GPS Receivers

[ToucheTurtle]

help!!

i'm looking at buying a handheld gps receiver and was wondering if anyone could help me with what the requirements (unit specifications) are that allow the unit to be used for aircraft navigation, is it just the rate at which it updates? if so what is this requirement?

thanks in advance

[Uncommon Sense]

reading between the lines you are considering a non-aviation GPS to use for VFR flying.

the issue you will have is with the aviation database.

having looked around over the past 2 months or so at various options (including PDA with Blutooth receivers) I finally decided on the Lowrance 500 AirMap. It is a little bit different to the Garmins - which dominate the market - but it has some nicer features in my opinion - time will tell if I am proved right or wrong.

the PDA option was just bit to fiddly potentially in turbulence I felt.

the Lowrance with Jepps Database and International basemaps is around $640AUD if bought locally.

the update rate is 1/sec

the units I liked the best apart from the Lowrance were the Garmin 196, the Garmin 96MAP and the older Garmin Pilot III Plus.

good luck.

[Sunfish]

TT, I may be getting out of my depth in aviation matters, but here goes.

If you are a VFR person, I'm not sure that anything other than the use of a fully approved Aviation GPS receiver can replace plotting your position on the good old paper charts.

GPS is a great aid to navigation but I wouldn't allow it to replace the paper chart just yet.

Although I've had ten years experience of GPS driven moving map displays in a marine environment, I've yet to commit to the aviation versions on PDA or the Garmin or Lowrance because I have this feeling that the technology is just a little too new and expensive to be good value - yet. I also have issues with chart file formats and keeping the charts and DB current.

I get by with a Garmin Fortrex ($300, Johnny Appleseed GPS) strapped to the wrist which works OK and an old Etrex in a bag with spare batteries as a backup.

There are ways:E To download the current ERSA VFR waypoints list and load part of it (Fortrex limited to 500 waypoints) into your GPS's.

[Ultralights]

I make do with a $150 etrex! its very simple, but it is only used as an AID to normal navigation techniques. runs on 2000Mha batteries for well over 10 hrs! or a cigarette lighter adaptor. basic, easy to use, and as an aid, you can still get the required info required for accuarate navs. never had a navigation issue with it such as entering CTA etc. about the only thing i cant think of doing with is is a GPS approach, then again, you could enter the waypoints manually from a normal paper chart!! and yes, it does have altitude capability

such as here!

http://home.exetel.com.au/pamuva/Other%20stuff/webstuff/gpssmall.jpg

good 32 Kts headwind, drift angle is easily determined, time to next etc etc.

[defiant]

Ultralights.. I hope your not suggesting that you could do a GPS approach with a handheld GPS ??!

My readings of the regulations indicate the GPS has to be TSO certified.. In other words, basically the only GPS's you can use to perform a GPS approach, are those fitted into an aircraft (not the hand held type, even with altitude capability!).

As for entering waypoints manually, it is probably widely practiced but i wouldnt trust it. An accidental slip of the finger entering in the wrong data could have dire results...

Just my 2 cents worth...

Defiant.

[ZK-DAN]

I've just acquired a Garmin iQue3600a. So far, so good. It's a fully-functioning Palm Pilot also. Great GPS performance with its 12 channel reciever and a full Jeppesen database (Pacific database in my case) and a yoke-mount with aviation buttons (direct-to, nearest, yadda yadda).
It's also an excellent MP3 player with a 1-gig SD card.

Worth a look

[Ultralights]

no im not suggesting you even try to think about a GPS approach with a handheld! :} what im saying is that when it comes to hand held GPS units, you dont have to spend big bucks for features you dont really need, if its going to be handheld, then im sure he/she will only use it as i do mine, as a backup aid to normal navigation techniques, or to save time with calculations of wind components or drift angles, such as shown in the pic i have posted.( 32 Kt wind from approx 10 deg left of track) its 12 Channel parrallel reciever, and cost no more than $149.99 very easy to use as it only has 5 buttons on the side. just press the button on the left in the pic, and i will get a heading reading instead of speed, average, time to return (Point of no return etc) last/first light all the usual gps features.
it has some useful features that bigger aircraft based units do not, such as crumbtrail following and return etc. where it will follow a previously flown irregular line instead of tracking to the next waypoint etc.

and can measure speed up to 999 Kts! accurate to 5 mtrs.

[Wheeler]

As far as I know you cannot use any handheld 'for navigation'. You can use it to help you along a bit but definitely not as sole or primary means of navigation.

'For navigation' you need a TSO'd unit, fitted and approved in the panel, with RAIM and a current database. None of the handhelds have RAIM, none can be apporved and few people go to the expense of keeping the datbase up to date.

Take a look at how expensive TSO'd units and databases are. There is a reason for that. Of course, the big joke is that although they supposed to have better integrity and reliability, most are much less capable than a Garmin hand held 196/296/396, which are the best but not cheapest available handhelds to my mind.

$150 or any handheld is fine - but remember it might well be leading you up a gum tree, especially if you have a 1995 database!

[CaptainMidnight]

As far as I know you cannot use any handheld 'for navigation'. You can use it to help you along a bit but definitely not as sole or primary means of navigation. Correct. And don't rely on one when attempting to avoid CTA CTR or Restricted Areas. Big trap for young - and not so young - players.

[zepthiir]

And dont forget that if you want to use a GPS for a primary means of navigation then not only does it need to be TSO'd but you need to complete a GPS day course and be certified. If you dont have the endorsement then you still have a legal requirement to get a positive ground fix at least every 30mins and navigate with reference to charts as usual.

Zepth

[SHAGGS]

In regards to the Garmin 296 GPS, I purchased one about 3 months ago, and it's the best piece of flying equipment I have bought in years. I spent several years flying in PNG, and I knew quite a few pilots who have died due to CFIT. I'm sure that if all these guys would have had a tool like the Garmin 296, most of them would still be alive today.

I also had a look at the Garmin 396, on the Garmin web site, and I'm still gob smacked, the technology is just getting better by the day.

:ok: :ok: :ok: :ok:

[Uncommon Sense]

As an aside, an interesting safety aspect of the GPS that is not often discussed.
Having more confidence in your position and tracking = less time head down in the cockpit looking at maps and charts - and more time looking outside at the other plane / eagle / weather etc - and enjoying the view of course.

So far I am really happy with the Lowrance - and the MapCreate software makes planning a breeze. Although I am sure the Garmins are just as good.

[Sunfish]

I think we are all in furious agreement that a handheld GPs as an AID to VFR navigation is a good thing.

There is absolutely nothing illegal or wrong about using it as an AID to navigation, but you are still required to have paper charts. You are also required to determine your position at least every 30 minutes by the most accurate means available - which may well be the GPS.

What I do is set up a route on the GPS and also plot it on the chart and then cross check the waypoints, bearings and distances. I usually start by doing it on the computer (Ozi Explorer software) and upload it to both my Garmins, Oziexplorer also gives me a set of bearings and distances.

In flight I cross check chart, compass, VOR, NDB and GPS all the time. Be aware that a GPS can go "strange" with no warning. I haven't seen it myself, but a reliable friend had it happen to him for about half an hour a few months ago.

[J430]

SHAGGS

Be warned i have found the base maps not too good on the terrain warning in Oztralia. probably the USA is good but I have flown straight at big rocks around SEQ and I chicken out before I get a warning, I can only assume they along with the lake are missing from the basemap.

It does warn me when dropping below 1000' on base leg though! Nice to know I am near the ground when landing....

Cheers

J

[Atlas Shrugged]

There are ways to download the current ERSA VFR waypoints list and load part of it (Fortrex limited to 500 waypoints) into your GPS'
I seem to be able to get them in PDF only. Care to share them with us?

[Sunfish]

Atlas, with the greatest of respect, I think Airservices would object very, very strongly if I did.

Since I've got a current copy of ERSA, I'm entitled to use the waypoints, but the copyright notice quite properly forbids me to reproduce, store in a retrieval system, transmit, redistribute, republish or commercially exploit any of it.

Translation: I'm sorry but no can do.

Of course if you have your current ERSA you can do it yourself very simply with modern office technology. You don't have to key them all in

[Uncommon Sense]

BTW, if anybody else here is using the Lowrance AirMap could they drop me a PM - I have a specific question regarding the alignment of the International Basemaps when using MapCreate Software.

Thanks.

US.

[VMC4ME]

Get yourself a Garmin 296 for AUD$2,200.

The only thing that baby won't do is provide inflight service.

It's got everything!

Money well spent that could one day save your life.

Had a VFR guy went with me recently when we were in IMC. He went straight out and bought one the next day - he was very reassured as we were zipping around close to IMC on the edge of airspace and terrain however the 296 told us what to do; god bless it!

As always, don't rely on it, however it can really be a life insurance policy one day.

ULTRALIGHTS - Get yourself a moving map. The $150 machines were great... 5 years ago!

[Uncommon Sense]

Thats a lot of dough!

If you are seriously in the market for a 196 or 296 have a look on Ebay - remember to get the correct basemaps and database however.

You can save a packet.

[defiant]

Personally i would recommend the Garmin 96c. It's not as costly as the 296 but still has colour and most of the features.