FR@BFS

[BELHold]

Seems just about everyone at BFS knows that Ryanair will be taking up apron space in the very near future, in fact they even know that the work in progress in the old baggage bay is in fact a dedicated FR lounge!

What I would like to know is whether MO & AH know.

[carlos vandango]

since when did FR have dedicated lounges?????

[eastern wiseguy]

Hey Bel H .....whats the truth in this?..seems every few months we get another "yes they are ..no they aren't" sort of story.What news of routes dates times?(Allmcc need not reply)

[mysecretsmile]

I too heard yesterday to expect an announcement before Christmas regarding Ryanair starting services from BFS - I look forward to hearing what new routes they will bring to the province. Should be good for all concerned in aviation business in N.Ireland.

[WHBM]

I've already been into BFS with FR. Fog div from DUB, approx 1900.

Sat on ground for yonks until crew were going out of hours and DUB just getting worse as predicted. Only then did anyone even think about ringing round for coaches. 130 pax dropped off outside a chaotic, empty, busless, taxiless DUB terminal at 0300.

PS - anyone else in this predicament, walk across car park to Great Southern Hotel, 10 Euro tip to night porter, taxi ordered and there in 10 mins.

[ALLMCC]

Wiseguy, you say no need to reply but can't resist it! Can't wait for this to happen - the beautiful "orange" fireworks display above BFS would be unmissable! - the only question I have is who will be brave enough to light the "blue" touch paper?

On a positive note, would be nice to see some of the vast empty space at BFS being put to some use!

Replies/usual childish abuse awaited in due course!

[omoko joe]

ALLMCC, much as i have no interest in the BFS/BHD debate which seems to be your raison d'etre, I'd love to know where all this space is at BFS. Last time I was in we were number 6 for approach and the apron was chocked full of boeing's and buses. The freight apron was busy too. Smell the coffee..its a CAT3 International airport with a nice big runway and a 'regional' sized spare. The city is perfectly adequate too..as a regional hub.

[ALLMCC]

omoko joe

Sorry when I was referring to "space" I was referring to the " terminal building" and not to ramp space!. Agree BHD is a regional hub (but much more than a spare!). However, judging by most of the routes operated from BFS, it considers itself to be also!

Herein lies the problem.

[richardnei]

Was taking to some workers at Aldergrove and was told that Ryanair have signed a contract to begin flights in Feb '04.

Also last night Ryanair were operating training flights into Aldergrove in the very early hours carrying out a number of touch and go's and go-arounds.

[with alacrity]

omoko joe

Excellent post. An accurate and truthful appraisal of the present situation.

richardnei

Ryanair have arrived at BFS on a couple of occasions recently to operate training flights but only because the weather at Prestwick was unfavourable. At least it gave them the opportunity to check the place out .

I have no axe to grind or appear contentious but I have also heard from a previously ' very reliable source' that Ryanair will indeed be starting up at BFS in February. Very good news for the travelling public of Northern Ireland as I would assume that the airline will be opening up new European routes instead of competing on existing domestic routes.
As I look after traffic entering and leaving the Belfast TMA it is also welcome news to me that traffic levels will increase.

[tallseabird]

"Last time I was in we were number 6 for approach and the apron was chocked full of boeing's and buses"

"Sorry when I was referring to "space" I was referring to the " terminal building" and not to ramp space!"

DUH! Load factors must be bad

(ALLMCC need not reply)

[TripleIRS]

Good news about FR coming to Belfast International.

As for Belfast City Airport (personally, I'd rather use the Dutch pronunciation of the word 'City'):

Only one wee runway
Only wee taxiways (and not enough of them)
Only a wee apron
Only a wee terminal, where one can't even buy a decent meal
Loads of wee portacabins, because the terminal is too wee
Only one wee CAT I ILS
Only wee approach and runway lights
Only wee airport opening hours

In other words it's just a WEE airport, not big enough for the aeroplane that I fly.

But, ALLMCC, you could always try writing to Santa!

;)

[Tower Ranger]

Triple RS
Thanks for your invaluable contribution. Obviously wee haven`t got all the big toys but I think you probably know from experience it`s not the size but what you do with it!!
(personally I prefer the Dutch pronounciation of aerosol )

[sparkymarky]

Part of Ryanair's route announcement yesterday was that the announcement of a new hub was imminent. But they declined to elaborate on it's location.

From this thread it seems the smart money will be on Belfast?

[ALLMCC]

Triple RS

And what is this "big" aeroplane of yours - a Spruce Goose perhaps - have you ever actually been to Belfast City? - big toys are all very well, its the no of passengers on them that actually matters!

All the rest (ex Tower Ranger - good post!)

If this is all supposedly happening in February then why has it not been officially announced? - new routes (and closings) revealed by FR yesterday (lets try these ones & see how they go).

TBI might own BFS but in name only because we all know who REALLY calls the shots there - looking forward to the fireworks!!

[eastern wiseguy]

Part of Ryanair's route announcement yesterday was that the announcement of a new hub was imminent. But they declined to elaborate on it's location

I suggest ALLmCC you ask MOL.

As to pax figures ...let me type s..l....o....w...l.....y BFS is streets ahead as I pointed out to you in NUMEROUS earlier threads(how's the runway resurface answer coming? no conferring...)

As to your "fireworks" I am of the opinion that with VERY few exceptions EZY and RYR go head to head..perhaps you could include those instances in your answer.

[sparkymarky]

Scrap my last comment. The new bases are Rome and Girona.

[ALLMCC]

Eastern Wiseguy, since you ALWAYS think you know best, we'll see what happens - are you really vain enough to think that if MOL opens a hub at BFS that he'll be content to operate just a couple of silly routes to the continent (even if the subsidies are available)?

If subsidies aren't available, then he'll do the next best thing and concentrate on domestic routes such as STN, LPL which will bring him into DIRECT competition with EZY - I am really amazed that you can't see that! - and do you really think that EZY will just sit back & let MOL crucify them? Wake up and smell the coffee!

Maybe now you'll see what I mean about fireworks! And the end result will benefit nobody!

[Buc Driver]

I must admit I hope that any European routes will be served by Easyjet rather than Ryanair, I fear that all Ryanair will do is fly to the middle of nowhere in France and Germany and then go head to head with Easyjet on UK routes, this is not what NI PLC wants or needs.

[ALLMCC]

Buc Driver

At long last a sensible post from somebody who has a true grasp of the situation - however, if the rumoured sale of TBI goes ahead then the whole low cost situation at BFS could be turned upside down as top priority for any new owner is bound to be to address the inherent causes of continually reducing revenue.

Perhaps this is the reason why all the rumours about FR have not got beyond pure conjecture!

[glynn-kayes]

He he he my airport,s better than yours,and so the saga of having two airports in Belfast goes on.But apparently FR are not just looking at european destinations from BFS but competition on the STN route with EZY,a twice daily service to PIK and up to five rotations per weekday twixt BFS-BHX.Flybe beware,theres many a slip twixt cup and lip........................................................

[Tower Ranger]

Oh Glynn, do behave, there is only one Airport in Belfast . There is however one somewhere over the mountains out in the countryside. Don`t tell me all that extra time you spent improving your spelling was at the expense of your Geography !!
BTW when are Baby moving to the city to improve their load factors?

[glynn-kayes]

Tower Ranger,BMIBABY have no plans to move to BHD whatsoever and are very happy with their operation at BFS and also they have just authorised a walk up sales desk at BFS and paid for it to be customised in BABY colours.BHD could never accomodate a low fares carrrier simply because of limited operating hours.If baby were to switch to BHD 20 percent of flights would have to divert to BFS because of jetbans after hours and a low fares airline could not afford to delay every night.As for BMI mainline,it is widely known that the biggest mistake was relocating operations from BFS to BHD although the contract is only for 5 years and not 10 as previousely thought.

BTW,let LC and BE fight over their 8 percent of scots traffic from NI from BHD,As if EZY will let Flybe take a share of their market.I dont think so.Flybe can never compete with EZY fares,just do a fare calc on either website for yourselves.....................................

[ALLMCC]

Glynn. where do you get your info from? BMI's load factors have improved significantly since they moved to BHD from BFS- admittedly a small part of this is due to the BA withdrawal since 2001 - how then can you say that it was BMI's biggest mistake to move to BHD - at least back up your statement with some facts!

As far as Baby are concerned, just because they have opened a sales desk in their colours at BFS does not necessarily confirm they are there to stay - after all it only takes 2 people and a pallet truck to lift a sales desk into a van and move it wherever they want - the current timings of Baby's flights would not require any alterations to fit BHD opening hours (which incidentally are under review, at present) - in the event that any flight was late that surely would be Baby's problem and not BHD's.

With regard to Flybe opening GLA/EDI from BHD, I suspect the "Orange " guys will have a few sleepless nights - I did a few dummy bookings on both websites and the fares were almost identical except in one instance when Flybe's was actually cheaper! The undoubted convenience of BHD will be an important factor in how the routes perfrom.

Finally.as for FR, dream on - it aint going to happen - a B738 on a short hop to PIK - get real!

p.s. interesting article in todays Belfast Telegraph re FR and Derry City Council

[eastern wiseguy]

ok ....I was going to say nothing ....BUT

1 BHD opening hours under review....yes they are BUT it will require a public enquiry to change them meantime finish your business and get to LHR nice and early...or finish late and drift over to LGW and home to NI later with Easy

2 Load factors on BMI LHR ...of course they have increased ...they have REDUCED the SIZE of the aircraft they fly into BHD because it would seem that the A321 doesn't like landing/departing on/from such a short field (nor do the pax!!)

3 Competition on the scottish routes. Will we see the same commitment to competition from Jersey/Flybe as they demonstrated on the Stansted route? They rolled over very quickly when they realised it was going to cost them a lot of money

4 I would suggest that Loganair have more to worry about than Easy as they will be chasing the same couple dozen pax a day who choose the "undoubted advantage of City"(paraphrasing but you know what I mean)

5 in the event that any flight was late that surely would be Baby's problem and not BHD's.

Great customer facing there....

6 Still no response from the runway question ....I am really going to have to hurry you


:hmm:


Tower Ranger

was I wrong...or didn't you seem to think that a move over the hill to a proper airport was a good idea not a few weeks back??:ok: :ok:

[Uncle Monty]

ALLMCC

That's quite a trick - comparing prices between FlyBE and ezy's NI - Scottish services.

Especially as Flybe doesn't start flying these roues until the end of March and ezy's summer schedules (starting end of March) haven't gone on sale yet.

Just what were you comparing?

Anyway, good to see you back in full flow. You went a bit quiet there when ezy's profits were posted. Was that anything to do with your hard and fast prediction that they were heading for a big year-end loss.

You provide us with endless hours of entertainment. Keep it up!

[eastern wiseguy]

Uncle Monty ...spot on ...he is our own Comical Ali....easyjet are bankrupt ...there are NO ...I tell you again NO passengers flying from BFS ...we will burn their stomachs in ....blah blah blah ..he keeps my typing skills up though...:ok:


yours (no doubt reported to teacher)

Eastern Wiseguy

[glynn-kayes]

Well said Eastern and Uncle,nearly three million pax per annum cant be wrong....................................................... ....................
BTW ALLMCC as I have already told you,Baby have no intention of moving to BHD,Believe it.

[babydoc]

Errrrr... BFS is within a whisker of reaching 4 million pax this year. BHD's figures will be closer to 2 million.

According to CAA figures posted on another thread, the BFS September numbers are up 17 per cent on the same time last year. BHD's were static.

Times are tough for TBI but they are tough for all airport operators with the exception of BAA (which owns all the prime-sited and extremely lucrative airports in the country).

The kind of fees paid by airlines at LHR, EDI, STN, LGW and co aren't available to the likes of BFS, EMA, LPL, BRS etc etc. You could also include BHD in that.

In order to win (bmi) and retain business (flybe) BHD will have had to offer similarly cut price deals as those offered by its rival up the road.

BHD's per passenger take isn't probably much more than BFS.

BFS does at least have the quite lucrative charter business and improving retail so that it can cash in on the growing loco passenger numbers.

Oh and people can't leave their cars in the local Tesco car park - thus depriving the airport of more crucial revenue.

There are no winners in the NI market - only losers. When's the big shake-out coming?

[glynn-kayes]

Hopefully soon,and thanks for the info Babydoc,anyway, Im of to NEW YORK for the hols so all of you have a very Merry Christmas and a prosperious New Year........................................................ ..

[ALLMCC]

Eastern, Monty & Glynn - the 3 wise men of BFS - wonder which star you're all following!

[Tower Ranger]

Eastern
It will hopefully be a little bit differerent this time to what happened with both Stansted and Luton. This time Flybe know exactly what to expect and with Gla and Edi being so close the en route times shouldn`t be too bad when compared to the eJ.
What was the question about the rwy , I must of missed it. As for a move over the hill, I`m always gonna be up for that but I don`t see why I should drag the other 1.9mil pax with me.

Glyn - have a great Hol, but is that New York JFK , La Guardia or Newark , which is your favorite and why are the others so bad??

[Kestrel_909]

T'is amazing the attention these two airports get, :) and yet it seems it's the same 'facts' brought up over and over again.

I know which is my favourite at the end of the day, and always the first I book flights from as opposed the other.

Still, better not take sides, BFx is the better :E

[glynn-kayes]

Tower Ranger,as I shall be on a standby ticket,I dont care much which airport I arrive into or out off,as long as I get on, their and back,also my first trip to NYC so have no idea which airport to prefer but i,ll let you know......................................................