Good news on the horizon with Gulf Air

[Ray Darr]

...Rumour has it there is good news coming very soon for the crew at Gulf Air - a nice, long overdue increase in pay and a few other areas (all over and above the current pay rise)!

More good news: a new simulator building under construction at GF's main HQ (NO MORE :yuk: DOHA! :D ), new flat-bed business class interiors soon, plus this years bonus, too...

It looks like the recovery plan is working - and things seem continue to get better for those at GF! :ok:

"Stay tuned for further developments" (within a few months??!) as they say... ;)

~Ray Darr

[ironbutt57]

no more doha???? man there go the per deims!!! heard 'bout the raise too.....I feel a trip to Senor Paco's coming on!!!!;)

[Ray Darr]

...that'll be tackled most likely (both comments you made, rightly!)

:p :O :ok:

~R.D.

[Left Coaster]

Okay ready? Now Inhale, more! and More!, Now Hold it....:suspect:

[costalivin]

we shall wait and see...no other choice really have we??

If the head honchos could see their way to giving us a realistic housing allowance and paying all our school fees i'm sure a whole lot of us guys would be happy to stay here.
I pay up to BD500 a month just to stay in my regular 3 bed house and put my kids through school...doesnt leave a lot left over does it??
thats why guys are looking around at other airlines and leaving in their droves.

school and housing boys...thats the bottom line

[tundra runner]

I am not saying no to money but there is more to life. For one thing you need the time to spend it. Seems there is a new practice to give rest time down route and keep flying for 12 days in a row!!! Take your 36/72 hrs rest down route and keep flying another block. How about the tax on leave tickets who pays that?:ugh:

[airwaya457]

Well, all sounds very promising! I guess we will have to wait and see, let’s just hope it’s not 20% of the communication allowance.

No more Doha, now that’s something to cheer about!
:D

[costalivin]

while we are on the subject of allowances...could the powers to be please explain to me why it is that GF pay double the school allowance to pilots whose children study abroad.?
So many of us here at GF cannot afford to supplement the school fees here in Bahrain and so to keep our heads above the water send our families off home to live, whereupon GF doubles the school fee allowances. This makes things easier for us financially but the emotional hardships of living thousands of miles away from the family is incalcable.
For the life of me I dont understand this logic. Why would GF make it easier for us to send our wife and kids abroad and then have to deal with the constant emotional strain of rarely seeing them and constantly worrying about them? Surely GF want happy, relaxed pilots in their cockpits.

[Bedouin]

Good News to whom? Latest Memo

Can’t upgrade, not enough FO’s to crew flights, so hire DEC, no type rated DEC available so Hire Non Endorsed DEC, now have to provide extra training on an already limited training resource to endorse DEC, so stop Training Captain Transfers. Training Captains resigning because they will not promote to other types “we haven’t enough training Captains”. So who will now train these non-endorse pilots? No upgrades for FO’s not enough Training Captains, so FO’s resigns and goes to other airlines that do, not enough FO’s to crew our flights so we can’t upgrade FO’s, see the trend?

This is an airline that is in severe troubles. You now have to question the Safety and Quality of this Flight Operation Department. We need mangers that will to break the pilot shortage cycle and promote Gulf Air as once again an airline with a career. If not the Standard of this Airline will cause another serious incident either finically or fatally.

To the Board of Gulf Air reputation can finically cripple an airline business if customers do not trust the Safety; they will go else where regardless of cost. As a pilot I am questioning the Quality of this Dept. The SAFETY of this airline is now under question.

Why is it so hard? Provide a career path for all and create job satisfaction for all and maybe you will save money with the reduction of Pilot resignations. Not to mention retention of experience staff and improved safety standard.

[knotaloud]

Bedouin,

Thanks for writing that about QR!

Seriously, Qatar Airways is in the EXACT same situation. We lose quality captains and, more importantly, long time quality first officers continuously because of the same lunatic policy.

Congratulations to Ethihad, Virgin, Dragonair, Netjets, Cathay and all the others who have taken QR and Gulf Air pilots who were obviously not appreciated by their respective companies.

When, if ever, will this stupidity cease?

[vfenext]

Reading between the lines BEDOUIN you are really saying if they give you a command then everything will change. Overnight the problem will go away and you will no longer have any reservations about safety or quality of management. Typical pilot talk. Fact is the 76 is a fleet with a dubious future in GF and until they make a decision to replace it or otherwise it will not get the same treatment as the rest of the fleet.

[Bedouin]

But the Airbus fleet is the same. Give all a career path FO to Capt to Trainining Capt to Examiners or A320 pilots to A330 or A340 pilots.

Vfe do you suggest that you are the only person who can fly in Gulf Air and no one else is good enough. All should be given the chance if they meet the requirements Airbus Boeing all Gulf Air pilots if not, throw out the upgrade and tranfer policy so all know.

This policy is there for a reason to maintain a standard just follow it a no one can complain.

That is typical pilot talk.

[Soft Altitude]

Spot on Bedouin, You just summarized nicely the situation, I would add the latest rumour I heard that some of the F/os who just got their A320 rating and came as non rated, would be soon in line for A330/A340 upgrade, which would make GF one of the most unique airlines in the world by upgrading inexperienced F/os especially on that type of airplane, before even their first bond started, 2 type ratings in less than a year, waow! Safety issue ? Likely to be one.
Now this looks like a pretty big one to me and I just hope it is a
r u m o u r.
Then really, since everything seems to be possible, why experienced F/Os with all the requirements and some time in the company could not be upgraded from right to left seat within the fleet? Like many other single type airlines do? Why this passage through wide body fleet before command upgrade ?
I apologize for being slightly off the initial thread, but Bedouin is raising a pretty current issue here.
Otherwise, back to the initial thread, yes, a significant improvement has to be done on the flight time or basic salary remuneration package, that would be really good news; If you fly low hours a month your salary goes very very low.

[vfenext]

BEDOUIN The seniority system in GF has been the same for a very long time. If anything things have improved slightly with the new HOFO, just look at bus fleet transfers. You must have known this is what it would be like when you joined, if you didn't then your research was lacking. Get in line and wait your turn like everyone else. With so many pilots GF is no differant to any other airline when it comes to promotion. 7 to 10 years to command is absolutely normal in a flag carrier. Patience is a virtue my friend. As for your suggestion I might be the only one who can fly in GF....are you in the pub by any chance?

[Bedouin]

That’s all I and many have asked they follow the seniority rules I have never stated anything else I have no idea what your problem is vfe next. I have not stated I should be upgraded or transferred ahead of any on that list nor has anyone else. Why do you take so offence when all I ask is they follow the policy they formulated in there manual so I can be transferred or upgraded in turn and not bypassed.

[Ray Darr]

Latest updated news re GF pay:

The said "substantial" pay increase will not be to the pay itself, except the previously promised 3% increase. There will be, however, an increase to some of the other non-basic-pay areas.

...It'll be better than nothing though.

[tic]

All of you need to maybe chill-out a bit.
GF is no better or no worse than any other in the Gulf.
My kids go to boarding school out of the country, AND they love it. Lets face it,the facilities are lacking for them in many ways re sport, where it is too hot to do anything but swimming, for a long period of the year. Actually the GF school allowance for kids away is almost 3 times better, than locally. In my case, I hope it doesn't change, but why it was done in the 1st place is beyond me.
Scott was on the aims the other day trying to explain the constant changes in rosters, which often makes life un-bearable for us, especially those of us with families. Rightly so, he explained it was due "sickness", and figures were shown. Really guys, are we professional or not? We are our own worst enemies, and it's high time we realised that. Any time you go "sick" for no real reason, you stuff some-one else up, and probably his family in the eye, but none of us care, do we? "As long as I'm all-right Jack", and we have the ordacity (SP) to blame it on rostering. I think not. Having said that, rostering is equally to blame, i.e. giving same routes time and time again. KTM is a case in point, where some of us are given 4 to 9 of them in one line. How does that work on a " computerised system". Or is it? I agree 767 gets the raw end of the deal ( ****ty routes), same same same meals, day in and day out, ( rather get an allowance and buy my own), but for most of us at GT, we get to live in DXB, despite the drive, and it is better than most places in the Gulf. Especially for families.
James Hogan may not be perfect, but no-one can deny, that GT has made an enourmous amount of money for this airline. His idea, and hats off to him for that.I believe we have all benefitted one way or the other.Yes all of us deserve a substantial increase, and to be truthfull ,all of us deserve it. ( Those of us that are loyal anyway) Most of us want to stay and see the airline prosper big time, but it won't happen if we act like children, will it?
Said enough and waiting for the baiting comments, but the truth hurts.
tic

[JoeJack]

Just to add some info on the yesterday's memo about training and recruitment stuff... RH mentions about experienced A320 pilots being hired for Direct-Entry F/Os on A330 Fleet. Fair enough, but seems like only 2 of the 4 new guys on A330 have previous Airbus FBW experience... the other 2 are regular Non-Type Rated guys... Come on! They're already bypassing people and not satisfied also bull****ting them?? How does RH expect the A320 guys to stay doing things like this one??

Looking forward for the increase on the package...:ok:

Cheers

[ironbutt57]

The reason for KTM is a lack of crew qualified for it..and why?...One reason "selective sickness" people go sick for the sim, and therefore don't get qualified.....then complain when sickness is taken into account during command considerations...I personally am happy to see that happening....

[costalivin]

Tic - It is great that your kids are happy at school away from your base however this would not suit all children and I for one do not want to be forced to send my family to live on the other side of the world simply for financial reasons.
Here are some solutions to the GF unrealistic school fee allowance which currently covers only 1/3 of the actual fees

1. Increase all school fees allowance to a realistic level irrelevant of whether your kids are in Bah or at school abroad

2. Since GF has a seat on the Board of Gov of a well know Bah school, negotiate a reduction in the school fees for GF crew

3.Reward long service with the company-- the longer you stay the bigger the school fee allowance you receive

4. I'm sure Mr H and his team could come up with some even more ingenious ways to deal with this issue. Get brainstorming guys!

We can put up with the repetitive routes and meals, the long hours, the illogical rostering etc but I for one do not want to drag myself back home after a long flight to an empty house.

A HAPPY PILOT IS A SAFE PILOT

[Basic Theory]

Costalivin,

This schooling policy is a left over from the good old overseas days when schooling facilities did not exist in this part of the world. Since then most international companies have updated there policies, but I think some are stuck in a convenient self inflicted time warp!:rolleyes:

[PayRaisePlease]

I was very disappointed to see that letter coming from Scott on Aims about ``suspicious sickness``. There are some reasons why the rate of sickness has gone up lately. The Canadians are trying to make the utilisation of crews and aircrafts as efficient as possible and I think we've seen a change since they joined. But they are forgetting something extremely important: human factor. I see 2 reasons that Scott should have thought of before sending that, HA, non-management skills, type of letter (please pilots, don't call sick because it is wrong):

1- The mixing of day flying and night flying on several consecutive days is a killer. I've seen rosters like this last month:

Day1:BAH-KWI-BAH-DXB-BAH
Day2:BAH-BKK-KUL
Day3:KUL-BKK-BAH
Day4:BAH-BOM-BAH
Day5:BAH-BOM-BAH
Day6:BAH-BOM-BAH
Day7:BAH-BKK-KUL
Day8:KUL-BKK-BAH

This was rostered without any days off or non-ops days in between. Just rest averaging between 12 and 24 hrs between each days. This is the worst, transferring from day to night flying ang vice versa with 24 hrs rest. How can you expect someone to stay alert and healthy with such an 11 days stretch. If the rest of the month is OFF you have time to rest but it is not the case in GF. 8 days OFF max per calendar month and this, even if you are over 75hrs. They will fill the blank spots with standbys.

2- The lack of preferential bidding

Solution:

1- Organize the rosters in a fashion that we fly the same amount of monthly hours but with more days to rest. I mean creating more productive blocks. This should come naturally with giving more than 8 days OFF a month when the 75hrs flying limit is reached. That means no standby days on a overtimed rosters. I understand this solution may be difficult to achieve considering our destinations network but there is definitely space for improvement.

2- Preferential bidding system. Some guys want to spend the most of their time down route (everybody have their preferences), somes guys want to be home with the family as much as possible. By exemple, give me that BAH-BKK-KUL (23hrs rest) KUL-BKK-BAH block 5 times in the months and I will be the happiest pilots on earth. Give it to half of the guys I know and they will be sad and more subject to call in sick. Bottom of the line, make pilots happy by allowing them to choose the flight they find suitable for their lifestyle and your rate of sickness will go down. That ``Come on guys, stop calling in sick because it is bad`` wont work for sure.


Conclusion:

Your rate of sickness will remain the same as long as you make your pilots fly above 75 hrs a month with 8 days OFF only AND without allowing them to fly the blocks they prefer. This is basic management. Making more productive blocks doesn't imply exhorbiting cost and a preferential biding system would be a good investment. There is a limit when you cannot press the lemon anymore and GF have just reached it. We are human and are responsible for several hundred lives a day. We need to be in a good physical and mental state when we drive those airplanes. Even if I don't cough or don't have a fever. that doesn't meen I am fit to fly an airplane. Flying 90 hrs per month (alternating between day and night flying) with 8 days OFF only is definitely the stall buffet. Scott, dont try to make us pull more on the stick. That message via AIMS and email by the management is totally irresponsible and borderline for air safety (pseudo threat for the sick callers). Just put the human factor issue in your scope and rethink the way you want to solve the sickness problem. I really think the new guys in Crew Planning have been doing a great job so far put they need our input at this time so they can keep on the right track.

[vfenext]

Excellent post! Of course it's possible to roster more friendly blocks but the will does not seem to be there.

[Tachi]

well said payriseplease ...there is no human consideration at all in the rostering planning .people are rostered in the same way a/c are rostered . thats a shame!!!! Wake up rostering planning its about people and their physiology , try Human Perfomance and Limitations for rostering personnel.
BTW thanks for the payrise.......:ok:

[tic]

Ironbutts and Costaliving

IB 57, I agree with you, we should ALL be qualified and current for KTM.( we all know there is a training problem ). Problem is when Monsoon is on, and ALL of us that go there, know what it can be like. Personal experience, when on stby during that period of the year, 9 times out of 10, you get called, and you guessed it, KTM. The person who has gone "sick" has checked the satellite wx in glorious colour, and any hint of red or magenta, he suddenly goes green at the gills, and is immediately on the telephone.!!!!: " give it to some other sucker" " give me a nice little MCT instead".

Costaliving
Excellent suggestions re the schooling. That would go a long long way in helping to keep pilots here, if you have kids.

Another thing, is all the rumours going round. IS GT going to operate as it is for the for-seeable future?, out of AUH, or not? I think we all want an answer from the powers that be. Yes or No.
Don't know about you bods, but I want some stability, so I can at least attempt to plan for my future. I'm not into hit and miss, and maybe this and maybe that. Come on GF, tell us.

tic

[billy34-kit]

.................ok, Bonus, new packages, raises, new allowances!!!!
Still waiting, for the moment ! It's only a rumor heuh?

[scanscanscan]

Hi Billy... Good to see you are still around.
Last year you posted on here news about your on going Back Pay dispute with GF.
Was this sorted out to your satisfaction or did you have to give up on it?
If GF did sort it all out for you eventually after you went public in desperation then the fact GF did pay what you were due should be recorded in the interests of fairness to GF and as a guide to any other crew in a similar situation.
Communication with staff was always a growing problem at GF after the unions and pilot welfare officer were both closed down in 1976.
Cheers scan