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pulse1
3rd Oct 2001, 18:08
Latest issue of The Big Issue stars our own Danny Fyne with supporting cast of Pprune.

Pprune is described as "a hot bed of expertise" - obviously thinking of TD and TW who surprisingly do not get a mention. (DF keeping all the credit to himself?)

Actually, a very good article by Jane Mackenzie. Danny's common sense approach comes over very well I thought.

If I knew how to link to it I would. You will all just have to buy your own copies. :D

Flintstone
3rd Oct 2001, 21:01
Hey mister.

If I buy a copy do I get the dog on a string as well?

The Guvnor
3rd Oct 2001, 21:12
I know that pilots are always bitching about the fact that they need to earn a minimum of the GDP of most African countries in order to keep their many ex wives at bay/kids in private schools/yachts afloat/private aircraft aloft/maintain second (or third, or fourth) homes in sunnier climes etc etc - but the fact that The Big Issue is doing articles about PPRuNe clearly indicates that either:

a) the GDP of an African nation is insufficient to maintain pilots in the manner to which they quickly become accustomed; or

b) they are expecting a sizeable portion of pilots to be joining their vendors in the not too distant future.

On the basis of 'what goes around, comes around' I have always bought the Big Issue - though I haven't seen this month's one yet!

I shall plod off in search of a homeless person forthwith.

HugMonster
3rd Oct 2001, 22:15
Well, I don't have an ex-wife, or a current one. I have no yacht, no house in the south of France.

I have a rented house, which has been sold by the owners, no job, and I'm living on my savings.

Guv, I know that you like stirring it, particularly with regard to pilots, their pay and woking conditions, but right now jokes about pilots joining the ranks of "Big Issue" sellers are not very funny. I know you meant no offence, but...

The industry is looking in a very parlous state at the moment. I have a lot of former colleagues who are very genuinely struggling.

sanjosebaz
4th Oct 2001, 02:17
Traps???? Do you mean tramps, perchance? :rolleyes:

The Big Issue is not unique to UK. It came from Gordon Roddick (Body Shop) seeing Street News, a newspaper sold by homeless people in New York, and deciding to set up a similar venture in Blighty (1991).

The Big Issue is now part of the International Network of Street Papers, linking similar magazines sold by the homeless throughout the world. :(

Paterbrat
4th Oct 2001, 04:40
The answer folks is, yes!! a lot of our profession are really hurting. Those twats who pushed the odds, did so a bit too much. The whole shebang was wobbling anyway and they just tipped the f***er over,
Now the steamroller is about to run over them and squash them. And I for one am getting ready to cheer, because they went jus a little too damned far.
Every single one of us gets a little bit of lattidude. Maybe an altitude bust of 360 feet, maybe a few extra knots on the approach, maybe you did get a little close behind that guy on the approach into Brussels this afternoon. It's all in the system and it will cope. But!!!! Step too far out of line, and you endanger every f...ker on the bus; suddenly we are not pleased. Even the mildest has suddenly realised that we are all heading for a very bad time.
The tit that did it, is now head down saying he had nothing to do with it. There are a lot of people wishing that he hadn't brought them into it, and there is a massive hesitatation world wide going on.

ARE WE DOING THE RIGHT THING??

IS THIS THE RIGHT ACTION ??

ARE WE BACKING THE RIGHT HORSE??

The answer is YES! YES! YES!

The Yanks did what ever single person on this globe wanted. They hesitated. They considered. They thought about it. They colllected evidence. They did NOT!! act reactively. They have tried to get a collective vote from eveyone and they have tried TOO DAMNED HARD!!!

Time is passing, memories are fading, shock is dulled. Our outrage is being obscured by the 1000's of fleeing (innocent) Afghans to whome reassurance, ( and aid ) is being extended.

If nothing is done now, soon, nothing will ever be done and the moment will have passed.

( Just a personel feeling, nothing serious. )

Throtlemonkey
4th Oct 2001, 04:49
What is the "Big Issue" and can i get a cpy of it in oz or online.

Congrats to Danny for the well deserved regognition of his efforts.

sanjosebaz
4th Oct 2001, 05:00
Big Issue (UK) does have a web site ... http://www.bigissue.co.uk ... but it doesn't appear to carry actual copy, unlike "real" online newspaper sites. You'll have to fly to Blighty - then you'll see it for sale in any major city - they go to great lengths to ensure that it is only sold by the genuine homeless, on the streets. When I am in UK, I usually give them the money but refuse the mag, since that gives them one more to sell ;)

Eric
4th Oct 2001, 11:56
On the basis of 'what goes around, comes around' I have always bought the Big Issue - though I haven't seen this month's one yet!

Good to see you're doing your bit Guv, but it comes out every week! :)

The Guvnor
4th Oct 2001, 12:58
Eric - so I see by looking at the masthead! Just goes to show I don't get out as much as I should. Review of the copies I have lying around here indicates approximately a 50% acquisition rate. :o :o :o

Celtic Emerald
4th Oct 2001, 14:23
beckxy

I resent your comments calling homeless people tramps (traps actually) :rolleyes:
I do work with the homeless, I've already spent an half an hour today trying to get a young homeless man off the street and into a position where he can build a better future for himself.

People like you who make derogatary remarks about people who are down on their luck never know what fate has in store for them.
But for the grace of God you could be in that situation given the same life circumstances. A little empathy and respect for people less fortunate than yourself wouldn't go amiss, you never know what life holds for you & I'm sure if your ever down on your luck you'd like people to treat and respect you as a human being as these "tramps" deserve to be" and not degrade you any further.

For any pilots/airline employees who are struggling at the moment my heart goes out to them. The knockdown effect the industry shakeup must be having on people and their families who work in the airline industry must be devastating. I'm truly sorry.

Emerald

Tricky Woo
4th Oct 2001, 15:11
Beckxy,

Likewise, I am appalled at your insensitivity. How dare you refer to homeless people as "tramps". The word "Tramp" has been politically incorrect for yonks and yonks.

As you know, the language of political correctness is in rather a state of flux. The latest news is that the homeless are beginning to find "homeless" far too negative, and, to be honest, rather passé. So they dropped it entirely.

In consultation with Saatchi & Saatchi, the "temporarily nameless" searched for a more up to date, trendier name; one that reflects their status, their impact on the modern landscape, their hopes for succour.

Their search was not in vain: There's a new term on the streets, and I have to say that the trendier magazines are already using it.

So here's your chance to show that you've mended your naughty ways: why not jump straight to the latest politically correct term? Skip the whole "homeless" word entirely? It's far more chic, too.

In future, please refer to these unfortunate people as the "biohazards".

A little sensitivity goes a long way, I find.

TW

rover2701
4th Oct 2001, 15:24
Beckxy

I am saddened by you calling the homeless tramps. The people who sell the Big Issue actually have to buy it for 50pence before selling it on. Whenever I see a seller I always purchase a copy. It shows me that that individual is trying his hardest to try and extricate himself from his unfortunate position. All power to him I say, and wish all the Big Issue sellers, and there Magazine good luck.
On a lighter note circulation may go down now that Danny has found his way into it

;) ;) ;) ;)

rebeccadblake
4th Oct 2001, 17:43
I didn't mean to cause offensive.

I have deleted the post, now sorry.

But I dont think its fair that you should judge me like that, I have done tons of chartiy work more than you lot put together I bet!!, if your going to write something bad about someone I advise that dont come to any conclusions first, and I think comments like

"People like you who make derogatary remarks about people who are down on their luck never know what fate has in store for them" its a bit childish to make such threats, it was a simple comment that you took the wrong way.

We have very few homeless people in bournemouth I am not too aware of the formalaties.

I am a really nice person.. really I am :( :( :( :( :(

--------------------------------------------
I am not aware of too many things
I know what I know if you know what I mean

Tricky Woo
4th Oct 2001, 17:53
Beckxy,

If you read my post again, slowly, you'll see that I'm on your side.

As to whether you're a nice person or not, I prefer to simply day-dream as to how much of a babe you are. Are you? If so, when are you coming to Zürich to meet me?

TW

pulse1
4th Oct 2001, 19:09
When I started this thread I wasn't sure where to post it, not being one of your actual perfessional pielots - more yer strictly amatueur jobs really.

I had hoped it would generate some mirth on the content of the article rather than a debate on the homeless, whatever they are called.

Perhaps when more people have had the opportunity to read it we will have more fun.

Still I'm off to the sun, courtesy jmc, so I look forward reading all about it when I get back. :cool:

Sensible
4th Oct 2001, 22:45
Beckxy, I didn't see anything offensive in your post. I think tramp is as good a word as any since it conveys to me exactly the type of person you mean. Homeless person is entirely incorrect since many Big Issue sellers are not at all homeless and often their lifestyle is a matter of their personal choice although I would agree that it may be a restricted choice.

If some people took offence at your post Beckxy then it's their problem, not yours!

I'm so fed up with all this negative politically correct crap! Get a grip on life people!!

The Guvnor
4th Oct 2001, 22:50
Now, if Beckxy had been a Yank, she'd have called them 'bums' - which doubtless would have caused lots of confusion as the one thing the airline industry is looking for is 'bums on seats'.

Hmmmmmmm ... might have the solution as to why Danny was featured then - Air Two Bob are looking for penny stamps to fill up their flights and make the competition jealous! :D :D :D

tony draper
4th Oct 2001, 23:01
Used to be some real Tramps still around when Draper was a sprog, I remember one used to appear every summer ,he was a proper tramp, string around his coat, floppy ragged felt hat, huge red beard,Gentlemen of the road they were called in those days, we were terrified of him.
Most of them then chose that life, and I don't recal people sleeping in carboard boxes in our green and pleasent land then either. ;)

Feline
5th Oct 2001, 23:24
Yes TD, I also remember a time when tramps were "Gentlemen of the Road", which was when most aeroplanes still had propellers (remember them?). But if you think about it, in those days they didn't have cardboard boxes big enough to live in (unless you were a hampster or a hedgehog!) :D ;) :D

Sheeit Dude! This thread is getting well off topic!

rebeccadblake
6th Oct 2001, 00:02
Thanks guys.

Tricky woo, I wasn't refering to you, dont worry I liked your post.

I was mainly refering to "celtic emerald".

I really like your post Sensible, thanks.. you make a lot of sense (not that anyone else doesn't oh boy I am scarred of saying the wrong thing now)

Velvet
6th Oct 2001, 01:33
Whatever happened to the right to an opinion, whatever happened to the right to voice that opinion! Beckxy, don't let anyone scare you into silence, it merely reinforces their belief that they alone hold the moral highground, when it is merely window-dressing to hide their own insecurities.

Why is it acceptable for some to think that they can be personally offensive against others about whom they know nothing, especially from (or because of) a position of anonymity. Selective tolerance only for those who you think deserve it means you are intolerant for all those you disapprove of, or who don't agree with your thinking. A bully is one who abuses others and forces them into an action they otherwise wouldn't do. Empathy and respect is demanded for ‘less-fortunate’ groups (possibly in an attempt to be seen to be compassionate), but not given to those around you and a form of abusive 'guilt' is employed to force someone to comply with your demands to ‘fall in line’.

To judge others based on one’s prejudice and ignorance is bad enough, to then clothe in some kind of pseudo moral superiority, implies that one needs to be ‘seen’ to be doing good, rather that one does it.

Loki
6th Oct 2001, 01:59
Once again the spectre of PC rears its disgusting head.

People who stand in front of department stores selling The Big Issue (homelessness) are of course supposed to be homeless themselves, demonstrating to themselves and others a willingness to do something about their predicament. I expect that the PC tyrants will soon decide that "homeless" is itself a derogatory term and be insisting on a new (and probably inane) term.

I agree with comrade Draper about the term "tramp" and remember them myself in the pre cardboard box era. The term, I believe describes their lifestyle (tramping about)just as the term beggar describes the actions of those people. Where I come from we call a spade a spade ( that`s not racist for any septics reading this), if not a bloody shovel.

Stop telling me how to describe the world around me! Rant over.

Paterbrat
6th Oct 2001, 05:10
Oh thank goodness someone else had had a little rant. I fear that in the grip of the date rape drug the other evening I got carried away, and wandered quite off thread besides.
The Big Issue is a worthy cause, surprisingly good read, and obviously casting a wide net to have fished up our very own PPrune leader.
The Homeless, Tramps, Bums, Biosalespersons, or Ladies and Gentlemen vendors of said newsheet I do think are certainly very much more deserving of our help than a number of other more slothful people who simply stick a hand out while smoking or taking a swig from a can or bottle.
It is a sad situation for anybody to be in and I for one am sincerely grateful that I am not in that position and from time to time purchase the broadsheet

Celtic Emerald
6th Oct 2001, 19:26
beckxy

I wasn't trying to threaten you when I said about 'what fate might have in store for you', but this is an subject I am very sensitive about because in my regular dealings with the homeless I see where many people fail to see a person worthy of respect & dignity behind the 'run down' exterior. The people I deal with have backgrounds ranging from drug addicts, alcoholics to family problems. Many people view them with either fear, disgust, or pity and many are loathe to get involved but behind this exterior when you get speaking to these people you often find wonderful people with loads of potential & personality and background who through no fault perhaps through an addictive personality find themselves on the streets. No, my wish to be involved with these people does not come from a sense of moral superiority rather because through experiences in my own life I can identify with these people and have learned that people are not always to blame for their life circumstances, and empathy and a helping hand can never go amiss. I have to admit sometimes I find people who've had life always go their way sometimes are the last to empathise with people down on their luck such is there feeling 'I can cope, so why can't everyone else'.

I'm sorry if I offended but the tone of your post did upset me but I understand it wasn't intentional or really the impression you mean't to convey.

Emerald

[ 06 October 2001: Message edited by: Celtic Emerald ]

Sensible
6th Oct 2001, 19:52
Beckxy, a classic response from a holier than thou PC person finding themselves under justifiable criticism. I repeat, there was nothing wrong with your post Beckxy, you have just received an apology albeit half hearted from one of your attackers, I wonder if any will actually have the balls to give you an unreserved apology!!

redsnail
6th Oct 2001, 20:09
Gees, this is bloody Jet Blast. So beckxy said a word...... Gees..... :rolleyes:

Sensible
7th Oct 2001, 02:51
Ha Redsnail, they don't have grouse shoots down is Aus. do they? :D

Paterbrat
7th Oct 2001, 03:18
I'm not positive sensible, but I'm not sure that 'balls' applies in this particular situation.

redsnail
7th Oct 2001, 03:28
Sensible, we have a lot of grouse things in Oz ;)
I used to think Grouse was a saying.. till I saw some in a field having a fight. Cracked up laughing, no way could I shoot them..... ;)

Sensible
7th Oct 2001, 03:37
Paterbrat, that was figuratively speaking!!!!

redsnail, the grouse in the UK are usually found in Heather :D :D

tony draper
7th Oct 2001, 04:10
lucky girl that Heather ;)

henry crun
7th Oct 2001, 06:15
And even luckier the grouse.

redsnail
7th Oct 2001, 14:47
Sensible... wahay! ;)

[ 08 October 2001: Message edited by: redsnail ]

HugMonster
7th Oct 2001, 15:05
I shall have to rib him unmercifully when I see him next week! :D

Capt PPRuNe
12th Oct 2001, 11:45
:confused: Ooooh... off topic or what? Having just returned from BKK I haven't had a chance to see the Big Issue and couldn't find anyone selling it in my nearest population centre.

Anyone care to post the article on here or better still mail me a copy of the article?

Paterbrat
12th Oct 2001, 13:11
Danny, your lead pig's starboard wing is beating at 1.6 beats/sec, the port, half that rate and apparently a smaller stroke at that. This could of course mean that he was in fact, in, or entering a non standard holding pattern, he is quite correctly seen keeping up a decent traffic scan, but I digress... again.
Didn't see the article either, if you get it perhaps you could post it for us please.

PPRuNe Dispatcher
12th Oct 2001, 13:48
Danny -

A copy is on it's way to you.

---Mik

Capt PPRuNe
12th Oct 2001, 18:33
Paterbrat, as soon as i receive my copy I will scan it and post it for all to see and criticise as necessary.

As for your observations on my piggie likeness and the fact that any pig, flying or otherwise, must be a rare sight indeed in your part of the world, I think you may need to get out a bit more! :p

Paterbrat
13th Oct 2001, 02:14
Very true. They are in fact seen so rarely that a chap in Dahran got the paperwork to import a dog( has to be a hunting dog of some type) and was able to bring a piglet in as a certified truffle hound, and no-one turned a hair. Said trufflehound sadly ended up shortly after with an apple in it's mouth.

rebeccadblake
13th Oct 2001, 02:48
I dont think any of us want to critise babes.. I certainly dont. Can't speak for some of us here tho. (mentioning no names)

Hope you had a nice trip.. speak to ya soon

Pseudonymn
13th Oct 2001, 13:53
Not to advertise or anything, but....


Geez, it's Grouse at Hardware House!!!!!

It must be an "Ozzie Chick Thing"... ;) :D :p