Aerostar 600 / Chieftain LDR &TODR

[nomorecatering]

Last night I was talking to a net friend of mine who will be doing some flying in the Carribean, visiting such places as St Maarten in the Netherlands Antillies( well known for the low approaches by the jets over the beach as seen on Airliners.net). As well he was thinking about dropping in on a little airport called Saba, a few miles away.

The runway is situated on a mesa, about 150ft above sea level, is flat with clear approaches at each end, infact almost sheer cliffs to the ocean below. The exciting bit is that the runway is a mere 1,312ft in length (approx 400m).

The aircraft considered for trip are an Aerostar 600 (non turbo) with VG kit or a Chieftain PA31-350 with VG Kit.

Given an early moring arrival and late evening departure for the cooler air.

Wind, generaly is 10 kts straight down the runway.

Temp about 20 deg C

Standard QNH

Aircraft to be operated at min fuel and 1 person, ie the pilot

My question is, can an experianced pilot, >500 hrs on type in each, get these aicraft into and out of this strip or is it just too tight.

I would look it up myself if I had the performance charts. How do the distances required(from the charts) stand up to whats realy need in the real world.

Any Chieftain and Aerostar drivers care to comment, would be much appreciated.

[swh]

Bit dodgy using forcast winds for perf cals ....

http://www.xs4all.nl/~pa3gio/PJ6/airport_mountain_small.jpg

http://www.xs4all.nl/~pa3gio/PJ6/airport_small.jpg

"Juancho Yrausquin Airport. 1,312 ft, world's shortest commercial airport. Officially, the runway is permanently closed to all air traffic as is designated by the "X" on each end. However, aircraft are permitted to operate on Saba by obtaining waivers from the Netherlands Antilles' Civil Aviation Authority."

Think you will also find its 396 m long....

[Tinstaafl]

Perfect for an Islander then! I wouldn't be too keen about a PA31. Even less keen about an Aerostar.

What do the performance manuals say? Including whatever factors that country's rules & regs require. If he uses an average wind to base his calcs, what will he do if it's not there when he arrives/departs?

[Curved Approach]

Sounds crazy to me! But hell I would love to see photos of it. Looks like he needs to strip the aircraft of everything not needed, seats and all...anything not tied down or removable ;)

[Sheep Guts]

Ask the locals what usually goes in there. If they say, Islander and Otters well, sorry mate your dreaming in a Deathstar and Chieftain. 400 Metres mm. No problem with obstacle clearance.

Try going half mains only and 2 pax in the Chietain, dunno about the Areostar if it has similair performnce to B58 or C310R well maybe. Go to the POH, though.and only trust the POH, if it aint inthere then dont do it.If there are nostatistics on what your about to do, then dont do it, otherwise you will become the next.


Make sure you have a a life raft, Big Tigers and Bulls, in the Carribean , and Im not talking about cats and cattle:E .


Sheep

[tinpis]

Please post photos of the aftermath:rolleyes:

[Dale Harris]

Tell 'im he's dreamin'.

[The Gimp]

Have seen a PA31-310 go in and out of YMAA which is 400m. :ooh:

[Jet_A_Knight]

Landing a 'star in 396m (no obstacles), no problems. Just don't undershoot(!)

You could more than likely takeoff in a light 'star but you would have to:

-Consider how smart the idea really is
-Line up right on the edge of the threshold
-Apply full power on brakes before brakes release
-No rotation, just drive it straight off the cliff
-Say your farewells to your loved ones just in case you had a problem during the takeoff roll (cause their isn't enough room to stop)

Surely there's a boat service to this joint?

[0tter1]

If you can get it in, then you can get it out.. I'd say a lightly loaded chieftain would be ok. Never flown deathstar so dont know.. Light loaded navajo or chieftain, can be quite the preformer. Its when there full they turn into another bus..

[nomorecatering]

Just spoke to my mate in the states. He's a seriously loaded dude.

Just got a new chieftain, only 4,000 hrs on it.Put a full leather interior in it, seats, headlining etc,new paint job....an expensive one, VG kit, winglets, brand new new engines blueprinted by Victor aviation in Palo Alto,intercoolers by northamerican aviation, gammi injectors, twin caliper brakes, 40 deg flaps.

Instrument panel will be trashed, a custom job being done. with new evrything, 2 x Garmin 530 GPS and plans on installing the new Avidyne Primary Flight display and nav display on the pilots side + a 2nd Primary flight display on the co pilots side. Digital autopilot and a new top of the line weather radar.

He wants to have the most sophisticated Chieftain in the world. Dont know why but he has the $$$ to do it.

[Sheep Guts]

There is s a Chieftain just like the one you decrisbe impounded infront of the JDF Jamaican Defence Force apron at Norman Manly International Airport. All smick aircraft except for the bullte holes, ws impounded for drug las August, alsoi a Westwind Jet and a nice Turbo Commander there aswell.

I hope you friend who is appears to be cashed is carefull down that way. An aquiantence of mine down here had his Islander hi jacked in Guyana by Columbians, he was forced out of the aircraft after being asked to land. They flew on to Who knows where.

[Dale Harris]

Just had a look at the standard figures for the navajo. The graph doesn't even cover 400 mts. The chieftain is worse. the VG kit doesn't really change t/o and ldg distances, just the weight you can carry. Going by the charts, even empty isn't a goer. At light weights, landing appears to just be okay tho.

[Curved Approach]

Tell your mate if he wants to go on living to enjoy his $$$ then he should fly into somewhere else not foolish and charter a boat with his $$$..........;)

[sedgie]

Saw a 601P based out of Mackay fly into Brampton island. That would be iffy landing on RWY32.

[TopperHarley]

If this place in the Netherlands is the shortest commercail strip in the world, where does YMAA come in ??

Only 4m longer last time i checked ??

Does that clown in the part-bananna still try and take a full load and a 10kt tailwind out of there ?!?

[circuit]

If he really wants to fly there, how about a seaplane. (on a calm day)

[assymetric]

deathwish either way:ok: