Setting up a website

[AerBabe]

Firstly, apologies - I am sure this has been covered before, but every time I try & use the search facility it is down. I think it was BRL who asked before, so if he knows the link, perhaps he could just post it here?

Basically what I want to do is set up a website as an aid to job-hunting. I would ideally like a sensible address, such as: www.aerbabe.co.uk (except with my real name!). I would also like to add some of my photographs, extracts of things I've written and links to organisations I'm involved with.

I am almost a complete beginner with this, so am not really sure of the questions I should be asking. I would also appreciate Janet & John answers to those questions!

[silentwitness]

Hi Aerbabe

Well rather than me explaining the ins and outs of designing a website, I can do one for you if you like. No charge, I enjoy doing them.

One I've recently finished is

http://www.studioargent.co.uk

Let me know, cheers

Col

[AerBabe]

Thanks for the offer - I do like the design of that site and that's very generous of you! However, I really want to learn to do this... :O

[BRL]

Hi AB. First off, you can register your name for very little. I paid £7 for mine (evo.me.uk). You will then need some web-space for it to go on. I use my free 50mgs provided by BT and redirect the web name to that so if you type in evo.me.uk it goes to my free bt page where everything is held. You can get your name from http://www.freeparking.co.uk Do you have AOL? I can't remember, but they should provide free webspace for you.

To upload, you will need something like cute FTP, it works like windows explorer. Dead easy. If you use frontpage to do it then everything is even easier, just one click does it all. Mine looks like an index right now so I will have to save everything on there and put it all into my web-programme thingy, I have got Dreamweaver MX to do this.

I will look back for my thread all about it but I think the search is off right now. Check back later.

[RomeoTangoFoxtrotMike]

AerBabe

However, I really want to learn to do this...

Good idea -- learning "how to do it yourself" does have it's advantages :) The biggest variable is in how your provider provides access to the webspace he's given you.
BRL has pretty much summed it up about domains and space, but please come back to us if you need further help.

As to creating actual web pages, if you want to learn how to do it yourself, at least to start with, there is a very helpful tutoria here (http://www.obliquity.com/computer/html/) :ok:

HTH,

/RTFM

[AerBabe]

I have AOL, but not as my main ISP. I use PW's account when I'm away from home, but usually I dial up with Freeserve. I think they give free webspace too - will have to check.

I checked Free Parking and, although 'www.aer.co.uk' has gone, 'www.aerbabe.co.uk' hasn't. (Obviously using my real first/last names rather than my PPRuNe ones!) I'll register & pay for them when I get home. Presumably there are other sites where I can do the same, for a similar fee? £9.99 for two years seems ok though.

That tutorial looks like a good introduction, thanks RTFM. :)

[Blacksheep]

That on-line tutorial is ancient and not very applicable today. Also, while its useful to understand the basics of HTML there's not much point in trying to write your own code unless you're a true geek. Much better for the amateur to use a ready made web authoring program such as Microsoft's Front Page. Then you just follow the program's built in tutorial until you have something worth publishing on the web.

Frames based pages are fine in these days of almost universal IE Explorer - how many of those funny old text only browsers are there in use today? Frames based sites are usually much easier to navigate. Images were a problem in the days of 14400 dial-up modems but as long as the image size is minimized - respectable jpeg images around 30K will load in seconds on even the slowest dial-up - images aren't a problem as long as you don't put too many on one page.

The tutorial is spot on about pages 'under construction', strange font sizes and annoying backgrounds though. Generally the plainer a page is, the better it is to look at.

One of the main reasons for having a personal website is photo albums for friends and relatives. Try and use a good thumbnail generator - such as Irfanview (http://www.irfanview.com/) for just one good example.

Websites are fun, good luck.

[CBLong]

No no no no no, frames are evil! (http://www.google.co.uk/search?q=%22frames+are+evil%22)

:)

[RomeoTangoFoxtrotMike]

Sorry, AerBabe, I can see this degenerating into a religeous debate... :hmm:

Blacksheep...

AerBabe said "However, I really want to learn to do this...": Now while I agree that HTML 3 isn't the latest standard, and doesn't include CSS, it's perfectly OK for somebody who wants to learn the bascis ofhow to create web pages for themselves.

"there's not much point in trying to write your own code unless you're a true geek." -- I'm not sure if that's intended to be an insult or a compliment :rolleyes:

"Much better for the amateur to use a ready made web authoring program such as Microsoft's Front Page. Then you just follow the program's built in tutorial until you have something worth publishing on the web." I would certainly agree that content is much more important then format, but that "bad format" can make "good content" very hard to follow. Unless you have well-thought out content, all the "presentation eye-candy" in the world isn't going to help...

"Frames based pages are fine in these days of almost universal IE Explorer - how many of those funny old text only browsers are there in use today? Frames based sites are usually much easier to navigate. Images were a problem in the days of 14400 dial-up modems but as long as the image size is minimized - respectable jpeg images around 30K will load in seconds on even the slowest dial-up - images aren't a problem as long as you don't put too many on one page. "

Well, I profoundly disagree about the need to pander to the lowest common denominator, no matter how ubiquitous it is, instead of aspiring to standards compliance. A site does not need Flash, bells, whistles, and all other manner of flashing lights in order to be effective... :suspect:

I'll shutup now...

[yintsinmerite]

If you want a good free HTML editor, try AceHTML5 from www.visicommedia.com/. It can all be done in notepad, but this has byuilt in previews etc. They also do a pretty good free FTP client to upload the website

[Bre901]

Just my 2 pence.

I do agree that you do not need to write your HTML code by hand.

Nevertheless, a fair knowledge of basic tags is quite useful as you may sometimes need to adjust things that the HTML editor does not put the way you want, or if you want to make minor corrections, it is indeed much faster to change a few characters in the HTML source code with Notepad or Wordpad, than firing up Frontpage or whichever.

And no, I do not consider myself as a geek (even though I would no take that as an insult :8 :8)

Another free HTML editor is the one that comes along with Netscape (Netscape Composer). It generates more standard (and less bloated) code than Frontpage (this is an easy one). Not many bells and whistles and no assistant, but who cares. I appreciate the possibility to switch between Edit/Preview/Source modes.

[Naples Air Center, Inc.]

For beginner web design, I recommend Dreameaver (http://www.macromedia.com/software/dreamweaver/?promoid=home_prod_dw_082403).

Macromedia has some of the best tools for website design.

Take Care,

Richard

[amanoffewwords]

I don't think Dreamweaver MX is the most appropriate program for a beginner and certainly overkill if the sole aim is to make one or two personal sites - it's also a very expensive solution for a simple problem. But you can download an evaluation to see for yourself.

Much better to start with a more economical solution such as Coffee Cup (http://www.coffeecup.com) - and upgrade later to a more professional software, if you catch the bug...

As for frames, in the web design world they have acquired a 'yesterday' kind of status - if anything you get loads of problems with search engines as they tend to index the individual frames so your potential visitor doesn't get to see the whole effect [unless you use some JavaScript I hasten to add). Much better to use templates, layers/ libraries/css etc, IMHO.

Btw, Webmonkey (http://hotwired.lycos.com/webmonkey/teachingtool/) is quite useful as a learning tool, IMO anyway.

amofw

[AerBabe]

Sorry... I didn't mean to start a fight!!
Thanks for all the software suggestions. I'll have a look at all of them and hopefully one won't be too complicated, but with enough options to make it look good.

[silentwitness]

Pretty much anything made (or claimed to be made) by Microsoft is going to be pants. Frontpage is awful for creating efficient, well coded web sites, which is what you want if you want your site to load correctly across different systems and browsers (don't use frames!).

If you want a simple to use, intuitive package that still goves you the ability to create pretty much anything you can think up, Dreamweaver is the best option. You can get trials free from Macromedias site.

A basic understanding of HTML is definitely worth learning as it can save a lot of time and stress when you're trying to get something to look right through GUIs when all it needs is a TAG altering or moving.

Just my opinion though....

[Naples Air Center, Inc.]

AerBabe,

Do not worry about it. That is nothing compared to the banter that goes on in the forum between the PC users and the Militant MACers. ;)

Take Care,

Richard

[Blacksheep]

Wow, I kicked up a bit of a fuss just by criticizing that crappy on-line tutorial!

Yes, frames are old time stuff, but for a beginner who wants to do just what AerBabe says she wants to do, its much easier to set up the navigation that way. She can move on once she's got a grasp of the basics.

Same with HTML - yes its easier to make changes if you can work directly in HTML but thats an awful lot of mugging up for someone who is just starting. Let her get something posted up on-line first.

My own first efforts were done using Netscape Composer and looking back at them they're crap, but I was happy enough with them for a first attempt. My next efforts were done using FrontPage and load as an all white page with a header and a simple navigation sidebar. Sub-pages come with some small images and dark blue writing in a nice clear modern looking font - Arial. The whole thing is actually a frames page with no margins and each page being small enough not to generate a scroll bar. You'd never guess it's frames just by looking at it, but doing it that way made it easier to set up the navigation.

Now I've got a grip, I can make nice clean, simple pages with minimal loading times. But I must say that simple is better. Always.

( Why'd you want to submit a mere personal page to a Search Engine manoffewwords? Enjoy getting lots of Spam do you? I suggest leaving the search engines alone until your efforts begin to blossom... )

[seacue]

Just a short comment:

I hope the book "Teach yourself HTML 4 in 24 Hours" ISBN 0-672-31369-3 is available in the UK (There may well be a newer version). It's a simple cook-book, but has a reference section for the common HTML commands. I found it very useful.

Another point I don't think anyone mentioned is that you can examine the HMTL of any web site with most web browsers. Just click on "Page Source" under Views in Netscape or "Source" under Views in IE.

Steal the source of a site you like and modify its content to make it "you".

I don't use any of the HTML editors mentioned. For my simple site I found directly writing in HTML to be simple enough after the first hurdle. I hadn't realized I could examine the source of real sites at the time.

I keep IE5.5, Netscape 6.2 and Netscape 3 on my machine and test my site with all of them. I find it stupid that advertisers use features unique to the latest IE on their site. They are driving away potential customers.

And avoid loading your site with "dancing squirrels" and other cute animations.

SC

[Diverse]

Aerbabe, if you want to do a basic site then I would spend about £20 on a book like seacue spoke of or HTML for Dummies and use Notepad. As you start to get the hang of the basics then look at source code for other sites.

Don't use frames, if nothing else they look 'orrible.

If you want to see what can be done with HTML and
Cascading Style Sheets (http://www.w3.org/Style/CSS/) then check out this site http://www.meyerweb.com/eric/css/edge/complexspiral/demo.html

Use Firefox (http://www.mozilla.org/products/firefox/releases/#new) or Mozilla to get it's full effect. It almost makes you wish flash hadn't been invented, and there's not a dancing squirrel in site either.


:ok:

[AerBabe]

not a dancing squirrel in site :rolleyes: Very funny... :ok:

Well, I've tried a few of the cheap packages over the last few days and the only one I like is Coffee Cup. I haven't had a look at Dreamweaver yet or even ventured into the land of HTML. I will though. Although I never even got the hang of Basic when I was little. :O

[Rugz]

Babe,

I have a number of ebooks that I can put on a server for you to download if you want. They are step by step guides to using HTML and you'll be surprised how quickly you'll find yourself feeling confident at using HTML!

I've passed them on to a few friends who all gone on to become quite competent in using HTML.

I'll put them on a server tomorrow and PM you a link. Take a look and see if they are any use to you.

I have other ebooks on ASP programming and Javascript that you may find useful once you have mastered HTML.

If you haven't bought your domain name yet, check out www.oneandone.co.uk as they are the cheapest I've found and I've been using them for purchasing domains and providing web hosting for the last few years. Highly recommended.

Good luck with designing your own site. It'll be worth it in the end, honest! If you ever have any questions about web design, feel free to give me a shout and I'll help in any way I can.

[Keef]

Agree absolutely with the suggestion "Don't use anything Microsoft" - you'll end up with a website that can only be viewed by folks using Internet Explorer if you do. Even Eurocontrol made that mistake!

Years ago, "CoolPage" was the low-cost option on the block - I don't know if it's still about these days, but I've still got my copy and use it. Extremely basic, extremely simple.

That produces HTML which can then be uploaded with your FTP, and job done!

[BRL]

Here we go, just found this link.... LINK (http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=75798)
How far have you got with yours? Do you have a webpage up yet?

[terryJones]

Hi AerBabe.
I can also recomend 'Oneandone', I have my own '.co.uk' with them, and as far as freebie ftp proggies go, look at "Smartftp", a very small download. Do a Google on it.
Dreamweaver I have got, but It's definatly 'Overkill', and to be honest the easiest personal site I have made was with 'Publisher' and it was perfectly readable in Netscape.

As with all software, it's really a case of 'What works for you'. I mean, some people even use Outlook for their email......

TJ

[Brooklands]

AerBabe,

There are three guides to HTML available on-line at the W3C web site: Basic Html (http://www.w3.org/MarkUp/Guide), Advanced Html (http://www.w3.org/MarkUp/Guide/Advanced), and Style Sheets (http://www.w3.org/MarkUp/Guide/Style). These form a good introduction if you want to try and understand HTML. There's also an authoring guidelines (http://www.w3.org/TR/wcag10) document which you might find useful. However I agree that you're probably better off with a design tool such as dreamweaver.

You might find it worthwhile having a browse through the computing magazines in your local W H Smiths, as there are quite a few devoted to producing web sites, and they often have cover CDs with free web site creation tools on them (beware of the ones with a cover DVD unless you've got a DVD reader on your PC).

Brooklands

PS I suppose the purists would say that you should be learning XHTML rather than HTML.

[AerBabe]

Rugz - Yes please, can you PM me a link to those ebooks.

I've had a play with Dreamweaver now and do like it, but it's a bit more involved than Coffee Cup. I've put together a very basic version of what I want in a couple of different packages and will have a read of the HTML bits next.

Oh, and I bought my domain name from GlobalGold...

[RomeoTangoFoxtrotMike]

AerBabe,

You might also find philip.greenspun.com/panda/ (http://philip.greenspun.com/panda/) helpful, particularly Learn to program HTML in 21 minutes (http://philip.greenspun.com/panda/html/). Much of this you will already know, but having allowed the religious war to abate somewhat ;) I'm fanning the flames again, since thus latter page actually contains as much about "style" as it does about "how to create it".

Hope it's helpful :ok:

Brooklands

See Greenspun (above) on the subject of XML :uhoh: [ not saying that I either agree or disagree with him -- just noting that his comments are, well, interesting... :)