Where are the female pilots ?

[huntnhound]

Okay...I know I`m cannon fodder..

Are there any Female pilots in the Police/medic aviation world at all?
Is it the the forces in the UK dont encourage them to fly from the ranks, or is it more the case they slip into the commercial fixed wing world with greater ease on retirement and renumeration?
or are they just better pilots???
Or is it just a male only thing?

[volrider]

HH a valid point..
In this day an age of equality I can't understand why we don't see female pilots. Lets face it in the world of aviation women have important role to play, any one dealing with ATC will often be greeted by a female voice, likewise numerous airlines employ women pilots and have done for some time.
So why are the Emergency services a male dominated bastion?
I would welcome the opportunity to work alongside a pilot of the female gender:ok:

[Whirlybird]

Am I right in thinking that the police and similar only take pilots with several thousand hours?

And I believe the military didn't start taking women as pilots until the early 1990s.

If my numbers and dates are right, there's your answer...just give it time.

Had I been born 20 yearsa later, I'd love to have done that sort of work/flying.

However, women are under-represented in aviation overall anyway. No-one seems to have any clear idea why. :confused:

[Thud_and_Blunder]

Hmm - food for thought.

Perhaps then you could get around the problem of "who'll make the tea while you're refuelling", not to mention the big Sunday breakfasts. Perhaps a female pilot would be :sad:appropriiate:sad: (damn, he got me) company for the 2 Fat Ladies she'd be carting around?!

Btw HnH, you misspelt "provoking" on the other thread - I knew you'd want me to point that out...

(before anyone gets upset over gender bias and other undesirable parts of this post, I'd just like to point out that I might just have had the slightest passing acquaintance with one, both or all of these stirring - sorry, should that be Sterling - geezers)

:cool: :ok:

Oh, and Whirly - you\'re quite right; only the finest of the God-like 2-winged Ubermensch can be considered fit to fly in this job... :yuk:

...or perhaps not...

[huntnhound]

Thud and blunder


Stones......glass houses..

"......appropriiate....."

But its true there are none...are there?

[Av8r]

If God meant women to fly, the sky would be pink, not blue.

(Should I of said that?)
:uhoh:

[Spunk]

OK, let's see. In Germany there is at least one CR female pilot flying in the Army, one or two are actually flying for the German border patrol, the local police department in Hamburg just finished training its first female pilot and I know at least 3 commercial female helicopter pilots flying in Germany.

Personally I think that will do for the "female quota", the statutory woman I think it's called. :D

It's not that I don't want women to fly helicopter but I hate to see that some people change the term of "sexual equality" into "sexual privileges". :E

[volrider]

I think that quotes like Perhaps then you could get around the problem of "who'll make the tea while you're refuelling", not to mention the big Sunday breakfasts.
are highly inappropriate in this day and age.We all know that Men make the best cooks and also the best cup of Tea..:E
I just think it may be nice to fly with a pilot who smelt better:cool:
Mind you I would get bored flying round the shops and who will park it when we land!!!

[CajunAl]

They are working in the GOM with several operators, If qualified The operators take them all Lucky us

[Whirlygig]

Gimme time boys, gimme time - I'm on me way up!! But, having missed the boat with the services, I'm doin' it the hard way.

Cheers

Whirlygig

[leginheli]

Just out of interest the South African Airforce have several female chopper pilots and the EMS operator STAR helicopters has a female pilot operating an EC135. There was also an ENG female pilot for the local TV SABC but I think she has moved on.

[huntnhound]

Mmmmmm!


So some ladies worldwide....but none apparently in the UK:hmm:

[goaround7]

Very interesting to hear European side of this. In South Africa, although white women still fall technically into the Affirmative Action category they are definitely not getting an easy time of it. Non airlines are the last haven for white male pilots and often they don't want to help females who they see as getting preferential treatment from the government and labour laws, especially if they could put themselves out of a job. Not to mention 'empty kitchen' syndrome amongst the older, ex Air Force and not quite so politically correct, old school senior pilots.

I know a couple of South African lady fixed wing pilots are flying into Baghdad and other places in Iraq on a daily basis as South African Airways won't take them (too white) nor will the local companies for the above reasons (too female) - Catch 22.

Ladies I have spoken to and trained on helicopters who have the money to do licences have usually stopped at PPL (except one). They don't see the point in spending so much money on a career that doesn't return much of a salary when compared with fixed wing flying which, as time goes on, generally involves an increasingly well paid, less stressful and if you go into airlines, pretty secure life. (I think the same can be said of most non white Affirmative Action pilots too and who can blame them ?)

There is at least one female flying planks for the cops here and they just decided to address their heli pilot shortage by retraining their fixed wing guys so maybe she'll get on helis that way...

As discussed on a number of threads, rotary flying is usually more independent than fixed wing. Pilots in the police and EMS are operating by themselves or in much smaller teams with a lot more individual decision making and responsiblity than say airline flying. Not that females can't operate successfully in this environment but it would appear that a larger, more structured and supportive team is more attractive to many.

It takes a certain (principled or masochistic ?) personality type to accept the poor pay and dangerous conditions of this type of helicopter flying in return for some job satisfaction. Maybe ladies just have more sense and less ego ?

[Thomas coupling]

Goaround7: bang on!
Might I also reinforce his comments with:
Helicopters are toys for the boys - X-box, playstation, the radio controlled toy, speed, noise, smell.....thing.
All the stuff of males. There are exceptions to the rule, obviously, but on the whole and added to the fact that women have twice the level of common sense guys have; they don't find the industry attractive???

Does anybody know many women who volunteer to get dirty, or tired, or stressed, or underpaid, or work unsociable hours........for FUN???

It's a woman's world remember - men are here to serve them:ouch:

The secret is to marry one who earns more than you and let them think thats the way it is :ok:

Whirlygig, how many hours do you have to date?

[Mr Toad]

Girl pilots were already established on the North Sea when I thankfully left it 15 years ago; there are girls flying in Hongkong and Macau as we speak. With respect there's nothing special about it.

[Whirlygig]

Does anybody know many women who volunteer to get dirty, or tired, or stressed, or underpaid, or work unsociable hours........for FUN???

Yeah - they're called NURSES - they must do it for fun 'cos they certainly don't do it for money.

No. of hours - not enough yet.

Cheers

Whirlygig

[Slartibardfast]

One has to remember firstly, that Equal Ops only applies to women... Most employers would fall over backwards to get a female pilot onto the books - How many boxes would that tick?

Unfortunately, after taking the training slot (usually at the expense of a more suitable candidate), absorbing the considerable time and effort invested in them (remember that they are impossible to chop - equal ops again) They find that people outside the cosy training environment stop bending over backwards to accommodate them and expect them to deliver the goods

The typical female pilot tires quickly of the unsociable, long hours, she tires of the ongoing training requirements and quickly falls by the wayside - Any long and meaningful sortie debrief usually ends, literally, in tears - This leads normally to a protracted period of ill health (Stress, 'women’s problems', etc) which in itself leads to currency problems - From here it is a slippery slope, these individuals can easily absorb all of the time available to the unit trainers to the complete detriment of everyone else’s training. This saga normally ends with some sort of ground job or pregnancy.

Women pilots? Why bother… it always ends in tears!

[Blind]

The RAF have a couple of female SAR pilots but I don't know of any HEMS/Police pilots. If anyone has a job vacancy I'll do it, I have 2000 twin turbine hours and make a decent cuppa and bacon butties too!!!

[volrider]

You'll do for me:ok:
On a serious note I do think that in this day and age there should be no reason other than the person's (regardless of gender) capable of doing the job. I am sure there are lots of suitable female pilots that can do exactly what a male pilot can do.
Ok we will leave out the morning botty burps..no women can compete with that! But I am sure it is only a matter of time and getting round some very old fashioned prejudices by the "men":)

[Whirlybird]

OK, leaving aside comments that the sky isn't pink and women burst into tears all the time, which just aren't worth replying to, whether or not they're meant seriously...
Does anybody know many women who volunteer to get dirty, or tired, or stressed, or underpaid, or work unsociable hours........for FUN???
Yes, actually. Whirlygig gave one example; there are loads more.

I still think the main reason is that most police/HEMS/SAR pilots are ex-mil, and the forces didn't start taking women as pilots till comparatively recently. There just hasn't been enough time yet. So, like I said, give it another ten years. Of course, there will always be some, like Whirlygig, who try to do it the hard way (good on ya, I would if I had any money left and/or I was a bit younger :ok: ), but not many people, male or female, can afford to do that. Especially when it's so hard to get started and get the number and type of hours required.

So there's your completely obvious answer. Why are you all complicating matters?

Unless of course you want yet another thread full of vaguely sexist banter, in which case feel free (yawn).

[Bertie Thruster]

A winchman once told me that all helicopter pilots were tarts.

A rumour also has it that UK Mil SAR has increased its female aircrew ratio by chemical/surgical methods!

I trained up some very determined and and skilful female SAR pilots in the early '90's. Most, I believe, have moved on from flying, with different priorities.

[teeteringhead]

The RAF have a couple of female SAR pilots just a bit out of date Blind .....

There's been quite a number on both SH and SAR - just off the top of my head I can think of at least 3 who have made it to sqn ldr rank too - and deservedly in each case...

And there aren't many male Chinook pilots who could get their frame refuelled in Albania with the wrong Credit Card .... by snogging the (Austrian IIRC) bowser driver ......;)

[Thomas coupling]

Referee................:\

[NickLappos]

pruners live large!

The sweeping generalizations about female pilots is awful. I have flown with dozens of US Army pilots, female pilots, who are first class aviators, motivated, hard working and good sticks.
The Chief Helo pilot for one US corporation is a female, and a crackerjack pilot.

If you sweep all women into one pile with generalizations about hard work, or tough conditions or the like, you are just plain wrong. I am sure there are mediocre female pilots out there but in my opinion, as pilots, women have to be somewhat better to be equal.

Maybe these thoughts will alienate some ppruners, but now when I go to the bar, my table mates will look better!

[volrider]

Couldn't agree more. It seems that, to be good many women have to be better than their male counterparts. Which isn't fair.

[Whirlybird]

volrider,

We're used to it. Since when has life been fair? :(

Women have to do twice as well as men to be thought half as good. Luckily, this is not difficult. ;) :)

[Slartibardfast]

Quite right Whirlybird - The small percentage of females who understand exactly what is expected of them know that they have to shine and outperform their male collegues in every respect - and they do! - This small percentage are an absolute joy to work with, they often race up the greasy pole with consumate ease..

[ralphmalph]

This thread is starnge!!!!

As a serving member of the AAC i know of numerous female pilots.

I am sure this is not the norm as I have seen many RAF SH female pilots over the years.....

as far a quality goes....the girls are easily if not better that some of the men.

Ralph

Although I do konw of one female SAR pilot who says that the trasition to the hover in a Mk3 is fantastic with love balls fitted!!!!!!

[volrider]

Although I do konw of one female SAR pilot who says that the trasition to the hover in a Mk3 is fantastic with love balls fitted!!!!!!

Heck I've had those factory fitted for years and never noticed that before.....er can I say that:)

[huntnhound]

The typical female pilot tires quickly of the unsociable, long hours, she tires of the ongoing training requirements and quickly falls by the wayside - Any long and meaningful sortie debrief usually ends, literally, in tears - This leads normally to a protracted period of ill health (Stress, 'women’s problems', etc) which in itself leads to currency problems - From here it is a slippery slope, these individuals can easily absorb all of the time available to the unit trainers to the complete detriment of everyone else’s training. This saga normally ends with some sort of ground job or pregnancy.


Slartibardfast,

You obviously dont work in the Police as those sort of comments would have earned you the sack...and probably a court case as well-assuming you shouted them in public of course...

Sadly..you are probably 95% correct... I reserve the remaining 5% for those who do get stuck in, and dont look for an early settlement in the courts
:rolleyes: :rolleyes:

[Jayfer]

Check out: "Other Aircrew Forums/Military Aircrew/RN 'Rescue 193' "

[Whirlygig]

The typical female pilot.....
Slartibartfast,

Whilst I have no intention in arguing with you because you are so obviously correct in what you say, I was just curious to know how many female helicopter pilots you have in your acquaintance?

Cheers

Whirlygig

[Genghis the Engineer]

I came across a book on doing postgraduate degrees the other day, which was called something like "A woman's guide to doing a Doctorate". My instinctive reaction was to think that there should be no difference at-all, and what sort of feminist pillock thinks there is.

But it interested me enough to pick up the book and read a couple of pages. The emphasis was interesting - it suggested that women routinely suffer from the misapprehension that ability alone is enough to succeed (in their Doctorate), and that much of the book was about explaining how and why it was important to fit in with the general ethos and modes of behaviour of their (academic) environment.

I'm not judging, but it was an interesting point - and written by a woman trying to give advice on how to succeed on (what she perceived as) a primarily male working environment.

G

[Darren999]

Hi all,

I happened to come across a stunning blonde, tall, blue eyes, absolutly lovely, getting into a S76, here in Pennsylvania. I believe she works for a local company. I'm sure she wasn't just cleaning it...... I really impressed her as I crawled out of my aging, but very attractive Bell 47..... not.

Did I once see on the Discovery Channel a programme on a lady that flew one in England?????

I wish I could teach more women.... flying

Darren

[IHL]

In 2004,
I would have never imagined that such sexist attitudes are still in existance.

Regardless of gender or race; it's the individual that matters.

There are good pilots and not so good pilots and bad pilots from all walks of life.

It is just wrong to prejudge someone's abilitites because of gender.

[nigel f]

A few weeks ago, there was a young Pilot who went solo on her 16th Birthday.
She started flying in an S300 C in January, and then went solo on her 16th Birthday, which was a great acheievement.
Hannah's anmbition is to fly the Apache.



Link to Yorkshire post article (http://www.yorkshiretoday.co.uk/ViewArticle2.aspx?SectionID=55&ArticleID=880017)

http://www.ntoc.co.uk/hannha.jpg


Nigel

[Sgt.Peppeh]

We have to be careful here,women are taking over everthing,I can just see her jut about to land,doing her lipstick /hair and eye shadow....oh my god !
:E

[ShyTorque]

Nigelf,

If that's a picture of her RHS......she's got the ideal looks for a helicopter pilot - she's ugly and got a bald head. :ok:

[Whirlygig]

Sgt. Peppah,

I can give as good as I get so you can make whatever jibes you wish but you could, at least, make them either
A) Original; and/or
B) Funny.

Cheers

Whirlygig

[Blind]

Well it didn't take long but this thread has got very similar to one a couple of months ago called sexual harrassment.

The fact is there are quite a lot of female commercial pilots out there, in a variety of flying roles. Some, I am sure are good, some not so good, we are only human after all.

The one thing, I think, that we all have in common is that we get bored of the mascara/parking/tea-making jokes, so if you're gonna try to be funny or insulting thenm do it properly.

P.S. Sometimes the sky IS pink.

Blind.

Actually I can't parallel park, that's why I fly helicopters, they can go sideways.:)

[volrider]

Good to see that the ladies can fight their own corner:ok:

[Anne.Nonymous]

The most southern female helo pilot must the one in the Falklands flying S61s who has to put up with horrendous weather.

However having flown both helos and now planks for an airline I have to say the latter is more enjoyable. At least you end up in comfortable hotel at the end of the day and more often than not it is at a different place (country) than where you started!

Anne :O

[NickLappos]

Anne.Nonymous,

"However having flown both helos and now planks for an airline I have to say the latter is more enjoyable. At least you end up in comfortable hotel at the end of the day......"

Good observation! It fits my favorite saying, "If a place needs helicopters, it is probably not worth visiting."

[Helinun]

A very interesting discussion. Surely some men are threatened by females in all works of life, not just the ones that fly helicopters. It's time guys (the very sexist ones) came to accept that some women are more than capable of doing whatever they set their minds to, without crying, having to stop to put on lipstick, or any of the other drivel that the insecure males in this thread mentioned.
NZ has a rescue Pilot flying a 222 that is female. The Airforce has several flying Helicopters as does the Army.
There are 1% of all pilots(H) in NZ with valid Class 1 medicals that are female, (576 to date). Five female instructors (H)(of which I'm one). We even have an A Cat instructor.
In some of the thread, I noticed the discussion was that women won't like the hours, conditions etc. What bollocks! If you like a job/career you will always put up with the bad stuff to get to the good bits.

Thank goodness I work with a bunch of men that are confident in their own ability and not threatened by working alongside a female pilot.

[Reefdog]

have only seen one lady that will rough it in the scrub in oz... and thats where all oz or should i say where 95% of oz pilots get thier start

please tell me which lady is going to roll the swag out for 3 to 4 weeks at atime have a bogie once or if you are lucky twice a week.. fly 10 hours a day every day oops 5 days a week sorry casa.
do 25 and 50 hourlies in the bush... come on

they want the good turbine or good piston jobs near town

if there is a female pilot out there now who wants a job as above i mean in the bush.. send me an email