British North West Airlines

[Helen49]

Is it true that the Ex- Comed gang are trying once again on the Blackpool - Ronaldsway route?

If so, how many more times will the CAA allow them to fleece passengers and airports with cancelled flights et al?

[dada]

sure are - more to the point, how can blackpool airport allow mergie anywhere near the place let alone start operating
it'll all end in tears
name sounds good though

[Eh Hello?]

Wasn't that the name of the "airilne" in the eighties film White Nights (Phil collins soundtrack, Gregory Hynes pirouetting on stage etc).? If I remember correctly, a Lingus 747 was painted up as a BNWA aircraft and crashlanded in Russia with a defected Russian ballet dancer on board. Spectacular crash scene done with a 707 in PIK I think...

Anyhow, apologies for going off topic but aren't Keenair operating Blackpool - IOM already?

[dada]

maybe this lot will crash spectacularly again (financially)

[Helen49]

Keenair are on the route and have been for several years so they must be doing something right! They actually provide a pretty reliable, on time service although the prices are maybe a bit high.

It would appear that BNWA are offering cut price fares with the normal flight cancellations etc of the Comed days. Just hope the passengers aren't duped again and that BPL and IOM get their money up front......or there will certainly be a repeat of the tears!

[Roberto]

From the Blackpool Gazette last years when he was about to start for the 3rd time, and this latest attempt is his 4th go.




Banned airline boss's latest venture


AN airline boss who has pledged not to run a company for the next six years is hoping his career will take off again – with the launch of new flights between Blackpool and the Isle of Man.


New twice-daily services are being launched from Blackpool Airport by British Northwest Airlines next month.
And the man behind the venture is Robert Murgatroyd, former director of grounded Blackpool-based airline Comed Aviation, which collapsed with debts of more than £1.1m.
In March, The Gazette reported how Mr Murgatroyd, of Elswick, undertook not to be a director or manager of a company for six years in a self-imposed ban agreed with the Department of Trade and Industry.
The DTI had found that Mr Murgatroyd had been unfit to hold a directorship
because he had allowed Comed to continue trading after August 1, 2000, when he knew that it was not paying suppliers and creditors.
Comed went into administrative receivership in 2001 with estimated debts of £1.1m owed to its creditors.
The undertaking given by Mr Murgatroyd to the DTI prevents him from being a director of any company or being concerned either directly or indirectly in management.
A spokesman for the DTI said: "Mr Murgatroyd has given an undertaking not to act as a director for six years."
Mr Murgatroyd has since relaunched a Comed flying school and has been employed as its commercial manager.
Mr Murgatroyd was also behind British North West Airlines, which grounded its twice-daily flights to Belfast and the Isle of Man from Blackpool Airport last year after three months' service, blaming disappointing passenger numbers.
He has so far been unavailable for comment.



30 May 2003

[Wing Commander Fowler]

Keenair??? Are you sure they're still operating? Heard otherwise. I hope they are though!!

[SM82]

.......well Keen airways anyway...........

[dada]

i wouldn't buy a pint (of milk) form that cowboy, let alone a flight.

[Niaga Dessip]

Keenair ARE running the route, apparently effectively.

The Blackpool Gazette last week or so reported that this latest relaunch did not involve Mr. M and that Blackpool Airport were not prepared to comment.

The airport website last week was not mentioning the airline so it seems that there is some tension there.

Then again, I know nothing.....

ND;)

[pure digital]

:uhoh: at £135 return:mad: in a PA-31 no chance mind you if it crashes the passengers can always paddle to the Island or catch the Ferry := LONG live the BEN:cool:

Pure Digital

[atprider]

So if RM's not involved........................How come he's doing the R/T then ?????????????

"We'd like to cancel the VFR (sic) plan & depart VFR at 2000ft"

[Roberto]

From what is on the street, they are only moving 1 or 2 pax at a time and quite offen don't carry anyone at all, so it seems that Robert hasn't learned a lot about business since he last went bust for owing £1.1 million.

Won't last long.

[boynefly]

BNWA are using an ancient Aztec now, they certainly know how to give their clients value for money!

[uy707]

Thanks for the entertaining reading, this reminds me of a couple of other cow-bows : MM Marian Kobzuki and Hank Wharton :D :O
Alain

[LGS6753]

UY -

Would that be the Kozupski (sp?) of Britair East Africa circa 1965? And wasn't Hank Wharton involved with gun-running in Africa in the 60s?

[EGCC24L]

So whats the latest on this J31 rumour? Anybody anymore news?
Any of the Keen Airways boys had any offers of employment from RM?

[dada]

to be added from june - believed to be the rusting ex platinum heap that was parked up for yeers aftert they went bust.

[Barmy Army]

It would appear that neither one of you know the running of BNWA

Therefore, ensure your facts are correct before you comment

I operate and hire aircraft from the people in question and find them to be good value for money and very fair

Why are you people against an airline trying to establish a base from Blackpool - that is unless you work or have an interest in the competitor?

Barmy Army

[Impressive_Wingspan]

Barmy Army,

I can't see why you are asking people to check their facts, or what you are trying to dispute.

What people have said in the thread about it being the ex-Comed gang, hearing RM on RT, Keenair flying the route and using an Aztec is all correct, (don't know about the J31 bit or £135 fare).

Just because you hire an aircraft from them and find them good value doesn't make the above facts incorrect.

Comed have tried before to establish a base from Blackpool and failed with debts of £1.1 million. Of course the question is going to be asked, why have the "Comed Group" been allowed to re-establish at Blackpool airport. People are not against an airline establishing a base, just against people being shafted, which is what happened when Comed went into administrative receivership in 2001.

It will be interesting to see how the new owners of Blackpool airport will take to RM and Co, they will obviously have an agenda different to the council and may be less forgiving if Comed, sorry BWNA, have a downturn in passenger numbers.

[Barmy Army]

Wingspan

The person in question has no financial dealings within the company - and having worked and been a bank manager for 9 years I think I know more about finance then you!!

With regards to passenger numbers - I know for a fact that they have been full, hence the need for a Jetstream 31!!

I also do not just " hire aircraft " from anyone !!!

Blackpool is a great airfield, but they are so many people waiting to stab people in their backs!

P.S Please do not talk finance to myself, I know more then you can possibly imagine!!!

BA

[Flightrider]

That has to rank as one of the most unbelievably arrogant postings I've read on PPrune for some time. Barmy Army's level of defensiveness only serves to make me question why he had a change of vocation if he was such a wonderful bank manager with a tremendous grasp of finance.

[touch&go]

Since when did bank managers know anything about finance?:yuk: :yuk:

[surely not]

Very good at using exclamation marks though !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[boynefly]

How many ex-bank managers does it take to fill an Aztec?

[Impressive_Wingspan]

No need to get over excited Barmy, you are getting very defensive old boy. I’m pleased that you have manage to conquer the world of finance, and a bank manger for 9 years, that is very well done. However if you are honestly trying to tell me that RM is not involved in any financial dealings of BWNA you really are trying to pi*s in my wellies and tell me it’s raining. That is just utter cr@p and you know it, everyone at the airfield knows it is his baby and he is pulling the strings, he’s just got someone else to front the operation.

I agree Blackpool is a great airfield, I have been flying there for many years and I can assure you I am not trying to stab anyone in the back. Unfortunately for the murgster he upset a few people (not me I hasten to add) with his antics, I just hope the J31 happens for them and they can make it pay, they are not cheap machines to run!

Just an aside, if you are as condescending to me in your next post I will be far less forgiving in my response, so just mind those p’s and q’s!

[Barmy Army]

Interesting comments from you all – thank you

My previous post was out of character and apologise for any offence

Looking at the issue sensibly, I thought the CPG (Consumer protection Group) of the CAA would ensure customers are safe

All new airlines now have to produce a business plan for the next 24-48 months, in this plan they have to demonstrate they can survive without any income for 3 months and satisfy the CAA by way of a bond

This bond would and does depend on the scale of operation

The CAA would also check the business “ethics” of the company and post holders

Once they are happy they will then issue an AOC

Has this indeed happened with BNWA, I would hope so because these are the type of issues, which have stopped airlines recently??

Wingspan, I do know where your coming from and I can relate it to Pheonix Night's when Brian Potter puts Mr Sinclair as the front man

I just wish everyone success in any venture they do, because Blackpool would benefit

Once again apologies for my outburst

Cheers

BA

[Yak97]

I believe that if BNWA are going to operate a J31 they will not need to go thru the CPG financial fitness model as they will require a Class B Operating Licence, not a Class A, which has the requirement for 3 months operation without income, 24 months business plan etc.

For a Class B all they would need would be to prove EU ownership of the Company & adequate insurance for the aircraft, then the CAA would give them the OL. They would, of course, also have to go thru the CAA SRG process to get an AOC.

Let's hope that they are not going to try the "ticket provider" route that Euromanx has been using, it certainly confuses the punters!

[dada]

well i think theyr a rite bunch of cowboys.how he was ever let back on the airport after going bust i'll never no.

[Germstone]

if the ex platinum j31 ever flies again i will be very surprised 2 years of outside parking by the seaside has done it the world of good