Tayflite & Hrs Building in Scotland, Q's

[Howski]

Hello All

I have done a search on the above subjects, however i would like to get some mo0re upto date info on the following specific questions.

1. Where is the cheapest place for Hrs Building in Scotland, I have spoken to Prestwick FC who offer a C150 for 36 Quid an Hr Dry, does any one have any other places at this kind of price, any rough ideas on how much that would be an HR WET.

2. I plan to do the CPL/ME/IR at Tayflite, does anyone have any comments on this school, so far I have heard/seen nothing but praise, I have visited them and them seem to be a nice bunch of peeps. If you have done the above mentioned courses there please let me know how much it all actually cost in the end, the prices that they give are very competitive but as we all know sometimes it does'nt actually end up that way, how long diod it all actually take and at what time of year did you do it.

Thanks & Regards

Howski

[witchdoctor]

Only used Tayflite for an MEIR renewal, but found them to be very helpful and friendly generally, and the instructors know what they're on about. Not got the glitz and glamour of some of the big schools, but that means they can concentrate on the customer rather than their image. I like them and would definitely go back again should the need arise.

[oskar]

hi,
All i can say about them is that it takes a good while so you will have to be patient, they are not the most friendly once you are in flying with them. It is true that they have a good record and have good reports, but when i was there it was not the best atmosphere and it was felt by the majority of the students. saying that you could do your cpl/ir i think with tayside aviation accross the road, they have an excellent instructor there named sandy torrance. he will have you done in a few weeks as he flys in any weather which is good practice for your test. The decision falls with you but do not take any negativity from the people at tayflite,

good luck

[Howski]

Hello

Oskar, could you be a bit more specific in letting us know of your experiences, what do you mean by "they are not the most friendly once you are flying with them", how long did it actually take you to complete your course ?

Ta
Howski

[Sally Cinnamon]

Did my CPL/ME and IR with Tayflite.

Excellent training establishment. Decent aircraft, well looked after with full time engineering on site. The course prices are competitive.

As for someone suggesting that Tayside are the better option for the CPL/IR, this is not true. Tayside do not even offer an Instrument Rating course. They run very few CPL courses and compete with Tayflite only in spirit rather than on product. Fiona Middleton got myself and many others I know though the course with minimum hours.

Good Luck

[P!ggsy]

In defence of Tayside, I did my CPL with them and Sandy Torrance is a top notch instructor. If you want continuity from CPL to IR then Tayflite is perhaps a better option.

[nosewheelfirst]

The Prestwick C150 is a group aircraft and im not sure if they have any shares available at the moment. However the club do have a scheme run where you can lodge £500 (refundable) with 'A' Flight and pay £48 a month and you can hire the PA28's for £65.40 an hour and the Bolkow for £55.80 an hour. These are 'wet' rates and are probably the best you can get in Scotland without entering into a group. Moray Flying Club are another option if you are from the neck of the woods. Tayside (where I did my PPL) have hour building packages available and are well worth a look.
SandyTorrance did my skills test so can't comment on his instruction but I have heard only good things about him.

[TRN3C]

Did my CPL/IR with tayflite back in 2002 and more recently my ME renewal, in the time they said and for the price they said. I have only praise for Fiona Middleton and all the guys there. Stick the head down do the work and you will get through. As a previous post states they train on a one to one basis and are not like bigger more well know shcools and furthermore they genuinely want to see you succeed. They are top class pros, and I would reccommend them to anyone.

[KTM 525 SX]

Tayflite is, without doubt the place to go.
The training is excellent, the aircraft are reliable (with onsite instant engineering backup). - And - the facilities at Perth are second to none - where else can you operate from an airfield dedicated to flying training with a VOR on site, Dundee's under used ILS 3 mins flying time away, GLA / EDI in under 20 mins joining the airway right above the PTH!!

And - if you require a bit of hour building - I am led to believe they currently have a C152, which I am sure they will do a deal with you in conjunction with an IR course.

I did my IR with Tayflite, back in the days of the non-approved IR. I passed first time (unlike my CPL after training at OATS!!). I saved a lot of cash by completing in minimum hrs thanks to the training I received from Fiona Middleton.

All said, for instructor ratings and S.E. work Sandy Torrance at Tayside is a very very hard act to beat.

[oskar]

I must disagree sally that your view of taysides training being only in spirit, I have to dissagree and feel it is an injustice to them that you make such a comment, taysides training is excellent and they get you through cpl course rather quickly,sandy is an excellent instructor and its a pity there is not more like him.

[Sally Cinnamon]

Oskar,

At the time I did my CPL Tayside were charging an incredible £60 an hour more than Tayflite to fly their Arrow. Over a 25 hour course this would have been an extra £1500 and it is for this reason I suggested that Tayside only compete in spirit rather than on product.

I believe they have now lowered their prices slightly to try to compete with Tayflite but there are still few takers for their expensive CPL course. Tayflite is a highly organised ambitious Commercial training school with decent aircraft and highly experienced instructors able to offer CPL/ME/IR. Tayside is a tired ppl training outfit very much on the decline that occasionaly runs a CPL course.

There is really no comparison.

[J-Heller]

Well Salli,

(& bump to the top)

Interesting to hear of the reasoning behind your post. Faded PPL school, doing odd CPL course? - that comes across quite strongly...do you stand by it?...can you expand a bit on that?

A friend was researching schools lately for the IR. It was Tayflite's pricing policy on money spent sitting on the ground doing FA that swung him elsewhere. The point stuck in my mind.

I am aware of Tayflite's reputation within and without pprune. Still considering them, and will hopefully pay a visit sometime this year.

What gets my attention is your rubbishing of Tayside Aviation...Please return to the thread, Salli, and tell us if there is more to it than mere course pricing.


Cheers

JH

[oskar]

sally it seems either you have shares in tayflite or you work there because you really do not come across as someone with a partial judgement on flying schools. AS the previous post added please enlighten us on how tayflite is an ambitious and excellent, school, your choice of words seem that your becoming defensive

[zcar]

It's a personal thing but I found Richard Darlow the best instructor at Tayflite. Fiona is very professional, but I found her a little stern which knocked my inexperienced confidence somewhat at first. I do appreciate that others get on very well with her though there were comments about the place (and some arguments) when I was there.

As to time spent hanging around, this cannot be disputed: they do not have a schedule for any particular day and so you can spend long hours drinking tea (at their expense - it's free!) waiting to fly at short notice. You will get to fly, though, pretty much every day as the weather is not bad, although the Arrow (v.reasonable rate) was out of action for a week last summer.

The smallness of the establishment is a bonus, the professionalism is unrivalled (things are quite simply done by the book, period) and the expense on maintenance is not spared: all aircraft are well maintained. Attitudes are that the customer gets told what to do and when to do it, as that is what makes the place work, at their convenience and not yours. If that is a big problem that's up to the individual to decide. Me? I'm off back there for IR this year...

[Nearly Man]

I flew all the way up from London, then drove from Glasgow to go see them at Tayflight, and they didn't have to manners to be there! I was told the lady I was to see, had gone on a jolly for the day! Could we wait 2 hours for someone to show us around?
Didn't get to go on the FNPT2 either!

No, I didn't find them at all helpful. If you don't want to do pre sales then don't produce nice flash brochures!
Not saying they aren't any good at the training, but my initial experience put me and my friend right off!

So, went to Bristol instead, where they bothered to show me about and let me crunch their FNPT2 :}

[A and C]

OK so what are the add on,s ? I expect that you will find that VAT , landing fees and a number of other fees will be atached to the deal !.

It would not come as any surprise to me if the thing was under maintained and had a radio system that was not much better than two tin cans and a bit of string ?.

The bottom line is that it cant be done at that price with out cutting corners so my guess is that you dont have the real "what it costs " price yet.

[covec]

Re Tayside Aviation & Tayflite.

Both thoroughly professional.

I did my BCPL & FI with Tayside. Sandy is top notch. Very experienced guy.


I did the BCPL to JAR CPL SPA ME IR with Tayflite. Fiona was top notch. Richard was brilliant too. The whole team are hard workers - happy to drink with them anytime!

If you yourself have a hard working attitude - and those who were with me did eg Forces aircrew & commercially employed FIs + 1 or 2 North Sea ATPLHs, then you will be fine.

No, I don't have shares in either org. But if you think that they are tough on you, then try the Military Aircrew Training System (Pilot or non-pilot)!

'luck to all.

[cesspit]

As mentioned before the Moray Flying Club is very cheap for flying in Scotland, nice aircraft, and according to one of their instructors, not too busy. Which is suprising when you look at their prices. It is probably due to the fact that they are out on a limb at Kinloss.

As for schools the best advice is to shop around and go and see for yourself. First impressions should count. What might suit you will not suit others.

Tayflite have nice aircraft, but are very slow at getting students through. Their sim is top notch, but I believe that too much of their IR course is sim based as opposed to on the actual aircraft. They are very much 9 to 5 weekdays, and never fly at weekends. Interestingly enough they will not use the shorter runways at Perth (even their PA28), so if the wind on the long runway is out of limits, but in limits for the short, they will stop flying, when everyone else at the airport flys on.

Tayside do not do IRs, so if you want to do all the course at the same school, it is not the place for you. The competition has been good, forcing Tayside to lower its prices. CPL courses are run full time or part time to suit the student, and flying will take place at the weekends if required. I am aware of at least one student transfering from Tayflite to Tayside. However Tayside have only one full time CPL/FIC instructor (Sandy), so it will be one to one, but he can be busy, making it difficult to get on a course. Also if you don't get on with your instructor, you cannot exactly swap.

It is also worth remembering that Prestwick Flight Centre now offer CPL/IRs, under the direction of former CAA examiner Henry Crone. They are new to the market, so are yet to build up a reputation. The IR is under taken in a SE a/c before moving onto the twin. So the whole course is airbourne. The test will still take place at Perth.

Hope this is of some help.

[juggernaut]

Sally says that Tayside are a ppl outfit in decline! I find this hard to take, I started the CPL course with them and completed in 3 weeks with a first time pass thanks to Sandy, take note - Tayflite do 5 hours in the sim, this helps reduce the cost but is a waste of time practically as it is nothing like the real aircraft. Tayside fly at weekends if you wish and there aircraft is the mark 4 Arrow which is more modern than the Tayflite machine. All 25 hors are on the aircraft. Most importantly their pass rate is the highest in Scotland and the CAA examiner thinks highly of them. They have been running the courses for many years and know every aspect of the course. If you take into account the hanging around in the wee room (you Tayfliters know what I'm on about) and the average pass rate then Tayflite aren't such a good deal. Just ask around.

[zcar]

Cesspit, it is not quite true to say that Tayflite will not use the shorter runways at Perth, even in the PA28.

It is true to say that runways 21/03 are most commonly in use, often due to prevailing weather. However in a strong easterly 09 is used for circuits in the PA28.

Runway 27 is not allowed for take off because of the trees shortly after, but is often used for landing. In fact I landed there on my test in Tayflite's PA28.

In the PA34 the east/west runways are instructor only landings.

It is true to say that the shorter grass runways are not allowed, and this is stated in the flying order book.

[ikea]

what im wanting to do is to get the ATPL Prep course from flyoba.com, the my ATPL Theory in Glasgow Nautical College, gaining my IR and CPL from somewhere in Scotland. Scotland is my home, and I dont want to move away :( so this is the only way to do it for me. I also really want to work in Scotland, but im willing to wait a long time to get a job in the country.

[Nearly Man]

Ikea .. why not have a go for the CPL/IR at Prestwick, .. couple of guys hot footed it ther from Tayflight. They like it ther, guy is ex CAA examiner and Prestwick airport has commercial stuff there but still not too busy .. just watch out for Ryanair pilots :)

What you gonna do if someone offers you a flying job 'down safff' one day? :}