Business Class / First Class

[Sumatra]

Does anyone have any idea of the typical annual income of customers who pay for tickets themselves and choose to fly long haul in business or first class? Thanks.

[BYveterangirl]

It's not that simple. Too many variables, such as frequency of travel, airline, point of departure, destinations, competition, and so on.

Since airlines began to treat economy pax like cattle, I elected to fly Business Class on long haul leisure travel, but this usually amounts to two, maximum three, roundtrips per annum. Additionally I go for a reasonably good deal and won't pay full whack. I earn the equivalent of an average BA Captain's salary!

[B Sousa]

annual income of customers who pay for tickets themselves and choose to fly long haul in business or first class? .
Answer is...........ALOFM. which translates to a lot of xxxxxxx money.

Just call up and ask for a First class round trip from your home to some distant place and back. You will :mad: when you find out how much it costs.
There are folks out there with so much money that it does not matter and for them First class is the way to go, good for them.

[BOFH]

Hi Sumatra,

as BYVeterangirl and B Sousa state, there are too many variables.

If you are still earning, you'll most likely be in the top 5% of income earners - but the spending patterns of these people is different to those who have plenty of accumulated wealth - usually older people who are well-to-do and are not aspirational any more.

I used to do this sort of analysis for a living, but you'd best PM me if you need to know more.

Cheers
BOFH

[phreegreens]

sumatra, it's about choices, not salaries.

My wife and I have an above average income, I got a reasonably senior job in industry, she is a matron in an NHS hospital. Kids are off our hands, we have a v.average house, I drive a Mondeo, staff junior to me in the organisation drive BMW's and Mercs. I could drive a company BMW, Merc. or Jaguar, but I don't want to pay the tax, I take a car allowance and fund my own car.

But my wife and I choose to fly business class when we got on holiday, I'm tall, I find economy class travel unbearable.

So, looking at average salaries is the wrong angle, look at how folks choose to spend their cash.

[apaddyinuk]

Pheegreens, My hat goes off to you for your honesty and intellegence! I can already tell the kind of person you are on the flight, someone who expects what they have paid for but instead of kicking up stink if something goes wrong, you will simply go elsewhere with your hard earned money!

[PAXboy]

I am single and choose to travel in Premium Economy or Upper/Biz. When I was part of a couple, I did the same.

This came about because family live in South Africa and I go there fairly often and, through biz travel in the late 80s and 90s, I got far too used to going Upper/biz!! I do not do much biz travelling these days as I am in a different line of work.

I have decided that I will not travel lonmg haul for more than 6 hours (approx LON~NYC) in Y. I use money and miles to upgrade. Of course, if there was a family emergency and I did not have the money I would go in 'Y' but it is not my choice.

Income is certainly not the only factor.

[B Sousa]

But my wife and I choose to fly business class when we got on holiday, I'm tall, I find economy class travel unbearable.

Im also betting, based on his short statement , that phreegreens also does not walk into the airline cold and say I want to go here on business class. I have a hunch some planning and shopping are done first. Given that he probably pays a more competitive price.
The super rich do not even consider that. If they want to go somewhere, they just call up and say I need a First Class ticket this afternoon.......................Whatever Airline gets me there. Better yet, if that wont work they just Charter.
Difference being in the price. One who shops can, even on first class, save upwards of fifty per cent.

[Avman]

I'm more or less the same as phreegreens. My wife and I are in our fifties and earn a comfortable income. We drive modest cars and live in a very average and modest detached house. We enjoy spending our money holidaying in style. As far as we are concerned our holiday starts as we close the front door, and ends when we open it again. Travelling with the minimum of fuss and maximum comfort is our number 1 priority. So, with the exception of flights of around 3 hours or less (for which C fares are a real rip-off anyway), we fly Business Class and stay at luxury hotels.

[zed3]

Same as Avman , anything over 3 hrs is Business Class for holidays - some good deals can be had even from the airline websites if you look early enough . Looked up Europe to Australia yesterday , for next year , Singapore wanted e25000 for 3xBusiness , Emirates wanted e9400 !

[Momo]

Based on personal experience, in June last year, Zurich-Mauritius in Business with Emirates via Dubai was the same price as non-stop with Air Mauritius (really one-stop outbound in Geneva, non-stop back) Special offer from the Dinarobin hotel.

Routings via third countries often produce very low C fares. A few years ago, I went from Geneva to Houston via London with BA, in Business (paid by my employer). A UK-based colleague joined the flight in London. His fare was triple mine.

Momo

[Jordan D]

Momo - well know fact that ... I remember an article telling how BA (and others) had clamped down on people buying their tickets overseas then ripping out the coupons as appropriate. I remember the case in point was someone buying a Vienna-JFK ticket on BA (via LHR & Concorde) ... he got his flight for less than 75% the cost of LHR-JFK concorde trip.

Jordan

[wub]

Mrs wub and I always travel to the Far East on holiday on BA World Traveller Plus and return Club. Like Avman we treat the whole package as a holiday, not just the destination. We particularly enjoy access to the lounges, especially the Arrivals Lounge at Heathrow, where we have a big breakfast, a shower and a change of clothes.

We have an average income but no kids, mortgage or other financial burdens. We prefer to blow our cash on top notch holidays than anything else.

Another benefit in flying business with BA is that we both collect BA miles, so a return trip to Asia earns us over 30,000 miles. Last year we went to Antigua and back in Club for almost nothing!

[phreegreens]

I remember an article telling how BA (and others) had clamped down on people buying their tickets overseas then ripping out the coupons as appropriate.

Yep that is certainly the case on BA, but that does not stop you actually flying the sectors. A google will throw up lots of tips.

You can still benefit from a low cost long haul flight on BA if you start from someplace like LIS (TIP is currently the best value), fly out there on a cheapo and then start your BA legs from there, you can at a cost even take a stopover in the UK, so you don't have to head out immediately on your long haul leg. Just don't turn up at LHR with a LIS-LHR-London Haul ticket and expect to get on if you haven't flown the LIS-LHR leg.

Nice one wub..!!

Mrs PG and I are off next month on BA LHR-CPT-LHR, out in J back in F, £226 thanks to BA miles and an Amex 2-4-1 voucher. Earlier this year we did LHR-BAH-SIN-SYD in GF J (excellent flights even got a op/ug to F SIN-SYD) for £1499 each +taxes, there are deals out there if you shop around... :ok:

[Pax Vobiscum]

If you can get a Premium Economy/Club/First seat for only a few extra pounds, by all means go for it - same applies if you're extra tall (or extra wide :D ) and need the space. But for my (holiday)money, I'd rather spend the extra on a better hotel or (several) nice meals.

I was once on a (package) holiday with a super-rich guy and his wife. The rep tried to persuade him to upgrade to club on the way back (HKG-LHR). He wasn't having any, even though (being in his 80s) he could have spent the rest of his life in F without making a dent in the interest on his interest. Clue - that's how you get to be super-rich!

[MrSydney]

I earn a decent salary (Aussie 71K), single and no financial committments. I travel overseas about twice a year. These days I will only fly Business Class long haul as Y class is just a joke . I appreciate the extra leg room/space, better service and food. The real plus are the lounges and being able to have a shower!! Since I only fly Star carriers it's nice accruing all those FF points too.

I guess its all about priorities and comfort and I am quite happy to pay the additional $$$$$$$$

[PAXboy]

Clue - that's how you get to be super-rich! Ah yes PV, too true. :(

But ... as I do not have children (nor ever will have) and am single, I only have to get to the end of the game with enough to pay for my funeral! Which means I travel in bigger seats that are strictly neccessary and reckon it's worth every penny. :cool:

--------------------
"I tell you, we are here on Earth to fart around, and don't let anybody tell you any different." Kurt Vonnegut, Jr.

[1DC]

I'm comfortably retired, certainly not rich, and we will fly long haul in business provided we can get a deal that is acceptable to us. We have always managed to get what we want by shopping around on the internet and have never paid full fare. I was fortunate enough when working to always fly longhaul in first and business and now i am retired I want that experience to continue so I will pay for it.
On shorthaul i go for the cheapest reputable, but not MOL's mob..
I have considered taking a platinum amex card to see if the perks on travel are worth it but i haven't done it yet..
We don't live an extravagant life at home, just normal (in our eyes, anyway).

[manintheback]

But when is it not worth it?. I note some talk about indirect routings. Earlier this year at short notice I had a trip from London to Toronto. No club seats avail direct outbounds, so was offered the choice of up front in Lufthansa via FFurt or in the back direct with Air Canada.

5 hours after take off from Heathrow as we flew back over the UK from Frankfurt, it occurred to me that I should have gone direct. Service was excellent, but I would rather have been in a bar in Downtown Toronto.

[Avman]

I agree manintheback, but the choice is yours of course. I generally will avoid flying "backwards" unless it's just a short one (BRU-FRA for example) with a good connection. I'll take a "sideways" (BRU-AMS), again with a decent connection. But, if I'm flying with the missus and I can save a total of 4000 Euros by taking a slight detour and still enjoy the comforts of C class then there's no contest. [That 4000 will buy me quite a few extra beers when I get there 5 hours behind you ;) ]

[Wot No Engines]

I won't fly Y for more than 8 hours/sector with a decent break between FINAL. You can just about manage this RTW, but it's painful.

As to paying for business/first, I have. The first time, at the time of booking, the cheapest Y I could get from UK to Australia was ~1600 pounds (quite late and over christmas). The best business deal I could find was Emirates at ~1900 - not a difficult decision (other than cancelling the trip).

When I moved from the UK to Australia, I checked all the deals I could find. Again Emirates came up with the best deal. This time 1st at just 50 pounds more than business (company were paying for the business fare, I paid the upgrade !)

Just back from Prague, and the business fare (Austrian) was less than double the economy fare needed for a fully flexible ticket. Ok, the company pays, but the difference is not always as big as it looks when comparing the airlines "list" for business and the cheapest (very restricted) Y available.

[OverRun]

The annual income of customers who pay for tickets themselves and fly long haul in first class has to be lower than those flying business class.

Why?

Taxation. The income of the super-rich is diverted into family estates and trusts and offshore accounts and the like (unlike poor suckers such as me who pay tax on a salaried income). They probably earn very little. Personally. On paper.

[MyData]

I would have thought that the truely rich would charter a personal jet, but for the rest of us that have to slum it in First/Business:

There are the very top earners who either have made their pile and now are leading a lifestyle they have become accustomed to.

Then those whose business are paying at cut down negotiated rates.

Those who have hunted high and low and booked months in advance on a very good deal.

Or those using their air miles.

I've not much personal experience of 1st but once did ORD->MAN on AA and there were only 3 of us in the cabin when business was quite full. So obviously the price for most people wasn't attractive enough (the company was paying for me).

Another time I did LHR->SFO and all 14 seats were taken both outbound and return, and I'd say about 1/2 of those were business people (the laptop gives it away), or individuals and couples just travelling and making it look like they did this regularly. The LHR->SFO return in 1st at that time was about £10,500 on the web site. A staggering amount of money, but there is obviously a market for it.


Probably the most interesting point on 'how much' came from the Concorde days. During the 80s, after privatisation IIR, the marketing team asked the business passengers how much they thought the ticket cost, or, more importantly how much they thought it was worth. As most of the bookings were done by the travel department the execs never actually new the cost of the fare. It turned out that BA were 'undercharging' and so simply raised the fare and increased the profits...