Standby for the exodus from Gulf Air!!!

[gfboy]

In response to the earlier thread regarding Gulf Air A320 rosters, if rumours are correct I believe in the next 3-4 months there will be a steady flow of resignations from A320 F/O's. I understand at the last count there was around 5-6 F/O's all ready to hand in their notice and leave!

The A320 appears to be short of crew at the moment, what will happen when these F/O's and are taken out of the equation? One can only imagine flights being cancelled and aircraft grounded!!!

Interesting times ahead.

[Gobble]

GF boy
It is a rumour mill .
I hope nobody shoots you down in flames for your statement.
Just talking to the guys on the street about this - your statement does sound correct.
It's been discussed on the other thread and there seems to be a very deep sentiment of discontentment and a feeling of being done up the @rse.... this is normal for pilot groups all over the world but for some reason it appears to be manifesting itself recently in very prominent ways on Paradise Island.

It sounds like people have already started to vote with their feet, history has shown on many occasions - and not just in aviation circles, that this is when people start taking notice and making changes.

I do wish everyone the best, I've made some very decent friends here on the island and I know that none of them came here with a plan to get a TR and leave. Everyone I met wanted to make a long term go of it and were willing to put in the hard yards.
Disregard, and a complete, deep lack of professional respect on the part of many members of managment have lead to this.

It's a big wide world out there and I sincerely wish anyone moving on to greener pastures the best.

(It will be another excuse to go and have a beer with 'old mates' on the lhr nightstop!)

Goobler :E

[ratpoison]

Well. I hope they aint filling out EK applications as the same thing is happening there, only the smell is different. !!

[mali]

I love paradise Island.

Gulf air is the best. I cant understand why everyone wants to leave. We should all be happy and be in the celebrations.
I tell you, in the old world this good it was not. Back home is not as good as is it here.
I love the jj's.
The people here are the friendliest in the world and they always tell you that they are you're friends. Back in the home, they have never says this to me.
flying the roots are the best. Where else can you fly to bombay and karachi? it's nice. why leave?
One day, I will go onto the big airbus and that will be exciting for me. i will fly over the top of india and into the storms. sometimes the Captains give me exciting stories about the wheather out there in the big world - it sounds scary. I'm glad im with them.
I hope we can all be in the positive ways and think together like a teem does. its good when that happens, we all pull together in unisoon.
I am excited for next months roster - i believe therell be big changes and i even heer that fos next year will be allowed to start the engines which will be relly cool. Carnt wait,

enyway, i dont wanna rant and the rave.

have a nice day - its good out there.

good by.

:E

[A300Man-2005]

What are GF's plans (medium / long term) for the A320 fleet? Do they plan to keep these aircraft flying for several more years, or go the route of EK and QR and restrict their operations to widebodies, to capitalise on restricted landing slots and congestion at airfields?

(I know QR currently has a fleet of 14 A320 family aircraft, but they have indicated that they will take no more narrow bodies and replace them as soon as they can).

Pity that there appears to be an exodus shortly from GF. Seems to be endless issues with the carrier right now.

[Scooter Rassmussin]

Sounds like EK alright all the ME carriers are all the same , these guys must be going home ....................Wise choice........:mad:

[Gobble]

Mali
great to see some people out there with a sense of humour still, albeit a little twisted and dark - put a smile on my face regardless!

We need more of it in this world.

Happy hunting to all as we continue in our endeavour for enternal bliss....

Gobbbler

:}

If we all pull together we can have a white Christmas!

[ratpoison]

Geeeeez Gobble, that leaves a bad taste in my mouth !!:yuk:

[jackbauer]

If we are to believe everything we read on prune about a mass exodus from all the ME airlines then the whole place would have come to a complete stop a long time ago. Fact is gf boy, 5 or 6 F/O's do not constitute a MASS exodus. If you need to go because you can't hack it then fair enough but don't give the impression that the airline will come to a stop without you. This whole subject has been covered at length on the rostering thread and the concensus is that there IS a group who just took the TR and are going to jump ship. Good luck but I doubt you will find an easier lifestyle anywhere else.

[inflames]

If JB has anything to do with management it's no wonder things are so f***** up in GFA. Wearing rose tinted glasses doesn't make things right for the rest of us out there. The fact of the matter there are serious issues within GFA that are non existent in other airlines. Have you ever worked for another western airline?

Most peopel would like to see things improve and not leave the airline, however you have offered no constructive tips, nor tried to explain the main grievences. We all know that there is no Biblical (or Koranical)exodus from GFA, it is 5-6 guys, but 10-12 guys in a year, and probably double that next year, as the job market becomes extremely bouyant, is not something to ignore. They will be screaming out for contractors by begining of 2007 I can assure you, and will they get them? at a pretty price, causing even more discontent with then, unfairly paid F/O's.

Do you ever think about moral? You think that we are wingers and moaners as you mention in rostering thread? Well good CRM buddy, you should be confined to a factory assembly line and not let out in public if that's your explanation of things! Ever think how much easier our rosters would be if people didn't go sick as often? Know why people go sick? probably not, ever think how much money could be saved, how more efficiently things would work if things were run a little more proffesionally, and we weren't run into the ground? The more I think about it the more you are GFA management, it seems typical solution to put ones head into some dirty sand and dismiss people as expendable comodities.

As for lifestyle, maybe I will find myself an Island with a beach. Accomodation that doesn't come with 'jack hammers' operating next door, and an airline that has a map and an airline directory in it's staff travel department!

[jackbauer]

Inflames, losing your cool and then mentioning CRM is not a good way to win friends and influence people. I was going to address your argument until I saw your standard of spelling/english and decided it's not worth it.

peopel - People
grievences - Grievances
moral - Morale
wingers - Whingers
proffesionally - Professionally
accomodation - Accommodation

Thats just at a quick glance, it's no wonder you need a map in staff travel, maybe a dictionary would help also. Be careful when applying to your next job, better get someone else to type up your CV.

[mali]

We should all celebrate in the hapiness of being with Gulf air.
I like Bahrain, we are all in the one island and happy for each other,
i would say we are lucky and life is good to enjoy for us.

good luck with everything to everyone, specially to the gulf air, in the islands.

bye.

:sad:

[inflames]

If JB has anything to do with management it's no wonder things are so f***** up in GFA. Wearing rose tinted glasses doesn't make things right for the rest of us out there. The fact of the matter there are serious issues within GFA that are non existent in other airlines. Have you ever worked for another western airline?

Most peopel would like to see things improve and not leave the airline, however you have offered no constructive tips, nor tried to explain the main grievences. We all know that there is no Biblical (or Koranical)exodus from GFA, it is 5-6 guys, but 10-12 guys in a year, and probably double that next year, as the job market becomes extremely bouyant, is not something to ignore. They will be screaming out for contractors by begining of 2007 I can assure you, and will they get them? at a pretty price, causing even more discontent with then, unfairly paid F/O's.

Do you ever think about moral? You think that we are wingers and moaners as you mention in rostering thread? Well good CRM buddy, you should be confined to a factory assembly line and not let out in public if that's your explanation of things! Ever think how much easier our rosters would be if people didn't go sick as often? Know why people go sick? probably not, ever think how much money could be saved, how more efficiently things would work if things were run a little more proffesionally, and we weren't run into the ground? The more I think about it the more you are GFA management, it seems typical solution to put ones head into some dirty sand and dismiss people as expendable comodities.

As for lifestyle, maybe I will find myself an Island with a beach. Accomodation that doesn't come with 'jack hammers' operating next door, and an airline that has a map and an airline directory in it's staff travel department!

[near enuf is good enuf]

That showed you jack!

[jackbauer]

That showed you jack! That showed me what? The idiot just posted the same retarded comments twice. Spelling is not his only problem, he is also computer illiterate!

[mali]

Thinks heating up!
hehe...

good to see some of the passion is still existing...

good bye

hehe

:}

[Mladen Ostir]

in flames
you need to control your temper - i can see some smoke coming from you head from here. put the fires out inside man - you are dangerous.
JB, to have an opinions are good.

in flames i think i know who you are, probably go and have a beer to relax i would say.
but you also have a point or too thats very real and should be considered but the methods to potray these points is violent, i think you are probably caught up with the lab rats you tallked about before in the topic before.
some beer will be good for you.

well hopefully the issues may be dealt with in the future cause i heard today things are changing for all of us in the best way.

it's multi cultural and good for that!

take it easy on me in the sectors inflames!

cheers to all

:cool:

[Dixons Cider]

cause i heard today things are changing for all of us in the best way.

Cmon Mladen, don't just dangle the carrot and run away - tell us what you know...

[lownslow200]

For those in the know, why is Gulf looking for a head of flight operations.

[Gobble]

They're looking for a HOFO for very similar reasons they are continually on the look out for new pilots....

They have a chronic problem of maintaining their staff levels the way they should be.... from the newest FO or Cadet to the mid and upper levels of management; GF are continually looking for staff.

"people come and people go.... "

I'm sure that saying must have originated somewhere in the halls of the GF extablishment!



:O

[scanscanscan]

No...the sayings are...F/o...Do you know what they just did to me?
Captain.....If you do not like it leave.... Shut up or ship out.... I just did my CRM course.... How am I doing?

[boeingdriverx]

i will say you do it the AUTOCRATIC way !

cheers
BD

[ironbutt57]

still waiting.....:rolleyes:

[Vinz]

With the simulators being re-located to Bahrain from Doha and Training Captains no longer required to spend time away from base nicely collecting the duty pay, we stand to loose around BD300 per month!! GF at the moment have not offered any incentive for Captains to continue in their training role. Consequently many are threatening to quit and even walk away from the job!

As gfboy mentioned earlier, perhaps the exodus from Gulf Air is even worse than was first imagined, F/O's leaving and now Training Captains leaving.

One wonders what the future holds for the golden falcon in the gulf??

[Bolty McBolt]

They're looking for a HOFO for very similar reasons they are continually on the look out for new pilots....
They have a chronic problem of maintaining their staff levels the way they should be.... from the newest FO or Cadet to the mid and upper levels of management; GF are continually looking for staff.
"people come and people go.... "
I'm sure that saying must have originated somewhere in the halls of the GF extablishment!
:O

Why is it that non of the ME airlines ever advertise for engineers/LAE ?
Do they only have locals? Are the expats they hire happy?
The only airline I have seen advertise is QR and they did walk interviews in SYD but were offering rubbish so no one (i know of) took up the offer as there is more money at MAS without the ME BS...

[chrispatrickGA]

Men it looks like GF PILOTS dont stop giving their resignation letter .
Bad time for the operation office where 3 pilots at least gave up their job last week:yuk: :yuk:
GF DOESNT HAVE THE STRUCTURE OF EMIRATES and few more pilots are going to abandon their job soon...:uhoh: :uhoh:
Whats the future for our airline ?How long can the management keep smiling?:} :}

[Heleheleyani]

I feel bad to see that everyone is looking for job and leaving also, well I am included just waiting for my time to be over before the end of 2007 I will be gone.

What bothers me is I only know gulf air for a few years and during my employment with the company I cared for it and protect it as much as I can. Seeing some locals not caring as much as I do for their national carrier is sad.

I like most of the people working for the company and I enjoyed my time, but the circumstances forced me to resign, I hope things get better, because company is a good place to work for and Bahrain and the people of bahrain are one of the friendliest I know. Good luck for the people who stay.

[Flyer1015]

What are the biggest problem areas at GF causing resignations?

Pay? scheduling? work rules? Rising cost of living that isn't being offset?

[boeingdriverx]

I have been here for 2 years almost and I feel the same. Bahrain is Bahrain, it is not Sydney, London or Paris but offers an 'OK' environment to live for few years. And I understand why some of my colleagues are leaving:

- the 767 crews have been treated like ****, and their management doesn't give a **** either. So that's why so many of them left GF in the last months...How many of them are now flying in Dubai... I am not surprised.

- about our 'package':
* our package is maybe an industry average, but think about that: GF doesn't have a pension scheme for expats, which is for me a problem. It will stop me to stay on a long-term basis with GF. EK for example does give 12% of your basic salary (12% of 20000AED (joining FO approx salary)=200BD approx) EVERY month into a pension scheme. You can claim it fully after 7 years... after 7 years that's a 2400BD X 7 = 17000BD approx without interest... And this is without your contribution. I am not saying this is the best scheme ever, but at least IT EXISTS! And this is on top of a basic salary already higher than ours and reviewed yearly (steps...) + decent housing.
* All of us know about the Housing Situation... 350BD max housing allowance per month when a decent home in a decent place for your family cost at least the double. Gulf Air if you dont want to increase this allowance then please provide us with YOUR decent accomodation (as per our working contracts), Families should get houses and singles apartment.
* Medical Claims: Since July none of my claims have been reimbursed... Who is to blame ? The easy system I guess, not so EASY ! nobody informed us, trained us or anything, again bad planning... Of course I emailed my 'hierarchy' many times about this and I GOT NO REPLY - management why are you here if it is not to help us with this kind of issues?

- Staff Travel / Ground Staff @ BAH Airport: We are treated again like ****, with no respect to our Terms & Conditions. GF you owe us these ID90s and ID50s (as per our working contracts) for my family and myself. It seems that you are aware of the problems with these departments, so I am waiting for serious actions here.

-PCE ? Yes we need one, believe it or not. A plane needs a captain and a company a Boss. Hopefully we will get a good one. And please don't tell me GF is loosing money because of oil prices ! It doesn't hold anymore:

Jan. 19 (Bloomberg) -- Crude oil's descent to $50 a barrel (...) for the first time in more than two years, based on historical price moves.

'your employees are your bigger asset so don't waste it!'
BD

[jimmyhagendas]

A major factor that Pilots are leaving GF are the housing allowance and the management knows the situation and doesnt do anything about it.
An average of 2300 BD a year you have to fork out of your own pocket if you are single & renting a 500 BD flat wich is the cheapest deasent bedroom in town.
There are some new joiners that refused to get out of the hotel when they joined and threatened to resign and guess what...they where asigned to a brand new modern flat with only paying the housing allowanse 311 BD.
What sort of segregation is this.:=
For F...s ake get down to the problem and do something NOW.:ugh:

[Gretchenfrage]

What's the problem? Soon you'll get Andre Dose as new CEO. He easily managed to run down the start-up SWISS with 1.4 billionUS as starter, in only 1 1/2 years. Soon your suffering will be over, either BAH will have a lot less traffic, or GF will be sold to another company, merely to get rid of a local competitor and to take over the traffic from BAH. Housing will be the least problem. But i hear EK and EY are desperate for jockeys......

Good luck

[REACH-69]

But we still can give GF the credit, for giving P1 Type Rating after being there for 2yrs and then you will stand a better chance of getting a better oppturnity some where else. Is there another airline that presents you with this kind of offer?:=

[Soft Altitude]

WOW Reach, How' s that?:eek: I've been with the company for 3 years now and no way someone with a similar seniority can get command in the following 3 years at least, since 80+ local guys ahead waiting for their turn !!!
How did you do that ???
Guys are leaving because of very limited career prospectives and someone once mentioned an "easy" lifestyle; well, its not an "easy" but an extremely lazy lifestyle over here and that is not to everybody's taste.
Working for GF itself has really no major pitfalls, the salary is on the higher side of the industry average, no airline is giving you 50 days annual leave nowadays, and even if the staff travel department needs a serious overhaul, you can still get as much reduced rate tickets as you want, something you will not necessarily find with other airlines, you only need to be patient, very very patient.
Soft Altitude, Out.

[cupstirrer]

Seems like the exodus barely started. Most of you guys on the B767 will be on the go once the first 2 B767s are returned to the lessors in the coming months (-GS & -GT me thinks), obviously no carreer prospect on this fleet. Feel bad for you guys!
Very true that EK and EY looking for jockeys, for GF Boeing fellas, EK will definitely be waiting for you guys with arms wide open.
Airbus bonded gents will also be leaving as soon as all of them have consulted with the bahraini lawyer who is advising about the 1-year bond limit, according to bahraini law.
Interesting weeks to come. Interesting job for the new PCE, if we ever get one.

Best of luck for all of us.

[ironbutt57]

Boeing driverx dont know where you get the idea that the 767 fleet are being treated any differently than any other fleet...most who left did so because of schooling/housing issues..the same issues faced by other fleets...others were established in the UAE following GT and were not willing to start over again in BAH, they found it easier to remain in the UAE...yes it wil be interesting to see what happens if and when the fleet is downsized GF in the pas have always accomodated crews on other fleets..wait and see...

[Trader]

They are downsizing the 67 fleet?? True or rumour??? If they do they can certainly use the guys on the airbus fleet since I know at least 8 guys who are leaving as soon as someone calls them.

[ironbutt57]

Have heard all kinds of stories about this fleet for a while..they change by the week...guess we'll find out when it happens....

[REACH-69]

WOW Reach, How' s that?:eek: I've been with the company for 3 years now and no way someone with a similar seniority can get command in the following 3 years at least, since 80+ local guys ahead waiting for their turn !!!
How did you do that ???
Guys are leaving because of very limited career prospectives and someone once mentioned an "easy" lifestyle; well, its not an "easy" but an extremely lazy lifestyle over here and that is not to everybody's taste.
Working for GF itself has really no major pitfalls, the salary is on the higher side of the industry average, no airline is giving you 50 days annual leave nowadays, and even if the staff travel department needs a serious overhaul, you can still get as much reduced rate tickets as you want, something you will not necessarily find with other airlines, you only need to be patient, very very patient.
Soft Altitude, Out. Just check the 767 upgrade scheme for last year and u will find out what i meant....4 guys got upgraded after being in the company for less than 3 yrs:oh:

[ironbutt57]

This has been hashed out before Reach....they were AUH base, and when their seniority number came up they got the command...the other more senior FO's (way more senior!) didnt have the hour requirements so the others went up...as mentioned before, the AUH base was "split" senioritywise from "mainline" at the time, so it was not permitted that senior f.o.'s from the airbus fleets transfer to AUH for their commands...not sure what the thinking behind that was, as many of the DEC's hired to fill those slots have left the company, but that was the policy..water under the bridge.....as the lists remerged Jan 2006, the senior f.o.'s are now in the pipeline, most have completed their initial line check..some have completed the trng if you think the policy is unfair, well all I can say is go to EK, EY, or QR..they have a documented policy of hiring DEC's regardless of the qualifications of the f.o.'s waiting and ready...what to do??? have a nice day:ok:

[REACH-69]

Well, I am sorry Ib if i offended your pals ,but i still think it's not fair to upgrade someone whom i am sure will be leaving after getting the required hrs and bypassing guys that will serve the company for a longer period.The accuracy of your info was 50% right cause that's what you think.The whole thing was fabricated.....Have a nice day:D

[ironbutt57]

I'm not offended at all...the people who were upgraded did so by AUH seniority..."fabricated" or not that was the system in place..what more to say...signing out:ugh:

[CG11]

hi,
just want to ask, Fos with GF how any STBY they have in one roster,

specially now, i was comparing with other fleet fos . i had 5 stby to 8 stby
what will happen to the 767 fos if 2 aircraft go out of service, i fly 50 hrs this month but i heared some of 767 fos they do 30-40hrs. TAFB 160 -250
if somebody can help me , is it true , cause i already had bad experiance with rostre. i hope it is not always

most of the time a i am flying for 50 -60 hrs , but some they reach 80 + .

i do not know , for how long we will suffer.

i had an offer from QA A330 with good pakage. but i heared so many things about qr

in a way it is batter then GF because of a destination, salary , new aircraft , and they r stright forward , about future plan GF they said they will increase fleet to 60 but what i see fleet is down sizing

[Jockofthebushveld]

Guys guys, agian stop fighting each other here,WE all work for the same dumb place!!
We are in need of
1) housing ,IF not soon , i am going to EK...
2)education ,If not soon , I am going to EK
3)Staff travel, if not working soon, Iam going to EK..
4 Pension fund,, well i shoud be going to EK
5) heavy trafic in dubai i am being told, dont care, just want to join EK
6)Guys are super at GF , just want to join Ek with flash new planes and big salaries and car to pick me at home and all these extra pay checks because we work hard i am told, love EK..

KEEP ON DISCOVERING .... just want to join EK:O :ok:

[Stratosphere6000]

Yes exactly who cares about the traffic if it means organised/professional staff travel, better pay, free accomodation, good education allowances, better insurance, pension plan, brand new jets, expanding/progressing comapny, realistic upgrade opportunities, chauffeur driven to work etc...the list goes on. Plus there is massive development to deal with the traffic..two new bridges plus the mono rail. Rome was not built in a day. DXB more expensive? Well consider this lets say with the higher cost of living you banking what you are here plus all the above benefits...Doesn't take a rocket scientist to decide where is more attractive. Don't see many EK guys running here. Plus most guys who are happy here are Capt's and/or ppl who probably cant make it elsewhere. General statement but its not far from the norm. A lot of F/O's came here for the long term. A lot of them now feel let down. We should start a poll asking all ex GF pilots now at EK if they made a foolish move....Hey never know mayb they did.......

[Stratosphere6000]

http://www.gulf-daily-news.com/Story.asp?Article=170749&Sn=BNEW&IssueID=29339

[bus787]

Guys lets be real.This thread about GF exodus started 2005 still didnt happen.Ek is not all heaven just check with guys there not guys who left here.On the other hand action better than talk.Stop complaining and act a lot of jobs around offering gud conditions.EK EK well u have to pass their selection process which is not always how much capable u are but what contacts u have.SSDD.

[expatula]

Right! Are there any exodus?!? All gripes and talk, no walk the walk. Argh! http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/emoticons7/102.gifhttp://www.forums.gamerskrew.com/images/smilies/305.gif