Gloves

[whatsarunway]

Whats the story with pilots in England Wearing dainty white flying gloves? Is there a reason ? Is it a world wide phenomenon or localised to the uk?

ill buy a pair if i get a good reason.

[MightyGem]

Keep your hands warm in the winter, stop them getting sweaty and slippery in the summer. They don't have to be white but it's easier for the ground crew to see your signals in the dark!

[greenarrow]

Only because they have runout of green one's!

[RW-1]

I use my old pair of Nomex flight gloves during preflight, not for cold, but if I'm taking the bird from another pilot just landed, I'm less likely to burn myself if I accidentally tough parts of the exhaust during preflight, also keeps my hands clean.


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Marc

[PurplePitot]

Also useful if you need to shake hands with any grubby engineer types......

[sarboy]

Of course, some people use their flying gloves as a ready log book ie grubbier they are = more experienced. But then you get the guys who take a new pair for a drag around the filthiest thing they can find (waste POL, tractor exhaust etc). The natty Britmil leathers are thinner than the heavy US green and grey jobs - better 'feel'. Don't even ask what the silky liners are for...

[212man]

Regarding the white gloves...if they ever get too dirty and you want to wash them, make sure it's on a cool wash. They look mighty strange after a boil wash; just about action man sized!




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Another day in paradise

[JoePilot]

I tried to explain to a pilot about 10 years ago that I thought gloves were an unneccessary and extra 'dangerous' piece of equipment - he naturally thought I was mad. I hear he just lost some fingers when his gloves were ripped off.... ouch, very sad - I hope he makes a good recovery. (!?)

Other pieces of equipment incompatible with flying helicopters: Knee boards, Sunglasses, Hats (bibles and other superfluous supersticious items)... IMHO

[Lama Bear]

Flying with gloves is like sc**wing with a condom.

[Kaitak]

I think not, they are the bees knees for putting out exhaust fires!!!!!

And they stopped me 'Degloving' a finger when I slid off a shiny Wessex 2 in 30 deg of heat.

Drag up a lantern, swing that sandbag.

Plus they are nicer to eat your sarnies with in the summer!



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[The Nr Fairy]

JoePilot :

I can't work out whether you're joshing or not about the incompatibility of sunglasses and kneeboards in helicopters.

Sunglasses I really can't understand. And kneeboards, unless you write on a map in something which stands out, which won't be the case at night.

Care to elaborate ?

[JoePilot]

Serious - no - too minor an issue to be serious about, just my (relaxed) personal view - part of the 'zen of helicopter flying' I guess - part of system of optimizing even fine details


Reasoning:
Sunglasses; wreck peripheral vision, distort angles (even the best by 1/4 deg(an accuracy which pilots are surprised to find they do actually use)), diminish the pilot's / eye's ability to cope when sunglasses not present. Often used to make pilots look and 'feel' like pilots (coolness, ego etc ...unhealthy)

Kneeboards: necessary for examinations where impression counts - but dangerous (only a little bit) since a rigid structure of that dimension is not compatible with most cockpits, jamming and catching (on gloves perhaps) - besides it's fairly rare to need to record something which can't be remembered if your brain is engaged (if the need arises - yes write on chart or an old payslip - the clear panel on yr trousers seems to work well).

Hats: limited field of view, extra equipment, ego problems - good for latent epileptics tho'

And on gloves - I did a check ride on someone the other day who had gloves shades,leather jacket, hat, kneeboard - he looked really cool. He inadvertently turned a switch off with the fold in his glove - I felt a wave of that brief warm smug feeling inside which happens when one can't quite muster an 'I-told-you-so' - and he didn't even notice the associated warning light!

Experience is a wealth of very many very small things ... you have some intresting/obscure ones to share?

[RW-1]

I don't usually wear my gloves when flying right now, just on preflight for reasons listed above.

I've gotten my kneeboard placement down, I'm more worried about it's strap coming off than anything else. going to a better make soon :)

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Marc

[A109]

Because,I suppose, most of us were in the military and were always told to cover all our body in case of fire we all wore gloves. Not expecting to crash and burn nowadays the practice is dying out due to the high c ost of those lovely cape leather gloves I expect.No reason why one shouldn't wear them though that I can think of.

[The Nr Fairy]

JP :

So without hats or sunglasses, how do you cope with glare from the sun - I assume since you're in the UK ( same as me ) that we get to see it every now and again.

[Whirlybird]

Nr Fairy,

I've come to the conclusion this is a personal thing. Every flying instructor I ever had, both f/w and rotary, insisted I'd need sunglasses when the sun shone. Tried them. Didn't like them. I don't find the sun a problem at all, but I find sunglasses awkward and uncomfortable. I don't like hats or gloves since they're just extra things to carry, and I can't see the point. I do like my kneeboard so I can write things down easily though. I guess we're just all different.

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Whirly

To fly is human, to hover, divine.

[fishboy]

While flying a Robinson R22 a few years ago (right seat), I had a kneeboard on my left leg. After a normal approach, I came to a hover into a fairly strong wind. I made a slow left pedal turn to start a taxi back. As soon as I got downwind, the cyclic (sprouting from the floor between the seats) jammed the knee board between it, and my pelvis! I couldn't stop the downwind taxi! A fairly panicked right pedal turn solved it before I hit the rapidly approaching fenceline. I don't use kneeboards any more.
Happy New Year all.

[JoePilot]

Nr:
I guess you prove my point. Glare for you is a problem because of your sunglass dependancy. (....maybe true?)

4 me and Whirlybird I guess no sunglass use and no glare problem. - I think its particularly important if flying on a dull day and you come around the corner of a cloud to full-on sun for your eye and methodology alone to be able to cope. (IMHO)

[JoePilot]

A109:Four reasons against:
1. my acquaintance's loss of fingers with gloves (see above)
2. My inexperienced 'victim' inadvertantly turning off a switch (see above)
3. Extra equipment needs to be able to justify itself - otherwise its just clutter
4. Skin is a pretty clever contact surface - well designed for the job (sensitivity etc)

Kaitak: Would you seriously have lost the skin of your finger in an unrecoverable way without gloves - please explain?

Fishboy's example is fairly good - don't you think?

It's only a small point - but lots of small points make the difference - when managing a basket of 'long odds' risks - which is our job when flying (- no?)

HAPPY NEW YEAR 2 ALL!

[FlyAny]

Some of you have known many more accident prone people than I. Never heard of someone losing a finger in a hung up glove. However, I have spent several days in inhospitable climates with infected cuts from cable burrs and cotter keys. I wear gloves during preflight for the protection. Light cotton ones so you can feel that bearing play.
If your hand does not sweat on a smooth plastic cyclic grip, good. I wear flight gloves for this reason. Do not mind a hat if I can pop the bill up and down on need. Never, ever had a problem wearing sunglasses in the cockpit. Fact is, I've been in some hazy places where the sunglasses made the difference between seeing the other aircraft a little earlier or being quick to respond a little later

[Earpiece]

I've heard that gloves are worn by military helicopter pilots because "its an order" and it then becomes a habit - like a monk's?

Outside - well it is an affectation. Why don't the passengers get them if they are so important? If your hands are that sweaty on the collective and cyclic you are probably nervous and that is not too good for passenger confidence (you could be excused if you are having an Instrument Rating test!).

I hear that surgeons and dustmen wear gloves and outside the military only rotary pilots wear them. What does that mean? Rubbish or what?

P.S. I have also heard that a kneeboard is the size of a Robinson (gosh I hate them)cockpit so that explains why Fishboy had a problem. Where do you put yours Whirly?

"Keeping an ear to the ground"

[Whirlybird]

I strap my kneeboard to my knee and it doesn't get in the way at all. But I'm only 5ft 3ins, so that probably makes it easier - I've just got more room generally :)

Now all I need to do is learn to write with my left hand.

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Whirly

To fly is human, to hover, divine.

[This message has been edited by Whirlybird (edited 29 December 2000).]

[Rusty Cessna]

I don't have any Helo experience, but I like to follow this forum.

With regards to Gloves, I do like them, I'm on the prowl for some Military flying gloves as you can see if you read that forum. I find they help keep me clean and the thinness does not hinder performance or feel, although I wouldn't know about a Cyclic or collective and its fiddle factor. I'm worried about getting my fingers ripped off though, how that happen!?!

Glasses, I find I don't usually have a problem with glare as long as I haven't got any into-sun oncoming aircraft bearings! And I find that once you put your headset on they dig in the side of your head and pop off their sitting position a bit. So i leave the ones I got given at home usually.

Kneeboards. The one I use is excellent in that I made a strap that goes on my knee and is tightly secured, but I can see the issue with helos. Because I'm a tad inexperienced I do like them to help me with Over head Joins, En Route and initial contact calls and such, also for wind and S.A purposes.

As far as head wear, I only have a headset.

Thanks,
Rusty

[Chip Lite]

Glare from the sun! Well I now pull down the multi-position, graduated sun visor.

Gloves! well if I'm cold I turn the air conditioning up and vica versa.

Kneeboard! I pull out the table in front of me to do my crossword on!

Touching dirty engines and things! I now leave to engineers.

As for looking cool! I have nothing to prove to anyone who is impressed by that sort of thing!

Be what you are for the right reasons! ;)

[This message has been edited by Chip Lite (edited 30 December 2000).]

[Earpiece]

Hey Chippie,

I've heard that the Stewards think you're cool! Well it begins with "C" anyway.

"Keeeping an ear to the ground"

[Kaitak]

Joepilot and Flyany,

Yes you can and I very nearly did. I caught my wedding ring on a piece of ac panelling as I was completing a preflight, I slipped and grabbed for something and my wedding ring jammed on the offending protrusion. Luckily the Standard Crabtastic kid leather gloves over the ring provided some extra friction and stopped the ring 'degloving' my pinky. After that I stopped wearing the ring! The wife wasn't convinced on the reason though!

Earpiece,

You're right, the military do 'have' to wear gloves, but I know I'd rather have them on should anything bad happen! Besides we are so cut back on manpower these days we end up having to do some more of the servicing than we once did, so they help keep your pinkies clean!

[This message has been edited by Kaitak (edited 30 December 2000).]

[EESDL]

Just to liven things up, I'm thinking of taking JP's advice..let's all try Silverstone without a kneepad!

Must admit, mine normally ends up on the floor out of the way.

[greenarrow]

Silverstone without kneeboards!
Most non goldfish pilots can cope after the first nearmiss. But then I suppose we all go into sheep mode BaaBaa!.

[Hoverboy]

Like some others on this thread, I only wear gloves for the preflight or other maintenance (grubby!) tasks. But I notice the only regular glove wearers I see are ex-military. When it's cold (half the year in Northern Canada!) I'll wear some light weight gloves until the controls warm up, but they always come off once everything heats up to normal temperature.
Kneeboards? Gotta have it... the silly little flipout chart holders on the S-76 have had an incredible ability to flip back uncommanded and outta sight at the most inopportune time. I have no problem with control interference, perhaps if you tilt the board at a very slight angle the cyclic won't jam it against the panel next to your leg?
Sunglasses? I thought I wore them to reduce the U.V. damage so that I can still see the sights on that beach I'm going to retire to!
Just my opinion... any medical people out there to confirm or deny this?
As far as obscuring peripheral vision, I happen to like the sports glasses with wrap around lenses... I just wish my kids would quit making fun of me when I wear them. There may be a slight distortion factor from the lenses, but if the sun is really bright, what is the distortion factor from squinting? If you don't need them, take them off? As far as the cool factor goes, I just saw Top Gun again, haven't seen it in a while, in the bar scene where Maverick sings to Charlie, Iceman and several others are wearing their Raybans... in a bar... at night?! That's cooooool! That's keeping the U.V.'s at bay! :)

[MightyGem]

Chips, happy New Year! Got your descents sorted yet?

I take it Earpiece is a friend of yours??

http://www.stopstart.fsnet.co.uk/aircraft/3flypigs.gif

[212man]

To quote Rusty cessna:
"I find they help keep me clean and the thinness does not hinder performance or feel"

Are we talking about gloves or something else here?

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Another day in paradise

[Rusty Cessna]

Depends 212!

hahahaha :) :) :)

[HOGE]

On that basis 212man, would ribbed gloves give a more pleasureable flying experience?

[212man]

I wouldn't know; having had the operation I no longer need to wear them! You can have a lot of fun dipping them in warm soapy water though (I've been told!).

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Another day in paradise