Decisions, decisions...

[stupendousman]

Hi there all fellow wanabees...

Wanted a quick opinions pol from those of you out there... I am (eventually) in a rather enviable position whereby I have just been accepted into the RAF as Pilot:E, But (heart-break I know), have just found myself in the phase 3 stage of the CTC Wings Programme aswell... Basically, what happens if I get offered them both? what do I accept? on the one hand have the opportunity to maybe fly the Typhoon (Top Gun!), but on the other, about the biggest leg into civil aviation there is at the moment...:ugh:

I know its a hell of a lot better than what it could be, but a decision has to be and, and it is a hard one (at the end of the day i suppose its all good), so any opinions would be appreciated (some ignored).

stupendousman.:ok:

[Mobster lover]

Go to the RAF. I can't understand why you are even contemplating anything else? You'll have the time of your life and when you come out there'll be plenty of opportunities.

How many chances do you get to be a RAF pilot? Any tom,dick or harry can do the commercial exams.

Just make sure you get through the training.

[YYZ]

Don't know about the Tom, Dick or Harry comment, but I do agree with the RAF comments.
You're going to have a wider choice and "fun flying" whilst with the RAF, you can go commercial after?

Plus it's one less for me to pass on my way to glory:}

[stupendousman]

Tend to agree with both of you, but girlfriend thinks differently:{

YYZ, are you through to phase 3 with Wings aswell?

[18greens]

Girlfriend?????

What has she got to do with this decision!!!

Join the RAF, fly big pointy things have an absolute ball, become an airline pilot later. You'll be beating off girls with a sh*** st***.

Better still, accept both but ask CTC to delay your application (desire to go around the world etc.. they will respect that). If plan A (RAF) goes badly plan B (airlines) is still there.

You lucky lucky lucky lucky......

[Re-Heat]

1) What are the home priorities? Is she a career girl who needs to be based in London or something like a teacher who doesn't?

2) Why did you apply to the RAF in the first place? If you aren't committed enough, you may end up moaning about the whole system rather than enjoying it for the flying you get.

3) CTC - do you want to fly punters shorthaul on a reduced salary for 7 years or have the opportunity to fly fast and low? Do you want the hours built up and vast experience young as a lo-co FO then young Captain?

We can't answer your questions. You need to do that for yourself.

[Pilot Pete]

stupendousman

You have to ask yourself what you actually want in life. You are indeed in a very enviable position with one of those 'pleasant' choices to make. I would have thought that you would know instinctively what you actually want and no amount of posting on a forum like this would actually change that.

So, do you want to have the opportunity to fly the Typhoon? If yes, then only the RAF is going to provide that, but, you still have to take a 'risk', as I am sure it will be only the 'best of the best' who get that opportunity. What if you don't qualify for the Typhoon? Would you be prepared to accept any other aircraft, fixed or rotary? You really need to want to be a military pilot above all else, rather than just want to fly the Typhoon.........

What happens if you go operational in the forces and then face active service? I presume you have thought all that through? It comes with the territory unfortunately. Perhaps this is the nagging worry of your partner? You also have to ask yourself about how strong your relationship is because a military career will certainly test that. A civil career will too, but not usually quite to the same extent.

So, going back to what you actually want, if it's to fly airliners then you can certainly do that after a successful military career, but there are plenty of variables that come into the equation; how long are you going to sign up to the military for? What happens if the civil market is depressed when you are due to come out? Do you plan on getting married and having kids in the next 5 years? Ten years? Do you want your family to live a nomadic life following you around the world or would you prefer to find your own base and pretty much stay there? There are many, many things that you should be asking yourself (and your family) which will help you decide what you want to do. But like I said at the start, I would have thought you already actually knew what you wanted and are just looking for some backup for your choice...........................!

All the best.

PP

[timzsta]

You have been ACCEPTED into the RAF. They will PAY FOR ALL YOUR TRAINING. By the time you come to leave the RAF the rules may well be such you need not pay a penny to get an ATPL and will be able to pick and choose what airline you work for.

All CTC are offering you is the next stage of assessment, which you may or may not pass.

Even if it doesn't work out in the RAF, you will have undoubtebly acrued enough flying hours to significantly reduce the cost of funding an ATPL.

The girlfriend just doesn't come into the equation. There will be plenty more girlfriends, but you may only get one opportunity at this aviation lark.

[flybe.com]

I agree entirely with timzsta. I do not know your girlfriend, the strength of relationship, or your ages, but think about how you may feel in 12 months time if you've turned down one of the best (if not THE best) aviation training systems in the world, and the girlfriend you did it for has moved on. Obviously there are wider issues to consider as Pilot Pete pointed out, but essentially it's a no-brainer, the girlfriend shouldn't play even a miniscule part in your decision-making process.

There are millions of girls in the world, yet potentially only one career, go figure.:ok:

[BigGrecian]

Try posting this in the mil forum and see what response you get! Having attempted flying training in the RAF and unfortuantely not finishing and just leaving to join the civvy world I would say join the RAF! If it doesn't work out then you can cross that bridge when you get there..

[rjay259]

Stu,

Having a few friends in the RAF they all love it, knowing first hand the life they are able to lead you will have a fantastic time, the problem comes from IOT, there are several binning days, which you will see lots of new friends being asked to leave.

Getting onto Initial training is one thing, compleating is another. Once you graduate then there is flight training and that may not start for at least six months after, then after basic flight training there is streaming, fixed wing, fast or cargo, rotary, merlins or chinnoks. They are all things you might not have a choice in.

As was said before keep both options open for as long as you can. But there is nothing like flying above the speed of sound.

Good luck in whatever choice you make.

259

[YYZ]

18greens When did stick become a rude word:rolleyes:

Also stupendousman Not in with CTC at all, to old, I meant the hunt for glory for the first "real" job:}

Please don't throw away a potentially great career over a girlfriend! People would kill to be in your position, if she cares for you she should support you decision.

YYZ

[Andy_R]

I have spent the last week flying with both current and ex-RAF pilots. They show exceptional discipline and skill and all their training has been paid for by Her Majestys Government, not out of their own pockets.

I am not saying that there are not highly skilled commercial pilots, but commercial training has its limits. A fast jet pilot gets the best, money no object. This also applies if you end up training to fly Hercules or any other 'craft in the forces.

The flying is fun and widely respected, so that when you do come back to the civilian world you have something to offer a potential employer, rather than just being a risk.

Re the girlfriend : am lucky, I have the most supportive partner who would go anywhere if it meant I was flying. Whether it is because she knows I would go anyway I am not sure :p But then if you don't have that sort of passion and dedication you are unlikely to succeed, girlfriend or not. I once made a career decision based on the relationship I was in and I will never make that mistake again. Sorry, you just have to be selfish (being older and more scarred just makes it an easier decision!!).

[mumbo]

BIN THE CHICK, DO THE RAF!!!!

In the forces, as a young gun, you will have time and opportunity to use your p##is as an area weapon. The other bonus, the flying will be great.

May the wind at your back never be your own.

Mumbo:ok:

[Mooney12]

Firstly, your only at stage 3 of CTC, this is no way means you have got it. I think its something like 40% pass stage 3 and then the sim comes after that. So firstly wait and see if you actually get it. This decision may be made for you.

I have to say though, well done for getting into the RAF at this time when they are recruiting hardly any pilots, as my local armed forces careers officer told me they are in a "dire" state at the moment and recruiting only 15 or so pilots for this entire year!

Well done for that, there are many that would want to be in that position I can tell you.

I was in a slightly similar postion to you. I had concurrent applications in with the RAF and CTC. Passed the first interview with the RAF and had my papers sent down to Cranwell were they offered me an OASC date. Obviously being a public service this all took months and months and my OASC date was months away.

In the meantime I passed CTC and took it without a thought, rang the RAF up and chopped it.

Thing is, the RAF is a lot different than it used to be, with a lot of inherent risks in it. I know a number of my ex UAS friends who are unhappy at the moment.

IOT lasts 6 months followed by a hold and then the EFT phase, after that you'll get streamed and you will also hold, perhaps for up to 2 years. You will then go onto your next stage of training, being optimistic say you got fast jet. You will go to Linton, where a lot of people are getting chopped. Indeed a third of Linton pilots were chopped FJ last year due to reducing fast jet requirement. If you pass Linton you face another hold, say 18 months. Then onto Valley and the Hawk. Again a difficult course with plenty of people chopped. If you pass you then go to an OCU, say for the Harrier, another hold of say a year inbetween. A lot chopped at this stage also.

Worst of all is that if you get chopped at any stage now, you are not restreamed but offered a ground branch job - say goodbye to your pilot dream

The main factor that put me off was the amount of holding going on. You would even have to wait up to a year to get into IOT. I simply dont want to waste years holding at some RAF station in the middle of nowhere. Moving house every three years didnt appeal either, neither did the minimum 16 year commitment!

So its not as simple as "join the RAF and fly fast and low", its a very complicated, lengthy and difficult process. However if you get through it all and end up on the Eurofighter, well Im sure it would have all been worth it... wait and see how CTC goes first though!

[Tigers]

Go for the RAF. Not only will you get exceptional training on well maintained aircraft you will learn to be a lot more confident and professional.
Even if you get chopped before your wings at least you have had the best grounding in aviation training.
Plus JEFTS is good fun, great aerobatics in the Firefly.

[BigGrecian]

Mooney12 I appreciate your point of view - but at the end of the day the UAS isn't the real air force. Also people may not be as happy as they could be - but they're still in the RAF having a great lifestyle.

Basically choose between the RAF - a way of life
or CTC - which is a job and way of a life but doesn't touch the RAF lifestyle.

[Dan Winterland]

The RAF will give you the best flying, the best social life and the best fun you'll ever have in your whole life. I did 18 years as an RAF pilot before joining the airlines and don't regret it at all. I always enjoyed the flying and the times I had were the best.

However, there are some snags. The RAF will put you back if your aim is to complete your career in the civil world (and you probably will as you won't get wealthy flying until age 55 in the RAF). As an FO in my 40's, I'm a good 10 years behind my purely civilain colleagues. Also, if you get married while in the RAF, the lifestyle does put quite a bit of stress on the family. Also, there is a lot of pressure on you while in the RAF training system. During IOT, you will wish you hadn't joined. It's a real pain, but grin and bear it - the end result is worthwhile. Also, the failure rates in flying training are higher than the civil world. Also, you will have to do a lot of other duties in addition to flying, but some of these can be fun and do add a bit of variety.

On the other hand, you are going to be bored a lot sooner flying your Orange 737 around Europe and although you probably can't think of a better job at the moment, once you've been doing it a few years - the glamour wears off. I can't think of one trip I flew in the RAF which I would rather have not done.