Overweight Cabin Crew [Archive]

SkySista

12th May 2005, 00:39

Can't recall which airline it was (OZ I'm sure), but on one info sheet they said you must "be able to comfortably walk down the aircraft aisle without having to turn sideways"

So I guess as long as you can do that then you're okay.

(I just wonder "comfortably" for who? Coz I wouldn't want a CC's butt hitting me in the face as s/he walks by! :})

I guess as with all things moderation is needed. If the CC can perform his/her duties without posing any risk during an emergency (as was mentioned about fitting thru overwing exits), and won't interfere with pax comfort (no hitting pax with your hiney, please...) then I don't see why they shouldn't be able to be a (healthy) size bigger than the norm (we don't need stick insects thanks) - and before you lash me, I'm one of the "stick insects" who would rather be a bit heavier, coz then I'd actually have more of a chance of getting work as crew- they look at me and think "She's so tiny - how could she lift anything? ;)

Sky

smile

12th May 2005, 00:46

It's funny to read that some people believe that hitting pax with your butt as you walk down the aisle means you are a little on the large size.

I don't consider myself big by any stretch of the imagination, although I do have a couple of curves, yet I find that at least once a day I suffer by what we call at work "C-D Disease". That's hitting the people seated in seats C and D as you walk up and down the aisle. Even the 'stick insects' suffer from this unfortunate infliction time to time. :E

Chris21

12th May 2005, 01:06

Just thought I would add the Qantas Medical form states that a Flight Attendant must be able to fit in between seats with an adult passengers seated - in order to assist in an evac situation.. or something along those lines..

SkySista

12th May 2005, 04:23

Smile, I'm not talking about the odd brush here or there - I know some pax deliberately leave their arms out as you walk by so they can... ahem.... accidently brush your butt....

I'm talking the "Im reading my book, and got my ear just about knocked off by some CC's ass" syndrome..... probably more common on some airlines more than others.

Agree, it does have to do with the a/c you are on... I mean, of course if you are on something small like a Dash 8, you will have more problem than on a bigger aircraft.

I'm talking the CC who really obviously need a wider aisle :E

I do have to admit, I haven'tsee it often - not in Oz, anyway.

roosterboy

12th May 2005, 04:52

I think it shouldn't matter too much - I have to say that QF lh has a few 'tubbies' from what i've seen lately, but it also doesn't seem to effect their work performance which is what matters.
I guess it just challenges the myths of what fa's should look like which is what makes it an almost controversial topic...
I've seen male fa's that would have been easily 220 lb (100 kg) - and it sure ain't muscle:\
If you can do the job well, then that's what matters most in my book...

frangatang

12th May 2005, 06:29

There was a stranded pilot whale working for BA who was so fat she went down the aisle sideways and l do recall someone
whispering,capt Ahab ,man the harpoon. You would have thought she had a generous personality to go with her size but no
,she was a miserable cow. Bloody strong though,could take 2 suitcases a time off the carousel in arrivals,which was damned useful when you had a bad back.Thankfully has retired ,probably to join billy smarts circus.

crewboi83

12th May 2005, 16:39

I'm about 2 stone over weight, when i applied to fly my 1st airline was Britannia, who told me over the phone If i lost 1 stone in 6 days i would be invited for an interview! how bad is that? advert for eating disorders or what!
I flew for Airtours/Mytravel... AV8 and European Aircharter then Excel and altho im a bit over weight no one has said anything. I can fit down the aisle lol
According to airline height/weight charts my height means i should be no more than 11stone 7lbs... and im 13.3!

PIGDOG

12th May 2005, 16:51

May I suggest a change in topic title to FAT FA'S

:D :D

CarltonBrowne the FO

12th May 2005, 17:29

When I'm travelling off duty, I always ask for a C or D seat. However, skysista, that is so I can get off the aircraft faster, honest!

Kelas

12th May 2005, 18:38

I in no way mean this to be offensive to our bigger sized ppruners but surely there are safety reasons why cabin crew are required to be a certain height/weight. I for one wouldn't like the person I'm relying on to get me out of a burning aircraft to be out of breath before I am! Just a thought!

SkySista

13th May 2005, 02:33

I believe you... suuuure I do! :E

hehehe

I am sure your motives for getting the C or D are perfectly harmless...... ;)

roosterboy

13th May 2005, 05:58

lol...:D
i've been knocked on the head as a pax many times!! I have to say i've also suffered from row c & d syndrome while working, but if the pax is sleeping with their head half in the aisle what can u do!:confused:

Sky_hi!

14th May 2005, 10:58

I think I have 'c d disease'. I don't know how many times I have bent over while getting something out of the cart and some poor pax has got a 'hiney in the head'. To all the c's and d's I'm so sorry!
:ooh:

Bandit_70

14th May 2005, 17:38

I agree..Too many lard arses getting into flying these days..

CrewChick

14th May 2005, 17:46

What is your definition of a 'Lard-Arse' though?

Human Factor

14th May 2005, 19:55

At the danger of moving the debate on....:rolleyes:

BMI (that's Body Mass Index) is probably a better measure than absolute girth. Equally, when (if???) you go to the gym, they're likely to have a chart which shows the healthy range of weights for a given height. For example, try this link:

Height against Weight (http://www.netfit.co.uk/fatwht.htm)

Something on these lines could be used as a sensible basis for recruitment. Weight in proportion to height is used for pilots (certainly at the initial medical), why not cabin crew? I'm 6'1" and 180lbs without getting paranoid about what I eat. If I can do it, anyone can.

NigelsFriend

14th May 2005, 22:48

When I joined, weight and hight HAD to be in proportion!!!!

Bandit_70

15th May 2005, 20:04

Lard arse-Somebody who does not have weight in proportion to their height,in laymans terms FAT!

I agree with the other comments,weight SHOULD be in proportion to height..Airlines cannot be "weightist"However from a safety point of view some of the crew flying around these days coudnt get their big ol butts out of the overwing exit on an A320

Also we have to remember that the airline industry was founded on glamour and i know it aint like it used to be but people still like to see a bit of eye candy when they take a trip..Sorry to be so controversial but its true!!!

jb5000

15th May 2005, 22:16

Hello all,

Interesting point with the BMI, however I have always particularly disliked this system.

I think technically if you put the England World Cup winning side on the scales they would all come out as 'clinically obese'.

Surely a simple test as to whether you can perform your duties effectively should be what is used?

EAAFA

16th May 2005, 02:54

This discussion reminds me of a crew I was with once. The Cabin Manager and R1P f/a were both very chunky (not necessarily obese, he was a big rugby player type, and she had very wide hips). They had to share a two-seater crew seat, and couldn't fit, so at the last minute the CM asked a slimmer f/a to swap with the R1P.

The point of the story being that it's all very well to talk about height to weight ratios, but you don't have to be obese to take up a lot of space. Maybe they should have a tester seat at recruitment sessions?

homesick rae

16th May 2005, 02:54

It is fine going by the charts, however....

I played prop forward for Edinburgh, I am big boned and my upper body is large...at a well discussed Gulf airline, I was weighed constantly...umpteen years as crew...it was a case of ..."but this is what the chart says..."

It does not make you not good at your job just because you have a few extra lbs...There are of course reasons as mentioned earlier in this thread, but some companies tend to be a tad OTT over this.

Cheers

HR

bekolblockage

16th May 2005, 05:05

Don't seem to have much of a problem with this at Thai or Singapore.
(Love those uniforms :ok: )

haamdhanimaid

16th May 2005, 08:44

I agree with Rae

At another (or maybe the same) well discussed Gulf airline, your weight was constantly measured and no matter how you looked ('overweight' or not), if the computer said you were overweight, you were overweight.

End of story.

:*

CHANEL

18th May 2005, 05:29

Obviously not working hard enough .... Gone are the days in aviation of the 60's glam when you had to practically be model thin with great looks!!

flybywire

19th May 2005, 18:39

Last year, during SEP training a new guy had to be fired (or better, made redundant) because, despite he had been successful during the entire training course, passed all exams etc, he couldn't fit in the jumpseat seatbelt/harness.
How embarassing, poor thing.
But he was only a victim of the equal opportunities system.

Now BA state on their recruitment website that, as a mandatory requirement, the day of the interview you'll have to be able to demonstrate that you can fasten your seatbelt without the use of an extention!!!

I had the pleasure to fly with this crew member once....really a sweet person, but sooooo big that only 1/3 of my left thigh was actually on the double crew seat (and I am a UK size 6!!!) I had to balance myself the whole time. The flight was ok, but what about if I had had to brace?
Ground staff wouldn't allocate a seat at an overwing exit to a passenger of an equal size....

As for the "C & D Syndrome" I think I will have to join the club!!! :}

FWB:)

TightSlot

20th May 2005, 19:36

Thanks for sharing dungfunnel. It is difficult to know which part of your post is the most offensive - your attitude, opinions, spelling or grammar. You have managed to achieve so much in so few words - impressive.

CHANEL

20th May 2005, 22:07

Well dungfunnel, love to know what you look like ... no oil painting, I'm sure!!! I'm not one of the larger girls and I would never of dated someone so into himself, what a joke!! ... you need an attitude adjustment!! Grow up darling!! And by the way, there probably not dating you for you, I'll give you the tip!! Competitive ... get in the real world, sounds like you're on the 'Milan catwalk', PLEASE!!

411A

21st May 2005, 05:32

Lets face facts here.

NO paying passenger likes to look at overweight cabin crew.
Clearly that is why the asian airlines don't have any, and the cabin service on these asian carriers is generally second to none.

However, being slightly overweight is not generally a safety issue.
Of one particular concern however was a female CC on one recent flight who was very pregnant.
She had great trouble getting down the narrow isle, could not push (by herself) the booze/food cart and, absolutely could not reach up and close an overhead locker.

Absolutely useless in any type of an emergency situation, yet here she was on duty.

Oh yes, the airline....Delta.

nurjio

21st May 2005, 11:46

dungfunnel, according to Roger Mellie all 'Kakpipe Cosmonauts', should be decaffed. Hows your collection of fartleberries coming along? Tw@t.

TightSlot, for a moderator, I find your user name as offensive as dungfunnel. Have you had surgery?

Human Factor, great link. All you lard arses out there, click on that link and explore the whole website.

Thought for the day..

'Nothing tastes as good as thin feels'

Flying Torquewrench

21st May 2005, 13:20

TightSlot,

I do agree with your concern about Dungfunnel's attitude and opinion but i have to disagree with your concern about his grammar and spelling.

As a moderator you know that Pprune is a worldwide forum. A direct result of this worldwide status is that there are people posting on this forum whose first language is not english. With your status as a moderator i find your comments on somebody's grammar and spelling offensive.

Regards, FT

TightSlot

21st May 2005, 17:20

Oh Dear

Flying Torquewrench if Dungfunnel chooses to post offensive opinions in an offensive manner (twice) then he/she can expect to deal with a little roughhouse. You may find on reading the follow up post that his/her command of English is rather more comprehensive than you had at first imagined. I am aware of the international nature of those posting here, but it is kind of you to remind me. It is regrettable that you have chosen to take offence, and I would suggest that your indignation is somewhat misplaced. Still, it's your dime...

dungfunnel will obviously be much happier in jetblast than here, and therefore his/her right to post in this forum have been removed.

As usual, 411A's post is both controversial and uncomfortably accurate - now why don't some of you work on an answer to him. If the tone of this thread doesn't improve from here on in, then we'll close it down.

Flying Torquewrench

21st May 2005, 19:36

TightSlot,

In almost every thread on this forum there seems to be somebody who finds it necessary to comment on spelling and grammar mistakes. This is annoying because it sometimes destroys a interesting subject and starts another fight about spelling and grammar mistakes. Therefore it is a shame that a moderator gives the example by doing it aswell.

But i have taken your point and indeed after reading Dungfunnel's follow up post it is apparent that his english is of a higher standard than in his first post.

Back to topic.

411A,

In several airlines when the cabin crew informs management that they are pregnant they are taken of flying duty with immediate effect. Thats the same in my company and the girls are given office duty. This to protect child and mother.

Indeed you are right that paying passengers don't want to see a overweight member of cabin crew. Most pax still expect cabin crew to be female and beautiful. Asian carriers got strict rules for cabin crew.

EVA AIR is advertising for cabin crew and the requirements are:
Female - Single - under the age of 24 and have their weight in proportion to their height.

No offense to older cabin crew but some airlines can follow this example. I have flown NorthWest several times from AMS-DET-AMS and if i have to guess the youngest cabin crew was between 35 and 40 years old. However that you need to be single is a little bit over the top.

FT.

EAAFA

22nd May 2005, 00:46

It's interesting that fellow cabin crew perpetuate the narrow minded views of passengers "who want to look at attractive flight attendants".
What matters is being proficient in our jobs and professional (in both our coduct and grooming).
It is one thing to demand a certain level of health and fitness from prospective cabin crew, but openly advertising for young, slim attractive, female flight attendants is the type of discrimination that belongs in history books.

411A

22nd May 2005, 03:19

<<It is one thing to demand a certain level of health and fitness from prospective cabin crew, but openly advertising for young, slim attractive, female flight attendants is the type of discrimination that belongs in history books.>>

You are very wrong, EAAFA.
The desire of some airlines to hire only the prettiest and slenderest female CC (and even perhaps...male:} ) will not change anytime soon.
You see, the CC are the face of the airline to the paying passenger, and if that face is growing fat and ugly, those paying pax will go to another airline, for the pretty gals (or guys...depending), provided the fares are about equal.
It really is that simple, as many asian airlines have proved, time and again.

Take travel USA-Asia for example.
You could take UAL or NWA ( rather senior routes for both) and be served by grandma, or you could take CAL, SIA, CX...etc, and see a pretty face, and superb service.

Pax aren't blind.
Now, if the older gals and guys keep themselves in shape, it might indeed help...but it will never replace the 20 somethings that serve up the booze.

HZ123

22nd May 2005, 08:15

At BA we field at least one female CC who is a size '28' and having seen her she is built like a brick out house and has to force her way down the isle. We also have one FC with a '52' waist, one can only assume he flys 'widebodies'.

Farty Flaps

22nd May 2005, 11:28

What! people banned for having a sense of humour. maybe the moderator should pull his/her head out and not be so up themself. Typical of cabin crew caring sharing forums. Gossip and slagging off is the real way of life in the cabin large or small.
Dont bother banning me im off. hippocrites.

I sit wong that someone doesnt like large people or just an opinion.

Ok then, take the rest of your life off... Goodbye

CHANEL

22nd May 2005, 11:34

Dungfunnel, I wouldn't like to be on board with you flying, you're mentually ill, forget to take your pills today ... !!! A320 figures!!

411A, I agree that cc's are the face of the airline and therefore their presentation should be of an impectable standard, including weight in proportion with height, definately!. Secondly, I fly asian carriers regularly and they have some real fatties and maybe if you scrape some of the caker head off (makeup that is!) maybe they'd be okay (no offence, just stating facts ... ) you're obviously not looking hard enough and think you're blowing to much sunshine in the wrong direction, so you face the facts 411A. Finally, if passengers want to look at girls or guys sexually they should go to a strip club.

Dungfunnel, whatever ... , you're a bore and ugly, snap those 'short mans' fingers all you like my skinny a-- won't be coming! Coffee, tea or me (don't thing so ... or maybe chicken or fish ... ! hehe!!) Won't be hearing from you too soon ... hehe!! Chao ...

Cheers
Chanel (Oh Dungfunnel, maybe you need some ... chanel that is, if you find it out of the low place you are to know what chanel is ... !

ps sorry moderators hope this isn't to much incorrect wording, if it is I apologise)

RoyHudd

22nd May 2005, 13:19

What rubbish. Fat people aren't worth all this bother, nor skinny ones.

What are you all writing about?

OZcabincrew

22nd May 2005, 13:45

I saw the Delta girls in the hotel the other day while on a trip and they were the scruffiest bunch i've ever seen!!!! Not only were majority of them grandma age (nothing necessarily wrong with that) but their grooming was terrible and the uniforms!!! no more said.

Oz

ps- however, i have seen "large" asian women/men, the reason why you don't see them if you fly SQ or CX etc, is because they probably wouldn't have made it past the first interview for this reason alone!!!! but of course the airline's reason as to why they didn't get through was because of something else, of course, hmmmmmm.

Oz

ozangel

22nd May 2005, 13:47

Since when do we assume that every passenger is a young male?

I find it quite funny really, because when it comes down to it, everyone has different taste.

Glamour will only get you so far. I have flown with absolutely gorgeous people who either froze when the shyte hit the fan, or had no idea what to do. Usually they struggled to hold a conversation as well. Of course, to be fair ive flown with gorgeous people who are brilliant safety and service wise - but there is NO link between looks and the duties of a flight attendant.

We generally did two types of flights

-Mine flights, where 99.9% of the pax were butch, hard working males.
-Holiday flights, where 99.9% of the pax were over 55.

We had a great variety of FAs, gorgeous, not so gorgeous, female, and male (well, i was the only male in my base).

Generally, the miners didnt care. Yes some of them loved their girls - but after their first drink they couldnt care if you were an orange panda wearing sequence - as long as they got what they wanted whether that be another drink, a chat, or to be left alone.
In one case, the miners requested the flight only be crewed with males, as I at least couldnt care less what obscenities came out of their mouthes, as long as they didnt offend anyone else. In some cases it did, as on the final sector normal paying rpt pax joined - however as I had a rappor with them it was never a problem to get them to settle down, unlike some girls who were in the galley crying with a closed bar and a double cart across the aisle at the front.

The oldies cared about one thing - service. It didnt matter what you looked like.

Yes you are the face of the airline. Theres plenty of attractive older, and larger crew too though.

Safety wise, it makes no difference how big ur arse is. I had one male pax in business class (who would travel regularly for business), who tended to give me in particular a hard time. I found he was happiest whenever the girls served him, and had no problem letting them. It only took one inflight fire, and him to see that all the crew, the pretty, the old and the large, male and female, working together using the safety equipment the pax rarely see in use (fire extinguisher, protective breathing equip, fire gloves, dangerous goods kit), and he NEVER had an issue with the older or larger or male FAs again. In fact, he even came up to me in the street when I was on an overnight, and he shook my hand and said it really made him realise just why we were there. (not a big place).

Finally - , personality and ability will outshine even the most 'less blessed' of crew.
Secondly - Not all passengers are so shallow. PLLLLEEEASE stop living in the past. Not all changes over the last 40 years have been for the worse...

411A

22nd May 2005, 20:41

\\\Finally, if passengers want to look at girls or guys sexually they should go to a strip club.\\\

Strip clubs are not the issue, CHANEL, it is the grooming and appearance of CC that is addressed here.

Older CC who keep themselves in shape, and do the job properly, will always find a job reserved for them...be it senior cabin chief, purser...or serving in cattle class.

The one's I refer to are those folks (mostly female...but some males as well) who just simply seem to ignore the required fitness standards...you know, the overweight ugly gals (and guys) who don't give a damn, thinking (using the term in its broadest sense)...'well I have a job, stuff the passengers, management too.'
Sadly, passengers see this for what it is, and vote with their wallets, as clearly such airlines as SQ/CX have found out a very long time ago.

And speaking of SQ, as I operated for 'em a very long time ago, their policy at the time (and may still be the case), hired their CC on four year contracts.
At the end of same, out the door they went, to be replaced by 20 somethings with more 'eye' appeal,
unless they had senior CC staff potential, and acted / produced accordingly.

Lets really face facts here.
The only older folks appreciated by the paying passengers are the guys (gals) at the pointy end...firmly planted in the LH seat.

Always has been...always will be.:ok:

bazzaman96

22nd May 2005, 22:13

If the purpose of weight guidelines is to enable the FAs to perform their job efficiently and move down the aisles speedily (as seems to be the case as shown by the Qantas guidelines on page 2), then why would BMI be relevant? BMI is a height/body mass guide - you can have high BMI but still be small and thus still fit through the aisle comfortably.

The test surely is simply whether you can do your job properly and move down the aisles with ease. This in itself (see Jessica Starmer/BALPA thread) might be discriminatory, since the anatomy of women generally lends itself to wider hips than guys.

CHANEL

23rd May 2005, 07:10

411A, I understand and can appreciate that 'strip clubs' are not the issue here, merely making an 'extremist' point relating to cc's being fat, skinny or whatever and having passengers looking at you like you are 'meat' (so to speak), I felt after reading one of your previous postings, that was the flavour. I also understand and I will reitarate, cc's are the face of the airline and DO need to present themselves in an appropriate manner i.e. looking after themselves - being older, younger, larger or smaller has NO relevance here, just presentation!

As I said previously, CX do not have the greatest looking cc's and many of them are older, especially in the J class and above cabins, so again, I do not know where you get your information, secondly, it is common knowledge that CX have lowered their physical standards, somewhat, just fly and take a look - not that it matters any!! However, I must say I've found the service on CX great as with most asian carriers (being a service culture) and that's what make's people return, obviously not the candy on display!

Fokker_Me here here, couldn't of put a better angument forward, my sentiments exactly, well said!

Cheers
CHANEL x

flybywire

23rd May 2005, 08:47

I have a friend who works for SQ and she once told me that only the prettiest FAs can work in First class. Imagine that, you go to the briefing and your in-charge crew member sends you to the back as in his/her eyes you're ugly!! Wow!! :}

FBW:)

AEUSkinner

24th May 2005, 22:25

I can't believe some of the things being said on here!
How can some of you be soooooo narrow minded, How do you know that passengers don't want to look at bigger c/c, there are some people in the world who think the bigger the better.
I fit just fine down the centre of the aisle even though I am a size 18. I am completely in proportion, I have not yet had c-d disease as you guys are calling it and I drink a lot of water and hence have great skin.

At the end of the day I work for a company which demands impecable appearance (hair and makeup tidy and appropriate) and that the uniform is worn to standards. When I work in a position where I am bidding the customers farwell they can't thank us enough for a wonderful flight, not once have I ever heard of a passenger say (even in private) that they did not like the size of one of the crew.
I have however heard people say ''she looks far too skinny, someone give her a pie'' or ''she has far too much makeup on'' or ''they do not look very smart/tidy''

So remember, we are there for safety first (I was the quickest person to evacuate my 'sim' plane in training, only girl to close the door first time and can lift a life raft by myself!) and as long as we can do the job WHO CARES!

cartexchange

25th May 2005, 00:44

this post keeps on appearing , can the moderator please close it, it really is a non issue, even though Im quite thin, I feel sorry for the "larger " people, who bloody cares, as long as the do a good job onboard, I dont care about their sizes, this post makes f/a look do pathetic, Moderator, close it

TightSlot

25th May 2005, 05:55

No. If this is what people want to talk about, let them!

So long as they abide by the rules, of course

Bandit_70

26th May 2005, 11:33

I bet all the people who don't agree with this post or can't believe that we are being so contraversial and discriminating the fat cc are a bunch of lard asses themself!!

All the fit,good looking cc are laughing there butts off to this thread!

face the truth..loose some weight!!

LOL

flybywire

26th May 2005, 11:55

Bandit I don't agree with you and I don't think you're being fair either. I, for example, am not laughing at all.
We were discussing whether carriers prefer "skinny" crews (and everybody would straight away imagine female crews, such is the world we live in) to attract more (MALE) passengers.
Also with a look over safety issues.

As I said there's a cabin crew in my base who is so big they can barely fit in a double crew seat, they're obviously way overweight and I doubt their FITNESS (and not capability) to do the job. But a bit overweight...who cares? As long as ppl are professional, and have good interpersonal skills and a bit of diplomacy (thing that you SEEM to be lacking in my dear) who cares?

Generalizing is never a good answer. Some skinny and beautiful crews (girls AND BOYS) can be complete tarts as well and though they have no C & D syndrome they wouldn't be able to solve ANY kind of problem on board and would run to their purser crying for help all the time!!! (seen it many times in my previous job) Being "good looking" and physically proportioned doesn't measure what you can/cannot do and HOW you can do it. Challenging situations do.

Enjoy.

FBW

EAAFA

28th May 2005, 06:49

Since 411A describes himself as an Airline Captain in his profile, it makes one wonder why he feels so passionately about attractive cabin crew...

It's 2005, 411A. Our customers are not mainly middle aged businessmen as used to be the case many years ago. The world has changed for the better, and not only airlines but also the majority of customers don't base their opinions on how pretty and slim the flight attendants are. The reason the Asian carriers are doing well is because they go all out with the service. If they didn't, they wouldn't get the repeat business no matter how attractive their staff were.