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Parapunter
27th Oct 2005, 07:59
George Best is fighting for his life it seems. According to the Beeb, he is in Hospital having suffered internal bleeding, complicated by the immuno-suppresant drugs he needs in order to stop his body rejecting his transplanted liver.

Wasted life or end of a legend? Me, I prefer to think the latter, Besty was weak sure enough but in his glory days, better than any Rooney, Ronaldhinio or Beckham. Good luck George.

tilewood
27th Oct 2005, 08:11
He was an alcoholic who was given a second chance and blew it.

In the dim and distance past he apparently kicked a bag of air about.

I can't quite connect the word 'legend' with someone possessing those credentials.

However I am sorry that he, or anyone, should come to such a sad self-inflicted end.

ORAC
27th Oct 2005, 08:27
He was an alcoholic who was given a second chance and blew it.

Professor Roger Williams, Best's long-term doctor, said that prescribed drugs needed after his 2002 liver transplant, rather than alcohol abuse, were the cause of his illness. He said the ex-footballer had become more susceptible to infections after a course of medication to suppress the immune system and prevent his body rejecting the new liver.......

tilewood
27th Oct 2005, 08:30
I don't wish to be pedantic, but why did he need a liver
transplant in the first place?

ORAC
27th Oct 2005, 08:38
Perhaps you would explain how he "blew his second chance", since his doctor explicitly excludes alcohol as the cause of his present condition?

under_exposed
27th Oct 2005, 08:55
Bad news indeed. I had him down for the 3rd of Jan 2006 in our sweepstake.

tall and tasty
27th Oct 2005, 09:04
end of a legend

That sums George up to me. Well the imminent loss of anyone's life is sad and to know that he is coming near the end is terrible for his family too considering he had a second chance. He lived hard and partied hard and is now paying the consequences but at least he can say he had a little fun along the way!

Everyone has their problems and deal with it differently, he drank which I am not going to comment on other than I lost a close cousin to it. He died in tragic circumstances related to his drink and that haunts me talking to him the night before it happened. I did not realise it was so bad, no one else in the family did, but with George's family they have had to put up with the media every step of the way.

My thoughts are with them at this incredibly difficult time

TnT

Biggles Flies Undone
27th Oct 2005, 11:32
The thing I find saddest is the bad press he has got for the liver transplant programme. He dried out, got the transplant and then went back on the booze under the ever watchful eye of the gutter press. Because of this, some people may decide not to become donors or authorise removal of organs from their family.

It's also very sad that he could be remembered as much for his drinking as his great footballing skills.

Ropey Pilot
27th Oct 2005, 12:42
From what I have been told he never did dry out fully (and certainly not for as long as is required for 'non-celeb' patients)

He is also frquently cited by next of kin as a reason for refusing to transplant organs (despite the deceased carrying a donor card).

He has single-handedly pushed our donor program a step backwards - as an 'icon' or 'legend' he is still influencing the public today - unfortunately in different ways to that of his past. Influencing young boys to pull more birds is very different to ensuring someone on the transplant list dies because a suitable organ was refused.

Very sad yes, and alcholism is a disease. It is a real shame that in this case he has affected far more people than those with this disease usually do.

frostbite
27th Oct 2005, 13:19
Medical bulletin as #1 item on the ITV lunchtime news - beats me why he was mentioned at all.

SilsoeSid
27th Oct 2005, 23:14
Beats me how he deserves this thread.

alphapat
27th Oct 2005, 23:32
that is going too far, George best is a football god, hopefully he will recover soon, although his alcoholism may have played a big part of his life it should not be what he is remembered for and as stated is not the cause of his current illness

niknak
27th Oct 2005, 23:38
George Best abused one of the greatest privileges anyone could be given, the gift of a donated organ.
He, by his selfishness, has denied the chance of to one of the many thousands of people waiting for a kidney transplant the opportunity to live a better life.

I hope he rots in Hell.

M.Mouse
27th Oct 2005, 23:47
These threads always degenerate don't they?

I have my opinions on the man but as they would be controversial I refrain from posting them.

If others wish to idolise him that is their right but here is a human being gravely ill, possibly dying and the poster above hopes he rots in hell?

Where has decency, dignity and respect gone?

niknak
27th Oct 2005, 23:54
OK Mr/Mrs/Ms Mouse,

You or yor relative is as compatible as Mr Best was for the available organ, they miss out, Mr Best gets it.
Despite the reservations of the surgeons, he gets the organ and then very soon afterwards, he abuses that privilage.

I am well aware that there are other people who have done the same, and that there will be others in the future.
But, instead of being an example to others, George Best did exactly what he did with his professional talent, and threw it all away.

He deserves everything that's coming to him, I have absolutely no sympathy.

jayteeto
28th Oct 2005, 00:27
We get the message I think Niknak. You are entitled to your opinion, but I think rot in hell is over the top. Try to remember that being an alcoholic is an addiction and also linked to being a mental illness.

M.Mouse
28th Oct 2005, 00:37
I may have no sympathy with Mr. Best but common decency means I keep my thoughts to myself.

niknak
28th Oct 2005, 00:40
Yes you are correct Jay, but I am not going to delete, alter or apologise for my previous posts.

Members of my family and many others are on the waiting list, so, while it doesn't make me a better person for airing such radical views, I hope you'll understand why it makes me and all others personally affected so angry.

African Tech Rep
28th Oct 2005, 01:02
I dont actually like football (tin undies on)

But he will be remembered as a legend not only because of skill on the field but also how he lived his life the good and the bad.

alphapat
28th Oct 2005, 01:25
i still cannot believe that someone can really wish upon someone else to "rot in hell", especially when he has done nothing to you, me or you could easily get a serious "gastro-intestinal" infection wether or not our immune system had been compromised or not and I am sure you wouldn't be happy if someone you had never met had wished this "fate" upon you.

RJM
28th Oct 2005, 04:07
M Mouse

It seems overly moralistic to impose on the recipient of a donated organ the duty not to abuse that organ on the basis that the next person in line might not have abused it.

Am I right in assuming that you would be in favour of a legal duty of care towards the organ?

That seems a bit much. Maybe when we're all perfect in every way that would be a reasonable proposition, but it seems a long moral bow to draw now.

As to Best, he may be a sporting legend, but he's also a silly bastard. He's not the first there either - look at Shane Warne, one example among many.

I wish old George luck.

ORAC
28th Oct 2005, 06:48
George might have had relapses into drinking, so do many alcoholics, his are just more widely publicised. They are certainly not the cause of his present condition. For anyone to wish him dead on that account says more about them than him.

BBC:

Football legend George Best remains seriously ill in hospital, but "we are not giving up", his consultant says. Professor Roger Williams said Best, 59, had an unexplained bowel infection, which was causing internal bleeding, but stressed that he remained stable.

Professor Williams said on Thursday evening: "His condition is stable but he does have a particularly nasty complication with bleeding from his bowel. "It is a complication that we don't fully understand, we don't know why this is happening and have, this afternoon, changed all of his antibiotics to try to get on top of it."

He said microbiologists had confirmed that the infection was not linked to MRSA and added: "I can't say how serious the infection is and the bleeding comes and goes. "I have looked after him for a long time and we are not giving up." He said that Best "still had every chance of pulling through this". He added: "The chances of that, I couldn't put a figure on it, it would be just a guess. "He's a very tough fighter, he's been through many other crises," he said.

He said the problems were not directly linked to Best's replacement liver, which was functioning well.

But he has previously said Best is more susceptible to illness due to medication to suppress the immune system and prevent his body rejecting the liver.

Son Calum, who visited the private hospital on Thursday, earlier told the BBC his father's condition was "touch and go".

Best "Bad as it Gets" (http://football.guardian.co.uk/News_Story/0,1563,1602690,00.html)

Mariner9
28th Oct 2005, 09:34
Prof Williams press conference was live on the BBC this morning, where he said that Bests's condition had improved overnight.

Seemed to upset the news-hungry journos present, who kept seeking reassurances that Best was still seriously ill :mad:

M.Mouse
28th Oct 2005, 10:57
It seems overly moralistic to impose on the recipient of a donated organ the duty not to abuse that organ on the basis that the next person in line might not have abused it.

Am I right in assuming that you would be in favour of a legal duty of care towards the organ?

I think you are confusing me with somebody else, I made no comment on the issue but was just saddened to see such base abuse of a seriously ill person.

ORAC
24th Nov 2005, 11:39
BBC: Best's doctors prepare for worst

George Best's doctors have said his fans and family must "prepare for the worst", after the footballing legend had a "very bad night".

A spokesman for west London's Cromwell Hospital, where the former Northern Ireland star is back on a ventilator, said he was "very, very ill"..... Dr Akeel Alisa said: "George has had a very bad night. He's very, very ill. I think we must all prepare ourselves for the worst. George is a friend, not just a patient. It's been a very emotional day."

The man who oversaw Best's liver transplant, Professor Roger Williams, said the outlook was "very gloomy" as there had been a "definite downturn in his condition. Bleeding has been a big problem. We don't think he is going to keep on surviving but it is difficult to say how long."

He added: "Everything has got worse and we are not controlling things well any more."

Best's closest family arrived at the west London hospital looking very upset and asked the gathered media not to film or photograph them as they went in......

ORAC
24th Nov 2005, 15:09
Legend Best 'enters final hours'

Footballing legend George Best is unlikely to survive another 24 hours, his doctor has said. Best, 59, could not recover from the internal bleeding that developed in the night, Professor Roger Williams said. "I have to tell you his hours are numbered," he said at Cromwell Hospital, west London, at 1250 GMT.

Professor Williams said on Thursday: "Mr Best is coming to the end of the long road of his ill health. The situation is that medically the intensive care team and everybody concerned have managed to cope with pretty well all of the complications except the one that has happened again during the night - this bleeding. Although [the blood] has been replaced, it has now affected the lungs and other parts, and there is really no return from that situation. It is just not possible to recover from that."

He added: "He is still having standard medical care and treatment but I have to tell you that his hours are numbered now and it's all very upsetting."

Best's closest family arrived at the west London hospital on Thursday looking very upset and asked the gathered media not to film or photograph them as they went in.

Professor Williams said: "We have just all been sitting down together and it's very upsetting for everybody, isn't it - those looking after him, the family. I have talked to them at great length, I think they understand everything... I think they accept what's going to happen."

Curious Pax
24th Nov 2005, 15:31
You've got to feel for his family over the last few weeks. My brother in law was in intensive care for a week before finally succumbing to a lung infection. Even though he wasn't a blood relative to me, the emotional rollercoaster as every slim hope of improvement is grabbed at, whilst underneath it all you know that the outcome is inevitable, is horrendous. Coincidentally they are/were the same age, although the circumstances of arriving at that position were totally different.

aidanf
24th Nov 2005, 15:42
Just an interesting moral question here to those who believe George's transplant was a bad thing.

It was announced just over an hour ago that he will be donating his organs.

Anyone care to comment?

Lionel Lion
24th Nov 2005, 15:55
The irony of the story is that on the same day as he's given hours to live...............we go to 24hr licensing

I'm sure George would probably see the funny side

Out Of Trim
24th Nov 2005, 22:42
niknak

I think your comments are out of order; It has already been stated that his present condition is due to the anti-rejection drugs lowering his immune system.

I admit that his alcoholism addiction was the reason for his Liver Transplant in the first place but to want him to " Rot in Hell " is quite disgusting and indeed says more about you than him.

I liked him for his Football skills and love of life.. Not sure I feel the same way about you!

George I hope you rest in peace!

Dead_Heading
24th Nov 2005, 22:44
I believe the man even had implants that made him vomit if he drank alcohol....it's not through lack of trying.

tony draper
24th Nov 2005, 23:11
Showing some of his old magic on newsnight right now,oh yeh the boy could play, he was flawed, but then that always seems to accompany genius of some kind, there seems to a kind of genetic penalty that always needs to be payed.

:(

Whiskey Zulu
24th Nov 2005, 23:14
I thought those of you interested in football might want to read this post from the Man Utd BBC forum. From a wolves fan, no less. Not ashamed to admit it brought a tear to my eye reading it.

May Bestie's passing be swift and painless.

Quote:

I've just phoned my Old Man and in ten minutes we've managed to bring ourselves close to tears, dusting down shared memories of Bestie in his last hours (and I pray that they are peaceful.

Dad's 68 and I'm 42, both Wolves fans with, it has to be said, a disproportionate dislike for all things Manchester United.

But I know that the first ever poster I selloptaped to my bedroom wall as boy was a picture of Georgie Best.

And I know that in 37 years of watching football I have neer seen anything more exhilarating, more captivating than that man with a ball at his feet.

We've just recalled the first away game he ever took me to on a cold January Saturday in the late 60s to Old Trafford and a moment we both still recall when two spindly legs underneath a mop of black hair cut through our dizzy defences like a machete through a bowl of whipping cream. A moment that made us turn to eachother and smile wistfully because we both knew, even then, we were watching something that wouldn't be coming along again for a very long time.

I don't have the self-importance to pass any judgment on what George has been like as a human being or the way he has led his life. It's none of my business.

And maybe some of the tears I'm sure me and my Dad will shed over the next day or so will be borne out of a selfish longing for things past, things lost....a time that can never be reclaimed or revisited.

A time when the game was truly beautiful and unwittingly innocent and all the more beguiling because of it.

A time when a handful of change from a dirty pocket could buy you entry, even for just a few hours, to a unique place, a world, that never disappointed the true believer.

A world that had Georgie Best in it.

So if you've ever loved, really loved, football - for what it is or even for what it was - you'll already be feeling the pain that comes with losing something close, something special.

He always had a little bit of 'miracle' in him. Maybe he'll find one last morcel and spare us all.

Georgie Best. Superstar.

Unquote:

Tribute

http://www.puredarren.com/best.htm

joe2812
24th Nov 2005, 23:18
What he said... extremely well put.

A legend for sure.

captplaystation
25th Nov 2005, 00:09
To those that seek to criticise him;perhaps you should look at some of the high-jinx involving the current generation of "stars"& then tell me, that in a much more liberal era,his behaviour wasn't exemplarary by comparison.Cheers George,from any of us who let something stronger than water imbibe us.

Send Clowns
25th Nov 2005, 00:18
Why the #(< has this been a major news item for days? There are mant more important things they are missing out; he's just a retired football player for god's sake! He isn't even dead yet. When he dies it will be news I grant you, he was a famous player. Now - it isn't and the Beeb should get their news values straight.

reynoldsno1
25th Nov 2005, 01:27
Intersting juxtaposition of news item on Sky and BBC World this am - the first was live from George Best's hospital and the metaphorical media vultures were lined up in the background waiting the news; the second was not live from Niger and showed dying infants, though the actual vultures were presumably out of camera shot, but also waiting....

strange world

ORAC
25th Nov 2005, 04:54
The poor are always with us, but there was only ever one George Best.

tony draper
25th Nov 2005, 09:28
I see evidence of the lastest fad for public displays of mass grief has reared its head yet again, people are already bringing flowers and the chap is not dead yet.
:uhoh:

1DC
25th Nov 2005, 10:25
I've never really been knowledgeable about football, probably one of the reasons I once had a season ticket for Grimsby Town, but I heard yesterday that George stopped playing football when he was 25. Was that because he was injured or decided to hit the highlife instead of playing??

Zoom
25th Nov 2005, 10:39
I feel sorry for George's career that he was born in Northern Ireland and so was never really able to show his undoubted skills in the international arena. Now, if he'd been born in Manchester............

Lionel, you're right about the irony. Will the new laws produce more or less of this sadness, I wonder?

Confabulous
25th Nov 2005, 10:56
The poor are always with us, but there was only ever one George Best.

Are you saying there's another one of you somewhere? There's only one of me as well. We all matter just as much as Best, and we tend to matter more when we're alive.

Parapunter
25th Nov 2005, 11:14
Hmmm, a spot of deliberate point missing me thinks. George Best shone light for a few years. I think his passing is a time for reflection on the cult of footballers.

In answer to 1DC, he quit & came back & quit again a few times, not for the desire of the highlife or injury but because he was a shy Belfast teenager who found the glare of publicitytoo bright. Booze made it all okay though. George Best's is a sad story but boy, could he play football.

Curious Pax
25th Nov 2005, 11:31
I suspect the anti-Best people are mainly those who weren't around in the sixties, and so don't really appreciate what an impact he had, with both unparalled skills, and maybe the first celebrity. I am of an age were I only saw him play on TV on one of his many comebacks, but my father, who hardly ever gets excited about anything, and is not a huge football fan, positively waxes lyrical when describing his skills. He was fortunate enough to see him play in the flesh a few times in the mid sixties when he was at his peak.

Sure he blew it big style, but you can't help but think that with the sort of help available to players nowadays things would have been better.

Surprised no ones repeated the famous incident (or possibly urban legend) of a hotel room service guy going into his room and catching him cheating on a former Miss World with another ex Miss World, drinking champagne. "George, where did it all go wrong?"

RIP (when it comes).

Daysleeper
25th Nov 2005, 12:02
While as an individual I wish him no ill, I do hope he gets on and dies cos I'm fed up with the media going on and on and on about him. Its not news, get this crap off the TV. There are a lot more important things to be worreid about in this world and perhaps a few of them could do with the exposure this walking corpse has got over the last years.

Elwood Senese
25th Nov 2005, 12:31
I'm sick of the coverage and don't get me started on the flowers!

At the end of the bar in O'Donoghues (Merrion Row, Dublin) there's a fantastic picture of Best, Phil Lynott and Gary Moore. The three of them in their prime, arms around each others' shoulders.

Sadly only one of the legends is still capable of breathing.

brain fade
25th Nov 2005, 13:04
A man who was good at playing football. Big deal.

ex_matelot
25th Nov 2005, 13:08
He has now finally observed Last orders.

R.I.P

ShyTorque
25th Nov 2005, 13:21
Sorry and relieved to hear he's now at peace.

The regard in which the nation held this man is best summed up by the fact that on his behalf, BBC Radio 2 news just postponed a breaking story about a comeback attempt by the pop group "Take That" (not including Robbie Williams)........

RIP George (but let's hope that next time the liver transplant goes to someone who won't pickle a second one).

SM82
25th Nov 2005, 13:27
R.I.P George :( a sad day

eal401
25th Nov 2005, 13:45
R.I.P George a sad day
Sadder for one of my managers who is burying his wife today.

The cancer and brain tumour that conspired to kill her were not self inflicted.

What happened to George ultimately was, yet we are certain of hours of TV devoted to how wonderful he was.

Maybe it's just the moment, but it makes me feel sick. :yuk: :yuk:

brain fade
25th Nov 2005, 14:03
Standing by for hours and hours of 'tributes'.

Mr Best's life had a value, the same value as everyones else's.

Being good at footy changes that not one jot.

aidanf
25th Nov 2005, 14:13
To all those who criticise - does the ability of a person to entertain millions, raise them up temporarily from their sometimes hum-drum lives, leave them with memories that last for decades and be widely accepted as one of the finest exponents of his craft/profession not warrant any merit at all?

Consider the work, not the life

Wyler
25th Nov 2005, 14:20
It is very sad but I, like a lot of people, am dreading the ensuing days of chest beating crocodile tears, 'specials' and crap TV. Not to mention the money grabbing ex wife etc who will now spatter the red tops with 'revealed, the real George' etc etc.
Like him, it should all be quietly buried.

IB4138
25th Nov 2005, 14:30
I shall remember Besty for his ManU performances of the 60's.

I was one of the fortunate ones, who had a season ticket, even in those days at Old Trafford.

His contributions to a great team will live on for ever...that is what will be remembered.

eal401
25th Nov 2005, 14:52
Alex Best will certainly be rubbing her hands in glee now, the thought of the additional s she can make.

Like Wyler said, he should be quietly buried and rembered by those who want to.

:yuk:

beamer
25th Nov 2005, 15:05
To ALL those who have entered such contemptuous posts on this thread - I saw Geoge play and I thank him now for the pleasure he gave me and millions of others - God Bless You George RIP

got caught
25th Nov 2005, 15:15
I don't know if I'm more repulsed by some of these posts, or by the pre-death macabre press coverage.

I know it says stay out if your feint hearted, but please, is nothing sacred.

Let him rest in peace.

B Fraser
25th Nov 2005, 15:20
I have not read all of the posts so apologies if I am repeating an anecdote. A reporter once asked George if he had regretted wasting his life.

George replied " Wasting ???? I have shagged two Miss Worlds, how many Miss Worlds have you shagged ?"

The reporter's answer was not recorded.


Good on him :ok: All I can say about most of our domestic football heroes today is that the average surname is worth about 87 in Scrabble.

Bahn-Jeaux
25th Nov 2005, 15:23
Death is an emotive topic at the best of times and one which we all have to face like it or not.

I have the deepest sympathy for someone taken early through illness or injury but whatever the level of this mans skills, whatever pleasure he gave to god knows how many,he effectively committed slow suicide.

Someones death gave him life with a tranplant and still he abused that privilege.

No tears or mock sympathy from me.

captplaystation
25th Nov 2005, 17:57
B Fraser, thanks I loved that,as I'm sure,did he.When you see the hoo-ha over Beckham knobbing around don't you hark back to the old days when it was OK for a lad to behave like a lad.At least in F1 Button& Coulthard try their best to do a James Hunt.

Duckbutt
25th Nov 2005, 18:25
To ALL those who have entered such contemptuous posts on this thread - I saw Geoge play and I thank him now for the pleasure he gave me and millions of others - God Bless You George RIP

I was priviledged to have seen George play on about half a dozen occasions (speaking as a Brentford supporter we didnt come up againdt Man U that often!) and can only endorse beamer's post in full.

No tears or mock sympathy from me.

Fair enough Bahn-Jeaux but many of us don't give a **** - how much entertainment have you given to millions of people?

beamer
25th Nov 2005, 21:51
Thanks Duckbutt - we did not see him at Northampton too often either but I was there when he scored six against us in the FA Cup - I did'nt much appreciate him that afternoon but what a memory on a sad day.

B Fraser
26th Nov 2005, 10:59
Any time Capt !

I have another anecdote in that Best was once asked if he had any regrets about his career........

"I did play for Hibs but I'd be grateful if you could keep it quiet"

Readers from North of the Border will understand the joke ;)

Binoculars
26th Nov 2005, 15:23
My favourite involves somebody asking him why in his "I'll play for anybody" phase, he went to Canada. He recalled a trip home from Heathrow where he spies a billboard which said "Drink Canada Dry". And he thought, "why not?"

Onya George, from us alcos everywhere.