Is it worth it.

[Tallbloke]

I am seriously considering giving up my gig doing the roadie stuff and going to City University for 4 years. It will be a struggle but me and my missus will be able to get by, BUT. What should I expect to be paid. I do not need a comparison, I need figures. Also, is it really that bad? I read a lot of posts from pissed off people. Really that bad? I need real info, this is a life choice. Cheers guys and gals.

[aeroguru]

suggest you do a course in plain english,before you start an engineering course.That is only assumed because you have posted to the eng and techs bb.It was not clear from your post.And re the monies expected I assume you mean when you are successful post grad and employed by an airline or major maint. player?Please clarify.And yes some peolpe do vent their anger here because they feel that they are talking to colleagues with similar worries.

[Tallbloke]

What happened I replied once already ho hum. Yes I am thinking about doing a degree in engineering, my aim is to end up in a management position with some large organisation somewhere. Sorry if I sound like trainee opposition.

[Mice]

Don't waste your time in engineering. Long hours, **** poor money, shift work.
Become a computer programmer/technician, or better job yet, a pilot! Plenty of money, little work (900 hrs/yr MAX). Can't go wrong in either of those lately.

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When all else fails, read the manual!

[Taff Missed]

Tallbloke.

Give aviation a miss please. The industry needs more managers that don't know one end of a spanner from the other like a hole in the head.

Sorry, but that's the way it is.

[This message has been edited by Taff Missed (edited 30 May 2000).]

[Tallbloke]

What exactly do you mean, does not know one end of a spanner blah blah? Mechanical aptitude I have. I do however also have management ability / experience. All I am trying to find out is what sort of money I could expect to be paid as a graduate engineer working for a major airline / MOH contractor. I have looked in the back of Flight (to which I have subscribed as a paying punter for 4 years), if anyone could suggest anywhere else I could look do tell. If it is so poor, why do people still a) do it and b) want to do it?

[Mach_Tuck]

TB
Sorry Mate,
But a degree in underwater basket weaving doesn't make you an all knowing spanner handler!

Those who think they know it all are a pain in the @rse to those of us that do!

MT

[Tallbloke]

Yeah, whatever.

[Taff Missed]

Tall Bloke.

What I mean is, you're going into aeronautical engineering for the wrong reasons. The first question you're asking is about money. There is no money in engineering, never has been and very likely never will be.

Aircraft engineering pays it's own rewards.

There are few things so satisfying as clearing a snag using your own experience and knowledge of an aircraft or it's systems. 4 years in the City Uni won't give you that experience, nor will 10.

If you're serious about aviation get out on the hangar floor and do some spannering. IF you make it to management in years to come you'll be a better manager for it but don't try to inflict classroom learnt management skills on a workforce that has come up through the ranks. They'll see right through you in a flash.

Taff

[NFF_PRF]

True.
Take a look at BA and how poorly it is managed by a bunch of idiots.

There are a few and I mean a few good managers who have worked their way up through the ranks but on the whole they are only interested in salary.

As for the graduate, school-boy managers, who's standard comment is "If you don't like it you know where the gate is!" Is that good management or an admission they cannot cope with the job?

[dqcolony]

to Tallbloke...
I did rather get the impression that you thought you knew what discipline you wanted to spend 4 years to become degreed in,,, IF the renumeration met your expectations. I would suggest that there are numerous folks already working in your targeted job, and that their salaries, or "standards of living" are not hard to discover. Some of them might tell you quite frankly what the pros & cons of the position are, if you were to ask them. Allow me to strengthen the reply by several of your mates there, NOBODY wants a 100% academically experienced manager in the hangar, or on the flight line! I retired after 25 years with TWA and have done more than I imagined in the 8 years since, but ALSO in agreement with your mates, experienced spanner swingers can see thru a "yuppie" in no time flat.
My suggestion: Decide upon a field of work that you know something about, and that you truly believe you'll love doing. Then, if you can live comfortably on what it pays, you'll have it made!!
Cheers.
Joe

[JET SET SPARKY]

Apologies to tallbloke on some of the abuse you've received.....(i read your previous thread some time back),but ,the guys/girls generally are justifed in thier views that aircraft maint. management SHOULD have a practical aviation technical background of some considerable duration.They should have 'been there ,done that,got the tee-shirt'to get a total appreciation of how strange an industry this really is,and of how much pressure the various departments work under for the majority of the time.....it starts with a proper apprenticeship,of which gives you an idea of all sectors of aviation maintenance PRACTICAL and theorywise,followed by time 'on-the-tools' for many a long day/night,in sun,rain,snow and topped off with heaps of fatigue,abuse,low morale and health problems!.....THEN you get the treat of sitting/sweating/crapping yourself through license exams to finally certify the work you or some other sucker has carried out....this finally shows financial benefits to you 'n' yours some way down the long road you've ploughed!
Most people follow this career path because they have an affinity with the industry,or they were planespotters(god forbid) or they naturally skilled in the art of ripping the guts out of multi-million dollar aircraft and then putting it back together in some semblance of the original order!
Tallbloke...they moan about it,but they must enjoy it somewhere down the line.....i know i do ..(since i moved companies)..BUT can you appreciate the feelings of some of these poor buggers? If some post-grad hot-shot walks into management giving them the "hey guys i've got a really good idea on how you can do your job better!" spiel ,...a size ten toe-tecktor boot will surely be the retort .........
on the flip-side of this though,i've seen many 'from-the-hangar-floor' type managers ,who don't know thier **** from thier elbow....but then again crap CAN float to the top of the bog ,eh?
Good-luck tallbloke,you must be an enthusiast somewhere along the line,and i hope you research it well,...but don't be suprised if one day some oily rag of a bloke you re-rostered for the umpteenth time that month,gives you 'an engineers kiss' and the subtle but effective arguement"you haven't a f#*!@%& clue you p'&*$!
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kick the tyres ,light the fires :)

[Taff Missed]

Spot on dq. You really have to love the job, warts and all, or you're wasting your time.

[Mach_Tuck]

Tallbloke

Me and my compatriots sat here, agree whole heartedly with Jet Set Sparkies comments, He's hit the nail on the head with an airframe re-shaping tool!

All the best in making what will be a very hard decision, But take note of all previous and ensure your heart is totally in it! you may not get the luxury of a career change again.

MT (a multi license type chappy) (and a couple of anon heavies looking over my shoulder!) http://www.pprune.org/ubb/NonCGI/cool.gif

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If you don't know how it works....Fiddle 'til you do!