View Full Version : Maintaining the Tristar
nosefirsteverytime
1st Mar 2005, 13:28
Taken from this thread: (http://www.pprune.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=70577)
Why don't you start a similar thread on the Engineers forum called "Maintaining the Tristar" then sit back and watch some grown men cry.
Was it really that bad?
spanners
1st Mar 2005, 18:49
Do you really want to see tears then?
Let the floods commence.:{
It was one of the worst aircraft to maintain that I have personally worked on, and that includes Concorde which was quite difficult!
Jobs like Slat PDU changes (:{ ), and HP duct connection after an engine,( :{ )change were some of the more 'juicy' jobs.
As for the avionics guys, just mention gold wires!:{
etc etc
Regards
:uhoh:
primreamer
2nd Mar 2005, 11:21
The description by spanners of some Tristar jobs as "juicy" is one of the more polite terms I've heard. I could add a couple more, mixer-ejector changes or replacing a pack valve in the sweatbox that was the MESC on a summers day. That said one of the main reasons that the L1011 was reviled in such a big way was that it was just "different". It took a bit of getting used to but once you got the hang of it wasn't too bad. FRM's and FIM's, used properly, were a big help and some of the system BITE equipment was OK too ( what was that thing called for tracking down overheat loop problems along the pneumatic ducts? Lockheed raved about it but I never saw anyone ever using it, forgotten the name now). The early aircraft lacked performance and range but later versions, the -200, -250, and -500 were pretty good aeroplanes. Flight deck had loads of room and was well laid out, passengers liked it for the wide airy cabin.
spanners
2nd Mar 2005, 19:20
OOps, I forgot to mention the time when I found the FCES computer actually covered in feces.
:p
That was a bag of laughs. (Fwd Toilet waste duct, to the waste tank had sheared above the radio rack)
:ok:
Regds
Oh, come now...it surely wasn't that bad.:\
Well for some, it surely was.
For others, who were sent to the head shed (Lockheed, Palmdale) and had the factory course, it 'appeared' to be a breeze.
I remember one guy in DHA many years ago. A full-blooded Cherokee Indian he was, who absolutely would go ape-s..t if the FIRM code wasn't used (and so he should have, IMO) but nevertheless had his 'little black book' (notes from that previously mentioned factory course...not girlie phone numbers:uhoh:) wherein when you arrived on stand with a defect, would promptly consult said black book, and pronounce a fix...that would always work, every darn time.
Quick turns were his speciality.
An absolute jewel of an engineering guy, and worth every $ he was paid...and it was plenty in the 'old' days.
Oh yes, forgot to mention.
In JED this same airline had a Thai national, named Noi (small, in Thai I believe) whose speciality was changing out ACM components...small guys with very long arms apparently needed) and was paid accordingly...always smiling at his bank book.
These were brand new aeroplanes then, and the dispatch reliability was 98%....minimum.
Goes to show, if you have enough dough....anything can work.:ok:
From a pilots' perspective....nothing finer, period.
Lockheed done it right!:)
Perrin
3rd Mar 2005, 14:56
#As I have said before on this site the replacement of a cracked
fwd toliet tank wait for it in the summer day time in Riyadh now that brought the time down. Will never forget the smell almost like the honey tankers that used to drive around the streets of Riyadh.
Captain Rat
4th Mar 2005, 16:38
Talking of the toilet system, seem to remember it was a funny arangement where each toilet flush motor flushed in turn and presurised the line, then the relevant flush valve opened to the toilet being used. The term 'blue rinse' springs to mind when working on a toilet and someone flushes any of the others in the complex....just try getting out of a cubicle in a hurry....!
the hydraulic bay was a great idea, ie putting a lot of the HYD components in there, shame they then put a hot APU air duct through it.
Lower galley...great for staff travel (not officialy of course) far more fun down there during the flight, helping the girls etc....
spanners
5th Mar 2005, 18:10
Mmmmmmm, toilet tank in the heat, nice. Makes me want to go and do one again . :{
I remember one particular honeycart driver who used his own GS to break the blue ice on the bog panel. On one occasion he did so, and then placed the GS in his mouth as he carried out his usual task. Nice. Fingernails were a big 'blue' as well.
Bon apetit.
(PS sorry for going off the thread of the topic.)
matkat
6th Mar 2005, 11:55
Worked as a flight mechanic for American Trans Air for a while great job great people but maintinaing the aircraft was a nightmare but to be honest it was very reliable only AOG twice in 6 months and for the same thing(leaking Hyd.line from no.2 eng)
Carl Kendrick
15th Mar 2005, 00:58
I currently work on Tristar at RAF Brize Norton's 216 Sqn
I am fairly lucky with some of the snags I get as a Lecky, but i know the Heavy Trades do get some bitch snags.
max motor
15th Mar 2005, 17:14
I currently work on Tristar at RAF Brize Norton's 216 Sqn
That takes me back a few years!
I seem to remember the Leckies spent most of their time playing with HDU's
At least in the civil world we didn't have them to contend with, or palletised seats and galleys, CCTV systems, main deck cargo doors or anything else added at Cambridge!
Max
PS Spanners, the pooey incident wasn't at LGW was it! I remember a similar case courtesy of a Greek cleaner who try to clean a blockage by ramming a broom down it. Net result returning pax (all economy charter) deposited last night Mezes straight into the FESC
Le Pen
16th Mar 2005, 08:45
Blimey....
411A posting on our threads.......... Was expecting a bit of a fight!! :}
Remember doing a No2 IDG change in the rain.... Horrid airplane!
Actually theres one parked over at the other terminal..... thats about as close as I wand to get now!:ok:
LP
allthatglitters
16th Mar 2005, 19:03
A much maligned aircraft, normally slagged off by people who were brought up on Mr. Boeings products. But personally, it was a dream to work on, for several years almost every working hour spent either working on them or waiting for them. (BA, Saudia, Gulf Air, Cathay Pacific, Dragon Air, BWIA, Air Canada, Air Lanka, Caladonian, Royal Jordanian, LTU). Spent some time on the RAF Brize Norton's 216 Sqn, in their early forces service, prior to there big mod programmes.
"jobs like Slat PDU changes" being rained on by dripping hyd fluid.
"HP duct connection after an engine", on a good day would fall on in no time, a right bxxxxxd in the early days, but new clamps sorted that out.
"mixer-ejector changes" a samll challange, especially #2, working high above the #2 engine.
" or replacing a pack valve"
"what was that thing called for tracking down overheat loop problems along the pneumatic ducts" Something to do with Fenwal springs to mind
The number 2 engine change, using the bootstrap equipment, cradle up, cradle plus engine down, cradle plus engine up, cradle down, what a joy when the overhead crane and sling was operational.
Regular problem was a down route station unblocking the aft toilets with a broom handle, puncturing the elbow below the throne, everytime the toilet was used the residue was washed onto the aft pressure bulkhead, under C3 bulk cargo compt, then under the C2 floors, for the 8 hour return trip. Just finished the clean up on one and another draged in, exactly the same.
Rebuilding the thrust reverser system after a cable break, blocker door problem or air motor change, shear delight.
Boroscoping the engines, lying on your back a/c out in the open, high above the ground.
spanners
16th Mar 2005, 19:39
Hi, max motor
Toilet tank incident was at LGW. There was also a subsequent incident, where the toilet tank itself (fwd), was leaking and required removal.
:{
Caravelle
26th Mar 2005, 13:04
Hello Everyone.
TAP ME still maintains the tristar and I tell you that every single time one of them is scheduled for a check it brings out "the best" in people.
Example:
a: Hey, the tristar is due for an A check.
b: The tristar ??!! These :mad: planes should have been :mad: retired. :mad: hell.
www.tapme.pt - TAP Maintenance & Engineering
Certainly no 'fight' from yours truly, LePen.
The ground engineering staff all made it happen, for those of us lucky enough to be at the pointy end.
In fact, us 'pilots' might even lend a hand at times.
Example, from about two months ago.
#3 engine oil pressure light on the CAWP unserviceable, bulbs replaced, no help, and does't test either.
I suggested...
Why not clean the contacts on the relevant ILCB in the FESC?...handing the GE a soft pencil eraser.
He does so...and voila, it works.
Whatever would these folks do without 'help' from the FD crew?:uhoh: :E
Denzil
27th Mar 2005, 16:47
The true "Queen of the Sky". There will always be work for engineers with the TriStar knocking about. Is the A330/340 a modern replacement????
Wasn't there once a missing oil story on those LGW based aircraft! Over high mountains, full of punters & all 3 engine oil qty low!!!!!! Sounds like the basis of Airport 92, did Joe Petroni work at LGW too!!!
BobTheRocker
2nd Apr 2005, 10:38
Ah! Denzil you are still alive then, thought Fatherhood might have dampened your sense of humour!
Nopax,thanx
2nd Apr 2005, 19:49
Not a 1011 mech myself, although I did a bit at Marshalls in the 80's, but one of my favourite stories came from an ex-GF man who was telling me about a Tristar that had just come off heavy maintenance and had been test flown...the general manager was in his office, scribbling away on a sheet of paper;
"Whatcha doin?"
"Filling out the 'boom' sheet."
"Boom sheet?" (abject terror, thinking that someone was about the get the chop for some grave error)
"Yep, the boom sheet." He went on to explain that in the war, when Lockheed were turning out P-38's by the thousand, after each test flight a sheet would be filled out with any defects noted on the test flight, then it was taped onto one of the aircraft's twin tail booms, hence the name; and it had remained in Lockheed terminology ever since!
Denzil
6th Apr 2005, 17:40
How could fatherhood ruin a sense of humour!! Sleepless nights, up to your eyes in poo, endless crying, etc, etc it's just like a nightshift on the line!!!!!
Sent you a PM BtheR.
Spent many happy years fixing the Queens own Tristars. An avionics gem if you like your autopilots with fingers in everyones pies.
8 years tanking for the Bosnian campaign, and 99.9% despatch reliability. Not bad...
Engines that don't need a ground run post change. And don't make you deaf as they pass.
Multiplex systems for getting muzac to the pax, which did wierd things when you unplugged bits.
Bongs that would go off on the approach for no reason, and could not be turned off.
Flight data recorders that proved the pilots were downright liars on more than one occasion. And saved you changing engines every three weeks.
APU's everyone could fire up to get the inside toasty or chilled as required. And a galley for 24 hour coffee.
A FESC and MESC the riggers didn't understand and rarely visited.
Wierd powered doors you had to have power on to close.
A HSC the fairies hated and avoided like the plague.
An SLB half way up the damn tail.
Linear Variable Differential Transformers. Don't think I'll ever forget that bizzarre description.
Camera control units squeezed between the HDU and the side wall. And camera's an eith of an inch shorter than the dome they live in.
Ah, sweet memories...
max motor
10th Apr 2005, 15:54
Engines that don't need a ground run post change. ??????
Max
Denzil
10th Apr 2005, 17:19
"A FESC and MESC the riggers didn't understand and rarely visited." Must have been lazy riggers and how did they change PFCVs without going through the MESC????? As an A & C man i'd rather not be in either though, especially removing a fwd waste tank!!!!
Out of interest what AMM allows an engine change with no runs, i'm sure the RB211 AMM on the TriStar would have listed some of the engine tests?? Even a modern FADEC engine would have an idle leak check!!!
They just do a check start, and turn it off again IIRC. Let the electronics monitor the rest.