The Whole Pilot Thing

[eoincarey]

Hey all

I am a school leaver, on way to uni to get a good degree before hopefully doing the airline pilot "thing". I just have a couple questions first.

Firstly, both GAPAN and the airlines comment about the shortage of talented young pilots entering the profession. Is this true, and is there a shortage of pilost developing? I ask this as I have also considered careers in Management and other such things, and am trying to weigh up the pros and cons.

Also, how many of you still enjoy your job? Would you still recommend being an airline pilot?

Many thanks

ETC

[Vee One...Rotate]

If you go to the Professionla Pilot Training and Sponsorship forums a little further down the page, you'll find some archived "sticky" threads - they amswer all your questions and more!

Good luck,

V1R

And, according to the above, I seem to have developed mild dyslexia overnight :(

[What to do?]

Hi

I trained as a lawyer, worked in London and got fed-up. I think that the sticky threads are VERY useful, but (and I'm preparing for a lashing here) I've found that this site can on occasion attract people who've never worked in any other sector and have no idea what it's like to pull 70 hours a week in central London for less money than pilots earn in parts of the country where living costs are much less.

Naturally being a pilot isn't what most people expect, but compared to the above position, after eons in academia, it's much better.

The question for you now is do you need a degree? That's another can of worms for you! :mad:

Later

[one four sick]

You don't need to have a degree to fly airplanes.
I don't and I do!
Getting a degree today is not like it used to be "special".
Today every Tom Dick and Harry can go to uni and have a party!
You can start your airline training right now, if you've got the readies £60K ish and party.
You could theoretically be in a right hand seat of a passenger jet in 18 months time.
Then, when you have settled in and earning your wages, you could opt to study anything you like. Long flights are boring!

Just a thought!

one four sick

[+'ve ROC]

For the love of god DONT do a management based degree!

I am just about to graduate with one and trust me it gets you no closer to where you want to be (the sky!)

Of course, Uni is great fun and you develop a lot as a person. Nobody can argue that education does any harm, but if you REALLY want to fly you should look into it NOW.

I know I wish I did :sad:

[IanFly]

do not train as a pilot unless:

You have a very close relative who is a senior Captain within a company.

or

you are a 'politically correct' option for the airlines ie you are female or from an ethnic minority

or

you are from a former eastern block country and have trained there

or

you simply have LOTS of money in your family.

I expect many people may disagree with me but believe me the vast majority of the people I know have got jobs (people i tranied with!) have fallen into one of the above - REGARDLESS of their training record and ability......

Ignore this advise at your own peril!

[Lolo737]

Cross female off that list, it's not working for me!:E

[Little Miss]

Didn't work for me either.

So I think the female bit is quite wrong.

I don't know of one female who got a job because she was female.
Nor that they were at the head of any Queue because they were female

[Jinkster]

I think the love for flying comes at an early age rather than just a pick from the hat when your about 15/16 at school looking at all your career prospects.

I'm not a religious person but as someone said if god had intended man to fly he'd and not give him wings but more money in which to do it!

[eoincarey]

in answer to that, i do love flying to bits, and already hold a ppl with about 100 hours.
Being on a flight deck is something Ive always wanted to do, and I think that Id be good at it, but at the same time we've all got to be prudent with our dosh!

ETC

[ILS 119.5]

I wouldn't bother with the degree you will lose 3 or maybe 4 years seniority which means loss of earnings. I lost 10 years seniority by being an atco first. If you apply to all the major airlines now you should be OK to obtain a job in the near future. You could even start your degree and keep applying. You could get a job and build up your hours and then instruct, it is up to you, but I would not bother with the degree.

[palgia]

I don't know of one female who got a job because she was female.

Don't worry, I've seen enough for both of us.:ok:

cheers,

palgia

[scroggs]

1. You do not need a degree to be a commercial pilot in any UK airline.

2. 'Politically-correct' recruiting is illegal in UK. If it weren't, airlines would be entirely staffed by ethnic minority, asylum-seeking females with a disability or two. They are not.

3. Nepotism (being the chief pilot's progeny) may work in Lower Slaughter Air Taxi Company, but it doesn't in large airlines.

4. Money most certainly is required, as there are no significant sponsorships.

5. There is not now, nor is there likely to be, a pilot shortage at ab-initio (i.e. novice) level. There are, and probably always will be, many, many more people wanting to be pilots than there are jobs for them. That's why there are no sponsorships.

Scroggs
(An airline pilot, working for an airline that recruits 90% white male pilots, most of whom do not have a degree! And before anyone gets shirty, that's because 90% of the qualified applicants are white male pilots, most of whom don't have a degree.)

[richiya]

Hi,
I believe the companies in the EU are going to start to ask pilots to have a Uni degree very soon. In Spain they have included in the selection process of the last year that all pilot MUST have a degree as of 2010, so you must start studying in 2007 to have it in time (or get a job before 2010)...
I think you should all follow your dream, and do everything possible to make it come true. I did but couldn't get a job, and I am currently finishing my second year in Uni. This doesn't mean you I don't want to be a pilot in the future, just something to use as a "back up" if you lose or don't get the job you want!
Good luck in whatever you choose.
Richiya

[karaoke]

Nepotism (being the chief pilot's progeny) may work in Lower Slaughter Air Taxi Company, but it doesn't in large airlines.


It worked in British Midland ;) ;)



Gerrupta Singh.

[dlav]

hey guys, this is my first post, but ive been reading this website for months. Im planning to drop out of uni once i finish my first year ( few weeks time).

I have my selection for the APP in 3 weeks. Anybody with success stories (or not) about dropping out of uni and going for the ATPL?

Its a big step for me but to be polite . Flying is what Ive only ever wanted to do and really not enjoying uni.

+'ve ROC - im doing a BSc Management!

:{

Any thoughts/comments greatly appreciated.

Dave

[jj232]

Reading all these posts makes me glad I no longer have any ambition to become an airline pilot. To all you guys and girls who don't make it don't worry about it's not worth it, I am an ATC now making pretty good money and more than happy that I am not working as an airline pilot, especially with all these low pay, low cost airlines around. There are other areas of aviation which are just as interesting and pay well too, and if your really smart you will start some kind of cash money business and make some real money like many friends of mine.

[Badgast]

You could always keep the flying for fun. I'm still undecided what to do. Go for the investment banking/real estate world and get my ppl during a summer or get into huge amounts of debt and join the world of aviation. I'm 27 at the moment and I'm thinking at this point of my life I should buy a house and experience what the corporate world is like and earn some real money. I feel age is not really a problem, more the financial power or lack of it. I feel money gets you very far in the aviation world, rather than raw ability. With money you can get yourself a rating and hours on type or an expensive course as the Oxford one. I'm not ready for the decision yet....

[scroggs]

by Karaoke:

It worked in British Midland

When? Are you suggesting that anyone has recently (within reason) got into a major airline without the required qualifications, because Daddy was a captain? Or are you just saying that some captain's son or daughter got in the airline? The first would be nepotism, the second is just someone legitimately following in Daddy's footsteps.

Scrogs

[brain fade]

Dudes.
Frankly a 'degree' (yuk!) is the last fuggin thing you'd want if you'd rather fly:ok:

Now, if you want a job at Mc Donalds on the other hand............................... maybe better get an MBA:{ :{ :{ :{ :{ :{ :{ :{ :{ :{ :{ :{

[abracadabra]

I echo What to do?'s comments above. Working 9-5 (or longer), commuting monday-friday with everybody else, and having to take work home on nights and weekends is IMHO a major repetitive drag and one that you have a good shot at avoiding if you get yourself into an airline.

That said, and before everyone posts their rosters to prove that they work much harder, let me say that your perception of your quality of life as a pilot will hinge dramatically on where you are based, who you fly for, and where you are in your family life.

Some pilots really do have a crap deal and get worked to death, losing that love for flying, and wondering if it was worth dishing out all that dosh.

If you're young and not tied down I suspect you'll find the lifestyle and the flying are terrific. Then, by the time you have a family to come home to, hopefully you'll have the seniority to get your preferred base, fleet, and days off etc.!

[JB007]

eoincarey

Read Puritans post here if you haven't already! (http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=149212) It outlines pretty much the long and short of the whole truth about "doing the pilot thing" at the present time, market considerations etc etc....

If you really want to do it, then go ahead - I have to agree with most peoples comments about kicking the degree into to the sidelines, start your ATPL writtens instead!

Outline a plan for yourself but remain VERY flexible with it, choose your training provider, finance it - add 20-25% and go do it! If you really want it then you'll work hard and succeed.

The hard truth about the whole thing is keeping your feet on planet earth - hang on to your ambition but be aware, that you may never ever gain what you set out to do. IMHO the reason for this is the importance of luck, never underestimate it! You need talent, application and luck to get on - and finding luck is the most important factor in finding success!

I've been flying professionally for about a year now, and I just love it! I keep hearing it'll wear off and become just a job and as lifes priorities change i'm sure it will - but the buzz of going to work is just unreal...can't get enough of it! Worth every penny and all the sweat and tears. But then I fit into abracadabra's "....young and not tied down....find the lifestyle and the flying are terrific etc etc etc" bracket!!!

The very best of luck.
Cheers
JB

[er82]

Not too many positive repies on here about flying for a living.....
It's a big gamble with a large sum of cash. Avaition jobs are never guaranteeed, and there will always be a large number of applicants for each and every single job going......

It's a pain getting up and some stupid hour to go to work when everyone else is asleep, and it's a pain having a rather unsociable lifestyle when you have to get an early night while all your mates are out on the town...
HOWEVER - the view out of my office window is absolutely bloomin mavellous, and having done the 9-5 job, it's something I wouldn't give up for the world.

Yes, there are low cost airlines giving out low cost lifestyles. Wherever you work you will have problems with your job. A job is what you make it, and if you really love flying and can;t imagine yourself doing anything else, go for it!!
If you're looking for a job that gives you lots of dosh for little work, stay away!

[dlav]

thanks for the comments guys

[eoincarey]

Cheers people

Although I disagree with the degree thing (I got into Edinburgh to do an MA in History, which is no mean feat!) and am not just going to chuck it as I think its important to have a fallback option, im grateful for all your advice. It seems that for better or worse, the pilot career is still worth it, just!

Cheers again

ETC

[GJB]

I am currently earnign very good money and to put it in perspective, I would have to be at LEAST a jet captain to equal my currently salary...........but i still want to give it up and start at the bottom of the heap in a flying career.

Flying for an airline is my ambition in life and I can't say much more than that. Take whichever path you wish to achieve your dream but be in control of your own destiny.

If you want something enough then you will get it in the end.

I'm personally avoiding a debt ridden route to qualification, but that's simply my decision. Others will be qualified at 19 years old with a £60k noose around their necks. If they can sleep at night and are managing it then that's fine. Do what you feel comfortable doing.