How long did it take you to get your first job?

[Fat, Dumb & Happy]

There are many future fATPL holders (including me) who are wondering about the chances of a job. Most of the fATPL's I know have now found work, but they all have >1000 hours instructing, and that sadly isn't an option for many people with £50k already invested.

Having read on another thread (http://www.pprune.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=125262) about the depressing number of fATPL holders who are still hunting for a job, I'm interested in the other side of the coin ....

How long did it take you to get your first "airline" (ie not hours-building FI / Meatbombing / Glider Tugging) job? How many hours did you have at the time?

FD&H

[redsnail]

Australia.
CPL obtained in 1991. Recession etc.
First Airline type job in 1998. FO Bandits. 3300 hours TT

UK.
ATPL obtained in July 2002. Got job in ops immediately. Flying doing night freight for same company on Sheds, 6 months later. 4500 hours TT.

Now looking for another job. 5100 hours TT.

[Luke SkyToddler]

Got CPL in 1995, spent 6 1/2 years in the aviation wilderness, spent my time instructing, working in poorly paid menial jobs, and generally cruising the world looking for flying work.

Got first piston twin job with around 1800 TT, did that for 18 months.

Got first "airline" position this year. (turboprop RHS in the UK) with 2400 TT, 550 MEP.

[PPRuNeUser0215]

First CPL/IR in 1991, bits and bobs for the next five years and first Air Taxi job (From 500 hours to 1200. Single Piston, Africa).
FATPL (UK) in 99 then first Turbine job (Single Turbine from 1200 to 1500 hours) in late 2000
First Jet job in 2001, October 2001 but like many I was made redundant before it has started.
December 2001 First twin Turbine job (from 1500 to 1700 hours, Africa).
February 2002 til March 2003... Back to the UK and twin pistons (1700 hours to 2200 hrs).
March 2003 First Medium/heavy jet job.... So far so good ;)

[Fuel Crossfeed]

Finished IR 10 days after 9/11 (nice timing!!)
Finished MCC in May 2002.
Finished FIC course May 03.
Joined airline 1st june 03.
300 hrs total time - was lucky with who I knew!!

[worzel]

Passed IR, in summer 2000.

Laned first job, multi engine turbo prop winter 2003.

The three and a half years in between spend desparately searching for that break.

worzel

[eagerbeaver]

finished training may 2001, licence atually issued 11/09/2001 ! FIC in November, instructed for 18 months then got first job with new airline at Luton, then recieved the bullet at christmas, back on the pile now.

Christmas was cancelled. Humbug.

[Howard Hughes]

Gidday Fat Dumb and Happy,

Living down under so this probably does'nt have much relevance.

Licensed August 1988.
First Job October 1998,
First Twin Job October 1999,
First Turbine Job March 2001,
First Turbine Command June 2002.

Total time now, 4050 hours of which 3300 is multi.

And as your name suggests, I too, am now fat dumb and happy....

Cheers, HH.

:ok:

[StudentInDebt]

Exams, BCPL and FI Sep-Jan 1999/2000

Started instructing June 2000

IR May 2001

Selected for jet job Sep 2001

Continue instructing and get time on air taxi Navajo

started jet job Jun 2003

Fatter, dumber and much much happier :D

[ECHIE]

Finished the ATPL course April 2002. FI rating April 2003, since then instructing at difrent schools. May 2004 turboprop job as FO on the ATR. Total time 340....

Greetings,

Theo

[buttline]

fATPL April 2003

First job on B737 Oct 2003 (CTC ATP Scheme)

[underread east]

fATPL March 2002
Job in night freight Ops department July 2002
Job on 757 with night freight operation May 2003 - 250TT

I know how lucky I was. However, it was not without a huge amount of graft on my part too. I had 2 near misses at jobs and the third one stuck. The airlines will look at the low-timer who makes him/herself stand out.

Take every opportunity to talk to absolutely anyone who is in commercial aviation, the vast majority are more than willing to take a bit of time to chat. It may well not lead to anything, but it has several benefits: It keeps you in touch with a business that unless you are closely involved with can prove elusive and you never know who or what they might know.

ANY job within aviation is better than sitting at home alone and hoping, especially with the smaller outfits - if you have the skills you are then in a position to make yourself known to the MD/Chief pilot who would otherwise have put your CV in the enormous pile with all the other suitably qualified individuals they have never heard of, other than by mass mailing. There may not be immediate opportunities for them to use you, but you are ideally placed for the time that WILL come eventually when they have got it their crewing levels wrong and are suddenly stuck for pilots. If that time doesn't come with that airline, you have still not wasted your time, but given yourself something else aviation related on your CV that may well set you apart when the others recruit.

I was very lucky, I got my job when a pilot from the airline I was working in OPs for tipped me off that the 757 operator I work for was recruiting low-timers. I called up IMMEDIATELY and had a CV in the recruiter's computer about 10 minutes after initial contact. Much hoop jumping ensued and here I am.

That's my story, obviously not the only way to do it, but it worked well for me. Have faith - it can be done. There are the jobs out there for the low-time pilot if you are persistent, and be sure to act on all rumours promptly - they can only be refuted, and if not you're ahead of the competition...

Good luck of you all...

[JetFixer]

IR finished in 2002.

Due to start first job in June this year as FO on a turboprop.

After nearly 2 years of sending out CVs mostly with no replies, last week I get a call from a guy overseas offering me another job flying as FO on a Twotter. Sods law!

I hope that the market is picking up for all of us wannabes.

Dont give up and good luck.:ok:

[Mr Magoo]

Hey, Mr Fixer, any chance of throwing that twotter job my way then? I've got all the ticks in all the boxes with 1100Hrs TT

Cheers

Magoo

[FougaMagister]

FD&H - I'll let you know when I find it! :rolleyes:

Cheers

[er82]

Passes IR 1st June 2002. Job on Turboprop Feb 2003. Now 750hrs TT (not much, but better than nothing!). Enjoying every minute

[Blu2]

Got my Frozen ATPL in April 1999 and first jet job in June 1999, not bad for 200hrs TT but realise I was stupidly lucky and am of course eternally grateful. Now have 1700hrs TT, all jet apart from those 200hrs and all is well. Do however have mates that were on my course that are still looking........:{

[JB007]

Obtained First Officer position on Jet in March 2004, passed IR in April 2004 - nepotism at it's best!!!!!

[FLYbyWIT]

Jet job before you got the IR passed, Sounds like a f**ken miracle to me.:p

[Baron Von Mildred]

FAA CPL ME IR 1991
CAA fATPL 1992
SEP Africa job 1996
MEP Africa freelance job 1997-99
FI job Uk 2001
Still not made it.

[dada]

trial flying lesson bolton air training school blackpool 1980. never took it any further. shame really

[New F/O]

Finished fATPLs + MCC 9-9-2001 :O
Sept 11th came along :{
Did FIC 2002
Instructed 2003
Did type rating 2003
Got job on type 2004 :O

Very happy now :ok:

Good luck

New F/O :ok:

[Alan Partridge!]

1999 PPL
1999-2001 CPL/IR Fr ATPL
2002 First Jet Job as F/O with low cost carrier with 220hrs
2004 1800hrs total!

A-Haaa

[euroflyer]

June 2002 - completed IR had 260hrs total
February 2004 - completed 757/767 type rating with airline
Now, a lot more hours and jet experience and a dream come true!!!!

[Snigs]

It seems that only the lucky are posting on here.

Me?

IR pass on 10/9/2001 (<--- look again!!!)
MCC
FIC 2003
Part time instructing because I can't afford to live on a full time FI wage
TT 450 hours.

Wait, you guessed it, no full time flying job, on jets, TP's or pistons, and getting increasingly unlikely as time goes on.

Just to put a little perspective to this thread, not everyone will get that first job ever!

[Kerropi]

Frozen ATPL CPL/IR

IR ===> 11 sept. 2001 :ugh:

TT: 350 hrs.

Working in IT

Still hoping for that job.......

K.

[IRRenewal]

It seems that only the lucky are posting on here.

Well, if you read the original message that opened this thread you might understand why that is.

Me? 4.5 years since getting CPL/IR, 9 years since I started flying after I had a trial lesson when I was bored one weekend.

All training done on the 'self-improver' system that used to exist before JAA came along. 'Unapproved IR' on reaching 700 hours instructing part time on a BCPL. Never spent a minute in a class room to pass the written exams.

[edited to add training information as requested by Louis]

[xodus]

IR + MCC completed spring 2003 - job, jets two months later.
blessed..........

[Louis Euan]

I dont know about anyone else but it would be nice to know where you all trained ie OATS Integrated or Modular etc.
Just a thought!!!

[runway]

OATS. Graduated 03-2003. Been cabin crew ever since! 300 hours now, and still trying!

[B757RATED]

Roughly 3 months and I started in April 1989.

450 hours total, I had 5 interviews, 3 job offers and 'chose' my first airline - Air Europe.

Great first two years and then the airline went bust. Out of work for a year and (B757rated !!!) no one would touch me with the proverbial barge pole.

I never did find such a good airline as AE and wish I had left the industry then and done something sensible.

[Ambulance 'Charlie Alpha']

BCPL issued May 1999

Total time 600 hours, got first job as summer scenic flight pilot in June 1999 on Cessna 172. (Single crew).

CPL issued October 1999

Total time 730 hours, got first multi-engine piston, scheduled pax job in February 2000. (Single crew)

Total time 1100 hours, got first multi-engine turbine job as F/O in October 2000. (Multi-crew, but on DHC-6, so single-crew in terms of CAA licencing). Got DHC-6 command at 1300 hours Total Time.

Total time 2400 hours, first proper multi-crew turbine job in September 2003, as Captain on SAAB 340s.

Enjoying every single minute of it!

CA

[Khaosai]

Trial lesson 89, hours building. 93 instructing. Start of 96 CTC led to 757. 99 Moved to the 744. 03 Moved to the 777. Happy camper, Rgds and keep plugging away !.

[Fokkerdriver]

Finished the integrated course Feb. 2002.

Worked the rest of the year to earn some money and spent them all on flighttime.

Feb. 2003 F/O turboprop.

I still feel very lucky!!!

[bmi-ERJ-FO]

Here's my short history:

Jan 1983 Born with "a dream to fly" already instilled in me
Aug 2001 Left school with A-levels
Sep 2001 Application to BA for their Cadet-scheme frozen
Oct 2001 Successfully completed an introduction to Cabin Crew course...then got told no airline would take me until I was 19. They never told me that before taking my money.....LOL
Mar 2002 Left for the USA for PPL + Hour Building
May 2002 Started ATPL theory exams (Distance Learning)
Aug 2003 Finished ATPL theories (all first time passes)
Oct 2003 Obtained CPL
Nov 2003 Passed ME/IR
28th Feb 04 Rejected at final Phase of CTC
2nd Mar 04 Last minute place on MCC/JOC at Oxford
Jun 2004 Starting with bmi Regional on ERJ-145

Total Time (including sim hours) = 288
Last Actual Flight = IR test (money has been so tight I've never actually flown apart from during my lessons!)

I just want to encourage people young and old....that even since 9/11 getting a job with low-hours: it IS possible. Even doing a Modular course at a 'smaller school than Oxford/Cabair/et all': it IS possible. After the painful rejection by CTC: it IS possible.

The key is to learn from all the experiences and become stronger, and not bitter/twisted. A bit of hope and faith go a long long way, as I can testify to.....

[fhchiang]

i read somewhere that there is overwhelming supply of pilots now..


i mean EXCESS of Pilot..... too many pilots on the market...

[The Greaser]

1995 - FAA PPL

1999 - FAA CPL/IR/CFI/CFII/MEI

1999-2001 - Hour building as single/twin instructor USA

Feb 2002 - Complete conversion to JAA CPL/IR (fATPL)

April/June 2002 - Successfully negotiate CTC ATP scheme hurdles

Dec 2002 - Start with ezy (B737)

Total time at first airline job 1500 hours (1000 piston single, 500 piston twin)

[sammyhostie1]

Hiya,

On my MYT training course, there was a bloke who had done his PPL, and CPL, but had no type rating.

He is now working as Cabin Crew with MYT because he cannot find a job.

It seems the hardest thing is to get a type rating?

Why not also do the same and Crew for a while?

At least then you can stay in aviation, make some contacts and improve your performance in CRM!

[loulou]

finished my CPL-IR training with MCC in 2001,
I had to work in an other area due to the bad situation of the airlines at this time
then I got 4 interviews,
passed 2 of them
I started to fly for TNT this year on Bae146 with 250 hrs total time

[Adhemar]

Loulou, please check your pm
thx
Adhemar

[FliegerTiger]

Adhemar, check your PM's