A Chance To Take The ATPL Groundschool Course And The Gapan Tests - FOR FREE!

[InFinRetirement]

ATPL DISTANCE LEARNING GROUNDSCHOOL COMPETITION


For some time I have been telling you of a competition for ‘you’ to take advantage of 5 FREE ATPL distance learning groundschool courses, each worth £1900. These courses will be on offer to those who can demonstrate the strongest desires to take the first steps on the ladder to Professional flying. These 5 courses have been donated to the PPRuNe Fund by Bristol Groundschool for which we are truly grateful.

We are, therefore, very pleased to announce the commencement of a selection assessment process to choose FIVE candidates for these courses.

You will be required to show determination, motivation and dedication with an above average desire to get on the Professional Pilot ladder. You will also have to demonstrate that you are worthy.

There are a number of requirements you must meet to participate. Please take a careful look at these to satisfy yourself that you can fulfil each one. There are no shortcuts. You must prove your desire to be considered. You must prove some academic qualities. You will also have to demonstrate that you have the financial means to continue the FULL (F)ATPL course. In other words if you cannot afford to go all the way we will not waste a course on you. The GAPAN aptitude tests will tell you, and us, if you will make it. Together they will tell you if you have a future in the airlines.

1. As stated above the first five BGS courses are free. Subsequent courses will not be free. All monies spent by the Fund to the benefit of selected candidates will be the subject of a payback scheme that will include a special re-payment of £1500 at the rate of £100 per month interest free. This payment will be your contribution to the Fund to help other wannabes. For the subsequent courses the cost of the BGS course will be added and the repayment period extended pro rata. This arrangement will be contracted and will commence at the end of the first month after gaining full employment.

2. You must hold a valid PPL and have acquired a total time of not less than 30hrs and not more than 70hrs. Please note: Those with any form of professional licence are excluded from this competition.

3. You must have a Class ONE medical at the time of taking part in the selection process.

4. You must have been registered on PPRuNe for a minimum of 3 months.

5. You will be expected to write to us in not more than 230 words why YOU should be chosen for selection. Tell us about yourself and why it is you we should consider above anyone else. Do not try too hard, be yourself. Also tell us separately about a little of your background with your educational qualifications and achievements so far. You should send your entry by E-MAIL only to this e-mail address stating your PPRuNe username and you full real name: [email protected] putting on the subject line the following: “BGS distance learning courses.” Note: You must fill in the subject line or your entry will be void and will be considered SPAM and deleted.

From the entries PPRuNe Towers, Scroggs, PPRuNe Radar and myself will assess the entries and invite those we consider worthy to attend the interviews. We will then select 10 candidates, and the best FIVE will go forward on the first available GAPAN testing date to RAF Cranwell where a former BA Training Captain will take you through the test.

If selected to attend the GAPAN tests you must achieve a high or average assessment. The tests, the cost of which is £150, will be paid for by the PPRuNe Fund. If any one of the selected candidates fails the tests the next highest placed reserve will go forward to the tests until we have a FINAL five. Please note: The tests were designed for people with little or no flying experience. The validity of the test declines rapidly for those who have in excess of 150hrs of pilot flying. This is why the tests are restricted in the numbers of hours you have flown.

The selection of candidates will take place at the Holiday Inn Hotel, Langley Drive, Crawley, Sussex. We will select a number of candidates to attend the interviews purely from their short essays. Date and time will be notified to those who are selected for interview.

Please watch this thread only - for any further details. You may ask questions if you so wish but once we announce that the process is under way the thread will be closed.

We wish you the best of luck.

IFR

[PaddyMcGinty]

I've already paid for my first module with Bristol GS but haven't sat my exams yet. Is there any way I can still participate? Thanks

Steve

[G SXTY]

That's a great opportunity - good luck to everyone who qualifies.:ok:

[trevelyan]

2. You must hold a valid PPL and have acquired a total time of not less than 50hrs and not more than 70hrs.

Are we talking P1 time here or total time? Most people pass the PPL skills test with 55 - 65 hours. With a bit of post PPL flying most people are going to be over 70 hours total logbook time.

Seems a bit of a tight hours bandwith considering the long winding road ahead that is ATPL - saving a candidate 1900 quid is very nice, but when he/she is already looking at another 30 or 40k im not sure that its going to get everyone reaching for their biro`s...

The Bristol modular course looks very good, but its the smallest part of the financial minefield a wannabe ATPL is going to face, granted cant do the CPL without them, but the course fee is less than a fifth of an IR - Now that would be a prize.......


:ok:

[InFinRetirement]

When you put the quote up, the middle part answered your own question - total time.

For each and every individual the cost of an ATPL is a requirement they will have to commit to. There is virtually no other way. What we are doing is making it marginally easier for someone with determination to get there.

Groundschool is the first essential. Without it no one is going anywhere in commercial aviation. The GAPAN aptitude test is the ONE test that will tell if a candidate is good enough. Whether to invest money in him or her self. Having passed it I suspect a bank might be more willing to assist an aspiring individual.

[trevelyan]

Thats cool, and best of luck to all who go for it!

Just thought the 70hr top limit might exclude a large number of new PPL`ers.

:ok:

[esvdx]

Hi,

Can you give an indication of a closing date for the 'competition' (if there is one) and a rough idea of how long to the selection phase?

I've got all the ticks in the boxes, except due to work commitments my Class I is scheduled for late June.

Similar to Paddy above, I've already paid for Module 1 with Bristol but haven't started, would that rule me out?

Thanks

esvdx

[InFinRetirement]

esvdx / PaddyMacGinty

Not sure about this one, I would have to talk to BGS but I am sure something could be worked out and so that BGS did not lose out.

There is no closing date for the competition. But we will require a reasonable number to interview and select from, and I do not see that happening before the end of June. July might be about right though. We intend to be a little flexible - if we can!


IFR

[InFinRetirement]

AMS

Have to say that this is not an application. It is a competition. However, just follow the details and you can send it when you wish. But please bear in mind that nothing will appear to be happening for some while.

IFR

[wbryce]

argg...damn!

i only got 5hrs T/T.....maybe next time :8

[trevelyan]

...and ive got just over 70.

Life just aint fair.

:{

[Digitalis]

So, on the basis of that, are you not going to apply? Or do you perhaps think it might be worth applying because the limits may have been set just a little more strictly than they needed to have been? What's the worst that can happen? Your application gets binned - are you worse off than you were before? No? So get on with it, then!

[Lightning_Boy]

I'm a fling wing pilot, I have 60 hours, so can I apply or is it just for you plank drivers.

Many Thanks

LB

:ok:

[jonathang]

Good opertunity, first time I wish I had less hours lol.

[PPRuNe Pop]

LB, nothing wrong with rotary pilots applying. Your PPL time is the key and no experience of fixed wing will be all to the good if you get through.

[Deano777]

I would definately be interested but I am just outside the hour bracket with 78 hrs in the logbook, and I assume with the criteria being so strict it is a waste of time me applying. (also upping my hours this week too when I finish work) ah well never mind, good luck to those who meet the entry criteria

Dean.

[El Desperado]

Bleh - first lesson in commercial aviation. Goalposts move when the people who move posts consider they need to be moved.

"Only CPL/IR holders who have in excess of 1500 hours turbine time need apply..." And when the (small) supply of people who meet the conditions dry out, suddenly the guy who has the 250hr CPL/IR but has kept the IR current gets a look-in.

Not saying you guys will, but the worst than can happen is someone files your email under 'spam'. Ermm.. wow. If that's the worst that someone does to you in a flying career than you will be very well off !

70 hours... 78 hours.... what's the practical difference in experience. None. That's right. None. The guys here have made an arbitrary decision, for reasons that obviously suit their selection criteria (there must be a cut-off) that may or may not come to be the ruleset that passes muster. Perhaps they will be flexible. Perhaps not. Unless you submit an application you'll never know.

Personal note - I was outside the age requirements by 6 months several years ago for a sponsorship. I still went for it. And.... mixed-haul 757/767 SFO five years later.

I'm not advocating spamming the poor Prrune fund trustees with hopeless applications, but if you're a whisker out... why not ?

[mungo_55]

Sounds like a great idea !

Can I ask a couple of questions ?

Is it too late now to apply ?

Also, I wasn't too clear about the repayment scheme. Am I right in thinking the course is free, but you have to make a £1500 contribution to the fund (payable over time) once you have employment ?

[InFinRetirement]

I apologise for not answering a couple of questions sooner. So here is a reply. If you still not sure do please contact me personally by e-mail the addy is in my first post.

70 hours... 78 hours.... what's the practical difference in experience. None. That's right. None. The guys here have made an arbitrary decision, for reasons that obviously suit their selection criteria (there must be a cut-off) that may or may not come to be the ruleset that passes muster. Perhaps they will be flexible. Perhaps not. Unless you submit an application you'll never know.

This is a good example. Just apply if you are a few hours over our limit. The BASIS of the required hours is purely this. The validity of the GAPAN tests are based upon people with NO hours. GAPAN then decided that with 150 hours the quality of the tests declines rapidly and has little or no value in assessing a candidates ability. That is the reason. Take it then that a high number of hours will not be favourable.

I would definately be interested but I am just outside the hour bracket with 78 hrs in the logbook, and I assume with the criteria being so strict it is a waste of time me applying. (also upping my hours this week too when I finish work) ah well never mind, good luck to those who meet the entry criteria

Quite frankly this is a cop out! Just do what others have said "apply and be damned" the worst we will do is bin your application if it is too far over the top. So others with the same view can apply too.

A piece of advice from old IFR! If you decide that you are not a fit or proper person to apply because you are a couple of hours short or a couple hours over, you are letting yourself down and giving the wrong (or maybe right) impression of yourself. Is that what you want us to think?

Is it too late to apply?

Also, I wasn't too clear about the repayment scheme. Am I right in thinking the course is free, but you have to make a £1500 contribution to the fund (payable over time) once you have employment ?

No!

You are right. The first courses are free. The subsequent courses are not and we wish to recover the money to use again and again - if we can. So.........we ask you to make a contribution to the fund of £1500 at the rate of £100 a month as your "thanks" if you like, that the fund helped you. ONLY when you are in full time employment. The five cadets the fund helped to get a job, with Astraeus, do that now at the rate of £500 a month.

If you have anymore questions e-mail me.

In the meantime, we are short of applicants and I suggest you get in there ASAP. To get you excited, and we are NOT, we have only three applications so far. We thought by this time it would be a large number.:confused:

[la-knet]

The validity of the GAPAN tests are based upon people with NO hours.


So why can't we apply with 30 or 40 hours (half way through the ppl)???

[InFinRetirement]

The reason for some hours, which have now been reduced to 30 - 70 is a requirment of the Bristol Ground School. Clearly you must have some to undertake and reasonably understand the ATPL course.

[scroggs]

Can I just try and explain the course situation a little more clearly?

We have had 5 ground school courses donated to the Pprune Fund by Bristol Ground school, in an effort both to help a few Wannabes now, and to give the fund a bit of a leg-up in its future plans to help more Wannabes more substantially. While the 20k-odd that IFR has raised is a major achievement, I'm sure you all understand that it wouldn't go far if we wanted to sponsor more people, So, we are hoping to use the free courses to generate a bit of income for the fund (so we can help more people) while effectively giving an interest-free loan to the successful applicants - which does not have to be paid back until you are in employment.

The points you raise about hours have been noted, and we are prepared to extend the bracket to accommodate more people; IFR will notify you of the new criteria shortly.

If there are other aspects of the scheme that put you off, please raise your questions here- we can't put your minds at rest if we don't know what you're thinking!

Please remember that the whole purpose of this scheme, and the fund generally, is to help Wannabes towards their licences. Nothing else.

Scroggs

[ikea]

sponsorship is not fair!! tener bet the winner is a middle class person with plenty of money-who doesnt need to have it free anyway, how about making it means tested, or go on your parents earning, whats they point in paying for someone if they can already afford it? I have foun GAPAN to be very elitis, and im not even going to bother applying

[aaaaa]

ikea

So you have just discovered life isn't fair, tough, join the club.

Maybe your post is a wind up but if anyone offers assistance to help you achieve your career and you are so rude as to complain about it then you don't deserve the help.

PPRuNe in this respect, has helped people in the past and hopefully will do in the future, with nothing to gain except just to assist wannabes get their first foot on the aviation ladder. The guys who organise this volunteer their valuable time and all you can do is kick them in the teeth. If I were them, I think I would throw in the towel at the rudeness of the likes of you. I just hope there are not too many of your sort out there.

Unless one is the offspring of extremely wealthy parents, there are probably not many people, irrespective of class, who can really afford the very expensive path to becoming an airline pilot.

Many wannabes and in fact I should imgine most of them, try and achieve their qualification without having to resort to borrowing from their parents. Please note the word 'borrow'

Is this why you are so bitter? No rich person to sponsor you?

I am glad you are not bothering to apply, that is your loss. Are you naive or just plain uncivil?

Enjoy selling furniture

:E :E :E
aa

[ikea]

whatever! i assure you the one who is picked will be middle class-someone who can afford to pay for it anyway. and yes-life is uunfair, hence im going to be self-sponsored! and sellign furniture is fun! shame i only do it 8hrs/week, the rest of my time is spent doing a degree at one of the UKs best Universities-so my days of selling flat packed furniture are numbered-but good luck to you all!!!!

[InFinRetirement]

ikea


i assure you the one who is picked will be middle class-someone who can afford to pay for it anyway


Oh really! And would you mind telling me where you have collected that piece of information from please?

You should refer yourself to the original page to see what is required. Perhaps it might be that you cannot meet any of the requirements. But, it doesn't matter, you sell your pre-packed furniture but be sure to keep an eye on this thread when we select FIVE people to advance ONE step on the ladder. Where they come from, who gave birth to them is of no consequence. What we need is the motivation and drive to succeed.

[densil]

InFinRetirement

I was just wondering if it would be possible for you to give us a bit of an update regarding the announcement of successful applicants and interview dates?

Regards,

James

[PPRuNe Pop]

Quite right! The current situation is that we now have 11 people who have taken advantage of the scheme, when we get one or two more we will start to process the candidates. That should be within the next month or so.

Once the first one is dealt with I think we will see a lot more interest - which, sadly, has not been as we would have expected.

No matter, we will strive to help the wannabes and I personally will continue to make the fund grow.

IFR aka PPP

[InFinRetirement]

The list, for the time being, is now closed on the current evaluation of 13 candidates.

In accordance with our plans we can accept further applications based upon the original page ONE of this thread. If you expect to offer yourself do PLEASE carefully read the page and digest the information for the next courses.

Thanks to those who applied. We will be in touch with all of you individually when we have made a final selection.

IFR

[hollywood285]

very helpful!!!

[Pearcy]

this gives me the perfect excuse to spend the money finishing my PPL even if i don't finish the competition.
thanks!!

[InFinRetirement]

What an exciting week!

In addition to the lucky 4 who will be selected for B757 training with Astraeus, we have now selected 8 students who will be interviewed on the 19th January as the final part of the process to allocate the BGS courses we are offering to those who want to step on the ladder towards an ATPL.

The response for these places was disappointing, with only 13 applying, but we managed to select some worthy students who will hopefully go forth into the ranks of the professional pilots.

The 8 being interviewed include reserves should any of the top five fail the GAPAN tests.

This will conclude the first offer. We will then lay plans to get another selection under way in the near future.

Good luck.


IFR