View Full Version : PA31-350 Power loss
On eyre
1st Jun 2004, 13:23
Anyone know anything about power loss/controllability problem on ASA flight TL005 ADL - PAG on Friday 28 June. One pax. at least quite concerned.
apache
1st Jun 2004, 23:37
Is this some sort of "PREMONITION" ? or is it coming up to one year old ?
Methinks that maybe it happened on MAY 28 ?
BTW... I have no info.
On eyre
1st Jun 2004, 23:56
Sorry - getting ahead of myself. This year is going too fast.
Incident happened last Friday May 28.
Probably ran the Aux's dry and was lookin out the window at the time. :p
MarthaFarka
2nd Jun 2004, 10:36
Were you there or is this speculation?
shaablamm
4th Jun 2004, 10:35
I guess VIRGS is too busy to reply.
I know the guy and would imagine that he is just speculating MF... He certainly wasn't there as he's not in the country.
On the subject, the 'contollability' bit sounds iffy.
On eyre
10th Jun 2004, 01:16
Yeah - thanks everyone.
All good stuff but no answer to the original question. Guess no-one in ASA read this forum - ho hum.
Still concentrating on the load factors )not) to PLC I presume.
Capt Fathom
10th Jun 2004, 06:26
Not convinced with the 'dry aux tank' theory then On eyre
rearwhelsteer888
11th Jun 2004, 01:09
Don't mean to be a **** but I was interested to see what 23 metros said about getting the auxs over to the mains once they'd run out while you were half asleep with a coffee,Dispite what the manual says it should ,and in my experience needs to be back to front in relation to:
Pumps on .
Tanks to mains.
As soon as you hit the pumps you are pumping the lines to the already spluttering engine full of air,no way not for me,I've done it half a dozen times and the first time was the worst,from then on it was always
Tanks to mains
pumps on.
At least you pumping fuel
May sound like im being a gimp but if you fly these machines Id recommend it.
RWS888 :E
Fairdinkum I think you are all missing the main point.
Only a complete moron would run out of fuel to start with
marreeman
11th Jun 2004, 07:14
cdf come on bloke who said anything about running OUT of fuel. I think you would find, it would be quite a common practice to run the aux tanks down to nothing. The engine does not usually stop dead you get a drop in power then a surge most pilots know to within minutes of when this will happen, not to mention low fuel pressure lights will come on before the drop in power & surge occur this is when most pilots will change tanks & all is ok:ok:
olderbutyzer
12th Jun 2004, 04:48
their flying in a superior advanced aircraft.
A Chieftain is a superior advanced aircraft? Not in my books it ain't! :{
Willie Nelson
13th Jun 2004, 03:58
The fuel pumps in the PA-31's whether it be the Hi and low in the Chieftain or just the Hi in the Nav. They pump from tank to engine rather than aircraft like the Seneca that suck from the engine side of the show. The only possible sucking involved in a PA-31 is in the vacuum caused by the engine itself which now well below the 31" (eg. of cruise power setting) would be very low compared to normal but worth considering all the same.
Pinky the pilot
14th Jun 2004, 11:46
On eyre; It is possible that ASA staff peruse these pages but I suspect that they do not wish to comment on unsubstantiated and/or possibly scurrilous comments on what after all is a RUMOUR forum.
cdf; It is my sincere hope that your comment does not come back at sometime in the future to haunt you! I know of one pilot, a deputy chief pilot of a company at the time with over 8000 hrs who suffered the unfortunate circumstances that you described as could only happen to a 'moron'
It would do you good to remember the old phrase
"There but for the grace of God go I"
You only live twice. Once when
you're born. Once when
you've looked death in the face.
MarthaFarka
15th Jun 2004, 09:55
Give it to them Pinky! a bit the the other aviation truism regarding wheels up, there are those that have, and those that will!
Give it to them Pinky! a bit like the other aviation truism regarding wheels up, there are those that have, and those that will!
Spinnerhead
21st Jun 2004, 22:53
I agree with you 100% about tank changing in a cheiftain. Having flown a few thousand hours in them on freight and running out the aux's as a matter of course as it gives you a very accurate fuel flow rate (I could always get 148ltrs into an aux after running it dry, rather than the placarded useable of 142). I have often sat there bored out of my brain waiting for the "low press boost pump" light to come on (there is no "low press fuel" light), and then missed it whilst picking my nose and gazing out the window at the moon or something else really interesting. I also discovered through trial and error that the fastest way to get fuel back to the engine is by changing over the tanks BEFORE turning on the pump. If you have ever operated the cheiftain at high power settings in the cruise i.e. over 200 L/hr, then you discover that you actually need to watch the fuel pressure gauge for signs of a flicker, as the low press pump light will not give enough warning to prevent engine surging.
23 METROS
I think you will find that when a tank runs dry the fuel line has a mixture a fuel and air in it. A bit like when you are sucking the last bit of orange juice out through a straw. The surging is caused by the engine getting alternate hits of fuel and then air. One would expect low fuel pressure to create a lean mixture and thus rough running not surging. Rough running is what occurs when you hit take off power and your main tank selector is not fully open. But that is another story.
23 Metros In a Row
25th Jun 2004, 14:14
Hey Spinnerhead
You may be right, cause you just D on't K now if the lights are actually working.
Been there with the high power settings too, what fun that was! Like you, have plenty of time onboard the old Chiefy.
Taught a bloke or two a thing or two and learned a thing or two from another but that again is another story......
Hope the interview went well
23 Metros
flyhardmo
25th Jun 2004, 19:28
Fairdinkum I think you are all missing the main point.
Only a complete moron would run out of fuel to start with
Well in a chieften its very possible. Those 350's outdrink a pub per hour per engine
Manwell
27th Jun 2004, 07:14
Okay, I'm a moron!
Maybe a bit too fussy about knowing exactly how much fuel the beast is burning and didn't catch the fuel pressure gauge fluctuations or lights. The trouble is that it doesn't scare me, but it does scare pax.
Probably not good for the engine too,..
The only thing I could possibly say in my defense is that my fussiness about fuel has never let me run out of fuel for real.