Flight delays moan

[newswatcher]

Turned up for BA flight to LA on 22/10 to find delay posted. Advised that allotted gate "occupied" by SA flight, but no sign of this when gate reached. BA 747 turns up at scheduled departure time, but now advised of further delays, due aircraft needing catering. Is it not possible for BA to get aircraft ready elsewhere, whilst waiting for stand to become free? Leave gate about 90 mins late, and then stop just short of runway, whilst at least 10 aircraft pass us and proceed to take-off. Eventually take-off about 2 hours late. During delay, noted Cabin Crew member in heated exchange with one of the passengers. Could this be cause of delay?

Week later(29/10), return from LA delayed by 3 hours, no explanation given other than delay on inbound flight. On arrival at Heathrow, nearly made gate, but stopped about 50 feet short. Captain says technical problem with gate equipment. Eventually made gate about 20 minutes later! Is there no backup for this final positioning? What happened to the good old "bats"?

BA Cabin Crew to be commended for their service, particularly on return flight.:ok:

[slim_slag]

Heathrow just sucks and should be avoided if possible. We had the same problem over the weekend with the lights failing at the gate, had to wait for the marshallers. Went from being 30 mins ahead of schedule to being late. Heathrow is just a dump (though some airlines there have significantly better ontime records than others so obviously it cannot all be blamed on LHR)

[Carnage Matey!]

Advised that allotted gate "occupied" by SA flight, but no sign of this when gate reached.

The SAA could well have pushed by the time you reached the gate. Unfortunately the BA flight needed to be at the gate 90 minutes before departure so it's already been delayed by the SAA. The inbound aircraft then has to be towed on to stand and this towing has to fit in with the airfield traffic flow. If the field is busy it could easily be some time before the towing can commence, increasing the delay.

Is it not possible for BA to get aircraft ready elsewhere
Realsitically, no. There exists a fairly complex plan for which aircraft is where on the airfield and how it gets to the next place. The caterers know where to expect the aircraft to be. If we try to redirect them to all points of the airfield whenever an aircraft is delayed then on to a stand then chaos would quickly ensue. Also the caterers do not have access to all areas of the airfield (eg th engineering base), so depending on where the aircraft was orginally parked they may not even be able to get there.

then stop just short of runway, whilst at least 10 aircraft pass us and proceed to take-off.

Absolutely normal operations at LHR. On westerly operations the BA flight to LAX is very close to the start of the runway. Other aircraft have to taxi all the way round from T3. Just because you get to the holding point befofre them doesn't mean you are ahead of them in the take off sequence. You may also be subjected to departure rate restrictions in the direction you're going that the other aircraft are not.

During delay, noted Cabin Crew member in heated exchange with one of the passengers. Could this be cause of delay?

Couldn't rule it out, but given the circumstances described above I'm not sure I'd even call a 30 minute taxi time a 'delay'.

return from LA delayed by 3 hours, no explanation given other than delay on inbound flight

Sometimes thats all the information we have.

Is there no backup for this final positioning? What happened to the good old "bats"?

They're still there, but you have to request them from ATC, then ATC have to get in touch with them, then yuo have to wait for them to finish whatever job they're doing at the time, then they have to drive round LHR to get to your stand before they can start marshalling you on. In my experience twenty minutes delay is unusal but certainly not unheard of. I've waited longer.

[newswatcher]

Thanks Carnage Matey. Perhaps I should add that it was announced that the tug broke down whilst towing the aircraft to the gate on outbound!

I imagine the problem at Terminal 1 for 747s was compounded by the decision from BA to move several of their 747 flights there!

If it is normal for a flight to be at the holding point for 20-30 minutes, perhaps a moment for the captain to state this over PA. When one is already subject to delay, such info would be appreciated.

Would love to know the full story behind pax altercation. Snippets heard included "suggestion" that a return to gate would not be appreciated by the other 350 passengers!

I am surprised that more information is not available for a 3 hour delay. Again, knowing the reason is useful PR.

[Farmer 1]

There are many Pruners who would pour vitriol of one kind or another on such a question.

It was a pleasure to read your answer, Matey, even though the event not affect me in any way. Thank you.

[slim_slag]

Looking at 2004 CAA figures, only 0.6% of BA arrivals from LAX were over 3 hours late into LHR, so you got unlucky.


Departure stats are interesting. On the LHR-LAX route, "on time" (The definition of being on time includes being upto 15mins late, which is a fascinating take on the English language) departures for the relevant carriers are (in alphabetical order)

AA: 65%
BA: 37%
UA: 76%
VS: 37%

Surprised about VS, but definitely looks like the home teams are doing something different.

[sixmilehighclub]

Newswatcher, you posted this before your flight:

I fly to LA with BA on 22/10. Flight due in at 13:05(local). If I was to book something for later in the day, and the BA flight was delayed, would BA be responsible for compensating me for the cost of the "lost" booking, where the delay could be deemed to be something within their control?

Can I please have next weeks winning lottery numbers please?

[newswatcher]

Yes sixmilehighclub, you can have them within a minute of their scheduled availability time.:p

Under the recent EU regulations change, passenger delays are covered as follows:

"In case of passenger delay, the air carrier is liable for damage, unless it took all reasonable measures to avoid the damage or it was impossible to take such measures."

Open to so many interpretations, of course!
:confused:

[OZcabincrew]

what needs to be understood is that aircraft aren't delayed on purpose just to annoy the hell out of the passengers, the crew would love the aircraft to get out on time aswell so they can either get home to their families or get to their hotel for the night and rest.

We were delayed a while ago and during the safety demonstration i had a passenger staring me right in the eyes shaking his head and huffing and puffing due to a 20 minute delay and also because he was seated next to a 6 year old girl (cos we all know children and babies aren't allowed to travel on aircraft). During the service there was also a lady who went crazy at the F/A because we were delayed 20 mins and also because she didn't get her choice of meal as there was none of that kind left.

Little did either of these people know that the reason the aircraft was delayed was because a lady (last pax to board) who was running late to catch the aircraft on time, got to the aircraft on time (she was flying because her mother was in Australia on holidays and needed an urgent operation all of a sudden and she had to go over and ok it), but as she was walking down the aerobridge, she got an sms telling her that her mum had died! so in a fit of tears she didn't know what to do as her mum was travelling alone, they didn't know anyone in Australia and she now had to deal with this, all via an sms! She was so upset (as you would be) that she couldn't walk, but she had to fly! so really at the end of the day, having to sit next to a 6 year old girl and and having to eat the pork rather than the chicken and also copping a 20 minute delay is such a petty thing to what this woman is going through. Maybe something to think about next time you find yourself getting upset over something so stupid! (not directed at anyone)

Oz

[newswatcher]

OZcabincrew, I fly 2-3 times each month so, whilst not claiming to be a "regular" traveller, I am exposed to my fair share of flight delays.

As such, I don't mind being delayed, so long as I know the reason, and that the reason is clear - "operational difficulties" not being top of my list of favourite reasons!.

Even if an airline wishes to be "economical with the actuality", then at least I have been given a reason.

If I am late for a business meeting, I apologise and explain why I was late. Is it too much to expect the same courtesy from an airline?

Incidentally, there were groans of derision when, on the return flight, the PA announcement apologised for the "slight delay".

[Gonzo]

We certainly don't delay a/c at the holding point because they've had a much shorter taxi than others. The BA longhaul flights from T1 are often not ready for departure when they reach the holding point for 27R/L, precisely because of that short taxi time. In fact we have a notebook next to the Air Departures controller now where he or she notes the callsigns of BA a/c that aren't ready for departure as it happens so often!

On many of the stands at LHR, if the a/c gets half on stand and then finds out for some reason (no guidance, equipment blocking the stand) that it can;t park, they actually have to shut down and be towed on, as the increase in power to get it moving again is a health and safety risk.

BAA is short of 'Leaders' (follow me vehicles who do the 'batting'), although they have just increased their numbers. As Carnage says, they are oversubscribed already carrying out routine tasks and handling a/c on stands where no guidance exists; therefore unusual situations (ie. broken guidance, equipment on stand) hve to wait their turn.

[fluffyfan]

In my experience most of the delays are caused by the passengers themselves, going missing in the terminal building whilst there baggage is loaded, then they dont show up, and it can take a while to track one persons bag down in the hold.........where do these passengers go? mystery to me

Sometimes the delay is for your own saftey, would you like us to go with unaccompanied baggage on board? we certainly dont delay passengers to annoy them. Btw, the fastest rising risk to air saftey is air rage incidents so all we want is for the passengers to get on the aircraft get to there destination on time and have a pleasant experience, but an aircraft filled with 300/400 passengers is not the same as one person being late for a meeting, there are many humans and hence many unknowns

[apaddyinuk]

These new compensation laws boggle my mind!!!!

Sorry to hear about your troubled journey newswatcher. Its a shame when that happens, as crew myself with BA I have always found departures out of T1 to be a lot less hassle than out of T4 for some reason and push back has almost always been on time or within 15 minutes!

All I can say is ROLL ON TERMINAL 5!!!!