Hawk canopies

[EasySqueezy]

I hear that the Hawks at NFTC can taxi and engine start with the canopy open. Why don't they do this at Valley?

[caspertheghost]

Because it's always raining at Valley.

[Carnage]

I believe it is an engineering/fatigue/FOD issue regards the canopy hinges.

Good point casper!:p

[High_Expect]

Its because the Hawk and people in Canada are cooler!!!


points, questions?!?

[BEagle]

Because years and years ago some time before 1980, some idiot senior ossifer had his gold braided hat somewhere in the back where it wasn't supposed to be stowed, and when the groundies lowered the canopy his hat caught the MDC firing thingy - which worked as advertised.

Ever since then, the groundies were taught to lower the canopy most of the way, then turn away. Pilots were supposed to close their eyes as they closed the canopy fully...then remove and stow the seat pins for the groundies to see.

Do you still do that - just because some Air Vice Worthless didn't stow his hat properly?

Silly idea to taxi with the canopy open - though doubtless it has added Maverick value. Because it denies you the use of the zero-zero seat if there's a suddne intense fire on start up or during taxy.

[High_Expect]

I thought it was something to do with a set of golf clubs?!?

[EasySqueezy]

If a fire occurs during engine start you can safely evacuate the aircraft with the canopy open during start-up - rather than endangering yourself with the black and yellow handle and causing lots of damage to the groundies and other aircraft on the ramp

I know what I'd rather do!

[High_Expect]

yeah, but......it could also be that having the canopy closed right up until the point you are ready to vacate the A/C ie. unstrapped, disconnected may prevent smoke/fire entering the cockpit whilst you do this. Using the yellow and back during start would have to be a Very Extreme case.

[Speed Twelve]

High Expect,

That wouldn't be a red set of golf clubs, would it ?!?

[EasySqueezy]

Correct me if I'm wrong - surely one would want to be strapped in and connected before starting the engine? Would be a bit awkward afterwards. You'd probably only get smoke and fumes from the engine in a tailwind.

[5 Forward 6 Back]

Speed Twelve; yup!

[High_Expect]

ES..... My point exactly. So if you are strapped in and connected then its going to take time to un-strap and disconnect why not do that with the canopy closed offering at least some protection. Allowing that the emergency is probably not going to require you to eject.
And if it is closed why not leave the pins in until a point that ejection is going to be more likely than an ground egress.

Speed Twelve.... It might have been. ps. like the nickname.

[BEagle]

The incident pre-dated the Reds conversion to the Hawk, I believe. In fact, it was probably still called the HS1182...

If the canopy isn't fully locked, the black and yellow option simply isn't available - so it'd be unstrap (careful you don't snag the bang seat handles as the pins will be out), open up the hood and over the side. Using the foot steps if you can find them - or the boarding step if you're lucky. Try jumping out on to the ground and you could well sprain your ankle and end up underneath a burning jet. HM paid a lot to give you a zero-zero bang seat - so at least keep the option open!

No clear reason NOT to be properly strapped in with the hood closed and locked prior to start; sorry if it lacks 'cool' factor but hey, it's only a weeny trainer.

For proper pose potential, one smiled at the perimeter fence spotters after selecting the canopy motor to 'shut' in one's Hunter; then mask on, a casual wave as the hood motored itself forward, onto the runway, 3600 rpm, stir the controls to check the hydroboosters, followed by full poke from the mighty Avon-200, off and away up into the WBY!

[Gainesy]

I thought it was something to do with a set of golf clubs?!?

... as we waited and waited and waited etc in Leningrad. The Sov mates were more amused than the AOC though. It could have been a real cliff hanger. Only one golf course in Mother Russia at the time and it was about 2,000km off track.

Coo, remember "Fun Captions?"

Thought not.:(

[nurjio]

For the record, it wasn't a set of golf clubs, it was a 7-iron...

I think I remain, to this day, the only RAF Officer to have received a formal AOC's warning behind the Iron Curtain (he wore leather by the way) - he went on as follows:

..."if it had been a wedge old son, you would have got away with it. In the mean time, you are just a f**king idiot, and that is going on your record".

The AOC then chose to fly with me (in the spare) in a subsequent display. Hurrah, forgiven.:}

Nurj

[Black 'n Yellar]

The talk of taxying with the canopy open reminds me of a famous SHAR dit. A newly promoted Commander was off to visit his troops somewhere and was very keen to take his cap with shiny gold braid on it. As the SHAR is not known for its generously sized cockpit, he wedged it on top of the instrument console. Whilst taxying in after the flight he opened the canopy for some fresh air and saw his cap disappear from the cockpit and down his engine intake! New cap and new engine please.

[BEagle]

"For the record, it wasn't a set of golf clubs, it was a 7-iron... "

Which only goes to show that the opinion about golf shared by Mark Twain, Jeremy Clarkson and myself is perhaps correct!

[ROUND TUIT]

Some of the export Hawks to warmer climes had a mod to enable the aircraft to taxi with the roof open. Quite refreshing sometimes but also a bit surreal.

[Background Noise]

To get back to the original question:-

The canopy seal in the T1 inflates, using air from the running engine, when the canopy handle is locked (locked shut, locked open, locked halfway - whatever).

Export Hawks have a mod to allow the canopies to be open with the engine running.

[L Peacock]

Beagle
No clear reason NOT to be properly strapped in with the hood closed and locked prior to start; sorry if it lacks 'cool' factor but hey, it's only a weeny trainer. Would you apply this to gingers carrying out ground runs? Would require a significant change to current pratices.
Has anyone ever delibertely ejected from a jet still on the chocks?