View Full Version : Another Mystery plane...

17th Jan 2004, 19:36
Hi all,
While Seacue's away, I thought I'd bung up a mystery marine a/c of my own. I know where I took it, and when, but I'm not giving any clues (yet) because I know how good you all are!

As to posting the picture -

Ummm. Here goes...

Or try this link:

Or this http://community.webshots.com/user/buchonalia
and go to Mystery Planes...

20th Jan 2004, 21:57
If you've checked back to see if someone's got the answer, you'll be disapointed - 97 views and NO bids - amazing.

OK - taken at Chino California, 2002...

21st Jan 2004, 05:25
The only thing I can think of, is it looks like a wind tunnel model of a Lake Buccaneer...? Other than that, I haven't got a clue.

21st Jan 2004, 06:21
Thanks BeaMan, but I never thought it would be quite such a stumper! It's in a museum, (clue) and it's a lot older than a Lake Bucaneer...

C'mon folks, you can do it...

And if you do, I've another one to ID...

21st Jan 2004, 06:30
Sorry James, confess it I must: STUMPED! In fact, they were thinking of me when they invented the word... (old joke but plagiarism is me middle name...)

21st Jan 2004, 17:34
Very early Grumman?

Iron City
21st Jan 2004, 22:06
I would go for a moderately early Leoning (as in Grover) amphibian/flying boat, though with no wings or tail is it really an aircraft or a water tunnel model, perhaps from Convair/Consolidated? Were wings and tail available but not attached?

Appears it has been rigged for display from the overhead, so presumably the underside is interesting.

22nd Jan 2004, 08:56
With an absence of engine mounting position - unless the engine is intended to be pod mounted - perhaps its not a fuselage dummy, but an experimental float of some kind?

Maybe not. :( Think I can now see main spa mountings.

22nd Jan 2004, 09:59
Looks like a Curtiss offering, maybe a HS-2L.

22nd Jan 2004, 11:23
JDK - I hate you!

Was about to go to bed then found this thread. Three hours gone. Still searching zzzzzz

Best guess is Marcel Besson design cos of almost separate fuselage/hull shape and the very distinctive step in hull. Where's me 1920 JAWA.


22nd Jan 2004, 16:39
Heh, heh, heh...

But honestly, as the wiplash quick responses to the others, I'd thought this would last a day, mebbe two...

I've already given a couple of clues if you want to cheat.

It's the hull of a single hull Flying Boat (I understand) the wings are stored seperately.

No Grumman / Loening connection that I know of, it's not a model or a float, and it is the real thing. It's on the right side of the Atlantic for it's history. The collection it's in has a wide range of a/c all (eventually) immaculately restored, so I guess this will be rebuilt in due course...

Good luck!

James K

22nd Jan 2004, 16:48
Yanks Museum at Chino have something called the Thomas Pidgeon seaplane awaiting restoration - is that the baby?


22nd Jan 2004, 17:42

Well done Mr Tredders... Now all we need is a picture of the complete a/c! Or ANY info on it. I was told what it was when I was there, but though I count myself a seaplane afician... fan, I was 'Stumped' as you said earlier!

Anyone got any info?


22nd Jan 2004, 19:40
Mr Tredders... we are not worthy! Re a full snap of the beast... might be able to oblige if someone could give me date of construction?

22nd Jan 2004, 20:09
See me after for autographs, I'll sign anything but cheques...

No mystery in my identification, I thought it might have been at Yanks after JDK's hint and found their website... no picture there though.

Tharg, I'm on leave next week - I could possibly wander down to Coulsdon either Weds or Thurs...

22nd Jan 2004, 23:47
WW1 Aero magazine Issue 175 (Feb 2002) published information supplied by the Massachusetts Aviation Historical Society about this vintage aeroplane. It was built by the Pigeon Hollow Spar Company of East Boston (founded circa 1830) for Reginald DeNoyes Thomas of Waltham, a WW1 Naval aviator. The Pigeon family operated the business until 1979 and Roy and Guy Pigeon were the principals at the time that this and other aeroplanes were built by the PHSC. They supplied light weight,but strong spars and masts for ship and yacht builders in the U.S. and the U.K. In the period after 1910 they built aeroplane fuselages, wings and seaplane hulls for a number of manufacturers as well as control cars for USN blimps.

I think the Boston and Waltham referred to are the US ones, not Lincs. or Essex !


23rd Jan 2004, 05:07

Microbash next week great idea. Check your PMs (first I've sent, hope it works). Am well stuffed on extracting snap/drawing of PigeonPlane from Fred T's mighty organs - 1919 edition too early for entry and the 1920 + 1921 editions are missing.


23rd Jan 2004, 06:02
It does seem super rare eh?

Guess wot - I've got another... Wait one...

James K

24th Jan 2004, 00:32
Tharg, check your PMs!