easyJet & Euromanx head to head on the Isle of Man?

[Compass Rose]

According to the Isle of Man on-line easyJet are in discussions regarding possible services to the Island:

http://www.iomonline.co.im/ViewArticle2.aspx?SectionID=870&ArticleID=977597

How might this affect Euromanx?

I would have thought that traffic to the Island is pretty much a static market. Would cheap routes to the UK and Europe actually generate new business and tourist travellers? Delightful place the Isle of Man may be but it is hardly a fashionable holiday destination these days. The modern tourist wants continental culture and sunshine !

To compete with Euromanx easyJet might have to concentrate on services to the UK before risking new routes to destinations previously not available from the Island. Low cost fares demand a pretty full aircraft. It might be difficult to fill a B737 on some business routes

Granted, of course, that Manx people would certainly enjoy cheaper travel.

So, are we going to see a head to head between easyJet and Euromanx?

[Hansol]

Never happen. Ronaldsway is a very expensive Gov owned airport, there are no pax numbers for EZY.

[San Expiry]

Absolute b....s. If the locos were going to come to IOM they would have done so years ago. The existing operators cannot fill 50 seaters so what would you do with a 130 seat 737. As Hansol says, the numbers just do not exist. And where would easy fly to? LPL on a 73 - economic madness; LTN - BA can't half fill their RJ. No, its wishful thinking by the fairies again. The Manx still believe in this myth that the rest of the world is flying around on £5 fares. Some lucky individuals are but there are also people on the same plane paying £300.

The locals are always moaning about fares but you can get to LPL for £32 return (probably about the same as putting fuel in the tank if you were to drive it) and MAN for £45 return. There is a price to pay for living in the middle of the Irish Sea.

No - pie in the sky, IMHO. Easy cannot be that desperate but perhaps the airport authority is. As for the government, it doesn't know its rear end from its elbow as far as transport policy is concerned. :ugh:

[granddaddy]

Totally agree with San Expiry,the pax loads that EZY require are just not there.80% load factors do not exist ex-IOM.
All operators are fighting to carry half that number.
Manx Gov. and Press getting carried-away by their own enthusiasm for 'bigger aircraft'

[Compass Rose]

I think you are absolutely right. However, the substance of the article (the link no longer works) is that the Manx Government approached twenty airlines to run services from the Island.

This suggests to me that they might be dissatisfied with the situation with Euromanx. I.e. they would prefer a dedicated airline for the Island rather than a hotch potch of wet leasing agreements.

[skiddyiom]

Have to agree with you there CR. My guess is that they have suddenly woken up to the real world and are desparate to have a regular, stable service to and from the Island.

Still, we'll have to wait and see what happens eh?

Skiddy

[EastMids]

No one would have said Newquay was a market, but Ryanair made it into one. Many years ago, IOM was a large market, particularly for summer holidays. No reason that with low fares Easy couldn't build a market to/from IOM.

Andy

[PAXboy]

Agreed. I did LTN~IOM~LTN last Saturday (delayed by the fog) and back today. Both at 50% load.

The problem that the island has is that they were thrilled to welcome new services to STN + LCY and are now wondering why the LTN + LGW routes are thin! There is, I suggest, a very clear limit on traffic to the South East. Those that need the charter and euro holiday routes have BHX + MAN + LPL at their disposal.

There is no way that EZY will be able to provide service and that has been known for years.

[True Manxman]

Lets face facts. The Isle of Man is just not big enough for Easyjet, How, with a 737 could they compete on domestic routes with the likes of Flybe/Emerald/Euromanx or BA. The operating costs would make the fares that expensive, who would use them. Dont forget, we are talking a catchment area of only about 85000 people, typically, easyjet serve catchment areas of hundreds of thousands of people. If they managed load factors of 50% i would be amazed, which we all know is nowhere near enough pax to be profitable on that size of aircraft on short hops. If they are looking at routes into europe, again there is not enough people travelling to warrant a daily schedule. The bottom line is the economics and practicalities dont add up to a viable operation

[LTNman]

Easyjet have been very good at creating a market out of nothing. IOM might have a small catchment area but at LTN they have the UK’s second biggest catchment area of any UK airport. If the fare is right there are many people in the southeast who would venture there for short breaks.

Ryanair have been flying for years to places most people have never heard of so why not LTN – IOM for easyjet which is a place everyone has heard of.

[Compass Rose]

But, LTNman, if easyJet hoped to create a 'Short Break' market on the rock where would all the visitors stay?

There is virtually no unemployment on the Island. I doubt that, with a bouyant local economy, there would be much local interest in increased tourism. A few more 'Short Breakers' in the summer maybe. Definately not in the winter though !

[skiddyiom]

Indeed Ryanair have been flying to places not manyhave heard of, but, they fly there as an alternative to the main airport of the region.

There still isn't the population on the Island, nor the business/tourist travellers to support a regular medium sized aircraft like the 737 or A.319 on a constant basis.

About the only way that could possibly be achieved is by using IOM as a stopover from BFS or DUB, which wouldn't be economically viable I would have thought.

If the IOM Govt. were to aggressively market the IOM and invest in rejuvenating it's tourist status, then you may get a rise in visitors. However, this would take time and money and isn't guarenteed.

Anyway, no doubt we will see in time, along with more rumours!!

skiddy

[Hansol]

If every ticket to and from the Island were £10 I doubt you would stimulate much more traffic then exists today. Air services to the IOM are an accident waiting to happen as the quality of the operators spirals down.

[Compass Rose]

Air services to the IOM are an accident waiting to happen as the quality of the operators spirals down.

Precisely. How, with a diverse collection of pilot contacts, do you create a cohesive team with a common safety culture ?

[Copenhagen]

Two years ago BLK DUB was flown with bandits. Now its a shiny 737-800. A similar story could happen on IOM LPL and IOM LTN. How long is the BHD GLA sector - which was operated by ATP's and now 733's!

Never doubt the ability of low cost carriers to at least double traffic on routes.

Oh, and if an A319 can land at LCY, it can land at IOM.

[skiddyiom]

Copenhagen,

No one doubts the ability of a 319 to land on the IOM, just the ability to operate it in a commercially viable manner and successfully.

I would love to see larger aircraft here, it would certainly increase competition.


skiddy

[MarkD]

CPH

A 319 can't land at LCY. Neither can a 318, yet.

[Dash-7 lover]

COPENHAGEN

THE A319 IS NOT CERTIFIED TO LAND AT LCY DUE TO THE 5.5 DEGREE GLIDESLOPE (USED TO BE 7.5) AND OBSTACLE CLEARANCE - NOT A REAL PROBLEM ON THE IOM.

[True Manxman]

Dont get me wrong, i agree with skiddy, i would love to see larger aircraft operating out of IOM on a regular basis, thats why the Government are investing so heavily in the runway extension project. I just dont think we have the people to support larger aircraft on scheduled services.

[Hansol]

Sorry Manxman, like a lot of people on the Island you are under the impression that the runway extension will allow larger aircraft to operate from the Island, the extension is in fact an extension of the safety "run off" area which is too short at present.
The airport has two options extend the run off area leaving the runway length the same, or extend the run off area and reduce the length of the runway, so the result of the current review could be a shorter runway.

[CAP670]

At 1753 metres, the runway at IOM isn't long enough to enable an easyJet Boeing 737 to operate out of the Island with a commercially viable payload.

And Ryanair requires not less than 2000 metres for its 737 aircraft.

Anyway, Euromanx very probably won't last and so in a year's time the market will probably be where it was two or three years ago...

Stay :cool: ........

[starbag]

I'm not a pilot, but AEU have operated 73G's into IOM to TFS (load restiricted) and 757s to PRG. Shouldn't be any load retrictions to LTN should there?

[STANDTO]

EZY would fill a 737 to Palma or Malaga if they decided to punt one off the end of the runway at RON, say five times during the summer season.

Ultimaltely we need one operator going on and off the Island. It could be done, with carefully chosen destinations; one north, south east and west.

My dear old mum lives in Menorca. They get a third off all domestic travel on presenting her residencia permit. Notwithstanding Manx Independence, it would seem a sensible thing to do here - viability with a bit of stability

[jem star]

Come on guys,

We of all people know it will never happen. I personally am hoping euromanx are still around as have applied for a job with them, would love the chance to personally see shower of s**t emerald off the liverpool as have been shafted by them good and proper.

If anyones going to be gone it will be them.

J S

:ok:

[part69]

Jemstar

The amount of bull that comes out your mouth no wonder you got shafted.
Euromanx's gain though, you would fit in well dressed in red selling tickets, as your not fit to be flight crew!!

[PAXboy]

if they decided to punt one off the end of the runway at RON, say five times during the summer season. Not going to happen. Operators want to run a route every day. At the least, they want to run it once a week but to operate a route for only half a dozen rotations? No money in that. The cost of setting up is never going to be recovered.

If the IOM gov decided to run the airport as a non-profit company? Then they could use it as a springboard for tourism. Mind, that I am not saying it should run as a loss but only at break even.

As far as I can see, the gov wants to make a profit.

[spanner the cat]

What's required for the Rock is one maybe two airlines running services on routes licenced by the Government. All the Manx government seems to want to do is grandstand how many destinations are flown from the island and never mind what sort of quality is provided by the operators.

As for the notion of a low cost carrier coming in it is laughable to suggest that it would happen with EZY's and FR 's business models. Even if it did happen the fare structure would still cause late bookers to be crucified in order to subsidise the early bookers and it certainly wouldn't be like the old farecrackers where every seat on certain flights was a fixed price.

Is the Moaning (I mean Mannin) line still in existence? Because if so I'm sure that whoever does decide to operate in and out will still receive a good kicking on the radio from angry of Castletown etc.

[True Manxman]

Paxboy

IOM Airport is already run as a break even operation and already do what they can to encourage new operators/routes by way of incentives that are available to anyone who wants them, still got to cover costs though.

Spanner the cat, moanin line still going strong, only once a week now though, sometimes the truth hurts:D

[PAXboy]

T.M. Thanks for that, I was unaware. With regards to the Moanin Line, "Angry of Castletown" is probably my mother. :\

--------------------
"I tell you, we are here on Earth to fart around, and don't let anybody tell you any different." Kurt Vonnegut, Jr.

[Hansol]

True Manxman - I'd love to see the figures you call "break even" RON is one of the most expensive airports in the country, they need to cut costs and improve their service to attract business.
One example - If security operated any slower it would be going backwards, ask any business traveller the place is a laughing stock !

[rubik101]

A few years ago, when BRS was served by a few 50 seaters with ridiculously expensive seat prices, GO, soon to absorb easyJet, moved there with 3 B737-300s and began operations to new destinations, as well as the established UK routes.
Now, the 50 seaters are gone, probably to the IOM, and easyJet now runs a fleet of 7, soon to be 8 aircraft out of what is one of their most profiatble bases. No chance eayJet to fly in and out of IOM? Don't bank on it!

[brabazon]

Rubik101 - which 50 seaters do you mean the Dash 8-300s or the now used ERJ145s?

[True Manxman]

Hansol - I would love to see the figures myself, but it is government policy that the airport operates on a non profit making basis. Good incentives are already given to new operators and for new routes, discount landing fees, load supplements etc etc, all to encourage new business. Surely to cut costs any further would impact on security and make it run even slower. I would much rather take an extra few minutes and be checked properly, than be rushed through and hardly checked at all.

[Hansol]

Manxman you are missing my point, security at RON is slow and badly organised, perhaps because it is sub contracted to a third party securicor. As a business traveller I see numerous airports and RON is second rate because it can be. Government run and financed it has no incentive to up its game.

In the past the business community on the Island have been shafted by high fares and poor service, now hard times are here the place must be losing money, but there is no sense of urgency from Gov (as usual), they will continue to fiddle as Rome burns.

[skiddyiom]

Hansol,

I have to agree with you re. security. It is farcical that the airlines have flights leaving from 06.40 and the security check point doesn't open until 06.15. Most mornings are chaotic because of this.
However, the security people work an exceedingly long day, not sure of the exact details. It's about time someone in authority had a long hard look at how the airport is run and made some changes.
It may be a "non profit making" enterprise. That shouldn't equate to inneficient.
Should the miracle happen and someone like Easyjet do start on the island, this is a problem that would have to be addressed.
Even more so when they eventually open the extra gates.
They can't have increased traffic with the same inefficient system in place.

skiddy

[corky83]

Hansol, you've confused me! When you say RON, do you mean IOM? RON is actually Rondon, Colombia.

[Hansol]

Corky - you are confused ? One is a banana republic and the other is in Columbia !

[Ronaldsway Radar]

Hey all,

Granted, ticket prices out of Ronaldsway are pricy to say the least, and operations can be non-profitable and un-economical. If more airlines operated...say....the AT43, or the DH8C, they would get (most of the time) full loads (almost) and a good profit. Now yes, you can have a go at me "oh you dont know nothing about running an airline etc" and true, I dont, but I do know that nearly everytime I see the Eastern flights or the JEM flights arriving, they are pretty much full! So maybe a few more turboprops should be used?! Sorry if I sounded like a 'know-it-all' was just my view of things.
If i'm talking out of my rear let me know, and i'll shut up again!
RR

(Yes I know Eastern and FlyJem dont operate the DH8C or the AT43 I was just using some examples)

[lfc84]

According to press report in Isle of Man examiner Easyjet have dropped plans for an Isle of Man route.

No-go for EasyJet
03/10/05
3FM

EasyJet have pulled out of plans to operate to the Isle of Man.

The low cost airline had been in talks with the Government with a view to running a service between the Island and London.

It’s believed the budget carrier is concerned about the length of the runway at Ronaldsway airport.

http://www.isleofman.com/locallife/news/

http://www.iomonline.co.im/ViewArticle2.aspx?SectionID=870&ArticleID=1208921