Cpt/FO's 'information' PA's to pax

[anengineer]

Hi,

Maybe I'm going deaf, but on the holiday flights I've been on over the past few years, the 'informative chat' from the flight deck has been virtually inaudible ! The most recent example was my return from Skiathos where the FO 'speed mumbled' his way through the announcement at barely audible levels. He sounded like he was talking to a busy ATC instead of informing passengers on points of interest.

If any FD crew read this section, can you SPEAK SLOWER AND TURN THE VOLUME UP PLEASE ! :) I for one am very interested in what you have to say :)

[BEagle]

Between BHX and FRA it's invariably "Mumble, mumble, first officer, mumble, BRUSSELS, mumble, mumble, altitude in 000s of metres (meaningless outside the CIS)......."

Pretty pointless, mostly. And in the awful CRJ it's pointless AND painful through those rubbish speakers!

[amanoffewwords]

Was on one of the new GB Airways buses recently - 'twas loud and clear, which was refreshing.

One thing's odd though, doesn't matter who you fly with the duty free message is always broadcast at 200db.:eek:

[BAe 146-100]

It is always nice to hear what the CPT/FO has to say about the flight, I look forward to it in a way when I fly. :p

I was impressed with the announcements on my recent flights with Hapag-Lloyd Express of Germany. On both flights the F/O's made very detailed annonucements, telling you the departure runway, what our weight and take-off speed was, detailed routing information etc.

BAe 146

[amanoffewwords]

I recall Swissair (3-4 times I went with them) pilots always mentioned something technical about the aircraft - like wingspan, fuel load etc. That's when I found out that the wing is all one piece rather than a left and right piece stuck to the fuselage - can tell I'm just pax :hmm:

Most memorable announcement I heard from a Captain was a mention that the flight had an all female crew - I thought I'd died and gone to heaven, but one (male) pax objected to it and insisted to be off-loaded - which he was, thus causing a huge delay as we had already pushed-back :mad:

So, I agree with BAe, keep them coming

[TightSlot]

There are several factors affecting Flight Crew infomational PA's which may affect the quality & volume:

Pilots being human, there are a range of attitudes amongst them to these PA's. Some hate doing them, others do them, but reluctantly ,others work to a standard template - others put real thought and effort in - each individual will decide upon their own level of contribution.
Modern headsets and boom mikes can be very sensitive, and it can be easy to accidentally come out too loudly. PA volume is set by engineers, individually for each aircraft and then modified in some cases, on the flight deck. Some pilots are naturally quietly spoken, or loudly, and their workload at the time of the PA, may inhibit effective communication.
It is difficult for pilots behind a locked flight deck door to appreciate the actual volume of their PA. While one speaks, the other listens out on the radio - If cabin crew call the flight deck to alert them to poor sound quality during a PA, it means that the other (non-PA) pilot has to come off the radio to listen to the Cabin Call (undesirable)
Cabin Crew have a better appreciation of PA volume and sound quality, as they can hear themselves in the Cabin - therefore their announcements will usually tend to be clearer.
Not all passengers enjoy or appreciate pilots PA's - strange, but true. Crew need to try and find a happy medium, which they do with greater, or lesser success


Hope this helps

[radeng]

I always find the BA announcements clear and informative. More so when we get the flight deck telling us which runways are to be used and so. Adds that bit of interest.

And the other week, coming from Venice to Gatwick, the Purser interrupted the safety briefing tape to tell the large number of PAX busy talking to shut up and listen! Done with adequate volume and very clearly. Good for her.

[expedite_climb]

IMHO I find that a lot of very experienced Skippers (and I guess therefore FO's) don't realise that if they leave their intercom on (757) while doing a PA it halves the volume output !!

[redfred]

Had to classics from a BA pilot, he was talking over the PA and went onto say that BA had excellent cabin crew but sadly none of them were operating this flight and whilst taxing to our stand at LGW we were passing under the new bridge or walkway there and he went onto say 'we are passing under the new walkway here at LGW, we are the first passenger jet to go under, so we'll find out if we fit when we get out the other side'

[wub]

A 777 fits under the bridge and we had a running commentary from the F/O while we taxied!

http://www.pbase.com/glenns/image/34618660.jpg

[CargoOne]

BAe 146-100

I was impressed with the announcements on my recent flights with Hapag-Lloyd Express of Germany. On both flights the F/O's made very detailed annonucements, telling you the departure runway, what our weight and take-off speed was, detailed routing information etc.

Sounds like he forgot to switch off PA when going through checklists :ok:

[expedite_climb]

BAE - sounds like a plane spotters paradise, but a passenger's nightmare ! We have one skipper who does those sort of PA's, even reads the ATIS with the info letter and the QNH! I curl up in a ball and pretend it isnt happening.....

[Flip Flop Flyer]

At the gate:

mumble mumble mumble expected flight time 2 hours 5 minutes mumble mumble mumble weather is nice with 20 degrees and sunshine mumble mumble.


In the air:

mumble mumble mumble we expect to land in 45 minutes mumble mumble mumble

(The mumble mumble bit is my personal filter :E )

UNLESS the chaps up front got something interesting to say like "ladies and gentlemen, we seem to have lost a wing". :eek:

[wub]

Peter Ustinov told a story of the night he was flying with Lufthansa and had just finished dinner, when the Captain announced on the PA; "Ladies und Chentlemen, I am pleased to announce that I have managed to rrre-gain contrrol"

[skydriller]

I consider myself a frequent flyer as I am a pax about once a week on average, and I too like to hear a little info from the flight deck, even if I have heard it before.

I think that in general terms BA is better at this than anyone else, with a good balance of humour and seriousness in the PAs, keeping the pax up to date if there are problems etc. what the route is and expected weather at destination converted into normal speak, not just taken directly off of the TAF/METAR.
And not the mumble ...mumble.....I dont really want to say any of this.....mumble... that you get on some airlines all the time.

I would also like to congratulate any FD crew that looks out of the window when the wx is excellent to tell pax what a certain ground feature is - for example the AF crew on a AMS-BOD flight mentioned being over Paris the other night when it was perfect vis and looked really beautiful - I noticed even the hardened business pax taking a peek across the other side of the aircraft!!

Just my two penny worth, but especially on short haul, a little interest from up front is noticed and apreciated by me,

Regards, SD..

[PAXboy]

Skydriller, I agree. Coming back from Rome t'other week with BA, they said that Paris was looking good, although I was on the wrong side.

Tightslot, thanks for the background. I think that one of the other probs that FD crew have is that they are used to talking to ATC, who also have headphones on and so they can speak more quietly. When it's time to talk to us, they have to adjust.

Not to mention that, if they are on turbo props, they are probably wearing noise cancelling 'phones and we in the cabin are not. I said, We in the cabin are not. :p

--------------------
"I tell you, we are here on Earth to fart around, and don't let anybody tell you any different." Kurt Vonnegut, Jr.

[Airbus Girl]

Our company's policy on the airbus is to use the (seperate) PA handset rather than the PA button on the radio panel. The former is much much quieter than the latter, so could be why some are loud and others not.

As for what the pilots say, it probably is partly to do with motivation - one Captain I know is so fed up with the company's attitude towards pilots that he no longer gives any PAs at all, which is a shame as his used to be the best.

We do get bored saying the same thing day in day out, but to be honest whenever I've flown as a passenger 99% of the people aren't interested. We often have "quizzes" in the cabin, where people have to answer something, with the answer having already been given out on the PA and most people can't answer it.

[Final 3 Greens]

The funniest PA I've had in ages was from a keen CSA pilot, enroute to Prague earlier this year.

The flight time was announced as 1h15 (pretty swift) and he says "We're near a jet stream and we have a groundspeed of 950kmh, oh yes, 950kmh. This means we have a big wind and that means turbulence, oh yes there might be some turbulence all the way, so keep your seatbelts fastened when you are sitting and when we get to Prague, we will experience more turbulence during our approach."

By this time, about 20% of the pax were holding on to the arm rests like grim death ... and funnily enough, the entire flight was smooth as a millpond - and very fast :}

The dumbest has got to have been by a BA pilot, years ago, shortly after departure from LHR for LAX. After all the normal stuff, "There might be some turbulence over Canada, about 7 hours into the flight." Again, iut was as smooth as a millpond, but why even announce the possibility 7 hours in advance, when some pax may be nervous :rolleyes:

[amanoffewwords]

A few years ago as we approached EDI a BA pilot gave us a weather update "for those passengers sitting on the left hand-side it is cold, and of those on the right it is mindbogglingly cold!"

[hoofie]

I had to travel to Glasgow from Heathrow twice last week. The 2nd time I went, up the Captain or First Officer (can't remember who it was) was chatting away about the flight whilst taxing, and even took the time to point out the work on Terminal 5 for those on the right of the plane !

Its much better if the chaps up-the-front take the time to throw in some extra info - I know they are busy, but you spend enough time queueing up to take off at Heathrow anyway.

p.s. On the way back from Glasgow after landing at Heathrow, my 2 year-old daughter said "Thank you, Captain!" to the First-Officer. He beamed and said "Not yet, maybe in another 18 months" - Priceless.

p.p.s. Quick question for the pilots - on one on the flights the landing was an absolute greaser - hardly felt the wheels touch the runway - is it acceptable to say 'good landing' to the F/O on the way out ? [Note : if he hammered six inches into the concrete I'd keep my trap shut].

[Bealzebub]

Talking on th PA whilst taxying is a bit like driving while using a mobile phone. It is usually a wholly unnecessary distraction. Both pilots should be monitoring what is going on around them and monitoring what is going on with ATC. Airports are busy places and just as on main roads, not everybody does as they are instructed or what you expect them to, and you need your wits about you. Of course there may be occaisions when a short PA is necessary and it is seldom a problem when stationary. You are right they are busy and in such circumstances there is a need to prioritise. Describing the construction progress at Terminal 5 is a long way down the list I would have thought.

I do agree though that PA's to the passengers ought to be delivered with more clarity and they are one of the areas of communication that perhaps has suffered over recent years. To a large extent I think the proliferation of In flight entertainment systems is a significant reason. It used to be that there were natural breaks when a PA could be given without disturbing people such as before or after the movie. These days the things seem to be perpetual with multi channels. From the pilots viewpoint there is no real way of telling when might be a good time to talk. As a result it tends to be the basic hello PA. Summary of trip at top of climb, and update and goodbye just prior to top of decent.

[PAXboy]

I agree that announcements about turbulence can be worrying for some pax. To advise of it too far in advance is not good. Also, the single word 'Turbulence' is interpreted by some as 'a bit of running over cobblestones' and others as 'the plane will be flung all over the sky'.

The words, 'mild' and 'average' may help to clarify it for the pax or, "Some light turbulence but nothing unusual to any other day" and so forth. If they think that it is going to be bad - then don't tell folks until very near the time!!

--------------------
"I tell you, we are here on Earth to fart around, and don't let anybody tell you any different." Kurt Vonnegut, Jr.

[Virgin Boi]

At Virgin the policy is to keep PA's to a minimum - which is great!

The Captain will generally say a very quick hello at the start of the flight, then will make one other very quick PA at the top of the decent. Thats it. Thats all thats needed!

The pilots job is to get the aircraft from A-B. We have amazing interactive entertainment systems on board the aircraft, and I assure you that 95% of the passengers would rather be entertained by that - instead of a barely audible PA detailing information they a) dont care about and b) dont understand anyway!

[slim_slag]

Channel 9 on United is better than any PA, especially when they keep it on for the Atlantic crossing and you hear the inevitable baseball/rounders/cricket insults fly

[Globaliser]

Ah yes, that for which 123.45 was expressly intended ...

[knobbygb]

Always nice when the drivers take time to point out interesting features - espexially long-haul. Yes, the IFE systems are 'OK' but 8 or 10 hours is a long time and a little chat from upfront breaks it up a bit.

I remember on AA going to ORD once, the captain made an announcement, very apologetic for disturbing everyone while they may have been resting etc. that we were just passing over the coast of Greenland and the views were unusually clear. I'm glad he disturbed us because that was the most stunning view I've ever seen from an airliner. I understand why he wanted to share it and I think maybe he had shares in Kodak - there were quite a few photos taken!

On the other hand I once flew from Phoenix to LAX (about 45 mins airbourne) and we must have had about 5 or 6 PA's about passing over such-and-such a township and this or that mountain/lake etc. He even pointed out the airfield where he learned to fly. I personally was quite interested (I was on a flying holiday and had flown over the area the day before) but I think most of the other pax were a bit peeved. Good luck to the chap though, he was obviously local and proud of his home state/country. :ok:

[timmcat]

On the subject of weather, and more specifically turbulence announcements - has anyone else noticed that there seems to be a reverse relationship between the forecast and actual.

"Weather en route is good" usually guarentees a few knocks and bumps. Likewise the opposite. I always remember a flight in an F27 from Jersey to Leeds. Weather had been foul all day, and severe weather warnings had been issued for south west england and wales (right on our route) of torrential downpours, thunderstorms, and high winds. Whilst taxying out, PA from cabin crew - 'the captain is forcasting some turbulence enroute so we will just be offering a drink service'. A few minutes later (still on the ground) 'the captain is now forecasting severe turbulence and the drinks service will not now be available'.

Now, to one like myself who is never 100% relaxed when flying, this was not good news. Anxious faces on other pax (and young FA).

It was one of the smoothest flights I have ever experienced. (although there was an awful amount of CB swerving). Good job done by the guys up front (and ATCO's presumably).

[TightSlot]

Decode for Pilot wx announcements pre-departure.


Misty - The destination airfield is presently closed due fog
Breezy - The destination airfield is presently closed with crosswinds.
Chance of Thunderstorms - The destination airfield is presently closed with thunderstorms
Chance of Snow Showers - The destination airfield is presently closed due to Snow

[Final 3 Greens]

Tightslot - LOL, but when you consider how they're trained in weather what do you expect??? See this extract from a pilot's training manual below....

Pilot’s Weather Testing Stone - Instructions for preparation and use:

Take a round stone, drill a hole through the middle and suspend from the eaves of a suitably positioned hangar, i.e. preferably where it can be seen from the airport bar.
Interpretation of stone readings

Stone all the same colour and not swinging Fair weather – good for flying.

Stone swinging gently- Breezy/windy – no major problem, but secure booze in hold in case of slight turbulence – can cause bottle(s) to break – with resulting loss of valuable drink.

Stone swinging violently - Very windy – this can ruin your perfect logbook, i.e. you may not have the same number of take-offs and landings after flying in this weather. Take another pilot with you and use your natural sense of cunning to make sure that they are designated ‘Captain’, even though you are handling pilot. If there is an ‘occurrence’, it’s their problem (and paperwork) then.

Top of stone darker than body - Rain. Make sure that you take a junior co-pilot to do the external checks.

Top of stone white Frost, snow or ice. Caution, aeroplanes do not fly very well with several tons of frozen water on the wings. Assign a junior co-pilot to do the de-icing, whilst you complete the Times crossword in the warm crew room.

Top of stone singed/black - Lightning. This is very bad, as it can ruin your whole day. Stay in the bar.

Top of stone covered in white pellets - Hail. See recommendation above.

Can’t see stone (1) - It’s night – birds don’t fly at night, why should you risk it? Anyway, nightime is allocated for the bar.

Can’t see stone (2) - Fog. If you are Cat IIIc rated, okay. If you don’t know what Cat IIIc is, try driving your car down the M1 in dense fog at 150mph, using your Garmin GPS III as the sole steering reference. Then you will understand why you should stay in the bar and take advantage of the gratuitous free entertainment on offer, as the airport fire engines try to find aircraft which are lost on the taxiway.

Can’t see stone (3)- Tornadic wind conditions have sucked stone up to FL330, where it has taken up the hold procedure – confirm by cross checking that the hangar roof is also missing. Although the up-draughts may improve the asthmatic climb performance of your aircraft considerably, it’s airframe might not be up to the +/- 35g windshear experienced within the accompanying CB clouds. Also, difficult to do Times crossword whilst experiencing ‘eyeball slap’ or reading glasses bouncing on nose due to extreme turbulence. Best to stay in the bar.

[LRdriver II]

On the orange airplanes and the harp clad ones, I am amazed the pilots even get a word in.

With all that incessant crap with inflight magazines, describing every item on the junkfood menu and trying to sell me every thing in the duty free cart...oh yea also the charity "change for good" faff trying to pummel me into feeling guilty... AAAAARRRRGGGHHHH .... SHUT UP FFS!! I dont want to listen to the PA system for the entire flight, usually overly loud (except the pilots of course) .

Leave the magazines behind the seats, people know where to find them or just make a short announcement. just STOP TALKING for the entire flight!!

[Air-Geko]

Usually it'll be flight time, arriving gate, mumble, mumble, mumble...

Then there was the approach into San Antonio, Texas a while back. "Ladies and Gentlemen, we'll be arriving on time for a change. Weather in San Antonio is 94 degrees with matching humidity. It's like living in a big dog's mouth ... and smells like it."
The laughter from those of us who were just visiting far drowned out the protests of the residents.

Or as we were lining up for approach into Cleveland when our 737 got a bit too close to someone bigger's jet wash. The 37 took a rather pronounced lurch down and to starboard and a few seconds later the flight deck came on chuckling and telling the pax what caused the surprise in the cabin... "Woo-hoo. Now you all know what happens when a little plane tries to occupy the air a big plane just left..."


Air-Geko