Ryanair...a different question.

[flybywire]

Right. It is very difficult to put things straight without offending the sensitivity of some individuals, but I have a query for any Ryanair crew who can answer.

I recently flew with FR STN-PMO-STN and then again STN-GOA-STN. I HAD to fly Ryanair as there was no other airline flying directly to Palermo and to Genoa from London. I had no choice, and my tickets were expensive as well since I had to come back on those days.
However this is not the problem. What happened was that the temperature in the cabin soon dropped, it was REALLY cold. Especially on the return flight. PMO-STN is about 2hr 45mins and about 30 mins into the flight I asked the in-charge cabin crew if she could ask the pilots to turn the temperature up. She said (in a funny, arrogant way) that she would ask as soon as she had finished the drinks service and that I had to wait.

One hour later, and still she had had NO contact with the flight crew at all (I was sitting at the front and could see everything). Other people had asked in the meantime, but nothing was done. I was really shivering despite I had 2 jumpers on. about 15 mins before landing my friend who was travelling with me noticed the colour on my face change, couldn't bear the sound of my teeth anymore and gave me his jumper as well (poor thing).

We finally landed and was only relieved when I walked off the plane. Even if it was rainy and misty, Stansted was warmer than the plane.
I thought: "bad crew" and didn't think of it anymore.

The next week I flew to Genoa, and on both sectors, again it was REALLY cold, so cold that an old woman even kicked off - being quite agressive I must say. I was well prepared this time as I wore my ski jacket!

So my question is: Is it common practice to have the temperature as low as possible in the cabin? Is it to "encourage" people to stay awake and to buy tea/coffee/snacks? Or is it to save fuel? Was I just unlucky and got 4 not-so-good crews?
Please clarify it for me.

Cheers

FBW

[threegreenlights]

It's only MOL trying to save some bread!
He is much maligned and actually is doing his bit for energy conservation - wear extra clothes - It's good enough advice for the home so why not the aircraft?

Guess you RyanAir drivers will soon really be on the glidepath to save fuel.:(

[flybywire]

You think? that is sad. I mean I do notice things when I fly with them like taxiing with one engine etc, but cabin temperature?

I am really looking for a possible honest explanation, so if anybody knows anything but doesn't want to share it here please PM me.

Thank you.

I wish I could say I won't fly with them anymore as I cannot afford to catch a cold everytime (I swear it is too cold) but FR is the only one flying direct to my home city.

[Baron rouge]

I think you have really been unlucky, because :
1 the pilots didn't check the cabin temperature which should be maintaned at 22°
2 the cabin crew did not inform the cockpit, about the temperature problem.

There is no savings to be done on flying with a low temperature in the cabin.

[757girl]

I don't work for Ryanair but we're always getting asked to turn the temp up or down in all sections of the aircraft - the crew usually ask the flight deck straight away and then all questions from pax cease. Problem solved. Don't see the point in doing nothing about it as you'll only have pax complaining for the whole journey. if I myself find it too hot/cold in the cabin, I'll go and speak to the F/D about it because I'm sure it's bothering pax too.

[Doors to Automatic]

It makes a nice change for the inside of a plane to be cool. Normally the cabin temperature is turned up so high it's stifling!

[jet2 crew]

FLY BY WIRE .

if the temp was actually that cold u're teath were chattering then i'm sure they must have been somthing up with u. the cabin crew are only human and if it was that cold they would have been the first to get the heating on, for themselves if not the pax . u say she didn't contact the flight deck at all , u know this because u were sat at the front. its not only the in charge cabin crew as u put it who can speak to the flight deck, an as most airlines have the rule to check on flight crew every 20 minutes i'm sure they we're having a rite old chin wag down the bag most of the flight , out of sight to u !

[flybywire]

if the temp was actually that cold u're teath were chattering then i'm sure they must have been somthing up with u. the cabin crew are only human and if it was that cold they would have been the first to get the heating on, for themselves if not the pax . u say she didn't contact the flight deck at all , u know this because u were sat at the front. its not only the in charge cabin crew as u put it who can speak to the flight deck, an as most airlines have the rule to check on flight crew every 20 minutes i'm sure they we're having a rite old chin wag down the bag most of the flight , out of sight to u !

My darling,

The cabin crew were too busy selling to probably feel the temperature dropping. They were selling so many teas and coffees they run out at one point. The lady in front of me had covered herself like an afghani. Kids were crying. People were pissed off. The same happened on the Genoa flight but not as bad.
Now maybe the a/c had tech problems? I'll never know. For sure though the CC didn't enter the F/D once, at one point the F/D called the CC (double ding dong) and kept doing so for at least 20 minutes!!!! I felt like getting up and picking up the phone myself! They must have been really pissed off, poor guys.

I don't care whether they are a good company or not, maybe I was just unlucky. They did look and act like a bunch of inexperienced cabin crew on that particular flight, that's true. I know that if you pay peanuts you get monkey service. But my point was another one. Do they do it on purpose to sell more??? Probably yes.

That's it.

[jet2 crew]

well if the bit about the crew ignoring the flight deck calls is true, then they do sound like inexperienced amateurs . at my airline if we get a double ding dong then its a mad rush to the phone and if the f/d say jump we say how high .

[Eddy]

This is extremely worrying. I seem to recall passengers onboard the Helios Airways flight which crashed in Greece in August complaining of the cabin being very, very cold shortly before the aircraft crashed.

For the crew to take no notice of this apparently serious problem, shows gross negligence towards the safety of the aircraft and the souls onboard.

Sickening.

[Dogs_ears_up]

Wow! - Eddy what a deeply worrying response to a not very deeply worrying situation!!

You don't think that linking flybywire's comments to the HELIOS crash is just a little bit tenuous?

One possible alternative scenario runs as follows:
[list=1]
The part of the Cabin in which flybywire was seated was cold
The Cabin Crew(s) mishandled the request to warm it up
[/list=1]
The management of Cabin Temperatures is always a compromise. The temperature will always vary throughout the cabin, and be influenced by other factors outside the crews' control, such as different pax clothing, medical conditions and fatigue, as well as the proximity to various items such as vents and doors. It is common to receive pax requests for contradictory temperature settings within 2 or 3 rows. A skilled crew member will handle such requests appropriately: A bad crew member won't.
In safety terms, there is no evidence that this situation was safety critical, nor that there was negligence, nor that it was/is "Sickening".
A "Double Ding" is not necessarily a flight deck call: The procedure will vary from airline to airline, some using single or even triple chimes. A call may be answered at a different handset, thus leaving the light illuminated at the station called, even though the call has been answered. I don't know if this was the case or not in this situation, but it is possible.

[bacardi walla]

But we are talking about FR crews here and whilst a high percentage of them are professional, there are lots who are just kids, speak very little English and act like they are serving tea/coffee on a train service between Liverpool Street and Cambridge (no offence to train workers). I've seen how unprofessional some of them are, and that's before they even get onboard !

[ifleeplanes]

bacardi walla
But we are talking about FR crews

So ALL FR crews are rubbish then?

What a deeply insulting comment, so because its FR the crews are rubbish are they? The cabin was cold and it wasnt warmed up...not ideal I agree but because it was an FR flight its due to bad crews. I have been on BA/Virgin/Emerates and had the exact same problem, yet its not spewed all over PPRUNE.

Your looking for cheap fares and silver service? You want a cup of tea you buy one. Same as on the trains. I have had tea/coffee and my dinner thrown at me on many of the full fare airlines, the cabin crew have a very difficult job to do and often only have a very short period of time to do it in. If you dont like it go and pay more for a full fare airline service with a premium upgrade. If not stop moaning.

Yet MORE Ryanair bashing for bashings sake....grow up the lot of you

[Eddy]

Wow! - Eddy what a deeply worrying response to a not very deeply worrying situation!!

Perhaps you're right and, assuming that you are cabin crew, both you and I know better than to think that there is any real link between the cabin being so terribly cold and the potential for the aircraft to be involved in an accident.

HOWEVER, the press carried stories about the Helios crash which clearly made mention of the cold cabin. Joe Public or your average nervous-flyer might not be able to see the situation as clearly as we can.

[keel beam]

Courtesy costs nothing

[flybywire]

Guys, that's it. I want this discussion to be closed now.

You're clearly unable to talk properly and discuss subjects that can be unpleasant without acting like kids and accusing each other.

You completely diverted from my first post, and the points I tried to make and that needed clarifying were totally distorted.

There's no point in going on.

And just for the record, FR is the only airline that flies between the mentioned cities, I personally would rather fly there with MY airline at much cheaper prices and better service any day of the year, but it's not possible. Yes the cabin was VERY cold on 4 occasions, we were all cold and pissed off. I must have been so unlucky then. Plane was ok and it's not a cheap selling technique.

GREAT! Problem solved.

Ciao

FBW.

[scobie]

I know this thread has drawn to a close but having read this in utter disbelief and as a cabin super with FR for 2 1/2 years out of four... I simply must set the record straight! It never ceases to amaze me how someone can have a bad experience on an FR flight and throws it to the hounds on PPrune and before we know it we have all sorts of rubbish coming out…

<Quote> well if the bit about the crew ignoring the flight deck calls is true, then they do sound like inexperienced amateurs . at my airline if we get a double ding dong then its a mad rush to the phone and if the f/d say jump we say how high <End quote>

People all over the world have bad experiences on aircraft… I had one with a certain other dual fleet UK low fares setup recently… didn’t go screaming about it though! Anyway, back to point…

There are a few reasons for the temperature being cold in the cabin:

The outside air temp on the ground was high, which heats up the cabin temp sensor at row 2 and the aft temp sensor around row 25-30 (having flown regularly to Scandinavia I know for a fact the air which enters the cabin during boarding affects the sensor... I've had to call many times to the f/d for a temperature change!) So, if the temp sensor is warm... it assumes the cabin is and cools it down (the opposite in Scandinavia where it positively bakes the cabin during the t/o and climb!)

The thing was broken!

She did inform the f/d who report back that the f/d temp indicators read 22-27 deg C - I know from experience when I have been in the flight deck to complain that the indicators are showing comfortable temp when its not!

The crew who as you say were working a lot might not have noticed the low temp - remember we are not sitting still...

You were un-lucky and had a poor crew (which I stress is not the case with all FR crew... we are in some cases more professional than other airline crew... I know this for a fact because I watch them when I fly with them!) Sorry, not so much a poor crew... possibly just poor supervisors. As always... a few bad apples... and a PPruner goes anti FR!

The in charge was busy and forgot!

You are probably aware how much/long/hard we work in the cabin in FR... we have to look and of course smell good for up to 12 hours... so we don’t want to work in a hot sweaty environment... pax are on for a few hours... we can be on for literally half a day! Maybe the crew wanted it cool?

With regard to the 'double call'; in FR a double call is cabin to cabin. There are many reasons for the crew to call from the aft interphone hence you would not have seen them! Sometimes I do that myself! Also with regards to the calling constantly for 20 minutes... if the f/d had lost contact with the cabin for that length of time, an emergency call to the cabin would have been made by the captain to find out where they were... long before 20 minutes had elapsed!

With regards to the in charge not entering the flight deck... that’s for security reasons.

So to answer your question(s):

No it is not common practice in FR!

No it is not to save money; cabin air is bleed air from the engines... They pump out air at 700 Deg C! We're not saving money by not powering a device we don’t have!

Second, I have never seen a memo or heard from anyone in the company saying "right lads, slip on your thermals every day under the uniform and we'll turn down the cabin temp to sell a few more coffees"!!! (Think about it... if that was the case, we would have extra on board and wouldn't have run out on that sector... would we???)

So, if you think by paying peanuts you get a monkey service, why not look closer to home... see just how your own airline staff treat their customers... they just pay a lot more for the hellish experience that is 21st century air travel (complimentary organic peanuts drizzled in the finest Italian olive oil and lightly sprinkled with fine sea salt included in the inflated ticket price!) ... and you, I and every one else on this forum knows it... whether they will admit it or not!

So please stop FR bashing! :ouch: Please? Help stop all the stupid remarks and assumptions people make when they take little things out of context!

PS with regards to the taxiing on one engine... after a two minute spool down time why not shut it down? With oil at what $70 a barrell or so these days, should every airline not be doing the same... oh sorry, how could I be so silly... they just pass it on to their customers! :p

[jettesen]

so what was your bad experience then???????????? spill.................

[RYR-738-JOCKEY]

Eddy, in my view you are completely missing some basics about flying, you wrote:
For the crew to take no notice of this apparently serious problem, shows gross negligence towards the safety of the aircraft and the souls onboard.
and
Joe Public or your average nervous-flyer might not be able to see the situation as clearly as we can.

First of all. Temperature has nothing to do with any airplane crash. Low temperature was mentioned after the Helios crash in relation to depressurization. This is what happens if you are at 40.000 feet and pressure suddenly drops. It gets cold and misty, but these are secondary effects and in no circumstance the cause of a crash. However if the pilots do not put on their oxy-masks, they might faint, and then you might have a crash.
Secondly, you are not one of the individuals who, as you express, see this case clearly. This thread was about low temperature felt by a passenger, and obviously not a problem to the cabin crew, so I really doubt the severeness of the situation.
I am sorry if I sound a bit harsh.
;)

[tea_or_coffee?]

let me join the party and my own two pence...

stop giving fbw a hard time cos he had a bad few flights by anybody's standards, your blaming the poor soul for asking a reasonable question. it doesnt matter if he paid £1000 or £1 you do not expect to be half frozen to death. if you had been in the savoy hotel or youth hostel, you would have got your stuff and left especially if you had raised it with a member of staff and been ignored! not exactly feasable at 37000 ft.

why do you guys who work for the no frills carriers take it so hard and blame us for flying lo cost? your not lo cost, its a marketing scam, you only sell the seats that would have been unsold at stupid prices, every other seat usually costs the same or more than than full service carriers, you might have conned the public but not us. so stop whinning when folk have a geniune problem!!!!

anyway i thought if a full fare paying passenger requests something from us cabin crew we are supposed to do what we can to oblige or is that a silly idea in the lo cost world?..

tea or coffee sir?.....................that will be a fiver please!

[Tudor]

I believe the term "low-cost" refers more to the airline's cost base rather than the price of the tickets...but, as always, I stand to be corrected.

[flybywire]

First of all. Temperature has nothing to do with any airplane crash. Low temperature was mentioned after the Helios crash in relation to depressurization. This is what happens if you are at 40.000 feet and pressure suddenly drops. It gets cold and misty, but these are secondary effects and in no circumstance the cause of a crash. However if the pilots do not put on their oxy-masks, they might faint, and then you might have a crash.

Jokey, with all respect, it's a bit patronising and very simplistic.

also

Secondly, you are not one of the individuals who, as you express, see this case clearly. This thread was about low temperature felt by a passenger, and obviously not a problem to the cabin crew, so I really doubt the severeness of the situation.

IT was freezing. We were ALL freezing, not just me. I spend enough hours on a 737 to know what feels right and what doesn't. Sometimes it's the plane, sometimes it's the crew, the SOP, you can add the rest.

I am sorry if I sound a bit harsh.
Ok....you're forgiven ;)


Anyway, I got my answers so thank you very much everybody.

Tea or coffee.....you're right, and I did pay a fortune for those tickets. Everything else was Low Cost apart from the tickets!!!
See you in the back galley ;)

FBW:)