View Full Version : 1st Class PAX jumps from DLH B747 in Mexico
Cejkovice
10th Mar 2005, 09:41
Just read in Flight International that a 1st class passenger jumped from a taxiing Lufthansa B747 upper deck in Mexico (28th Feb).
Report didn't really say anything else other than the slide deployed, the passenger was caught by security and was "confused" but not really anything else.
Had a quick look on here but not found any further info. Has anyone else any knowledge of this incident??
Cejk
Any 747 drivers who can tell me whether it IS possible to open an emergency door when the cabin is pressurized, or does the Jumbo pressurize after lift-off? I always understood the Boeing 'plug-type' doors would not open when pressurized.
Rainboe
10th Mar 2005, 13:25
Yes you can open the door. The upper deck door is not plug, it hinges open at the top and is powered. Only very minor pressurisation on the ground.
Presumably the same as the 737 NG windows, I guess? A potential problem if the c/crew are not on the ball. I assume the pax would have got a bit close to an engine?:eek:
Danny
10th Mar 2005, 14:55
U/D door has a a lock that activates in flight to prevent inadvertent operation of the operating handles. If the lock fails to activate after take off it's possible to open an U/D door when cabin diff pressure is low. (less than 2psi I think). Obviously, on the ground, even after engine start, the door can be operated (common sense). In automatic mode there is a gas bottle powered assist which swings the door up.
(Ask me again in six months and you'll probably get one of those confused looks!)
Flybob
10th Mar 2005, 15:57
Also while ground sensing is active both outflow valves are modulated to full open. Zero pressurisation effect on the ground. That way any main cabin door (main deck plug type or UD doors on stops) can be opened on ground during emergency....and possibly otherwise as has just been demonstrated apparently.
Obviously, on the ground, even after engine start, the door can be operated (common sense) not quite sure I see the 'commonsense' there, Danny. Opening the doors into a running engine would not be ideal! I assumed there would be some sort of procedure to prevent such (other than c/crew), but obviously not. It appears from what I am reading that following an aborted take-off, while the f/deck are sitting, engines running 'consdering' their actions, it would be possible for ALL the doors to be opened by panicking passengers. :eek: At least on the 737 classic it needed engine shutdown/depressurise to facilitate door-opening.
PS I WILL ask you again in six months.:confused:
Danny
10th Mar 2005, 16:36
As far as I remember there is nothing to stop anyone opening the exits, armed or otherwise, on the B737-300 or 700 whilst on the ground, depressurised, engines running or not. The evac QRH does require the F/O to make sure that the outflow valve is open but under most circumstances it would be anyway... wouldn't it? :confused:
(Then again, it's at least 6 months since I last read the B737 QRH in depth so hence the confused look!) :O
Not quite that simple!! It is all very complicated, depending on which pressurisation controller is fitted. On the ground, the one you probaly knew (DCPCS? - no flt/grd switch) has the outflow valve fully open, and the cabin unpressurised (that's progress!?) while the CPCS has it mostly closed, pressurising the cabin to 1.25 psi when the Flt/Grd switch is in 'Flt' (you can feel it on the ears). Hence I was always told that the doors were 'plugged' on the ground with the CPCS, needing the depressurisation to facilitate opening. (DV window was quickest).
Why wait 6 months to be confused? It only takes me a few minutes.................:D
PS Don't make the print any fainter for me old eyes.
WTH. Altogether an amazing event! Should sharpen up the cabin crew.:D
hobie
10th Mar 2005, 17:30
PS Don't make the print any fainter for me old eyes.
thanks for that BOAC .... I was beginning to wonder if it was just me :p
Blue light...Blue Light...BLUE LIGHT!! AAaarrrgghhhh....:}
CargoOne
10th Mar 2005, 21:18
Just out of interest... I cannot remember any "real" 747 (pax) evac involving U/D slides. Am I wrong or this guy can now claim something from Boeing as the first man who prove it works? :}
HotDog
10th Mar 2005, 21:32
BOAC, you are correct in saying that the airplane is slightly pressurized on the ground with AUTO mode selected on the pressurization control panel and all doors closed. In fact cabin altitude will be 70 feet maximum below field elevation at sea level which equates to approx. less than 1.25 psi. I have never tried it but I'm fairly certain that cabin doors can be opened at that differential. By the way, there are no DV windows on the 747.
Skylark_air
10th Mar 2005, 21:35
I personally don't blame him. Mexican food it bad, but Mexican Airline food is AWEFUL!
TheOddOne
10th Mar 2005, 21:45
Just out of interest... I cannot remember any "real" 747 (pax) evac involving U/D slides. Am I wrong or this guy can now claim something from Boeing as the first man who prove it works?
There have been a few. We had a video at work of a really nasty-looking attempted evac from the UD where the slides got caught by a very strong wind and were wrapping all around the fuselage. Either LAX or SFO, I think. Sorry I don't have a link to it. We had a 747 evac at LGW about 15 years ago, again no piccies, I'm afraid. Usual broken ankles, friction burns etc. I've only seen one evac where no-one got hurt getting out, an F27, they were able to just step out as normal. We even had one guy crack his skull getting out of an ATR42 - smacked his head on a no 1 engine prop blade!
Cheers,
TheOddOne
foxile
11th Mar 2005, 13:12
Just as an aside, from someone in total ignorance, can someone tell me how long it takes for these slides to be re-installed etc for the a/c to be serviceable again - assuming of course someone qualified was at hand?
Rollingthunder
11th Mar 2005, 14:10
They don't get re-installed. A spare can be fitted if available. The blown slide will take at least a day in the shop for inspection and re-packing. Longer if repairs are required.
Tartan Giant
12th Mar 2005, 23:18
Evac with no injuries.
Going slightly off the B747 UD solo evac and, adding toTheOddOne's post,
I've only seen one evac where no-one got hurt getting out, an F27, they were able to just step out as normal.
There was a deH Comet 4B aircraft evacuation on the 25 March 1978 at LGW where 95 pax plus crew all left the aircraft via chutes in 33 seconds (ATC tower timing) and there were no injuries at all. Just for the record.
Whilst no where near the B747 shute exit level heights, it was a full blooded evacuation after the aircraft had landed from declaring an emergency (fire warning, No2 engine).
Cheers
TG
RevMan2
14th Mar 2005, 08:20
LH must attract them!
My wife was a sandwich mechanic on a flight back in the early 80s (I tagged along for the ride) where a pax sleepwalked over to 3R and tried to open it between JKT and SYD. All hell broke loose and they restrained the chappy and put him in F to keep him out of the way of the rest of the punters who were all for a lynching.
All the vacationing LH mechanics from HAM on the flight plus the FE agreed that nothing could happen, all locks still in place etc etc. Aircraft touches down in SYD and the door starts swinging open. Said wife flies across from 3L and applies her 45k as a counter weight, joined 3 seconds later by 90k of steward from 2R, having set a 747 hurdling record in the process.
Slide didn't deploy, but people claimed to have seen the runway sliding under them at a significant rate of knots through the gap.
Sheepish looking mechanics and FE. Never heard what happened to the perpetrator.