Gaining a CAA/JAA CPL/IR abroad

[Adam P]

Hi all,

Is it possible to train for a CAA/JAA CPL/IR abroad or do you have to do it in the UK? Also, is it cheaper to do it abroad and convert or does it cost just as much to go through all the groundschool? Am very confused by it all!

Adam.

[mad_jock]

the problem is that all schools need to be approved.

And also you need to get access to a CPL examiner and also a CAAFU examiner for the IR.

BAe in spain can do the whole lot for you but its intergrated.

In florida you can do cpl course and also flight test (proberly with keywest a moderator on pprune) You can also do the IR training as well but I haven't heard of anyone doing the flight test over there so you would need to return to the UK and get used to our airspace, procedures and RT. Which might be ok if you were an experenced FI in the UK but it might be a bit much if you are a min hours modular student.

And to be honest although there is a big saving in PPL and hour building abroad, there dosn't seem to be the same saving for the proffesional courses compared to UK prices.

MJ

[BillieBob]

Right, let's try to correct some of the misinformation:
Is it possible to train for a CAA/JAA CPL/IR abroad? Yes, although the CAA CPL/IR no longer exists so it's just the JAA that you'll be interested in. The UK CAA is the only authority to ignore the JAA requirements and approve modular schools overseas.
Is it cheaper to do it abroad and convert? Probably, a little. By the time you have taken all costs into account, there will probably not be a lot in it. However, there can be distinct benefits in mixing overseas and UK training to get the best deals.
the problem is that all schools need to be approved. Not a problem at all. The UK approves a number of overseas FTOs - check out their website to obtain a list.
And also you need to get access to a CPL examiner Again, not a problem - plenty of people complete the CPL Skill Test in the USA.
and also a CAAFU examiner for the IR Again, not a problem. The IR Skill Test has to be done in JAA airspace at present and there are plenty of CAA FEs to do the job. btw - CAAFU hasn't existed for many a long year.
proberly with keywest Probably with Keygrip?
IR training as well but I haven't heard of anyone doing the flight test over there It is not yet permitted to complete the IR Skill Test outside JAA airspace. However, that is likely to change in the next amendment to JAR-FCL1 although the costs will doubtless be too high to make it a realistic option for UK-based candidates.

[YYZ]

Hi Adam

FFF obtained his CPL abroad & had the pleasure of getting to know the PPRuNe Mod Keygrip

Look HERE (http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=108385&highlight=cpl+diary) for a very good read.

YYZ

[Adam P]

Thanks for all your replies....FFF's diary is excellent!

Right, I'm trying to get my head round this then and how the process from start to CPL progresses. The PPL is more or less 40-50 hours flying from ab initio to test & issue of the licence. Full stop.

Before you can get onto the CPL course, you need to tot up about 150-200 hours. Full stop.

You also need to complete the relevant groundschool exams for whichever licence you're going for. Full stop.

Finally, you get onto the CPL course which is only 25-30 hours long and do the flying stuff to finally get your licence.

Is that how it works? If so, is there anything to stop me completing the PPL & hours abroad then coming back to the UK to complete the groundschool and CPL course?

[EGAC_Ramper]

Hi Adam:O

Theres nothing stopping you at all doing your PPL abroad and your hour building then returning to the UK to complete you CPL/IR flying.This is the path I'm going along myself as I already hold the PPL I'll be returning this year to hour build up to 150-160 hours then pick either Oxford or cabair for my CPL/IR training.With the full time gound school to obtain fATPL.


Regards Gavin.

[Adam P]

Thanks for that Gav mate! (I'm steering clear of you for a while until I've fully recovered from last weeks shenanigans! ;) )

Right, I think I need to look a lot more about each of the parts and which is cheaper and where....

Thanks!

[englishal]

I dunno why more people don't go the conversion route, especially if they already have a PPL and are used to the UK airspace :confused:

There are literally massive savings to be made by training for an FAA CPL/IR and doing a conversion course in the UK ($220 / hr multi IR training as opposed to >£350 / hr in the UK) . Plus you come out with several independant licences and ratings as an added bonus....?

No doubt someone will mention that the conversion will be the problem as the FAA / JAA are so different......and I'd respond by saying that if you train for the FAA stuff right first time, then this won't be an issue. Incidentally, its no different than going somewhere "Approved" like E** and doing their IR course (their training is in US airspace after all).....but the big difference is that they don't even put you through the FAA IR skills test, as you "finish off" back in the UK...................

EA

[Charlie Zulu]

The above conversion route is how I am going about obtaining a JAA CPL/IR with ATPL Knowledge Examinations Passed.

People have their own reasons for choosing the way in which they gain their coverted licence, I'll write mine here. Be warned that this may sound like a war story to you so I don't mind being ignored if you feel as though you're nodding off. :D

After finishing University I managed to find myself a job that paid enough in order to learn to fly. I had always wished to obtain my PPL so signed up for lessons as soon as I could. I obtained my PPL a year later, which is now six years ago.

I also had it in the back of my mind to make a career out of flying but only really decided upon this career once and for all a couple of years ago. By this time I had my PPL and a few hundred hours of flight time, mainly from flying in the UK but also three flying holidays in the United States. Problem 1 solved - ie no need to gain PPL or hour build!!

So now I had decided upon going commercial, which route to take? As I had a PPL and a few hundred hours I immediately discounted the now Integrated route. So modular it would be. I also liked the idea of business jets so saw being dual licenced, that is having both an FAA and JAA licences would help matters. In any case if I obtained a job later on that didn't require the FAA licence, it wouldn't be wasted as I am sure a few flying holidays in the USA will be forthcoming in the years to come.

I had decided upon obtaining the FAA CPL/IR before starting the JAA ATPL Theoretical Knowledge Course and Examinations. Obtained my FAA CPL/IR at the end of last July with around 490 hours total time.

Enrolled and started on the JAR-FCL ATPL distance learning modular course a couple of months ago, with my first seven exams in November of this year.

In two days time, on Monday, I travel to Florida to add a Multi rating to both my FAA CPL/IR and CAA PPL/IMC. This is in order to have the JAA IR reduced to a minimum of 15 hours flight time, although I am not dislussioned with the fact that this is minimum time, ie I will probably need more than the minimum. The same with the JAA CPL course that is hours as required as I already hold an ICAO CPL. I now have about 530 hours, by the time I finish all of my basic flight training I am looking to have around 700 hours (I do fly quite regularly in a group aeroplane), which coincidently is the minimum hour requirement for Single Pilot IFR Operations!!! Guess what I am looking to do before corporate bizjets or the airlines? ;)

Anyway now the war story has finished I shall say I would recommend anyone starting out, or for people with a PPL already, to go along the Conversion route. Be it FAA and JAA or TC (Transport Canada) and JAA or any other combination.