Life After The Services

[EESDL]

Had an opportunity to leave but due to personal circumstances (house move, kids etc) have delayed my leave date for another couple of years. Will spend that the time at a UAS, teaching youngsters to fly who may or may not decide to join up.

Leaving aside the regrets one feels about the state of our Armed Forces and what the politicians (in uniform or not) are doing to it and why I don't want to stay in any longer than absolutely necessary.....

I would be interested to discover what jobs our ex-Serviceman/woman have gone into.

More interested in non-flying-related careers. Use my ATPL(H) quite regulary in anger but looking at other avenues. Resettlement advisors do their best to enlighten us but has anyone out there gone down a diverse/different track.

Living in Harrogate, I'm looking into coorporate/exhibition management or a rivals to Spearmint Rhino! All those delegates need to relax somewhere!!

Genuinely interested in ideas as aircrew tend to think quite narrowly when it comes to moving on.

[Radar Muppet]

Plumbing - get GORGI registered and charge ~£60 a pop for gas safety checks, not to mention actually doing something!

[The Gorilla]

Aircrew, Flight Engineer to Freight Train Driver. 35 hour week maximum, a contract in black and white, no cr@p and a union not to be messed with.

Been out for 3 months now and haven't missed a thing. I haven't laughed so much or enjoyed getting up to go to work like this in years!!

It really can be fun and rewarding out here in the right places!! Making the decision to go is the hardest part but once you have done that, then leaving is a doddle!! Didn't use re-settlement etc.

Only regret? Not having done it 2 years earlier!!

:O

[motionlotion]

EESDL

You're right of course "think quite narrowly" - not a criticism more an observation.

Master Green to Lean Bean - had a crack at Corporate Hunting,Shooting and Fishing / Holiday / Airport big bucks hire service. (PM for details, good earner, just lacked the bottle to go all the way!).

Networking is still the key and not biting off more than you can chew (the safety net is no longer there). Having a family also tends to help with the levelling factor and usually prevents rushing into something with the promise of high earnings and brings you (kicking & screeming sometimes), back down to earth.

I do also have to agree with RM, plumbing is the steadiest number going. No.1 son has just been awarded a Prep schoolarship and both Mrs motion and I are quite sure that if all else fails and he becomes an obnoxious teenager - it's off to Plumbing School for him!

Whatever you decide, don't look back to often and don't tell to many "war stories" - good luck.

ML

[Gainesy]

Flight Engineer to Freight Train Driver

That's quite apt when you think of it, handling the power & systems and no steering involved!:)

[Uncle Ginsters]

EESDL,

What could be more perfect for a widely travelled brave Ascoteer in the afterlife.....

Set up an international dating agency - only this time somebody else gets the benefit of your wit & charm.....

May you live in happily ever after in Tutorheaven :cool: - when you get there.

Uncle G

[DH98]

I'd be very interested to read peoples stories too. I have decided to PVR earlier than planned, RAF driven I'm afraid. I attended OASC recently for a commission in my trade only to be catted Permanently Unfit Zobbit, my eyesight falls below the requirement.
As you may appreciate I am rather cheesed off, but I am unwilling to stay knowing my ceiling is so dramatically limited. What really grips me, is that I am fit to do the job as a SNCO and could enjoy a full career to WO but not for commissioned officer.
I have a few ideas, eg: Airline ops and dispatch (I'm an FOM), College, or civvy industry doing something totally new.

[Dark Helmet]

I left 3 years ago (Rigger Chiefy) and moved into IT. I left at my 22 year pensionable service point. Not an easy decision to make as I really enjoyed my career.
I am now a senior analyst programmer working on the latest in e-banking and e-commerce. My earnings are now far higher than had I stayed in and I have a company car.

With hindsight, I think that I left at the right time and have now got another career with time left with which to develop it further.
I do still miss the RAF though!

Slightly off topic, but I am doing a PPL now, which is strange after not being interested in actually flying for my RAF career!

[VP8]

Left 6 yrs ago itno cargo operations with AN124's...

We've got 3 ex loadmasters here doing flight managing on the aircraft and thehy seem to enjoy it:}

VEEPS

[EESDL]

Uncle G

Keep well blade for my produce may pass your way some day!!

Dark Helmet

Good luck with the PPL but beware wasting all your money now that you've got the bug but you are having to pay for it yourself! Whatever you do..Never, I mean never, under no circumstance, ever sit in a helicopter.....you have been warned!!!

[Dark Helmet]

EESDL - Thanks! As someone who had a 'Q' for rotor tuning and balancing (and therefore many 'happy' hours sat in the back trying to figure out what all the numbers on the Rotortuner meant!) I'm afraid the helicopter warning comes a little late! However, the rotary world is safe from my flying attempts as it is terribly expensive!

[moggie]

After being a VC10 pilot, Harrier and F3 siminstructor I joined the BAe Flying College at Prestwick, moved to Spain with them and got made redundant this week after BWoS sold the college to a "management buyout team".

So, currently job hunting which leads me to a question:

Dark Helmet, what courses did you ned to do to get the qualifications for your new job, where did you do them and how much did they cost?

[uffington sb]

Left the RAF in April 2001. Ops at Atlas Air at STN for 6 months then joined Railtrack. Grade 3 Signaller at Uffington for 18 months and now Mobile Ops Manager at Hitchin. Making considerably more now than I did as a Sgt ATC, with no hassle, 6000's, Guard Cdr, deployments etc etc. and a pension!!
like The gorilla, no regrets and I wished I did it at the 22 year point.
Gorilla, which FOC are you with??

[TheNightOwl]

I left at my 22-year point in 1983, as a Ch.Tech simtech. We emigrated immediately, I joined an airline as a simtech here, until said airline "went under" two years ago. No regrets whatever, but I have to confess I DO miss the "Mob", curiously the Taceval part!! I suspect a touch of the nostalgia, after 20 years away, but I look back on almost all of it as fun.
I was very well paid as a shift-working simtech shift-controller, I have my service pension paid to me here, it's Summer, what more could a man want? The beer is AWFUL, the wines are WONDERFUL, it's almost knocking-off time!

Kind regards,

TheNightOwl.:ok:

[Argus]

I think it comes down to doing some reality checks on one's quals, skills and aspirations. In my case, I decided on a radical career change - but had to rely on my good wife for moral and financial support whilst I "retrained" via a three year full time Uni course plus 'articles'. Being a member of the profession that I aspired to join, she proved to be most supportive. I'm sure she'd tell you that it was worth it. I certainly think so!

As to 'missing the mob', I've found that Reserve service goes quite some way to compensate - except that Mess life these days is really quite boring and lacks the verve of past times.

[The Gorilla]

Uffington - Senior Bobby!!

EWS


:ok:

[uffington sb]

NightOwl,
It was fun 20 years ago! I can't say the last five years or so was though, what with cut backs, budgets, being b*ggered about with postings, promotions etc etc and the late notice "Andy, you're on Guard Commander next week, okay".
At least with my new outfit, if they want me to work more than my 36 hr week, they ask me nicely and then pay me extra!!!!

[Dark Helmet]

Moggie,
I found that the IT industry weren't really interested in qualifications per se. They were more interested in experience ( and not just IT), attitude and flexibility. There is no doubt that my service career played a large part in my being selected, despite my lack of modern programming experience.

As for qualifications, well, you could use your resettlement to complete some IT courses. I don't know what area of IT you are thinking of or what experience of programming etc you have.
However, if you are thinking of programming or development then courses in Visual Basic, .Net, Java, HTML or any SQL database will always be useful.

A lot of people start off in the testing side of IT and then move across.

Always remember that employers in the IT world are impressed by reliability, loyalty and flexibility coupled with a willingness to learn.

If you want any further information please feel free to PM me.

[moggie]

Dark Helmet - thanks for that.

It's not so much resettlement as post-resettlement re-settlement.

I left the RAF 8 years ago and have just been made redundant by BWoS and so am now thinking of:

a ) trying to find new job in the same field or

b ) complete change of tack

As I'm overseas at the moment I can´t really do much until I get back to the UK at the start of next month - then I shall have aword or two with my brother in law who works at Microsoft.

Thanks again.

[Akrotiri bad boy]

I left a few moons ago and tried my hand as a self employed sparkie. Loadsamoney but very lonely. In an effort to get back into teamwork I joined HM Customs. Now back in uniform but have jumped from groundcrew to Commissioned Officer with the power to invoke fear simply by standing there. Public sector pay will never match private sector but if it's job security you're after.... I skip to work in the mornings!

[BEagle]

It's strange; once upon a time people thought of HM Customs as 'those miseries who charge us duty'. But now I think that the UK genpub are pretty well happy with the way HM Customs and Excise regularly nab those ba$tard low-life drug smugglers and other scum. Good for you, chaps and chapesses!

The uniform you wear is very similar to the one which CAA Flight Examiners wear. So much so that, when a CAA chap came to the Brize Flying Club once in blue pullover and 4 gold rings, the muppets who live in the hangar thought that the Haupsturmfuehrer from Customs had arrived for a surprise visit. There was chaos - people running around and more and more senior muppet officers arriving on scene...then we let them off the hook. CAA chum laughed his bits off!


As for my activity having left the mob, in the 4 months I had doing nothing for, but being paid by HM, I deliberately 'fined' myself by transferring anything over my anticipated post-retirement pension+investment+'other' income into a do-not-touch savings account. That got me into the mindset of knowing what was guaranteed safe-as-houses dosh and what wasn't. So far it's working out fine...off to the part-time job in Europe again soon, all expenses paid and biz class. Shall be paid for the work I do, then home. But the mutually best part is that I can survive without needing to do it, hence the company gets someone who works for them because he enjoys it and likes doing it, not because he has to in order to pay the mortgage. An enthusiastic and willing part-time consultant gives them the added-value which a salaried employee might not.....

Other tips:

Join BUPA whilst you're still in the mob.
Don't have spending plans for your terminal grant for at least 12 months after retirement.
If you're a pilot, get a PPL to keep yourself sane!
Learn not to worry about your ODT date, RAFFT date, SLJs and other embug.gerances.
If you must tell them, tell war stories not bore stories.

[Bear 555]

Hi All,

Left 3 years ago on medical grounds. Went to Saudi with BWoS to carry on managing ATC Engineering projects (ex-TG3 SNCO). Just come back and moved sideways in company.

BWos in Saudi was easy transition with mess style accom, uniform to wear and similar lifestyle - oh and loads of dosh to boot.

Harsh realities set in now on return to UK 'civilian' life - - it sucks. Looking to run away now, preferably to somewhere warm!

I do miss the life, the being involved and most of all the cameraderie in difficult times.

Dark Helmet - I also did PPL and it surely keeps me sane.

As for advice or thoughts? The grass on the other side of the hill is a different shade of green. It can be, but its not always, a nicer shade.

Cheers,

Bear 555

[Blacksheep]

Aeroplanes are in the blood lads; you can't shake them off that easily. Anyone who really wants to break from aeroplanes is in the wrong job in the first place and its probably best to leave as soon as possible.

For those who want to leave the RAF/RN/AAC but stay with aviation, get well away from the military stuff and get into proper civil aviation. Don't be sucked in by "mess style accomodation" and all that sh*te, you might as well stay in as do that - their money isn't as good as it seems either, if you compare it with other expatriate lifestyles.

**************************
Through difficulties to the cinema

[EESDL]

Thanks for the suggestions/experiences folks. Some of you are quite cagey about what you do now, though. I'm not after your job, just your reasoning/logic etc. So Beags, if you're a 'consultant' what are you consulting about? Blacksheep, what are you actually doing in Borneo.

I've done enough flying in Civvy street to know the differences/advantages...surely there's a job out there that not only involves job satisfaction, being accountable for your own f
'ck-ups/reaping the benefits and with a bit of flying thrown in for good measure.

[BEagle]

EEDSL - I consult as a SME.

Qualifications: Degree in Aero Eng, several thousand hours specific role experience, the ability to communicate orally and verbally, plus a bit of basic IT (Word, PowerPoint, Excel) - and formal instructional qualifications. But more particularly, the word of mouth of others who know you!

[Blacksheep]

EESDL - I don't fly, I'm a reformed grease monkey - one of those forelorn figures you may occasionally glimpse lurking about in the rain when you mount your winged steed and take to the sky.

But check your Private Messages - the pathway of life can take many interesting turns without getting too far from where it began... ;)

**************************
Through difficulties to the cinema

[smartman]

BEagle

Orally AND verbally - what talent.

[BEagle]

Sorry - I meant that's what they wanted, not that's what I had to offer!

Edited later - Oh, AR$E!! I see what you were getting at, smartman! 'Verbally' and 'orally' are, of course, synonymous! What I meant was 'adequate written and spoken expression'! ******** that I am!

Mark you, 'oral expression' always puts me in mimd of Monica Lewinsky....

[Chef]

I left in 1997 ex MT after an attempt at a posting to Lossie, nothing against Lossie a fantastic place, however new house baby settled down you know the score.........

I got messed around and PVR'd, lucky it was free as they were on the tail end of "options for change" found it very difficult to adjust to civvie life, went to EGSS part time dispatch then worked my way up to management i am so glad that this was my direction, i would not work in any other industry. You will be suprised how many ex forces work in civil aviation and you still get the inter services banter. Remember a couple of things though.

1. You will need to chill a little and take things a wee bit slower

2. Join a union, be careful who you trust its not the same as the mob where you look out for your mate, some not all will stich you to save themself.

3. Enjoy what you do, trust me having an ex services background helps you go along way.

[FEBA]

EESDL
There is no surgical procedure that I know of that can remove the pleasant nostalgia that aflicts you on a daily basis after you have left. When you're in it's cr@p, when you're out it was a fantastic life.
Speaking as one who has had the pleasure of falling out of the side and back of many a helicopter and noting your ATPL(H) I have the perfect job for you. Fancy being a delivery man? PM me for details
Hapy new year
FEBA

[Bodmeister]

I put as much distance between me and T.Blair Esq by emmigrating half-way round the world to NZ. Now happily basking in the sun teaching airline wannabes as a University Lecturer. Biggest news item in the antipodes is crayfish quotas, bummer eh!!!!

[Airbedane]

I left a full career by PVR some 15 years ago, and I haven't looked back. The reason was partly lack of promotion and partly that I was offered a job as a TP with a major UK company. I'm still in the same work, but with a different Company - both corporate and test flying - and still very much enjoying it.

The only things I missed were the medical and dental support, which I believe is non-existant now, anyway. The plus's were no SDO's, no junior sqn ldrs practiing their man management on me, no secondary duties, no short notice postings and no mess bills. I've kept in touch with old friends, though, through military contract work.

Civilian life is different - you're stuck with the same people for the whole career, rather than postings every three years or so, so choose your work mates carefully. You're also stuck in the same place. Appraisals still exist, but pay is also negotiable and if objectives are agreed, remuneration could be tied to success or failure - you become a part of your destiny, something I did not achieve in the Service.

I really enjoyed my 20 years in the RAF, but I've had a lot more fun and success as a civilian pilot.