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Delta Whiskey
9th Dec 2003, 08:02
For those interested in Jon Johanson's latest endurance epic:

He filed NZNV DCT 90S180W DCT HONDO DCT SADG (Mont Grande in Argentina I think). I believe he left Invercargill about 0700 UTC on the 7th and had a total EET of 33 hrs, END 35 hrs.

McMurdo Centre told me just now that he got as far as the South Pole before having to return to McMurdo, and is on the ground there at the moment.

Cheers
DW

Bevan666
9th Dec 2003, 08:56
Crickey thats a long way on one tank of juice!

For those who want a map view look here (http://gc.kls2.com/cgi-bin/gc?PATH=NZNV-90S180W-SAWE%0D%0A&RANGE=&PATH-COLOR=red&PATH-UNITS=nm&SPEED-GROUND=130&SPEED-UNITS=kts&RANGE-STYLE=best&RANGE-COLOR=navy&MAP-STYLE=)

Bevan..

Woomera
9th Dec 2003, 11:32
VH-NOJ = VAN'S RV-4.

Where does he put all the gas for 35 hrs endurance? :confused:

williamsf1
9th Dec 2003, 13:34
The back seat has a bloody great big alloy tank in it!!!

Aussie Andy
9th Dec 2003, 17:49
Jeez, that's impressive: what an inspiration! Makes my ambition to fly back to Australia SEP look pretty tame!

Andy :eek:

Knackers
10th Dec 2003, 05:36
He flew Hedland to Parafield via over head Perth on the first day of NAS. Thru a gaggle of inbound jets at FL155, which gave us all a feel for the way the E airspace worked!

I understand that this was a record attempt - how did it go?

Pharcarnell
10th Dec 2003, 06:06
Appearantly he's had trouble and landed at McMurdo and now the seppos are refusing to help get him going again.
This could get interesting.

Bevan666
10th Dec 2003, 07:30
Is there any avgas down at McMurdo?

There is a woman in a piper dakota trying to fly over antartica at the moment aswell. She's on the other side at the moment I think.

Bevan..

Aussie Andy
10th Dec 2003, 07:33
There is a woman in a piper dakota trying to fly over antartica at the momentYes, its Polly Vacher from the UK in PA28-236 DakotaLATEST NEWS:Tuesday 9th December 2003 - POLLY IS NOW TRYING TO REORGANISE THINGS AFTER HER FLIGHT TO McMURDO LAST FRIDAY HAD TO BE ABORTED DUE TO STRONG HEADWINDS, FORCING HER TO RETURN TO BASE. It was the only safe decision she could make in the circumstances. See http://www.worldwings.org/

Andy

Delta Whiskey
10th Dec 2003, 08:14
Appearantly he's had trouble and landed at McMurdo and now the seppos are refusing to help get him going again. This could get interesting.

I don't know whether it's a case of anyone refusing to get him going again - there simply isn't any AVGAS at McMurdo, everything there that flies runs on kerosene. But you're right about things getting interestng.

I hope he's packed a few spare pairs of undies and a wooly jumper - it might be a while still the next tanker comes by with petrol

DW

Wirraway
10th Dec 2003, 11:10
AAP

Australian pilot stranded in Antarctic
By Steve Larkin
December 10, 2003

AN Australian pilot is stranded in Antarctica after becoming the first person to fly a home-built, single-engine aircraft over the South Pole.

Pilot Jon Johanson had been refused fuel, which he needed to fly home, at a joint United States-New Zealand base in the Antarctic, his partner Sue Ball said today.

Mr Johanson yesterday completed his flight over the South Pole, which started at Invercargill on New Zealand's South Island on Sunday.

The Adelaide-based pilot had planned to continue on to Argentina but strong head winds meant his plane used more fuel than originally planned.

After realising that his fuel load was about an hour less than required to land in Argentina, Mr Johanson made a forced landing at the US-NZ McMurdo-Scott base in the Antarctic.

The base deters tourists, insisting any visitors are totally self-sufficient.

In line with that policy, officials at the base had refused Johanson the 400 litres of fuel he required to return to NZ, Ms Ball said.

"He is stuck there," Ms Ball said today.

Base officers had offered to put Mr Johanson on one of the regular commercial flights from the Antarctic and then ship his plane home when a suitable vessel became available with the pilot picking up the costs.

But Ms Ball said that scenario was unsuitable when Ms Johanson could return if given 400 litres of fuel.

Ms Ball had asked the Federal Government to lobby the US and NZ officials to provide the required fuel.

Mr Johanson flew his RV-4 aircraft over the South Pole after travelling a total flight distance of 3345 nautical miles in 26-and-a-half hours.

The home-built plane was modified with a specialised engine and greater than normal fuel capacity.

Ms Ball said it was also believed Mr Johanson became the first person to fly a fixed-wing aircraft solo over the South Pole on a long distance flight.

Mr Johanson had previously flown the same plane around the world three times, including over the North Pole.

AAP

=========================================

slice
10th Dec 2003, 12:10
So is there any Avgas there ?? If not the usually accuracy of reporting has applied

Base officers had offered to put Mr Johanson on one of the regular commercial flights from the Antarctic

Regular commercial flights !?!?!? :D - wow I'm off down to the Flight Centre to book a ticket on one of those regular commercial flights! :E



Mr Johanson made a forced landing at the US-NZ McMurdo-Scott base in the Antarctic.

So he actually ran out of fuel and glided in did he ? :suspect:

Beer Can Dreaming
10th Dec 2003, 12:37
Hate to sound like a wowser but after flying his sircraft solo around the world three times this guy has nothing to prove to anyone.

It amazes me to see people doing silly things like this as I was witness to many years ago in Papua New Guinea when some menapausal divorcee house wife was in the media for doing long over-water stints in a single engined aircraft.

The fact was that female ferry pilots do what this woman did but on a regular basis - but they dont get the unnecessary media attention.

Touted "Amelia Earhart" this person had some equipment stolen by rascals in PNG from her aircraft,broke down uncontrollably and threatened to return to Australia.

After our employer gave her some lone equipment (not sure if returned) she was on her way much to the medias delight and fanfare.
Not ever a word of thanks to those that made her flight possible.
Says alot really.

Needless to mention the huge cost involved if anyone ever went missing over huge areas of water.
If anyone goes missing fair enough but whilst performing a "stunt" who should pay the Bill?

Bombay
10th Dec 2003, 13:51
It's absolutely disgusting behaviour on the part of the officials at the Antarctic bases.

The guy isn't asking for a handout to get home. There are no taxpayer's dollars going to be spent rescuing him.

HE WANTS TO BUY FUEL!!!

If I didn't have so little faith in the power-at-be in the Antarctic, I'd ask the boys for a whip-around and we could get him the 400 litres of Avgas ourselves and send it to him.

I just watched the news footage on TV here in NZ and the officials are adamant that they will not help him, even to the extent that he is being made to sleep in the plane at a "perfectly fine" -10 deg C!!

Good luck Jon. Safe travels home.

kavu
10th Dec 2003, 14:10
typical aussie

doesn't plan properly and gets stuck in the deep south. then crys because nobody wants to help. or at least would charge a heavy penalty for helping him and he crys over it.

bout time

:{ :{ :{

YMML
11th Dec 2003, 06:25
I must say I'm getting a little annoyed by Jon Johanson. What is he trying to achieve other than personal glory? Is there any benefit for anyone else such as Charities?

I strongly support people persuing their dreams, but believe it is unreasonable to expect others to make up for your own careless risk taking. Being adventurous doesn't absolve one from responsibility.

Whilst it may seem extremely unreasonable not to make the fuel available I would expect they fear the precedent they may set. If fuel is made available why shouldn't anyone else give it a go if that's what excites them. What happens when someone crashes 50 or 500nm from the base next time? It won't be SAR in Canberra that goes to get them. The people working in Antarctica will have to expose themselves to additional risk to go searching for someone who is not actually achieving anything for the wider community.

They have offered to send him home on a scheduled flight and thats about all he should hope for.

Slice: There are relatively regular flights to and from Antarctica in the right season (Southern summer). Not quite B737 CityFlyers on the half hour but similar to the regular commercial charters to many mines in Australia for crew changes.

With regard to Avgas actually being available, not certain, but there was DC3's flying in Antarctica as recently as two years ago and I expect some still do. Good chance that some Avgas is around but like everything in Antactica I doubt you would describe it as surplus!

I thought in aviation we tried to balance productive goals against appropriate levels of risk taking to achieve a safe outcome. In these adventure type flights all I see is huge levels of risk with little or no productive goal attached.

A decision to fly unassisted in the Antarctic is not only made with your own life, but with that of others. I think they are justified in doing nothing to encourage further attempts.

Safe flying, YMML.

Ushuaia
11th Dec 2003, 11:47
"Oh ok then, Mr Johanson, we'll sell you 400 litres of AVGAS then, just to get you moving. That'll be $100 per litre, sir.... yes, that's right, per litre.... Don't like that? Well, feel free to shop around...."

TIMMEEEE
11th Dec 2003, 15:54
Please correct me if I'm wrong but isn't this guy actually sponsored by Air BP?
So what are their comments I wonder?
And yes - this guy knew prior to his departure of the difficulty in obtaining Avgas in such a remote area.

If there is any left over Avgas from a few years ago it would have been time expired.

Thirdly Kavu was spot on as the headwinds were predicted by the NZ Met office prior to leaving Invercargill.
He pressed on regardless so should pay the price accordingly.

If you ask me the NZ/US authorities have better things to do than to bail out enthusiastic amateurs such as this guy.

Speaking of enthusiastic amateurs what about Dick Smith and his comments on "bastardry" and insisting that this guy should be elevated to "hero status".
Typical of Dickless.

Kanga767
11th Dec 2003, 16:16
I agree, give him nothing.

There's no requirement nowadays, in the name of human endevour/exploration or adventure, why someone has to operate a particular piece of machinery in the glory of being the first to do so to an isolated spot of the globe, then expect government agencies to come to aid them in succeeding if something goes wrong. (For Government agencies, read, you and me, the taxpayer).

Indeed it should now be considered an individual's glory/exploration/adventure that is being sought, with associated costs/risks borne by same.

An offer of rescue at his expense, which is what is on offer, is adequate. Being able to buy fuel from the base should be considered as 'Government agencies coming to aid them in succeeding if something goes wrong'.

What next, people launching themselves into orbit expecting NASA, the Russian space agency or China to rescue them/fill up at the ISS, then claiming to be the first individual to sponser themselves in space??

K

slice
11th Dec 2003, 16:39
YMML - as far as I know all the flights to Mcmurdo are conducted by Air Force aircraft C130s C141s C17s etc. - It is an ice runway. Hardly similar to civil mining charter flights.

BTW has heard the interview Dick tool made on the ABC ? The usual waffle you expect from this eeejit.'NZ won't give Johansen fuel because they are scared of America' -yeah whatever Dick !! :hmm:

Extract from http://www.theice.org/mcmstay.html


FUELS
Fuel conservation is of primary importance. Scarcity of this product and increased costs have a major impact on the operational program. Your compliance with published antarctic energy conservation measures is required. Keep room and building temperatures at a comfortable level (65 degrees F or lower) and turn off all unecessary lights.

KAPTAIN KREMIN
11th Dec 2003, 17:27
You're missing the big picture - give fuel to this bloke and you're likely to have all sorts of yurgens and poms and kiwis charging over there in their homebuilts - thousands of the ******s - not to mention the illegal immigrants!

This is all about deterence.

BUT

This could be a time to test the American - Australian Alliance (DOH! but we don't have an Australian - American Alliance though do we! - foiled again) or perhaps the ANZUS treaty.

josephshankes
12th Dec 2003, 03:55
Well I guess the US/NZ authorities are being Pedantic.

I am sure the Australians know all about that.

Let us just cast our minds back to when Helen Clark arrived in Australia and was searched. Yes, you never know she could have been armed.

Rules are rules. Right?

KAPTAIN KREMIN
12th Dec 2003, 05:01
ABC reported, last night, that Jon had used up excess fuel due to "HEAVY" winds:

Who plans for that!!!!!

compressor stall
12th Dec 2003, 05:56
Notwithstanding the above, as of a few years ago, there are a few drums of AVGAS about 50nm from McMurdo, lying around in the snow...Might be a long roll for him though.

It is a long standing policy of Antarctic bases never to assist adventurers there. I seem to recall DS himself commenting on that during one of his flights round the pole?

poteroo
12th Dec 2003, 07:28
Was there a shorter Route?


A year of two back, there was a lot of talk about Albany WA,(35deg S), being the best departure point for aircraft taking a load down to the Antarctic bases. Had to do with stronger winds from the W/NW as you fly further south. Calculations were an extra 1 tonne on a 737 out of Albany rather than Hobart.

Of course, it was against Albany on the return - better to go Hobart.

Just idly thinking about whether Jon Johanson looked at this aspect, but I have to admit that an extra 10 deg south from Christchurch might more than make up the difference.


THE 'RESCUE'

Further, on the 'rescue' issues, Australia has engaged in several very expensive rescues of yachtspersons, who knowingly sailed far south into known dangerous waters. Bullimore the Pom was one, and the most infamous was the French woman,(twice rescued). Neither of these paid a cent back, despite earning windfall payments from the press and media. The latter was notable for her arrogant lack of contrition.

It begs the question as to whether Jon made any worse a planning decision than these yachties?

cheers,

tobzalp
12th Dec 2003, 08:08
Especially as there is not alternative to sending a frigate down there. :rolleyes:

ugly
12th Dec 2003, 08:27
It is a long standing policy of Antarctic bases never to assist adventurers there. I seem to recall DS himself commenting on that during one of his flights round the pole?I believe Mr Smith ended up buying fuel from the Russians. As an occasional visitor to these forums perhaps he has some insights to offer

Pharcarnell
12th Dec 2003, 10:34
His insights were being aired fairly loudly on radio this morning. Missed some of it as I was in traffic but I think he was sh*t canning the seppos/kiwis.

ZK-EBC
12th Dec 2003, 13:45
Polly Vacher today aborted her flight, which was two years in the planning, because of fuel supply difficulties and bad weather.
Antarctica New Zealand spokeswoman Shelly Peebles said Ms Vacher had "very kindly" offered her fuel, which was left by a private cruise ship at Scott Base in Antarctica, to help Australian pilot Jon Johanson.
Mr Johanson, who was attempting to fly to Argentina from Invercargill in New Zealand, had been forced to land at McMurdo Base in Antarctica on Monday after flying to the South Pole without enough fuel to return to New Zealand or fly on.
Antarctica New Zealand chief executive Lou Sanson said Mr Johanson "should be grateful" to Ms Vacher for enabling him to fly his plane back to Invercargill.
"We do not have the type of fuel (avgas) his plane requires at Scott Base and have been advised by other pilots that Mr Johanson would be running a significant risk if he used the fuel (mogas) that we do stock," he said in a statement.
"The fuel we work with is for generators and not of aviation quality."
Ms Vacher's trip had been well-organised and "properly planned", he said.
"She and her staff spent two years preparing for her flight with significant advice from national Antarctic programmes.
"It is ironic that she is now assisting a stranded pilot who embarked upon an ill-prepared and secret flight over the South Pole," he said.
Mr Johanson had 35 hours of fuel for a journey estimated to take 36 hours by going through the South Pole rather than the most direct route to Argentina, which would have required 33 hours.
He had no search and rescue back-up or contingency plans in place.
New Zealand and United States representatives in Antarctica offered Mr Johanson transport back to Christchurch on one of the regularly scheduled flights between McMurdo and Christchurch and to return his plane via ship at a later stage.

Stuff news 12 December 2003

However, Mr Johanson did not want to accept the flight back to Christchurch, as he feared it would be expensive and his plane might be damaged during shipping.

YMML
12th Dec 2003, 14:46
Slice- Sorry if I implied that the flights were the same as mining charter flights. What I meant in terms of similarity was that aircraft are commercially chartered on a relatively regular basis to move crew and equipment into Antarctica. Various Russian cargo planes (some ex-mil, some civil) land on ice runways down there. It's not just military though it may be specifically at McMurdo, I'm not certain.

There's a company called Adventure Network International that enables private travellers to fly to Antarctica.

Anywho, what's the latest with the situation?

Bevan666
13th Dec 2003, 09:51
From Polly's website (http://www.worldwings.org/)



As you may be aware, Australian pilot Jon Johannsen recently made an unscheduled stop at McMurdo in his home-built RV4 light aircraft. To aid the Australian and New Zealand National Programmes with the problem, Polly, together with the owners of her fuel, Shell, have released two barrels of her fuel which has been stored at McMurdo to enable him to fly back to New Zealand. Antarctica New Zealand has released a statement saying they are sorry Polly Vacher has not been able to complete her flight, which was professionally planned, and are grateful that she has, in turn, been able to help Johannsen. It is on the understanding that he will now work tirelessly for Wheelies on Wings, the Australian equivalent to Flying Scholarships for the Disabled.

halwise
14th Dec 2003, 06:06
LATEST NEWS: Saturday 13 December 2003 -

VOYAGE TO THE ICE RE-ROUTED AS ATTEMPTS TO FLY ACROSS ANTARCTICA HAVE HAD TO BE ABANDONED

Polly still remains at Rothera Base, Antarctica, waiting for a weather window to fly to the Argentine Base of Marambio. We are sincerely grateful to the Argentinian Air Force which has come to her rescue by flying fuel to Marambio so that Polly can return to Ushuaia.

Polly is unable to continue her flight across Antarctica as, for logistical reasons, she is unable to secure fuel at Patriot Hills, despite making plans to do so from the outset. Once back in Ushuaia, she will be retracing her steps through South America and the USA to California where she will fly across the Pacific to South Island, New Zealand to continue with her original route from Dunedin as planned.

As you may be aware, Australian pilot Jon Johannsen recently made an unscheduled stop at McMurdo in his home-built RV4 light aircraft. To aid the Australian and New Zealand National Programmes with the problem, Polly, together with the owners of her fuel, Shell, have released two barrels of her fuel which has been stored at McMurdo to enable him to fly back to New Zealand. Antarctica New Zealand has released a statement saying they are sorry Polly Vacher has not been able to complete her flight, which was professionally planned, and are grateful that she has, in turn, been able to help Johannsen. It is on the understanding that he will now work tirelessly for Wheelies on Wings, the Australian equivalent to Flying Scholarships for the Disabled.

THIS PROJECT IS NOT TERMINATING. POLLY VACHER IS STILL THE FIRST WOMAN TO HAVE FLOWN AROUND ANTARCTICA IN A SINGLE-ENGINE LIGHT AIRCRAFT AND WILL CONTINUE HER FLIGHT.

compressor stall
15th Dec 2003, 12:07
Nice publicity for Shell, as BP are Mr Johnassons's main sponsor!

YMML - Adventure Network International are no longer servicing Antarctica. Not even sure if they are still in existance.

RV6-VNE - Albany is indeed closer to the Australian bases - not to Antarctica. Our bases are quite a long way west. CHCH-McMurdo is 3831, HB-McMurdo is 3995. Also remember that CHCH is a little way "up" in the south island, so the over water distance is reduced even further!

Also, if he was flying due (true) south (makes sense as he was headed over the south pole) he'd want to start from as far south as possible. Albany is a bit further north than HB!

CS

Hippolite
16th Dec 2003, 22:43
Just some facts for interest..


All the aviation fuel at McMurdo is turbine fuel for the C130s, C17s, Twin Otters, Bell 212s and AS350s down there. All the vehicles are diesel powered so it would only be the portable generator fuel from the Kiwis which would be available.

All flights to and from McMurdo are by either the US military (New York Air Guard etc.) and the occasional Kiwi C130.

There are no civilian flights to or from McMurdo to anywhere.

Hippolite :cool:

MLS-12D
7th Jun 2004, 22:21
Great post, Kavu. :p

Yep, Alex Henshaw, Jean Batten, Amy Johnson, et al. ... a bunch of good-for-nothings who achieved nothing and required too much official assistance. :hmm:

Personally I think that you're simply jealous of all of Jon Johannsen's many accomplishments.