simulator hours

[traffic jam]

About simulator hours, do they count as hours in our total time when an airline is asking for a certain amount? Or do they not? And do they count as hours in a particular a/c type i.e a single or a twin?
Thanks

[mad_jock]

They don't count for anything apart from the completion of a course eg type rating, IR etc.

They don't go towards total time on your CV or in your log book.
I have seen some CV's with huge lists of sim time and types. But it looks very crap if you ask me.

MJ

[Pilot Pete]

Got to agree with M_J

This topic has been done several times in the past. The only pilots in the UK who seem to add these hours into their total time are low hours pilots. Employers are not interested in your 100 hours in a Frasca, just like they are not interested in my hundreds of hours in 757/767 sims.............. They want to know how many hours you have in the real thing only.

PP

[Manflex55]

Like other things on a CV, I think it's up to each individual to decide what he wants to put in. There is no specific rule. If you feel comfortable with adding the sim hours to your TT (and are ready to defend your case) and the airline does not state "actual flight time", go for it. I did it before (yes when I was a low time guy) & never got told off for doing so. I wouldn't exceed the max nr of sim hours you can "claim" for the purpose of the issue of an ATPL as stated in JAR-FCL 1. Say the airline asks for 500TT (no other specification) & you have 490 actual + min 10 in the sim, you should definitely apply.

[scroggs]

I don't even log simulator time at all. If I ever wanted to know how much I'd done, I'd ask my company. As no-one gives a damn, though, I doubt I'll ever bother.

Simulator time is ground training. Are you going to tell your prospective employers how much time you spent in the classroom as well?!

Scroggs

[SlowMover]

Hm. The company I was working for these days gives a little overview every months about the hours of flight time, and this actually does include every single simulator hour. As well as many even experienced captains and flight instructors told me they would count every simulator hour as flight time, so do I.
Maybe it is because of the differences regarding JAR and not-JAR countries (in Germany JAR regulations were introduced not so long ago).
And by the way, no-one ever complained about it before. So when I try to be lucky with my applications in other countries around Germany, I would give my total flight hours including sim hours.

[mad_jock]

Slowmover to be honest it dosn't really matter once you have a full ATPL and have 3000+ hours.

But some companys have insurance rules for low time pilots and contracts which stipulate how many hours crew have before they can operate for that company (Shell for example). Sim time is not included in these hours.

Dosn't look good if the company has an audit and finds out that you have 200 hours of sim time logged as TT and then loose the shell contract due to breech of contract.

MJ

[Luke SkyToddler]

Here's one for you then ...

Can you count sim multi crew time towards the 500 hours of multi crew time required for the issue of a JAA ATPL?

In my case I have all the hours requirements for the issue of the ATPL except for the multi crew, I've got more single crew multi piston hours than a bull can sh!t and my employer is keen for me to get my full ATPL issued so I can crack on with the command upgrade on the turboprop I presently fly. I've still got to get another couple hundred of multi crew in the aircraft, but if I count the initial MCC course / aircraft type rating sim training etc, then that would help a lot.

You reckon the CAA would go for it?

[redsnail]

Luke,
Initial MCC probably not, sim time for the rating is a possibility, sim time for recurrent checks is quite probable.*
Check with the CAA.

*I know someone who needed 500 hours for the 737 Oz to UK conversion. Needed to use some sim time to cover it. He had ~7000 hours jet FO time though.

[mad_jock]

From lasors G 1.2

500hours Multi-pilot operations on aeroplanes type certified in accordance with the JAR/FAR-25 transport cat .... etc

Cunning plan though

You also have to have a LPC after you have completed all the hours requirments.

MJ

[BigHairyBum]

Whilst I accept that simulator time is not always relavent when considering total time for a job application, put yourself in the employers shoes.

If someone has many simulator hours in a multi-jet sim then they are more likely to find a type rating easier and may have better crm skills as a result.

It is well worth highlighting sim time in addition to your total flight time.

Good luck.:ok:

[Artificial Horizon]

Luke SkyToddler,

I to am in that exact situation of just needing another 50 hours multicrew for the issue of an ATPL, I spoke to the CAA and it is a definate no go using simulator hours towards the total.

Oh well, back to knock off the next 50 hours, is it true that you need to do an LST after completing the hours as I have just done my LST so if this is the case will have to wait another year?????!!!!!

Surely not.

[Luke SkyToddler]

Damn :(

As far as the LST goes, my scant research leads me to believe that there is actually such a thing as an ATPL skill test that must be passed under JAR ... your guess is as good as mine as to what that involves and whether it's different to a regular LST though

I'll ask the boss and get back to y'all :confused: