View Full Version : BORING: "Airbus are mad building something so big!"

15th Jun 2005, 21:27

Boeing will hold a board meeting this month to consider the launch of a stretched version of its 747 jumbo jet, a plan which the head of Boeing Italy said on Tuesday looked set to go forward.

The plan comes as rival Airbus prepares to deliver its mammoth 555 seat A380.

"Boeing will launch a new version of the 747 to counter the A380. Boeing has decided on the relaunch, with a larger version, of this glorious airplane which is 30 years old," Rinaldo Petrignani, head of Boeing Italy and vice president of Boeing International, told Italian reporters at the Paris Air Show.

Another senior executive at Boeing confirmed that a board meeting this month would consider the idea of launching the new model, called the 747 Advanced, but added it was premature to speak of definite plans.

"The airplane looks good. We have a fair amount of interest," said Mike Bair, Boeing vice president and head of its 787 program. :ooh:

15th Jun 2005, 23:55
747 stretched but with, basicly, 1969 aerodynamics with a few mods ... mmm, my money is on the A380?

16th Jun 2005, 08:13
1969 aerodynamics

aerodynamic testing results dont change over time!

16th Jun 2005, 08:34
Exactly Ultralights! They don't get worse.....or better ;)

Howard Hughes
16th Jun 2005, 08:36
aerodynamic testing results dont change over time!

Yep!! Mach .86 I believe, the big fat airbus won't even come close.....

Cheers, HH.


16th Jun 2005, 11:09
A '69 wing originally built for an aircraft 20% lighter than todays 400 (don't fly 'em so only guessing).

Add more wing span (at a later date), then throw on some winglets, (at a later date).

Maybe there has not been huge advancements in aerodynamics since 69, but I would be very surprised if the A380 wing, designed from scatch, could not beat the 400 (plus any future wing span increases) for aerodynamic efficency.

16th Jun 2005, 11:27
there are not many similarities between a B474-400 wing and a B747-200 wing! for a starters, they are made from different materials and different alloys, saving a vast amount of weight, and there are subtle differences to the aerofoil profile, not just spanwise, not to mention there are a lot more composite components in a -400 compared to a -200

now an SP wing...........

it would be interesting to see the comparison between cruising Mach numbers of a B744 and the A380, have they sacrificed a higher speed cruising wing for greater lift at approach speeds considering the rather larger amount of weight it has to carry?

404 Titan
16th Jun 2005, 12:26
Add more wing span (at a later date), then throw on some winglets, (at a later date).Maybe there has not been huge advancements in aerodynamics since 69, but I would be very surprised if the A380 wing, designed from scatch, could not beat the 400 (plus any future wing span increases) for aerodynamic efficency.
For those not up with the history and development of the B744 program, the wing on it was a completely new design from the ground up. It incorporated a new aerofoil cross-section, increased span with winglets, a large proportion of composite construction and a completely new wing to fuselage fairing. One could argue this is exactly what Airbus did when they developed the A330/340 series from the A300.

Chris Higgins
17th Jun 2005, 02:01
My money is actually on the redefined Boeing. They'll be able to stretch it just enough for consumer demands. The A-380 could turn out to be a white elephant...a very large one at that.

17th Jun 2005, 03:40
In my view the 747-400 is getting close to as big as it can go, problem being landing gear.

777-300ER is running into problems with the high PCN/ACN required, very few runways in Australia can actually handle such weights, look at airports that have high volumes of 777 traffic you will see you they are actually moving the flexible pavement.

Over time you can see spots where the 777 brakes, the pavement under the aircraft actually moves with the aircraft causing large bumps in taxiways.

A 747 advanced will have a high PCN/ACN with the higher weight still distributed over 18 wheels, without a gear redesign to have the weight over more wheels this aircraft could be limited out of more airports than the 777-300ER or A380.


3 Holer
17th Jun 2005, 03:47
Wait until you get three or four of these monsters arriving at thirty minute intervals. The terminal congestion will be unbearable.

You will stretch customs, immigration and security resources to the limit.

I agree with Chris Higgins , a big white elephant !

17th Jun 2005, 04:33
My money is also on the 747ADV. Other than Emirates (who don't operate 747s), no other carrier has ordered significant numbers of them... in fact after the EK order I think QF might be the next biggerst customer with 12 on order.

There are numerous other carriers out there that have looked passed the A380, yet will need 744 replacements. BA, UA, NW, BR, CI, CX, AF, KE, OZ, NH & JA are just a few of those.... add to that other carriers that HAVE ordered A380s that may still need 744 replacements such as QF, LH, VS & SQ.

Regardless, there is money to be made and aircraft to be sold, and you can bet your bottom dollar that several of those mentioned above will NOT be ordering the A380.

Can't wait to see what happens.

17th Jun 2005, 13:44

The North American carriers have been dumping their 744s as soon as they can get away with it - AC has just got short of the last of theirs. NW is gone 777 and UA has no money. If they had any I suspect 772LR/773ER would be the priority purchases. Also the busy trade in 744 F conversions

BA and the East Asian carriers sound like good bets as they have retained their 744 fleets.

SAA are talking about 380 which may or may not mean the end of their 747 fleet.

Ditto the likes of AI if they could get their government to draw up their fleet plan at better than a snail's pace while the new entrants are ordering 100 A320s at a time and Kingfisher looking for five 380s!