RAF to get new Airships?

[Navaleye]

The R101 lives again?

From the Times:

British troops are go with a Thunderbird airship

BRITAIN’S armed forces could be transported to the world’s troublespots in what is likely to be the largest flying object ever built, writes Peter Almond.

Senior Ministry of Defence (MoD) officials confirmed last week that they were looking at commissioning the first British-designed Skycat 1000, a giant combined airship and hovercraft.

Resembling the film world’s Thunderbird 2, the Skycat would be more than 1,000ft long, bigger than the MoD’s headquarters and 230ft longer than the Graf Zeppelin airship of the 1930s. It could carry up to a dozen Challenger tanks or, potentially, several hundred troops. Today’s largest transport aircraft can hold only one tank.

The seriousness with which the MoD is considering the Skycat was revealed by Wing Commander David Stubbs, a director in the expeditionary logistics and sustainment section, at a conference on ways of making the armed forces more mobile. “You may be pleasantly surprised at how far the technology has come on,” he told the conference at the Royal United Services Institute in London.

The airship was the “most likely to deliver” the solution to the chronic shortage of heavy transport aircraft and ships capable of carrying large numbers of troops or equipment.

The Skycat 1000 would compete with a new generation of large fast ships and a sea-skimming cargo plane developed in Russia. The US military is also studying the craft and at least one other government is said to be close to placing an order for a smaller version. Officials believe the Skycat could be ready for use by the RAF as early as 2010.

Designers at the Advanced Technologies Group in Cardington, Bedfordshire — home of the R101 airship that crashed in 1930 — said six gas turbine engines would lift Skycat to an altitude of 5,000-8,000ft to cruise up to 6,000 miles at 100mph.

Some defence experts, however, are sceptical about its prospects. “Current defence thinking is to do more with less, but I would be very concerned about putting all my eggs into this one basket,” said Tony Mason, a retired Air Vice-Marshal and an expert on air pow

[the_flying_cop]

strange as it may seem, the cops have thought about acquiring airships to complement their helicopters and fixed wings.

i initially thought that this was a rather silly idea, however having recently been in athens for the olympics there were 2 airships over the skies.

the first, was a media type blimp complete with sponsors logos etc, the second was an unmarked off white coloured ship. both operated over the city and although noisy when directly above you and obviously highly visible.

it may be a nice, low cost option to consider domestically as i assume that the operating costs are significantly lower. however the glamour factor may be considerably reduced, after all you cant walk into a boozer and grin smugly saying you operate in a hot air balloon, can you???

i also anticipate that the dimensions of the copper blobber will be significantly smaller.

[buoy15]

Interesting!
6000 miles @ 100mph - that's 60 hours airborne - how many crew to cover crew duty time/rest periods etc?
Iv'e done 15hrs refuelled, overnight, and that was quite tiring
How would they evade a hostile intercept or ground based TripleA?
How many diversions available in case of problems?
That's only for starters!
The Soviet WIG programme was impressive - however, limited to over water and low-lying swamps - probably not suitable for mountainous regions or deserts, which is where we seem to spend most of our time

Military jet noise - the sound of freedom

[BEagle]

Food, water, accommodation for 'several hundred troops' for 60 hours would be quite a problem. As would adequate sanitation requirements - this thing would have to carry thousands of gallons of water and would surely need to have washing and sleeping facilties!

Barking mad.

[The Gorilla]

Never mind food water and toilets!! This thing is going to need the one thing the Air Farce doesn't have --- MONEY!!!

:D

[soddim]

If this was announced on Apr 1st it would make more sense.

Even a troopship would not be as vulnerable as this and how close to the theatre of operations could it safely get?

Is there a senior officer in MOD about to retire into the airship industry?

[tradewind]

Damn, there's me thinking the RAF might be getting new 'management'!

[Melchett01]

Tradewind - you weren't the only one getting excited and then finding their hopes cruelly dashed!

As for flying at 5 - 8000 feet at 100kts carrying MBTs, I can only say one thing ......... oh my gawd!!!!!!! Even my gran could hit that let alone needing a modern integrated AD system.

And who would we get to fly such 'targets' into a hostile area of operations - would flying pay be finally classified as danger money? Just think how much you would lose, both in personnel, materiel and investment if just one of these things went down. I suspect that any DAS installed to cope with the multiple spectrum of threats would cost a fortune - and flares would be right out!!!!!

[TC27]

Guys, this things hardly going to be flying into the danger zone, its more a kind of 'rapid reaction' alternative to the ro-ro ferries the MOD hires at the moment.

http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/systems/aircraft/images/skycat_200_mil_01.jpg

[WE Branch Fanatic]

1. Is this a serious proposal or just hot air?
2. Are certain PPRuNers showing a Colonel Blimp mentaility?
3. Do the project costs allow for inflation?
4. As with other defence projects, will the cost just balloon?

[TC27]

I think savings could be made by filling it with hot air piped straight from Parliament.......

Or Hoon could 'modernise' it by cutting 20% off the end.

[J.A.F.O.]

NEW RAPID REACTION HOT AIR BALLOON ANNOUNCED

The MoD has today announced the decision to purchase over a thousand hot air balloons for troop transport to the world's hotspots. It is believed that each balloon would be quite big and capable of carrying in excess of three troops and some of their equipment.

MoD spokesman, Gp Capt March-Hare, said "The cost of operating these new troop transport balloons is minimal and fits in well with current government policies. As long as we ensure that we become involved in conflicts upwind of the UK there are no foreseeable problems. However this is cutting edge technology and we are prepared for the challenges that their introduction will surely bring forth."

The announcement was hailed as a triumph for the British wickerwork industry who have been lobbying parliament for the re-introduction of wicker into frontline equipment for many years.

A government spokesman today stated that, "There has been a significant decrease in the use of wicker in modern military hardware, an area which was sadly overlooked by the last Tory government. We are pleased and proud to be bringing wicker back to the frontline where it probably belongs. Private finance will see the introduction of hundreds of gondolas into frontline service within a handful of decades."

It is believed that the government is attempting to secure sponsorship for the hot air balloons; meaning that not only will the impact on the defence budget be minimal but also that those who we seek to liberate can be introduced to Western products from the very start of any conflict.

The balloons will be crewed by Territorial Army members of the Women's Army Balloon Corps thereby reducing impact on already overstretched regiments.

Reactions the the announcement have been mixed with someone who was once in the army for a bit saying, "Yeah, great, whatever.", but another former soldier commented, "You're all mad."

The plans of the MoD seem to have progressed a long way and it should only be a matter of months before the government is ready to start ploughing hundreds of millions of pounds into unnecessary research and development with the first hot air balloons in front line service by 2093.

[16 blades]

100kts? 'Rapid Reaction'?

What if you had a 90kt headwind?

Surely a target like this would be a terrorist's dream? You couldn't miss it if you tried!

Hell, why not just go the whole hog and put a runway on it's roof and a hangar below decks - a flying aircraft carrier!

Now there's a thought...........

16B

[Ian Corrigible]

Ah yes, The Times. Soft, strong and thoroughly absorbent...

As the Gorilla says, this would cost a packet. If a 'serious' outfit like Cargolifter - which enjoyed the financial backing of the German government - failed to make this concept 'float,' how exactly is ATG (whose greatest achievement to date is the Skyship blimp) going to fund the development of such a system ?

Even the US DoD's studies into a heavylift HTA airship ('Walrus') are years away from any kind of firm commitment (and at least a decade away from IOC), due not just to the funding question but also due to serious misgivings over the ground infrastructure required for such a system. Even Skycat's hovercraft-type landing system is expected to require extensive pre-positioned infrastructure; then there's the question of counter ballast.

Sounds to me like a planted story to get the Govt. to throw some seed money ATG's way, ahead of a tie-up with a U.S. prime. Where's Jacko ?

I/C

[BlueWolf]

Brilliant idea.

And since not enough people laughed last time, here it is again:

http://www.pprune.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=89696&perpage=15&highlight=Balloon%20Launched%20Interdiction&pagenumber=2

:D

[teeteringhead]

16 Blades
A flying aircraft carrier .... old hat mate It's been done before (http://www.nlhs.com/fleet.htm) ...and 70 years ago too!

[floppyjock]

Has everyone forgotten that the Army Air Corps trialed Airships in the late 80s early 90s to replace helicopters over Belfast.

Floppy

[NVG_CAT3_retd]

Was the RAF formed on 1st April aswell? seems to make sence to me.

[MarkD]

why does the RAF need new "airships" when there are so many posts here that say they have too many in stock now?

[Melchett01]

Just been reading Spike Milligan's WW2 memoirs - Adolf Hitler My Part in His Downfall. Low and behold, on page 2, a drawing of a troop carrying airship circa 1939. Fast forward to 2004..... sound familiar??

Please tell me that UK Defence policy - if we have one at all - isn't using Spike Milligan's memoirs as a template for our mobile-networked enabled-expeditionary force's strategic airlift capability???

On second thoughts, it might be the only way to get a sane decision out of their airships. Quick someone send CAS a copy!!!
What's the betting that having read it, CAS comes up with his own autobiography - The RAF My Part in its Downfall:E :E :E