Sleeping and long haul

[aaaaa]

I note that BA are offering a sleeper service in business class on long haul flights. In other words, they feed you in the departure lounge (if you have the time to get there early) and try and put you to bed as soon as they can after take off and then not serve breakfast until about one hour before landing. What a boring long flight.

I have done many long haul flights and I get fed up to the back teeth at being made to feel like a criminal just because I wish the blind by my seat to be raised. It is not natural to sleep for about ten hours + especially as when you arrive, more often than not it is time for bed.

The excuse is that it will disturb the passengers who wish to sleep or it causes reflections on the IFE screens, both of which may be true. However, passengers are given eye masks to keep out the light.

Any ideas how to overcome this problem?

aa

[Jerricho]

Fly Virgin

;) :ok:

[Ozzy]

First, the sleeper service is in Club. Coach pax get fed as normal. I've done the sleeper service and in actual fact enjoyed it. The food in the lounge was excellent, a buffet style set up with it replenished as soon as required. Beverages were as expected.

On board if you want extra booze, no problem - I was given enough Glenfiddech to help me sleep :E and there are snacks in the galley if you want to indulge. The bacon butties for breakfast were execellent (and in fact that was one of the first times I have eaten breakfast on a red eye for some time).

Now this was before the Gate Gourmet fiasco!

Ozzy

[aaaaa]

Jerricho

Will Virgin let me open the blinds then? Trouble is they are a lot more expensive than even BA otherwise I would travel with them for sure.

I am off to HKG and cant remember how much of that journey is in daylight as I normally fly direct to MNL whilst on my Far Eastern travels.

Whilst I am at it, does anyone know if there is an hotel actually at Chek Lap Kok as I will be going on to MNL the next day.

aa

[sinala1]

On any overnight Long Haul flight, or a flight that goes through/into nightime, we tend to prefer the window blinds are down - that way people can sleep at the time they wish to. We offer a "Snooze Zone" service on overnight flights less than 7 hours I think it is? Similar to BA's service - eat in the Clubhouse (most prolific on JFK-LHR flights), sleep onboard, then eat upon arrival at LHR. Not done in this fashion on Longer flights for exactly the reasons you say - 10 hours is too long to expect people to not eat and be very very quiet.

On the LHR-HKG VS flight you can expect the window blinds to be down as it is an evening (2230?) departure...

[MerchantVenturer]

.On the LHR-HKG VS flight you can expect the window blinds to be down as it is an evening (2230?) departure...
A member of my family is claustrophobic and is a nervous pax as well. She has a doctor's note to this effect and to help her always tries for a window seat.

Thus far airlines have been very co-operative (she doen't fly regularly) and she has managed to be allocated a window seat.

This helps her overcome her phobia to some extent even when it is dark outside.

How would you as a cabin staff member deal with such a situation if she requested the blinds be open, after explaining her circumstances obviously.

And if it is dark outside how does closing the blinds make it easier for pax to sleep?

I have asked these questions before on PPRuNe but no-one has ever given me a reply. Here's hoping this time. Many thanks.

[sinala1]

Flights that cover a lot of time zones, particularly west to east flights such as LHR-HKG, LHR-PVG and LHR-NRT fly through a very short night time back into daylight, when most people are still trying to sleep. We create a false night environment so that people can get as much sleep as they would like/is possible. Having the window blind down during the short night time makes no difference really, however even one window blind open when flying through daylight in a dark cabin makes the most immense difference- particularly for those who are seated near the window that is open.

As far as nervous pax/claustrophobia is concerned, thats a tough one as obviously we want to be as helpful as possible. If the majority of pax were not sleeping, I would not at all be adverse to her having the window blind open. The problem is that we have lots and lots of people on flights, and its difficult to make a lot of others uncomfortable to meet the needs of one person. Clearly claustrophobia and flying dont go very well together, and your family member would obviously feel uncomfortable in this situation. I would try a few different things - attention diversion (eg conversation, showing her how what movies/games/tv shows are available and taking her through it all, taking her to the galley for a chat and a cuppa etc)... try moving her to an area that is perhaps a bit roomier if possible... suggest she tries to get some sleep - but in all honesty if she really was struggling that much and needed the blind being open I dont know many cabin crew who would flatly refuse it! :ok:

[aaaaa]

I know one blind open can cause a problem to a large area of the cabin, but as said before people can take, or in some cases get given eye masks which in fact seem quite good at blocking out light. I wear mine at home during the summer nights.

Hoewever most people say they need an average of eight hours sleep a night, so that still leaves a few hours or so when the blinds could be opened. Personally, I don't sleep on planes at all well, thus I admit to having a vested interest in open blinds.

I once took half a sleeping pill flying HKG/LHR, it knocked me out for six hours, so when I woke up I took the other half and was once again, knocked out. It was the best flight I have ever had, but I wont do it again as it is not good. I do reckon a lot of people do this however.

If the sleepers can have eight hours of darkness :zzz: :zzz: :zzz:
surely the non sleepers can have a few hours of daylight :ok: :ok: :ok: before they land and have to go back to sleep again !!!

aa

[newswatcher]

aaaaa, the hotel at the airport is "The Regal", but it is kinda pricey. Expect up to 200GBP per night.

[apaddyinuk]

aaaaaa,
I think you need to get your facts a tad more accurate, the sleeper service is only available on certain "short" longhaul flights, flights which are generally under 7 hours such as most of the US east coast, Bermuda (although not totally on this route as the lounge in bermuda is unable to provide meals), and Middle Eastern routes!
You will not be sitting bored on a 10 hour flight, Im just back from Barbados and we provided a full meal service in club on a flight whcih was only 7:30 hours. The Sleeper Service was introduced due to customer demand. Ba plaud themselves on providing the best nights sleep in business class (Leave that debate to another thread please!!!LOL) and passengers who book these seats buy them simply to get some sleep before a busy day at the office in london after arrival! The service has been very popular I rarely hear anyone complain, I certainly dont have as many complaints as i did from passengers trying to sleep when we had the lights on serving everyone else a full meal!!!

[BRUpax]

Most FAs answer with the short night bla bla, but fail to answer the point raised about eye masks. What are they provided for if not to hide daylight? I too detest being forced to lower the blinds, especially on a westbound daytime flight which leaves Europe late morning. If pax want to snooze on these flights than I would ask FAs to suggest they use the provided eye masks and not insist we all lower the blinds.

[Globaliser]

aaaaa: Hoewever most people say they need an average of eight hours sleep a night, so that still leaves a few hours or so when the blinds could be opened. Personally, I don't sleep on planes at all well, thus I admit to having a vested interest in open blinds.A LHR-HKG will only allow about 8 hours of sleep at best, anyway, except for the most dedicated sleeper. The actual flying time is something like 11 hours. It takes about two hours to serve and clear away dinner, and then the before arrival annoucements start about an hour out - the second meal may be served a bit before that. So even your suggestion would have the blinds left down for the whole of the cruise portion of the flight.

Most LHR-HKG flights are mostly in daylight, particularly during the northern summer, and especially if you are on the flights that depart after it has already got dark in London. On the late flights, for example (c.2230 departure), it will only remain dark for three or four hours, and then the remainder of the flight will be in daylight.

But (as has been said) you don't have to worry about the Sleeper Service on the HKG route - you won't get it. But you may entertain yourself by seeing how many of your fellow passengers adopt a self-made version of it by getting on board and going straight to sleep, particularly in the HKG-LHR direction.

Me, I'm looking forward to a long kip on a LHR-HKG tonight ... desperately need the beauty sleep. :) BRUpax: Most FAs answer with the short night bla bla, but fail to answer the point raised about eye masks. What are they provided for if not to hide daylight? Eyeshades are not 100% effective. They work better when the cabin is dark to start off with.

[aaaaa]

apaddyinuk

You are correct, I didn't do enough research. I had assumed after reading about the sleeper service and the flat beds that it applied to all long haul flights.

I will watch with great jealousy, all those lucky people who can sleep as soon as they get on board, I just wish I could be one of them. I will think positive, I will sleep this time, I will sleep this time, I will sl.............

How about a few sheep on board for me to count, that would be interesting.

I was flying over BKK once and had a quick look behind the blind and it was a beautiful sight. Even better coming in to MNL this time last year,(blinds open), the cloud formations and evening sunshine colours were just incredible, I am glad I didn't miss it.

Don't get me wrong, I am not knocking BA, in fact I have extremely close connections with the airline and think it is an excellent service.

aa

[apaddyinuk]

As BA cabin crew I will just say one thing and I will shout it too....

YOU ARE UNDER NO OBLIGATION TO LOWER THE WINDOW BLIND!!!!

There, I said it and you can quote me on it! But, it is simply a curtosy, if you want to look out the window then look out the window, if you want to watch the sunrise, watch the sunrise, if you want to drill holes in the window....well no lets not get into that! But as a courtesy to your fellow passengers perhaps it would be nice if the majority of you did lower your blinds in order to provide a more dark and cosier surrounding which helps many dose off! I personally find wearing eye masks uncomfortable and I know many people do!

[BYveterangirl]

As BA cabin crew I will just say one thing and I will shout it too....YOU ARE UNDER NO OBLIGATION TO LOWER THE WINDOW BLIND!!!!

Try and convince the American battleaxe I had on a recent flight. I fully expected to be arrested as a potential terrorist upon arrival!

[apaddyinuk]

Well I wont get into the american battle axes, I was personally scolded for standing outside a toilet for more than 2 minutes recently, not my fault the person inside was taking forever!

[Jordan D]

I get very annoyed when the blinds are put down on a day-into-night flight ... after all why would I ask for a window seat if I didn't want to look out of it? This is very true on the LHR-BOM flight (day) where am dept leads to a post-midnight arrival. I'm an amateur photographer too, so if I want to take sunset at 35000ft, for goodness sake let me (unless the seatbelt signs are turned on ...)

Jordan

[Pax Vobiscum]

Many thanks for that, apaddyinuk. I'm glad it's not just me wanting to stare out of the window (never have been able to sleep on a plane), though I might make an exception if it's 8/8 cloud.

[apaddyinuk]

Jordan, Dont get annoyed! Let the crew "ASK" you to put down the blinds, its just a simple procedure we do but we dont expect passengers to do it unless they want to! (At least not a BA on one of my flights). If you see something you like of course take a quick snapshot....Or several!!! But im sure if you are watching a movie or reading, then perhaps lower it then! Of course if a crew member rudely "makes" you do it, simply smile back, ask for the Senior crewmember and make a complaint, the crew member will learn in time!!! lol!

[Jordan D]

apaddyinuk - thanks for the advice ... shall note that for the next time I fly Longhaul!

Jordan

[shortm]

As VS cabin crew I was also surprised to read that pax thought that they had to close their blinds. We always go round on a night flight asking people to close them but if someone chose not to, or opened it later, I certainly wouldn't say anything about it.

Shortm

[Globaliser]

Jordan D: ... after all why would I ask for a window seat if I didn't want to look out of it? Quite a few of my friends are like me: I want a window seat because it isn't a middle seat, yet it is a seat where nobody will be wanting to climb out over me, therefore leaving me to sleep in peace.

[Wot No Engines]

Like Globaliser, I want a window seat on LH - not to look out, but so I don't have anyone waking me to get out. I always want an Aisle seat for SH as I find them more comfortable when I'm not trying to sleep.

As to sleep, I try and adopt the time of my destination as soon as possible, and get 7 hours + sleep if possible at the correct point. If it is light outside, I really would like everyone to have the blind down !

[TG345]

As a regular Europe-Far East flyer, I can heartily recommend Diazepam. Available over the counter in Asia, no side effects that I am aware of, and guarantees a good six to seven hours which pretty much breaks the back of the flight.

[slim_slag]

Diazepam (Vallium) is not the drug of choice if you want to sleep on a long haul flight. Talk to your doc and they can give you a prescription for something more appropriate and this will also keep you legal for taking controlled drugs across international borders. I am partial to Ambien myself and Sonata is another good one.

[apaddyinuk]

Be very careful with sleeping pills people. If they knock you out flat then you wont be moving very much in your seat (especially of your down back) and you could easily develope a DVT! I just dont think its worth it!

[newswatcher]

If you are deemed to be inebriated then, if TV airline shows are to be believed, :rolleyes: you will be denied boarding on the basis that you may be unable to react properly in an emergency.

If you take a sleeping pill, doesn't that put you in a similar position? Are you obliged to tell cabin staff that you have taken such a "pill"?

[1DC]

When I go to the far east i generally fly Malaysian, when i am awake I always like a blind up. I have never been asked to put them down, in business or economy..

[aaaaa]

Re the DVT thing and sleeping pills, if a DVT is brought on whilst flying, it seems to be accepted that this is due to lack of movement. However does the cabin pressure have something to do with it as well?

If it is lack of movement then those people who regularly take sleeping pills for a good night's sleep whilst on the ground are surely just as much at risk of a DVT as those in the air, or as mentioned before, does flying at 6000ft or whatever the cabin pressure is at, aggravate the situation. I understand that the same problem can occur on any long journey at ground level, when movement is difficult.

Also, no-one ever seems to mention the poor flight deck crew on long haul and even short haul. How many of those get DVT's? This subject is never covered by the media or is it that each pilot does 100 steps around the flight deck once an hour!! :hmm:

Just out of interest

aa

[chornedsnorkack]

How much does a person move who sleeps in a real flat bed on ground or air with no safety belts or armrests or back of next seat around, compared to one sleeping in an economy seat?

[SLF]

Regarding sleeping potions, a colleague swears by Night Nurse, one of those cold remedies that "may cause drowsiness". Personally 2 x G&Ts and a couple of red wines does it for me :cool:

[Globaliser]

SLF: Regarding sleeping potions, a colleague swears by Night Nurse, one of those cold remedies that "may cause drowsiness".The drowsy-making ingredient of Night Nurse is a drug called promethazine. You can buy it separately in the UK as Sominex, so you can take it on its own without the other gunk that's in Night Nurse. Sominex is what I use, and I swear by it myself.

Doesn't seem incompatible with G&Ts or red wine. :)

Promethazine is (I believe) prescription-only in the US, so:- It must be good. ;) US Sominex unfortunately has something different in it.