US Warned it could lose air supremecy (from CNN)

[Load Toad]

Dunno if been posted already but:-

http://edition.cnn.com/2004/US/06/23/airforce.supremacy.reut/index.html

[allan907]

Interesting that the Spams are quoting the Typhoon as being 'superior'. Contrasts nicely with comments on other threads that the UK should be buying off the shelf F15s rather than the Typhoon. Perhaps that nice Mr Hoon should be trying to sell some on the other side of the pond.

[BlueWolf]

Can't understand why the F-15 with movable canards and thrust vectoring never made it past the experimental demonstrator stage, particularly considering what's coming out of Sukhoi nowadays.

I wonder how Israeli Eagles would have performed against the same opposition?

[propulike]

Actually the report says that Russia is designing and building increasingly advanced fighters, France and Sweden also build advanced combat planes, and a consortium of 4 European countries are producing Typhoon.

Not quite the same as superior :O

[Jackonicko]

Propulike,

You're right, Hornburg didn't say Typhoon was superior when acknowledging that the F-15s had a nasty surprise when confronted by well flown Su-30s and MiG-29s..... :rolleyes:

So to please you, here's another credible senior US officer on Typhoon.

Lt. Gen. Bruce A. Carlson, a one-time director of operational requirements for the US Air Force, said that "Typhoon will easily outstrip the capabilities of the Su-35 /-37, as well as the F-15, and in fact is considered second only to the F-22 in capability. Typhoon is more maneuverable and has better radar detection capability than the F-15 and is harder to detect on radar."

Happy?

[Gainesy]

Hmm..
Cowboys and Indians banter anyone?

[OFBSLF]

Can't understand why the F-15 with movable canards and thrust vectoring never made it past the experimental demonstrator stage, particularly considering what's coming out of Sukhoi nowadays.Wouldn't that have the radar cross-section of a steel barn?

[ShyTorque]

As I understand it, the TypeHOON was designed from the start to be superior to the latest Russian built fighters and their possible future developments.

Having recently been shown a few facts and figures (by the head pilot on the project) it appears that this has certainly been achieved.

It does seem that the aircraft has slightly inferior flight performance to the JSF, but it makes up for this by the effectiveness of the weapons fit. Hopefully this will never be tried out in anger so it is largely irrelevant.

In any event, it is VASTLY superior to the Tornado F3 (so-called "fighter" - pah!) that our chaps have been forced to put up with for so many years.

[soddim]

Wish people would not refer to what Typhoon is . If it was in service maybe it would be, but it's not. In the meantime we can but dream.

[ShyTorque]

soddim,

:ouch: If Typhoon doesn't exist, what was the Typhoon shaped jet that flew past us at low level up by Morecambe Bay a few weeks back? Certainly looked like one to me....

I understand the first OCU course is scheduled to start later this year.

It was also being compared to another "non-existent" jet in any event, wasn't it?

[soddim]

ShyTorque,

I didn't write that it did not exist - simply that it is not yet in service - unless you count the corner of the manufacturer's hangar as an RAF station. I don't.

In any case, even later this year it will not have any operational capability except to thrill the crowds at airshows - if it is serviceable.

[ShyTorque]

The original point WAS about the future though.

[WE Branch Fanatic]

I found this....

Splashed over Iraq in 2002 (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/2602049.stm)

[Skylark4]

WEBF
Is it just me or was that link you posted totally irrelevant.

Mike W

[WE Branch Fanatic]

No.

If they could kill something in an air to air mode, in 2002, after years of sanctions, no fly zones et al.....what could a nation that hasn't had sanctions, no fly zones etc and wanted to fight, with motivated forces, do?

So it was a Predator. But what if it had been, say, a helicopter or an ISTAR or transport/tanker aircraft?

[osbo]

I think this is all about ensuring that Congress give them the funding for the Raptor in the numbers they want..............politics in the military........

[Blacksheep]

Had a chance to look over the Typhoon in Germany. It certainly looks the business and has amazing interactive avionics that can call up things like fuel states or weapon selection by voice recognition commands. It is designed to minimize crew workload while fighting. I think you guys are going to love it. :ok:

I can't say the same for your maintenance people though ;)

[46Driver]

Osbo is definitely on the money. Its all about the Air Force desperately trying to justify the F-22 because it is the next big ticket item up on the chopping block (the Crusader artillery piece and the Comanche helicopter have already been axed.) After the Air Force - Boeing tanker scandal...........

[Navaleye]

Additional info on the Indian encounter... slightly suspect source but it seems credible.

Link (http://www.strategypage.com//fyeo/howtomakewar/default.asp?target=htairfo.htm)

[propulike]

So Typhoon can outperform the F-15. I should hope so, seeing as Eurofighter's brief was to be able to defeat son-of-Flanker (yes, still got one of the brochure's somewhere....) although I trust no-one's really trying to claim the Typhoon is a stealth aircraft :confused:

The linked article still separates Typhoon from 'advanced' aircraft, much to my amusement, and I care not how many senior American officers are quoted bidding for funds!

[smartman]

soddim

So your point about Typhoon is??

And do make any reponse credible old chap - not the well worn ramblings about BWoS/lateness/cost/obsolescence etc etc. They've all been done - and don't say 'rest my case' either.

It's a v good UK (and GE, IT, SP) product. And far exceeds all existing US and Russian (albeit to a slightly lesser degree re-Su27+) products. Only Raptor is better. And given the long-term foreseeable world order in military aircraft combat capability (inc A/S), it'll cut the mustard.

Note also that, to side with your grammatical description of Typhoon (ie can't do it yet), I've used the correct tense about Raptor. Soddim, none of the current 'in-development/about to enter Service' aircraft (UK or US) fulfil their paper-specs to date. But they all will - and when Typhoon does, now only subject to HMG funding, it'll do the job, well. Forget F3 folklore, move on.

[jwcook]

Well the Radar in the Typhoon is by all accounts performing very well and has been credited with not only detecting aircraft at over 100 miles has been tracking them as well.

The maintanence is also below the contracted figures, by as much as a third!! the contracted figure is IIRC 9.5 hours per flight hour.

So the maintanence guys should go get a good novel or two.

Some other figures
the Raptor is supposed to be 15 MMH/FH, but not sure if there matching that so far .

The JSF will be very close to the Typhoon, maybe slightly better but only by mins.

older fighters are in the mid 20 to mid 30's eg Tornado and some are much higher....

These are from memory if anyone has a quotable source or better info, let me know...

Cheers

[Navaleye]

Well the Radar in the Typhoon is by all accounts performing very well and has been credited with not only detecting aircraft at over 100 miles has been tracking them as well.

Good news, but detecting what? The US have been claiming 100nm detections for years, the F14 /Phoenix combo was designed just for that.

BWOS claim that a Typhoon with Meteor should be roughly on a par with a Raptor with AMRAAM . Hmnnn...