View Full Version : Calling ex City Flyers.

Captain Correlli
7th Dec 2001, 20:10
Have any City Flyer pilots got any comment on life with BA. I'm with BRAL, and we seem to be being drowned in new ways of doing everything, mostly ill-conceived at short notice. (This can be seen by the fact that procedures change and change again on what seems nearly a weekly basis ie lock the door, keep it open, no, keep it shut, no it's optional, and now back to locking it again. The original operational instruction on how to take a pee had to be seen to be believed)

From being, (in percentage profit terms) the most profitable operator in the UK last year, we are now apparently heading for a huge loss. We have joined BA :rolleyes: More than that, now we are supporting BA's and BAR's huge losses, and yet we seem to be spending more more and yet more again on new layers of management that we didn't seem to need in the good old (profitable) days. We have been told we should be proud to be part of a world class operation (hysterical laughter). For the first time ever, we now have to suffer a pay freeze. I don't mind that so much on its own, but to have it imposed because we are now part of the worlds most arrogant airline, losing money as it does is a bit hard to take.
So, how are you all in CityFlyer being a bit further down the road than us - oh an nearly forgot, we don't even get onto the BA seniority list; although we are apparently going to be getting loads of BA cadets to come and work with us - probably on more than our training captains, lol :eek:

birdseed jr
7th Dec 2001, 20:28
Firstly BA cadet pilots will not be getting paid more than your training captains. I think its common knowledge that BA cadets are on a lower basic salary than a direct entrant (21 opposed to 28, i believe) then have to pay part of their training back at 250 quid a month. I know because im one of them who may be joining you next year.
i had looked forward to that and i hope there arent more in your company who resent this. I hope you dont believe that they have as much of a right to a position in your airline as any other new first officer would have. From what understand, the regionals are expanding, so were not costing you a job, and because of our secondment are not directly affecting your salary.
Im not looking for an argument, but i am looking for your views?

7th Dec 2001, 20:30
I think you'll find this clock is going backwards. Things don't look so great down here in darkest Gatwick. Lots of obscure changes to working for no apparent benefit, non of the proposed carrots that got us (cabin crew) to sign up to BA in October, just the big heavy stick and the constant threat of cutbacks.

Still from the FT web site today strong hints in there that it probably won't matter after Feb 2002 anyway.

ft.article (http://globalarchive.ft.com/globalarchive/article.html?id=011206000275&query=British+Airways)

[ 07 December 2001: Message edited by: mainfrog2 ]

[ 07 December 2001: Message edited by: mainfrog2 ]

7th Dec 2001, 21:24
What an excellent idea:

Buy a profitable company at LGW, that is already a franchise, for 75 million. Merge it into mainline 12 months later (despite having pledged to the MMC to keep it seperate) thus destroying its cost base that made it profitable in the first place, and then pull out of LGW altogether because the management finds itself unable to make a profit at LGW.

The only words for it are "INCOMPETENT MANAGEMENT"

7th Dec 2001, 22:49
Was there an official date at which CityFlyer ceased to exist. I know the process was gradual, but was there a 'last day'?

7th Dec 2001, 23:27
Yeah! and guess what Topman, since I started working for the company with the higher cost base I've actually been earning less money. Somebody is doing very well out of me I tell ya!

Captain Correlli
8th Dec 2001, 00:21
Nothing personal birdseed junior, I'm sure you'll enjoy the flying. Just to clarify though, the only reason we are recruiting YOU guys is because of a BA inspired hiring freeze causd by the BA losses. I'm sure I'd like to buy you a beer, but there's a thought or two needed carefully here. Are you not maybe just a step on the way to aiding BA cost cuts? Do you seriously expect to ever get back to mainline?
Ask yourself, (hell, I'm asking!!!!!) what is your future. Are you going to fly with our guys and then take a hefty pay rise and disappear into the milch cow that mainline appears to be, and will that apply to the guys you operate with. I bet its a case of YES and then NO. Do you think that will endear you guys to your crew members?

As I say, nothing personal, but don't expect us to cheer as we bend over and the bat slides in. Again.
Then again, watch your contractual terms VERY carefully. What's to bet you might find the small print has subtly changed, and omigod, maybe you're about to become an example of the BA scale 'B'.

Good Luck, but does Harry Wragg have any comment please? What is the serious prospect for City Flyer guys, pay, seniority, T and C etc??

[ 07 December 2001: Message edited by: Captain Correlli ]

8th Dec 2001, 00:26
Well, to put the positive side of things:

Yes, there've been a few changes to SOPs, but they've been introduced in a gradual, sensible manner. (Locked cockpit doors are a necessary pain for everybody in the industry, I imagine.)

Flying is much the same. My pay has risen, my allowances have gone up with longer tours, and I get good food most days.

We are still on our own AOC for the time being, but the snappy little callsign has, alas, gone. However, I'll put up with this - see above :D

The chaps at EOG seem to be a nice bunch of blokes, and we are looking forward to moving in at Jubilee House, if not the Z car park.

The economics of all this are beyond my payscale. No doubt somebody else will pipe up with the negative aspects.

[ 07 December 2001: Message edited by: Brakes...beer ]

8th Dec 2001, 01:09
If you want the negative aspects, just read mainfrog's link.

Enjoy the sarnies while you can!