EC 135 v MD 902

[MightyGem]

We are in the early stages of looking for a replacement for our Police twin squirrel.
We can get good and bad feedback on the 135 from users, but asking questions about the 902 brings blank looks and a change of subject from anyone involved with it.

Would anyone care to comment?? :)

[hydraulicpalmtree]

MightyGem :

Wiltshire Police have a 902 which is shared use between themselves and the Ambulance service. It flies from Police HQ in Devizes, and I think it's operated by PAS out of Staverton - sorry Gloucester. Perhaps worth speaking to them to see what they think.

[Marco]

Mighty Gem:

West Midlands ASU have just taken delivery of a 902 and I'm sure they would oblige if you have any queries. As to comparisons the 902 can give you Helipad performance at MAUW up to +26 deg C which I know the 135 can't.

[PurplePitot]

The EC135 is an excellent police machine and is very similar in performance to the Mk9 Lynx - with which I suspect you are well acquainted! - AUM is never a problem and the only draw backs that are worthy of note are; the 17 hour service bulletins on the drive shaft which should be resolved this summer, the high skid which can (and does) get in the way of the camera and the poorly positioned SX5 which, again, is limited on occasion by the high skid position. These limitations can be easily overcome by the pilot.

I have just remembered the biggest drawback of all, the EC135 is restricted to 1000 ft cloudbase at night due to a lack of AP and despite what MACS say about this CAA regulation, it’s going to be a long time before it is resolved.

I have not flown the 902 but from looking inside I can tell you that its looks mighty chummy!!

[Zeusman]

Mighty Gem,

A new helicopter will look nice outside your new portacabins!!!! Thought you lot were short of money or are you keeping up with the Joneses.

You already know who and where I am. We have just put the names in the hat to choose between the two above helicopters. The UEO and most of the staff here are well versed in the facts, lies and counter-lies regarding the 135/902. Get your UEO to speak with our UEO and I'm sure he will discuss the boxes and boxes of information he has gathered researching the topic.

Be aware that when £2-3 million is on offer peoples ability to give a clear, concise answer to tricky answers can be affected. :rolleyes:

Best of luck.

[Skycop]

One unit flying one of these two types has had two replacement main gearboxes so far (luckily for them inside the warranty period). Unlucky?

[Tipstrike]

Zeusman
I thought you were buying a fixed wing not a new chopper - why the change of heart (and wings)?

[leading edge]

I have flown both and from a piots point of view I liked the MD902, lots of power and not too sensitive to wind direction.

From an operator's point of view though I would go for the 135 as it will probably have better support from Eurocopter (at least in Europe) Residual values should be better as well. I really hope the 902 does well as it is a great idea but it is going to be a brave commercial operator who buys a fleet of them.

I also flew the EC 155 recently and it is an impressive machine from a pilots viewpoint. It should give the 76C+ some stiff competition but it needs a higher TOGW to really compete in the offshore market.

[Hoist-to-Crew]

What has happened to the problem of cracking on th e135 that caused the North Wales one to place a concrete weight in the bay at the back of the fuselage?

[Chip Lite]

I thought North Wales usually put a local scroat in the aircraft while they went for a brew!

[ANOrak]

CAA's General Aviaton Occurrence list 1.11.99 - 17.1 00 reports a VSI and a laser beam problem with the EC135.

The MD900 has pitch link problems - would you trust a pilot to maintain your helicopter?

It also reports the MD900 having a double salko and triple toe-loop characteristic - worrying.

The Romney Marsh A109 Power looks interesting - or even more worrying.

[hydraulicpalmtree]

ANOrak :

Do you have the URL for the CAA occurence reports ?

[ANOrak]

hydraulicpalmtree (hope the spelling's right I find it difficult to spell aviatoin).

Sorry no URL but telex: 878753

Tel: 01293 573220

[MightyGem]

Many thanks for all your replies. Zeusman, your bit about extended range tanks reminds me of when we fitted them to a Mk 7 lynx in Detmold as a trial. There it was sat in the hanger with both extra tanks fitted and as much fuel as could be poured in. It was only then that someone had a thought, did some sums and found it was over MAUM!! Ah Detmold... those were the days :)

[PurplePitot]

Halycon days indeed. Wasn't that particular Mk7 called the flying bomb?

[Chip Lite]

Mighty G, Hadn't you better get yourselves a decent and permenant Gaff to live in before you purchase a new steed? :)

[MightyGem]

Just to say thanks for all your replies. CL, you don't need a nice garage when you're going to keep the ferrari parked on the drive! ;) ;)

[Chip Lite]

A 10 year old one at that with 2x V23's submitted!!!! :)