Constructive Hour Building

[P1 Forever]

Hi everyone,

I am currently building my hours towards the 150hr for CPL.

I would like to know if anyone can tell me what we mean by constructive hour building and the so called burning holes in the sky phrase that we hear?

I know that it would be silly to stay in the circuit and build hours that way but I would appreciate if anyone could enlighten me on how to build hours effectively.

Thank you.

[FlyingForFun]

Just my opinion:

Burning holes in the sky would be: staying in the circuit for 100 hours. Or spending 100 hours flying backwards and forwards from Lydd to Le Touquet. Or getting some aerobatics training and flying loops and rolls for 100 hours. Or getting an IMC rating and flying the ILS at Bournemouth every week.

Constructive hour-building would be: staying in the circuit enough that you can land the aeroplane exactly where you want every time. And doing a few trips to France, Belgium, Luxembourg, Holland, Channel Islands and so on, but also to the far corners of Britain - and varying between large controlled airfields and small farm-strips. And getting some aeros training, or some tail-wheel training, or some float-plane training. And getting an IMC rating, and getting some actual IMC as well as taking a safety pilot to a variety of precision and non-precision approaches.

Note the important word: and. I think that variety is the important thing. It might also to help to read my CPL Diary slightly further down in this forum to see what you'll be doing on the CPL course, and make sure you're up to speed on everything that's covered.

Don't forget your 300nm trip with landings at two airports other than the airport of departure. And don't forget your night qualification, which isn't mandatory, but if you don't have it before your CPL you'll need to do it as part of the CPL training anyway.

FFF
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PS - Wish I'd had a chance to do everything on my list! But I did do most of it.

[pa28biggles]

Im currently hour building, and try to structure it in the way that FlyingForFun has described. Except I don't go abroad (would like to do though at some point), or practice IMC flying since I have no IMC rating.

FlyingForFun, what would your opinon be now you've got your CPL, would you say:
1) Get the IMC and practice whilst hour building, it will save money at CPL training, well worth the investment.
2) Get it if you can afford it, but if you cant it'll get covered at CPL anyway, though you may have to spend a bit of extra time practicing IMC.

Feedback much appreciated, this may help P1 Forever too.

[FlyingForFun]

PA28Bigs,

The CPL course includes a minimum of 10 hours of IMC flight, unless you have an IR. There is no reduction for holding an IMC rating, nor for any other instrument flying. So if you don't have an IMC rating, there is plenty of time on the course to learn everything that needs to be learnt.

However, you have to build 100 hours or so. It makes sense to do a small number of those hours with an instructor to ensure that you don't let too many bad habits creep in. So the IMC rating is, effectively, free. And having the rating will definitely make the CPL easier - the whole of the instrument section of the CPL, except for plotting navaid fixes, was a complete non-event for me. And I'm all for making things easier when possible!

Hope that answers the question. But I have heard a rumour that the amount of IMC stuff on the CPL course is going to be reduced quite dramatically fairly soon.....

FFF
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[18greens]

Just a small technical point, the correct term is DRILLING holes in the sky if you are in something with a spinny thing on the front. Burning would apply to something with reheat.

On the subject of what to do just make it count like FFF says. I don't fly unless i am with someone or going to a flyin or renewing a rating or flying a new type or something. The worst case is someone who rents the same plane and goes off to the local area for a hour every time.

Make it fun.

[pa28biggles]

Thank you for replying.
I thought that you needed to build 100hrs P1 time post PPL. If you do an IMC rating, the time will not count because it is Pu/t ????

[P1 Forever]

Thanks for the input guys!

I get the idea now, although I don't know about flying to France or Holland especially on my own.

Anyway, thanks again, Cheers!

[FlyingForFun]

PA28,

The requirements for modular CPL license issue are 200 hours, including 100 hours of PIC. That means that, if you're going to apply with the minimum time, you can still have up to 100 hours of dual.

The PPL is a 45-hour course, of which at least 10 hours must be solo, leaving 35 hours of dual. The CPL is a 25 hour course. That's 60 hours of dual. Since no one gets through in minimum times, we'll increase that to, say, 80 hours. That still gives you 20 hours of optional extra dual, without having to go over the 200 hour minimum.

The IMC course is only 15 hours - let's say that it takes you 20 hours, so it will fit into your hour-building quite nicely unless it takes an unusually long time to get either your PPL, IMC or CPL.


P1,

There is nothing difficult about flying out of the country - but it's a mental barrier which is nice to overcome (and which you'll have to overcome if you're going to fly airliners!) Why not do it once, either with an instructor, or as a passenger with a pilot who's done it before? If you're hiring a club aircraft, you may find that your club requires you to do it with an instructor the first time in any case.

What you'll find is that the flying is no different to any other flying. All the hard work needs to be done on the ground, before you go - and that basically involves reading up on customs, immigration, special branch and flight plan requirements (it's all in Pooleys, except for how to file a flight plan which is in one of the CAA Safety Sense leaflets), and learning to read foreign charts (not much different to our charts - just look at the key for anything you don't recognise).

FFF
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[Tinstaafl]

Usually the intent of min. experience requirements that exceed min. training course hours is to try to have the candidate for the licence gain experience & improve skill. A broad range of experience is better than 100hrs of any single thing. Part of learning involves stretching yourself out of your 'comfort zone' a little bit. Not so much that you're overwhelmed, but enough to force you to look carefully at what you're doing, cope with new variations of problems etc.

FFF has given very sensible advice.

[willbav8r]

I enjoy circuit bashing, as landings are the fun part. Nothing wrong with practicing touch and go's, engine out and other emergency procedures, short approaches, soft field. short field etc.

If all is working smoothly, howsabout the following;

Tailwheel
Aerobatics
Seaplane
Multi Engine
Night Cross Country
Complex / High Performance
Instrument training
Cross Country

If you have an interest/chance to do the above stuff, you will quickly have a lot of different experience and knowledge.

[pa28biggles]

FlyingForFun,
Thank you for taking your time to explain things. I've been so focused on hour building 100hrs P1, I've forgotten about the fact that I'll need some more time with an instructor. Going to have a good study of LASORs to clear things up.
Thank you again.

[englishal]

Just my opinion: (as every opinion I post on here is, unless someone is telepathically feeding thoughts into my brain without me knowing:p )

Constructive hour building is improving you level of experience, however you do it. I would tend to go places, point at the map, choose a location then go. Don't get into the trap of going from A to B, B to A etc., as this is not constructive hour building. The key to being a commercial pilot is aeronautical decision making, you can teach a monkey to fly a 152, but he can't nescessarily make the correct decision with regards to the safety of the flight.

My advice would be to go and get an IMC rating if you don't already have one, then go and get some experience, fly in marginal weather IFR. Fly some other aircraft, maybe a high performace, complex, tailwheel, airship, whatever, get pleanty of cross country time and IFR cross country time, and the big thing....HAVE FUN doing it :D (get a mate to go with you for a 100GBP/$/Euro burger, or another pilot who wants a jolly to france...)

Good luck

EA

[Linda Mollison]

Another bit of advice - get hold of the 'CAA Notes for the Guidance of Applicants Taking the CPL Skill Test' - Standards Document 3, Version 06.

This goes through the whole procedure of the CPL Skill Test and, most importantly, includes on the last page the CPL Skill Test tolerances.

My advice is, when you go flying, try and replicate a CPL skill test and try and do it within the tolerances given in the CAA document.

You will find it helps enormously when you come to do your CPL training.

[FougaMagister]

P1 Forever - constructive hour building means treating each flight as an exercise. It's also more cost-effective in the long run. As they say Stateside, "train hard, fly easy".

PA 28 - don't be reluctant to cross FIR boundaries. VFR Channel-crossing is really a non-event, and sampling different airspace & procedures is good practice.

Cheers

[pa28biggles]

FougaMagister,
The reason why I haven't been to France is that its a 'long way' from Leeds, whereas if you were based at Cranfield its not quite as far. Its satisfying the following conditions that's the problem:
1. Getting decent weather from Leeds down to northern France at the same time
2. Actually being booked to fly that day
I'm going to plan to go to Isle of Man soon, then France to get that cross FIR experience! :D