like and then went to be around 10 as we were all quite tired (surprising how tiring the activities are)

Day Two, and earlier start we all arranged to go have breakfast together before we went to the assessment area. Day two consisted of team exercises and the individual interviews after lunch. The team exercises got us communicating as a group (going out for a pub lunched helped a lot with this as we were more comfortable with each other so I strongly recommend it. We were asked to read some text and prioritise items from a shipwreck (can’t give too much away) and then as a group order then. We then had to build an object using given materials to a specific height and be able to support a weight (cup of water:rolleyes: ). However it wasn’t as straight forward as this as we had periods of silence and a limited time. Once this task had been completed we has a group discussion of recent events so reading up in the newspapers is going to give you a little advantage (my groups topics were speed cameras, cannabis and a third which I can’t remember but you get the idea). There is no correct way to be in these scenarios but don’t just sit there and listen and contribute, also don’t be someone your not. You hear all this said over and over again but it’s the best advice you can get. If you’re being somebody else in the interview then yourself in a cockpit you may be totally the wrong person. This part of the day was most enjoyable as we got to express ourselves in a group and wasn’t too taxing on the brain.

The second part of the day (after lunch) was the interviews, I had mine last so I had to wait till 15:20 but if you need to catch a train they understand and will allow you to go earlier. The interview consists of some personal question, what you understand by the course and your general knowledge of aviation industry (eg a recent accident, a good example now would be the 747 that had engine fire after take off). The interviewers make you feel relaxed, just be yourself and tell the truth.

After you have had you interview another person will come and see you (normally 30 minutes after) and explain how you did and then tell you if you got in or not. If you do get in your given a talk about when courses start and so on if not your told where you went wrong. I was the last to leave at around 6pm where I had to catch a train within 30 minutes but the lady on the desk was wonderful and she got me a taxi and helped me out so much (thank you and sorry I cant remember your name).

I unfortunately didn’t get in because I failed the physics by one mark (gutter) but I am going for a retest in a few days. Lastly I wish everybody good look, enjoy the day it’s an experience and if you don’t get in then don’t let it stop you chasing your dreams


If you have anymore questions, the please PM and ill be glad to answer any questions

The Dr (Chris)

[Artificial Horizon]

Sounds like a pretty thorough process, just wondering what the point of it is. I gather that you had to pay to do the two days. What is the reward if you "pass" the two days and get 'accepted' onto the course. Does it then give you the right to hand over a massive check for £85000 or does it mean that they won't train you at all if you fail the check! Just wondering what all of this achieves, I always thought that OAT was a training school and as such would train you if you had the money. Just a little weary of this sort of thing as when I instructed for another large FTO they also did these assessment days for £150 a pop which apparently would rate your ability to pass a course of training. I trained several students who had got less than favourable reports which really dented thier confidence for no reason. One student particulary springs to mind, he had the most natural appitude for flying of anyone I ever instructed even after the 'computer said nnooo'.

[DrRedHead]

LOL:D , yea thats right you do have to pay and i think iots around £175 for the two days (not including food or a room to saty in). The school used to accept anyone and take that £60k right off you but now they don't want people wasting their money (or so they say). The test really just measure your ability on coping with tasks in the actual work environment, i mean my self i took to flying like a duck to water but some people may find that they have no ability what so ever and rather then waste 60k and not passing then they only waste 175 and find out why.

If "computer says nnooo" then you told why and you can come again for retest in 3 - 12 months, just so you forget questions as i think they stay the same :p. This happened to me but since i only just missed out on physics by one mark then they said come back in two months as everything else was very good. Failing doesn't mean you can't fly it just means you need to work on you hand eye co ordination and things

If however "computer says yes" (christmas special) then you can delay your entry upto a year and it gives you the right to choose a start date and then you can pay in monthly installments or in 3 lump sums.

I think it does rate your ability to pass the exams and the course in general but is also a requirement to be accepted into the school, hope this helps

The Dr (chris)

[Artificial Horizon]

cheers mate, well worth while doing something like that to allow you to make a well rounded decision. Good luck with all the future ambitions to fly, it is well worth the struggle initially.

Good Luck:)

[DrRedHead]

Just to let everybody know they say the standardof maths and physics is gcse standard, while this is true for the maths i found some of the questions for the physics beyond gcse as i had not studied it

A general list they want you to know for physics is (information given to me by assesser)
Radiation (alpha, Beta, gamma)
Waves (all types)
Atoms (names of parts proton,neutron electron and their charge)
Force
Power
Temperature
Heat Transfer (Conduction, Convection, Radiation)

Hope this helps

[Craggenmore]

Atoms (names of parts proton,neutron electron and their charge)
Eh, sounds like overkill? There are only about two electric questions on the systems paper! :}

[DrRedHead]

well thats just the list the guy told me, are you suggesting the questions say the same (Cough cough) dam winter

[Permafrost_ATPL]

Shame you did not apply two years ago, when they were trying to build up the APP intake. Having met some of the less gifted pilots coming out of the APP program (from that time), I reckon there were only two questions in the assessment day:

1) Are you legally blind?
2) Do you have 60k?

;-)

Thank you for the write up, very helpful for new guys. Good luck with your flying career!

P

[lockton9334]

Just to note, it cost me £195 for the Skills Assessment at OAT, which I took middle of November 05. Descriptions above match my 2 days. I passed first time and starting AP258 27th Jan :D (Went for my Class 1 after SA, which cost me £337 but got a rebate of £44 after passing, perhaps because I already had a Class 2 i.e. reduced admin costs??)

I would say the Maths was higher tier GCSE and physics would be triple science GCSE, perhaps some not covered at double science GCSE (??) and hence a flick through an AS Physics book would not go a miss. Obviously time since you were last "in school", I would guess, would determine amount of revision required?

Good luck to everyone else taking SA,

Jonathan

[link4]

Can anyone recommend any book i can buy to help with regards to preparing for the Psycho/Apt tests (must be psycho to be spending nearly £60,000!)

All help appreciated :ok:

[stue]

Hiya link4,
I have been assessed by OAT and am starting in Feb.
The assessment is not all that difficult, it is just like any other assessment that you would go through for a job, but this one lasts for 2days. The psycho and apt tests are not that bad. By their nature you cant really "revise" for them but do brush up on your maths and physics. Just simple stuff like long division and multiplication. It really is GCSE stuff so if you have got a C or above, with a bit of brushing up, you should be fine.

Make friends with the people that you are on the course with too. We all went out for a meal in Oxford on the 1st night and that helped us all in the team building exercises the following day. And most of all, just relax during your interview.

Be ready for a bombardment of "you shouldnt go to OAT" on these pages too.:p

It is expensive, but if you have got the money and the love of flying then go for it!

Good luck!!:ok:

[BOZZATO]

Hi there!

I've been through the OAT selection too and would agree with the afforementioned post! Most of all enjoy yourself! It is there to assess you but remember to have fun too, especially in the group discussions and exercises!

I'm also hoping to start in February, hopefully i'll see you the Stue!

Regards

James

[F3]

I'm glad they're giving people the opportunity to determine their aptitude for the course.
When I attended OATS (1998) me and my dad spoke with a silvery haired chap (Slippery Bob or Forked Tongued Bob or Economical With The Truth Bob, I forget now) who broke the bad news that I may have to put up with flying a turboprop of some type immediately after graduating - but don't worry, you will find yourself in the RHS of a jet a/c very soon after that. If successful at taking this grim disclosure (turbo-prop, how dare they!) without being reduced to a quivering wreck, the only further test was the ability to stump up £500 deposit (turbo-prop! How dare they...Barstewards!) as commitment to to starting the course.
That was the entry procedure and I felt sorry for the people who would burn though 10-15K only to find out they wouldn't make the grade.

I passed my course and thoroughly enjoyed my time at Oxford, although I have yet to secure my first flying job. Even if it means long re-positioning drives, flying bundles of newspapers or operating old equipment, I would love to fly a turbo-prop!! :)

[hedges81]

F3, ive heard its a hard game to get jobs in but 8 years?! U bin trying all that time? wots the story?

[Blinkz]

Link4, just get a book on mental arithmetic. Practice maths in your head, mainly long multiplication and division. Also brush up on basic physics, thats all you can do. Just relax any be yourself. Don't try and give them what they wany as they will just see right thro you. Good luck!

[stue]

BOZZATO,
Yeah, hopefully will see you there. The cheque went in the post yesterday for the deposit!:ok:

[dlav]

F3 - Where you on one of the old interated courses at OAT? After 8 years you still have not found anysort of employment?:uhoh:

[mad_jock]

I must admit you have to take your hat off to Oxford.

Actually it's a very old physiology trick which I had never heard of before until I worked at a University. The deal is if you really want people to choose your Establishment above all the rest you have to make them feel that you are more selective than the rest. So they feel that they have been chosen.

The Uni had the problem that they had a 100 person engineering course to fill. All the breeze block uni's had just got degree status and were advertising heavily, red brick and stone Uni's have a long standing agreement that advertising for students is a bit common and if the student is thick enough to be taken in by an advert on the telly they are probably quite suited for a breeze block uni.

Now there was over 1000 places for accredited engineering degrees going in Scotland but only about 800 potential students with the UCAS points and preference for engineering. Everyone else decided to drop there required points. This Uni decided to increase the points and also give interviews. They increased the points to near medic levels. Which most of the research slaves who had graduated from the course and continued wouldn't have been able to get on their former course.

The end result of academics spending weeks of getting moaned at by admin officer into doing the interviews was that the course was over subscribed. Started with an extra 10% which is a normal attrition in the first term as people get home sick or can't handle it. And another couple of Uni's engineering departments struggled to stay open for the next few years.

The course was exactly the same, and according to the academics the quality of the students didn't change either.

Most people in the department were very scathing about this plan until it proved to be exceptionally successful.

Its just another marketing ploy by OAT to make the potential customer choose their school over the others. It also has the advantage as well of generating some easy profit.

The purpose of this post isn't to say you shouldn't pay the money for the selection, do integrated or any other of those well worn debates on wannabees.

Its just meant to open your eyes to the ploy behind it. Its to try and make the limited market for intergrated students go to OAT instead of the other 2.

MJ

[F3]

I would hope that I'm the exeption in not having secured a flying job in 7.5 years!
I had to take a few months out of training (between s/e and multi phases) in order to help my parents, my father was terminally ill. Realising I had limited time in order to complete the course, I resumed training late '99 for 4 weeks, then had to go back home, then resumed again in june '01 (I had to as the 36 month rule meant I would have lost my ATPL ground school passes). At this stage my dad was very ill, but the one thing he wanted to see me acheive was a pass in the IR. I nailed the IR (after a partial pass :O ) and rushed back home. My dad died 20 days later.
Sent out loads of CV's then 9/11 happened!
I carried on sending out CV's for 18 months or so and couldn't even get a normal job! Debt was getting very serious, but I landed a non-flying job in London (280 miles away from home) I was all set to pack my bags and revalidate IR and get back in to the swing of things when my mothers condition deteriorated and she was in and out of hospital and I was unable to take the job. The iceing on the cake was the DWP stopping my jobseekers allowance as I had turned down a job. Flying was very much on the backburner at this stage!
I continued to look after my mum, got a far better paid job only 13 miles away and sorted out my finances. My mum died in April 2005.
It is only now, dear reader, that I feel in a state of mind and have sufficient financial resources and domestic stability to step back on the perpetual hampster wheel of keeping current, sending letters, researching, PFO letters back, and so on..... but I'm proberbly too old now! (late 30's)
I don't beleive in giving up, especially when so much went in to doing the course in the first place. I can't wait to fly again! I;m going all out to make it happen this year. :D
Good luck to anyone about to embark on their flying training/job hunting. I hope you have a rather smoother ride than I did at times.

[BOZZATO]

F3 i'm really sorry about your parents.

I can't begin to understand what you've been through! I am so very impressed with your positive attitude and wish you the very best of luck and hope everything works out for you:ok:

Regards

James

[flash8]

F3, you have shown a lot of determination - good luck mate!

[dlav]

F3 -- You are without doubt an inspiration to all of us. I hope I did not cause any upset with my post, it could not have been easy to reply.

:ok: Good luck mate and ill see you on the cockpit one day soon :ok:

[stue]

F3,

Like people have said, good luck mate. After all that the least you deserve is a job! You got a lot of balls mate, hat off to you!

Good Luck!:ok:

[F3]

Thank you very much for the support guys.

I felt it neccessery to give the full story as I wouldn't want people thinking they were wasting their time in undertaking flying training.
On a positive note, virtually all the people I trained with secured the flying job they wanted - some easily, others needed more determination. As long as you have a valid class one and determination there is always hope.

What happened to me is somthing we all go through at some point in life, it was just unfortunate timing, not that any time is good of course!
Also, I'm no stronger than anyone else. When sad circumstances occur, one has no choice but to deal with them and do whatever feels right at the time.

Thanks again and sorry to have drifted the topic so far off track!

Back to Oxford and good luck to anyone attending assessment days.

[DrRedHead]

Just an update, after passing the oxford selection (second time round) I had a look at how much it would cost including food and housing (based on the OAT accommodation) and well 73K is a lot of money.

I met a guy on holiday who passed the aptitude tests for Jerez and said its a lot cheaper as accommodation is included as well as food and so it only costs around 63k, now 10k less debt is quite a substantial figure so I do plan to go and visit sometime in Easter and make a judgement on which I prefer and I will write a review and make a comparison.

Very sad what happened to your fairly (deepest sympathy)

If anyone would like any help with the Physics on the OAT selection PM and ill help you with the areas they are looking for.

[hedges81]

F3: if anyone deserves a flying job then its you. Poor fella, I do really feel for your situation.

[Vee One...Rotate]

Assessment processes are fine and are important as regards gauging future success but to be expected to pay for one at a commercial school where you're, presumably, considering being a paying customer is a bit cheeky.

Independent organisations such as GAPAN also offer aptitude testing for a fee. Fine - it's a useful service they offer and I'm not considering giving them 60k soon afterwards.

The selection costs should be absorbed by the FTO as a cost of doing business. OAT are a business, they will aim to make a profit.

A bit too idealistic perhaps but certainly fair. To get into university you have your qualifications/experience and no doubt one or more interviews. Job done. No cash exchanging hands - except maybe travel and accommodation - certainly nothing for the actual process. If there is a requirement (as at OAT) to go through selection, then it should be subsidised or paid for by the school. This, of course, applies to all FTOs, not just OAT.

Crikey this industry is expensive!!! :bored:

V1R

[lockton9334]

Assessment processes are fine and are important as regards gauging future success but to be expected to pay for one at a commercial school where you're, presumably, considering being a paying customer is a bit cheeky.

Perhaps it is a way of "clearing out" the people that are not serious about their flying training and just want something to do for 2 days, especially at someone else’s expense?


To get into university you have your qualifications/experience and no doubt one or more interviews. Job done. No cash exchanging hands - except maybe travel and accommodation - certainly nothing for the actual process.

When I applied to University last year, through UCAS (the only way now) I had to pay for the application process, granted I think it was only £15 (not £195 as for the OAT SA), but I had to pay none the less.

Jonathan

[Rudedog]

F3: Was just interested in reading this thread because I trained at Oxford a few years ago. However, I thought that your first post was one of the funniest I have ever read (I think I know the barbed-tongued one) and the second was quite amazing. I am a bit late with this post but I sincerely hope that things go well for you from here on. Incredible to see someone with such a positive attitude. Someone is bound to snap you up. For what it is worth, I took a non-flying job with an airline when nothing better appeared. I am now in the right-hand seat of a 757...well not right now obviously!
All the best to everyone
RD

[ask26]

With regards to paying for assessments as Vee One said the FTO should have to absorb the costs.

CTC was £165 - sitting Advanced Pilapt
OAT was £195 - sitting Compass

FTE is £0, you pay for flights, then transport and tests are all included so perhaps we are slowly going the right way.

[Frank Furillo]

Look, maybe its me, but I cannot see the piont of spending good money just to get into a intergrated school. If you want to blow £75K+ just pop down to your local casino they will help you along. Oxford and others all tell you that they are the best and only they can get you a job.

How many students do Oxford have going through their school per year? How many of them have a job within six months? and is it on a Jet? I would ask these questions of any school I was looking at before I blew that much money.

I got my Blue book for half of what Oxford charge and amazingly enough it is the exact same as the one all you oxford guys get???? WOW

BTW I have not paid for any assessments and just last week had a assessment on a 737 for a job, been looking for 3 or 4 months. Not bad for a crappy modular student and even if I was asked to pay for a type rating I will still have change from £75K, enough to put down a large chunk on a nice RX8 for myself.

Originally Posted by Locton9934

Perhaps it is a way of "clearing out" the people that are not serious about their flying training and just want something to do for 2 days, especially at someone else’s expense?
What the hell does that mean?????????

[dlav]

If you dont like oranges - then dont buy one
If you dont like chocolate - then dont buy it
If you dont like BMW cars - then dont buy one

If you dont like OAT/FTE - THEN DONT BLOODY GO THERE!

SIMPLE, I would have thought. it appears not.......

Why do people feel the need to come on here and tell us all about how much they hate integrated schools? Have you honestly nothing better to do with your time?

We are all aware of the costs involved, the commitment, and the pressure we are under, needless to say we can do without all these stupid rants/digs at integrated schools.
Its a matter of personal choice where we go to train.

If you dont like it, then keep your thoughts to yourself.

[Frank Furillo]

Got your back up Dlav have I???? By the way I rather like my BMW thankfully I CAN AFFORD to run it, after all I did not go to a Hyped up school.
as a wise man once said, you cannot argue with a fool

[lockton9334]

How many students do Oxford have going through their school per year? How many of them have a job within six months? and is it on a Jet?

As you asked, around about 250, about 83% (100% within a year), and not sure about the last one (anybody got any idea). Figures are from the investigations I have made with various people, not just OAT.


What the hell does that mean?????????

To "weed out" the people that are not sure what they want to do with their life, especially if it does not cost them anything. Better?


BTW I have not paid for any assessments and just last week had a assessment on a 737 for a job, been looking for 3 or 4 months. Not bad for a crappy modular student

Out of interest, did you get the job? (congrats if you did btw)

I also agree with dlav, what is the point?

Jonathan

[adwjenk]

I agree with dlav,

Why the hell does everyone slate OAT and FTE!!!
Come on guys drop it!!!
Frank Furillo i don't like BMW but am i having ago about BMW and how the only people who can afford them are stuck up tits and think they own the road??? The simle answer is NO!!! Go get a VW golf just as good and just as nice, but less exspensive and you get more for your money, but thats MY opinion, which i KEEP to myself.
This is a usfull thread for wannabes looking at doing the OAT selection, lets not turn it into another thread where all we do is go round and round in circles slaging off OAT and intrgrated.
I must admit im slighlty against spending the £190, it would not be to bad if you got it refunded to you once you started your course, but hey its aviation you have to spend money to blow your nose in this world!!!

Best of luck to anyone going to OAT for the assesment enjoy!!!

Hope u got the 737 job Frank Furillo!!

[F3]

Thanks Rudedog and well done on getting there!
Hey, Frank try a Honda S2000 before blowing a stack on an RX8.

[Permafrost_ATPL]

As you asked, around about 250, about 83% (100% within a year), and not sure about the last one (anybody got any idea).

So you asked around a couple of people and have come up with the exact figures of 83% and 100%? I'm sorry, I don't tend to criticise other posters on the forum, but this HAS to be made up. Unless by job, you mean any job, including dispatcher, ops, cabin crew, etc. I don't think even OAT will try and pretend it's 100%!!!

P

[lockton9334]

So you asked around a couple of people and have come up with the exact figures of 83% and 100%? I'm sorry, I don't tend to criticise other posters on the forum, but this HAS to be made up. Unless by job, you mean any job, including dispatcher, ops, cabin crew, etc. I don't think even OAT will try and pretend it's 100%!!!
P

As it happens yes. (statistics can prove anything lol) Calculations based on number of APP Students graduated and those that have found employment, listed on OAT's website oAs it happens yes. (and as we all know, statistics can prove anything lol) Calculations based on number of APP Students graduated (informed guess) and those that have found employment, listed on OAT's website or otherwise (asking various people). 100% is implied by OAT (as they never quote exact figures), after a year from graduation if you have not found employment (doesn't say of what type), they renew your Multi-IR at no additional charge, they have never had to do this, hence the statistic. What it shows, I'm not so sure, like I said statistics can prove anything.

Make your own conclusions about my calculations etc. They are not endorsed by OAT nor anyone else for that matter, just thought some people might be interested……obviously not.

Jonathan

[qw21]

100% is implied by OAT (as they never quote exact figures), after a year from graduation if you have not found employment (doesn't say of what type), they renew your Multi-IR at no additional charge, they have never had to do this, hence the statistic.

Not so.

The OAT 1 year IR renewal guarantee (part of "Skills Net") you refer to is a recent thing, maybe not even 6 months old. The earliest we will know if anyone has had to use that backup i.e. no job after a year will be one year after the first "Skills Net" APP FO courses graduate/issued their IRs.

[Frank Furillo]

it seems like Permafrost_atpl stole my thunder, still I would like to see some hard and fast numbers if I were looking at going there and I have NEVER seen any.
The main problem I have with ALL the Oxford Student's I have come across, is the simple fact that they all have a 'Right Stuff' attitude, sorry guys and gals BUT you are not Chuck Yeager, Scott Crossfield, Al Shepard, Uri Gagarin, Jim Lovell or any number of guys who have hung their ass out in the line and hauled it in, neither am I.
Arrogance will kill you very fast in a aircraft, I know you boys know this as you are far supieror to anybody who has not gone to Oxford, I just thought I'd like to say it. Enough, this is getting tedious, as i said earlier, you cannot argue with a fool.

BTW F3 I am not sure about the S2000, I know it's mental, I am not sure I could live with the digital dash, I will have to take one for a spin, thanks
FF

[dlav]

I find that quite amusing actually, "you cannot argue with a fool", and then you go and argue back!

Its better to keep your mouth closed and let people think your a fool, than to open it and prove them right.

Why do some of you feel the need to open it?

[Permafrost_ATPL]

The OAT 1 year IR renewal guarantee (part of "Skills Net") you refer to is a recent thing, maybe not even 6 months old.

Thanks qw21 :) Jonhattan, I was not being mean, but you really have to watch the OAT propaganda.

I'll believe them if they ever release the real figures. But when you ask, they say that they can only rely on people who get back to them once they have a job. In a way that's fair enough, but then don't publish number based on that (they will look really good but won't be exactly accurate).

I wonder what they claim for modular students (even the ones who did all their modules at Oxford and were thus promised career help). Ahhh, but I guess modular students did not do the 2-week classroom course "First Officer Fundamentals (which covers mostly MCC material). That must make them a MUCH higher training risk for airlines, so their files are rarely forwarded. Makes perfect sense :hmm:

P

[Frank Furillo]

Dlav, you just proved my point. Thanks
Adwjenk, just so you know I have had several Golf's mainly GTI's one Rallye even a Corrado G60 once, nice thing, you cannot beat rear wheel drive for sheer fun and that is where the Golf runs a bit flat even the 4wd ones.

[lockton9334]

Not so.
The OAT 1 year IR renewal guarantee (part of "Skills Net") you refer to is a recent thing, maybe not even 6 months old. The earliest we will know if anyone has had to use that backup i.e. no job after a year will be one year after the first "Skills Net" APP FO courses graduate/issued their IRs.

Was un-aware of this to be the case, more research required lol

Permafrost_ATPL, i know you weren’t being mean, its good to have a "balanced discussion", makes it more informative.

Jonathan

[adwjenk]

Thanks for the advice on the golf, i'll remember that for the future!!!

Best of luck for the future

ADWJENK

[5N-VNA]

Could anyone give me an insite into the Skills Test days at OAT? I know they're important to filter out the applicants but a heads up on what's tested and how the days take shape would be very much appreciated.

[flyingmutant]

I'm sure someone will come along and give you a much more detailed answer but this is what I can remember from the OAT seminar a few weeks ago.

Over two days you do COMPASS tests which includes a maths and physics exams and tests similar to the PILAPT program used by the other FTO's. They look at hand-eye coordination, memory, mutli-tasking and the like.
You also have group tasks and discussions followed by a sim-ride and finally an interview+debrief.

Don't qoute me on the exact order of all this tho!

[flyingmutant]

Didn't have a chance to ask when I was there but are the maths and physics parts of the test computerised too?

Do you get a calculator or at least a pen+ paper to work with?

[rogueflyer01]

Do you get a calculator

Nope. Pen & paper only.

good luck :ok:

[Katherine Alexandra]

I know nobody's said much here for a while, but just to add recent experiences.

If you get 9/15 on Tech test, do not despair. I know someone who got 9 and failed Tech, but I got 9 and OAT's commercial director, who was debriefing me, passed me :) it all depends!

Oh, and in terms of topics for discussion in the group assessment, I had "Automation in aviation", "Aviation over the last 10 years" and "Iraq- is it just a cover up for the failings of the UK's foreign policy?" and while I liked the topics, there were those that found them too hard. You have been warned!

Good luck to all sitting the assessment though, it's good fun!

[DrRedHead]

Just to plug the local pub and make things a little easier on the social side. I highly recommend visiting the Jolly Boatman which is one of the local pubs and does cheap grub. It’s also a very good way to socialise with people on your selection which may just make that bit of difference when it comes to doing the group tasks.

Directions - at the roundabout with the large car dealership in front of you turn Left and continue down the road until you hit the traffic lights. At the traffic lights turn left and continue down the dark road for about 100M and the pub should be on your right.

[neilia]

Also 10% discount on food if you flash your oxford pass. ;)

[Katherine Alexandra]

Oops :rolleyes: knew there was something important I wanted to say...

You CAN fail OAT assessment on the personality test! That's it :) although it's fairly tricky I think, and happens very rarely!

[DrRedHead]

yea that is true, there is a girl on our course to which this happened to and she has had no bother

[Propellerhead]

Exact employment statistics would be a bit meaningless. There are so many factors involved that can change fairly quickly. The number of airlines recruiting now won't be the same in 12-18 months time when you graduate.

Also, every candidate is different and if you're a good student who's done well at the course and is the type of person who the airlines are looking for you will almost certainly get a job (provided market conditions are still good).

The skills assessment should (and does) increase the level of student going through, therefore more will pass the course, more will get good grades, and more will get jobs(and more with major airlines). This increases Oxford's reputation with the airlines (as they know they are getting a quality product who is likely to succeed at their training), and therefore increases Oxford's 'pull' for potential students.

[Yomomma]

Hi All,

I am going for my OAT 2-day assessment shortly and was wondering if anyone could pass me some additional tips? I have read the posts which are helpful but just wondered if anyone else had 1st hand knowledge of the types of questions involved in the Maths/Physics tests? and whether they are both multiple choice? Additionally if anyone had examples of their interview questions and group discussion examples? Would appreciate any advice or comments and/or PM's especially from any recent attendees.

Cheers
YM

[744FO]

No way does OAT have a 100% employment history. I know pleanty of guys who went to Oxford years ago who are still waiting for that job which just wont come.

Does OAT issue rose-tinted glasses as standard to all its APP students?:ugh:

[Sinbad_633]

I did the OAT skills assessment back in the middle of January. It was quite an enjoyable experience, although I think I could have had more fun for £195.

The best advice I can give for the maths part is know your times tables up to something like 20x20 and know them well. I have a calculator on my desk at work and I am lazy, I reach for it for even simple things. The fact I took the time to learn the tables was really helpful. It makes your long multiplication and division so much faster.

The physics part is not too difficult, but I did A-Level physics, an engineering degree and I have worked as an engineer for five years so I am lucky that I use that stuff all the time and I just "know it" now. A lot of people have recommended the BBC bite size website. If you can do that you should be OK.

The hand / eye stuff, I think you can either do it or you can't (I passed this by one mark). Strange really, because I was really good in the sim and the guy said I scored very well.

For the interview and group exercises, be yourself but you must have confidence in yourself. You can't just sit there and let it pass you by, you must contribute. I also can't overstate how useful it is to get to know your selection-mates. We all went out for dinner & beers on the middle night and it helped greatly in the group exercises.

So all in all I passed and I got a phone call a couple of days later asking me if I wanted to book a start date. I said I didn't as I still had to make a trip to Jerez.

I was successful in Jerez too, so I had a decision to make.

I didn't mind paying the money to do the OAT selection, I was however amazed that I had to buy my own lunch. Trivial I know but it set the tone. To cut a long story short in June I will have my sun cream on and my Spanish phase book handy.

[aF380]

PLEASE can you tell us what kind of questions we will have on physics
example will be nice thanks
and with subject to revise on www.bbc (http://www.bbc)......

[Blackstone]

Exactly what I was going to ask here! I am taking the OAT/NJ Skills Assessment next Thursday.. Anybody else? I did some basic physics revising already, but an example of what we can expect would be greatly appreciated.. Is it comparable with something like this?

http://www.cabair.com/integrated/physics_paper/Physics.htm

[PLATO_Y2K]

Blackstone, From what I have heard, the skills assessment at OAT is slightly more taxing than that at Cabair. However this is not from direct knowledge, as I said this is just what I hear.

I am fairly fortunate as I have done Chem Math and Physics at A Level and am almost finished an A/C engineering degree. But still going to brush up on the Bitesize website on some of the fundamentals.

Going to be there on Thursday also, look forward to seeing you there.

Craig

[DrRedHead]

hey guys.

i just had a quick sift through those cab air questions. Im not sure if things have changed since i origionally posted the topic but the cabair questions are VERY similar to those that you get at Oxford. The topics are all covered in the cabair questions. I would say they are actualy harder then the oxford ones.

the Dr

[hollingworthp]

I would agree with The Dr

I sat COMPASS on Tuesday and the Tech Test is looking at more basic knowledge than the CABAIR sample Physics paper.

Quite a lot of it relies on your general understanding of how things work rather than quantum physics!

Kind regards

Phil.

[PAJ]

I was at assessment for NJ with phil - I think he has hit the nail on the head. It's not necessarily just about physics theory, its more about applying the most basic theories to an every day situation. Boyles Law, Electronics, Magnetism, resultant forces, basic aero/ fluid dynamics are all worth learning - but do not restrict yourself to these alone. Anyone who has more advanced physics qualifications, don't look for the catch, look for the most basic applicable principles - this is much harder than it sounds! Bitesize is probably the best online source - I also suppleneted this with the Higher Level GCSE revision guide by CGP (purple one!) - only £5 and will be useful preparation regardless as to where you end up doing your training. Good luck

[SingSong]

How about the maths paper? is that like the Cabair one???

[hollingworthp]

I suppose the question style is broadly similar but it covers more areas than that and also the CABAIR test paper is particularly time-generous.

The OAT only gives you 10 minutes to answer 25 questions. Anyone could answer these in 30 minutes but it is speed and accuracy that they are looking for.

HTH

Phil.

[stephen_b]

I have my assessment on the 17/18 April and I have had a go on the EPST tests and my main downfall was memory - does anyone have any ideas on how to improve this and also does anyone have any hints for the day etc...

Thanks,

Steve

[MorningGlory]

Good on OATS! Nothing like it when I was a student there, just handed over the cash and jumped into the fire.

However, anything that improves the gene pool of first officers coming into the industry is a good thing in my opinion.

Good luck to you all! :ok:

[737cap2b]

Hi,

I am currently wanting to go to Oxford Aviation Training Centre. Has anyone done the Skills Test they want you to complete before entering Oxford? What do you exactly have to do - I can't find it anywhere what you exactly have to do.

Many Thanks

[alio25]

Thank you DrRedHead for posting your diary of events from your visit last year, it is very helpfull indeed. I have my assessment 10th & 11th of April so im touching up on a few things. Hopefully it should all go well, is anyone else visiting these two days?

[737cap2b]

Yes, Thanks DrRedHead, it really helps - at least I now know what I need to brush up on etc. Many Thanks

[Garfmc]

Hello all,

I am going to the skills assessment at Oxford this month. Could anone give any advice or topics which could be revised? Also, what does the interview cover and what preparation should be done for this part of the skills assessment?

Thanks:hmm:

[balboa]

Oxford assessment is a farce- nothing less. Three fossils from the cold war will ask you how you are going to pay for it. Unless you burn the building down- you're in.

[Ronnie1317]

thats the most untrue statement ive heard lol.......

[hollingworthp]

Balboa - either you have never taken the assessment or you bombed it really badly as you clearly have no idea what you are talking about.

[737cap2b]

Hi,

After passing the Skills Assesment what months do OAT start the course? Monthly or specific months?

Many Thanks

PS, I have not passed or attempted the skills test yet, I am trying to make a plan, and PPRUNE's members have been great in helping me! Thanks :)

[asuweb]

Assuming you're talking about the APP FO, then a new course starts every month.

[737cap2b]

Thanks! That really helps! Yes i was talking about the APP FO!

[ballyboley]

I'm not wanting to start the age old "is OAT the best" debate, but as a current APP First officer student there at present, I can tell you for a fact OAT are turning away people quite reguarly from skills assessments. I know of 3 people I spoke to on the last assessment which were turned down although one of them was told to re-try in 6 months.
So, no, its not a farse i'm afraid.

I can also tell you as a real student (and not the usual complaining people on here who've never been to OAT or have been rejected at assessment) that once you're in OAT it does not mean you pay your way and get an ATPL. OAT do their own Finals which are much harder than the JAA exams. They will move you back a course if you fail some of them and will most defiantly kick you out if you're not doing well enough. This can happen right through to the flying stage which is also highly assessed. They're also the only school I believe that will give you every penny back if they have to do this. Its called "skills assurance" see the website for info.

I dont work for OAT, or trying to sell their products. I just spent ALOT of time weighing up the best schools including visiting them and hate people coming on here making statements which they know nothing about.

Hope that helps any serious prospective students.

[bri1980]

They won't give you every penny back: I think the limit of liability is £37k. There are some worked examples on OATs finance page that indicate different scenarios for training being terminated and how much you would be invoiced for, and how much protection you get from the Skills Protection Scheme.

Don't get me wrong though: it's a very good deal!

[ballyboley]

I beg your pardon, yes, there is an upper limit. But it has just been extended to include right up to the CPL skills test in the flight training stage, and it is very unlikely that they would kick you out much later than that.
It does cover up to £37,000 which is essentially the entire first year which is the most demanding.

[Max7t9]

All the very best F3.

[Captain Melly]

Hi

Anyone out there going to Oxford for the assessments run on the 15th and 16th May? If so, what sort of prep are you doing? Feel free to PM me.

Look forward to meeting to all then.

CM

:)

[Blind_Pilot]

Could somebody tell me what the physics questions are like. Will there be purely theoretical questions, or are they more based on logic? Because I haven't had any science class in the last 3 years, since I passed a French scientific Bac, and I must admit I'm kind of at a loss regarding where to start putting my brain concerning these subjects...

I got 6 out of 8 at the Cabair physics assessment, but I don't know if that's enough...

[ballyboley]

I suggest you check out our forum at Oxford - ask.oxfordaviation.net and run a search on the assessment. There are LOTS of posts there about it. Obviously they dont like giving too much away but if you're happy with GCSE physics you should be fine.

Best of luck

[hollingworthp]

The physics is all straightforward and I imagine it is similar to CABAIR's (although I have not seen that one). Check out http://www.bbc.co.uk/schools/gcsebitesize/physics/

HTH

[nicksmalley]

Hi All,

Noticed this thread started some time ago. If anyone has done both Cabair and OAT quite recently, I would be really keen to chat to them. PM if poss.

Thanks in advance,

Nick

[Feet of Flames]

Hi,

Due to attend assessment day at Oxford. Great write up regarding the event. Are you sure Journalism isn't your field?

Just curious regarding the type of questions in Physics and Maths that came up. Can you help or remember the level / standard? I have bought the Maths and Physics Disc's from the school in an attempt to brush up, as whilst I achieved the grades at school, it seems a distant memory.

Hope all work out for you in the end.

C

[GLAMM]

Not long passed the assessment day myself.
Physics questions were 15 in total, along the lines of the following, all multi choice:

A hot air balloon rises due to......

A drawing of a beam and asked where to put a weight A to balance the beam which has other weights B and C placed along it.......

Maths questions were fractions and percentages of numbers, also speed distance time etc

Group discussions were, but guess they can pick anything for you:
NHS v's private health care
Environmental Issues and how they'll affect your career as a pilot

[TRY2FLY]

Anyone for assessment tomorrow and Friday?

[DrRedHead]

hey guys, havnt added much to this thread in a while so if people who have recently done the assessments and cann tell me if things have changed id be more then happy to update the post. From the things iv read however i can say that the assessments have not changed that much
regards the Dr