Battle Of Britain Tonight!!!

[BEagle]

Hoorah for Channel 5! The famous Battle of Britain movie is on TV tonight - and it's advertised as being in Widescreen!! Satellite Channel 105 for those of us with what chum vascodagama calls 'Council house TV'.......

BEagle Towers will once again reverberate to the sound of Merlins, the Luftwaffe march........and there will, of course, be the sight of Susannah York in her undies to drool over...aaarrgh, nurse, the medication please!!!

Just realised it's over 34 years since I saw the premiere in Nottingham as a Flt Cdt!!

Edited to add: Starts at 2000 and ends at 2235. Videoplus+ code is 12915042 in case you want to make a back-up tape for your own personal use if you think you might doze off.....or just want to freeze frame on certain items:E

[Man-on-the-fence]

Any idea what time. Mrs Fence is currently glued to the telly watching Hollybollocks and I cant get a word in edgeways.

Not that I am complaining with all the lovely girlies on it:E

[Molesworth Hold]

From Spring Chicken to ****ehawk in thirty minutes.

Dagger Dagger Dagger!

[CrabInCab]

I just hope Ch5 don't bow to the PC brigade and give us the Ni66er version not the come here boy version.

[SirPercyWare-Armitag]

Isnt that the Dambusters?

The BofB also has the classic lines:

Following the nazi diplomats fascist tirade threatening England with devastation at the hands of the Luftwaffe, dear old Ralphie Richardson pours him a cup of tea and replies

"sorry, its 2 lumps you take isnt it?" :D


tak a tak a tak a tak a

[Man-on-the-fence]

"Ive seen it. Its a smelly old shack full of dead flies"

"Help yourselves everybody, theres no fighter escort"

[treadigraph]

"Get them up... get them up...": Trevor Howard, in persona Keith Park. Flies in the face of my preferred edict "Get them down, get them down", etc.

Can't receive C5 (Sinclair?) therefore might get video recording out in sympathy to help beer digestion!

[BEagle]

Well - the movie was in the best quality I've seen since the premiere!

Pity about the commercial breaks and C5 news though:(

[Maple 01]

You can teach monkeys to fly better than that

And for you F3 types


A third of a kill laddie, a third of a kill

-Nick

[Man-on-the-fence]

Most poignant quote

"Our young men have to shoot down their young men at a rate of 4 to 1"

[overstress]

My fave bit is the early morning scene where the guys leave the kids asleep in the cottage and exit the door.

The door is a '60s special large sheet of glass in the upper half and the door frame carries an 'Avon Lady' special bellpush not yet seen in 1940.

Iain McShane excels as the Sgt pilot and the final 'dogfight' extended sequence comes to mind every single VMC day entering the hold at BIG (and I'm serious!)

It must be the fp in me although farepayers not taxpayers now furnish the mortgage...

[reynoldsno1]

Just realised it's over 34 years since I saw the premiere in Nottingham as a Flt Cdt!!
mmmmmmm... must be about 100 Entry then.........

[Capt Homesick]

Something I've always wondered... at the end, there is a listing of all the nationalities who flew for the RAF. Included in this listing is one Israeli- 8 years before the formation of the state of Israel! Ever since I first saw the film (mid 70s? I was pre-teen at the time, anyway) I've wanted to know who he was...
Bows head and waits for the chorus of "Get a Life!"

[pr00ne]

Capt Homesick,

This used to intrigue me too, 1940 would make him a PALESTINIAN would it not?

[BEagle]

reynoldsno1 - close, actually 99 Entry B Sqn. My Flt Cdr appeared in the movie!

[YellowBelly]

Yup - a great movie but that modern doorbell always stuck in my mind too! Sad or what?

Remember looking out of my classrooom window as a young lad and seeing a large formation of the vintage aircraft (spits, hurricanes, hispanos) flying around. Lots of filming at Duxford which was not too far away - or perhaps enroute to Pinewood?

Gather that the hangar explosion was at Duxford, and they have regretted the demolition of that historical building ever since...

And yes, the fine display of webbing by Ms York...no more postings for a while....

[tony draper]

Didn't watch it this time round,had to go out, but I seem to recal Susana Yorks skirt length and general appearance owed much more to the sixties than the forties, and the chaps hair length would have raised a few eyebrows as well.

[BEagle]

It was a very good pin-sharp print which Ch5 used last night. So sharp that you could even see the fine texture of Susannah York's cheeks.

Though to which particular cheeks I refer I shall leave for you to imagine:E

[pulse1]

Herr Draper,

Didn't watch it this time round,had to go out


I have it on good authority from another thread that you were watching th "bollix" on another channel.:confused:

[MilOps]

Stupendous, fantastic film. I remember, as a 4 year old, it being made when I lived in Brighton, dog fights going on overhead. Left a lasting memory I can tell you.

Lighten up guys, if you want to nit pick you can have a field day, 4 bladed props, 6 stub exhausts, internal windscreen armour on the spits, cannon bulges etc. If you want to extend it then you can get into real triv; incorrect mae wests hair styles and lots more. But then hey who cares, it's a brilliant film that has an atmosphere that is unique, and according to my dad who was 14 in 1940, accurately captures the feel rather well.

I didn't bother watching it, I now have it on DVD! Region 1 unfortunately. Through my surround sound system the furnitre shakes and the moggie scarpers, bl00dy marvellous.

And welcome home sir, undercarriage lever a little sticky?

Well yes, as a matter of fact it was.

well don't tell the CO that, not if I were you........

[Dop]

I noticed the modern door (and I don't think they had metal up and over garage doors in 1940 either!!) when I was watching the DVD version a few weeks ago.
(How stupid is it that you can only get this film on DVD from the States?!)

Are we saddoes or what!!!

"Silence In Polish!"

[Pilgrim101]

I like the bit where the American Pilot from "Pearl Harbour", probably with an Enigma machine on his lap, shoots down most of the Germans, some wayward Japanese from a Kurosawa movie fighting alongside the Luftwaffe , and all the Italians over the English Channel in the rain and fog with full right rudder to counteract the drag from all the swastikas painted on the fuselage of his Spitfire.

All this is of course going on while the Brits are all taking advantage of the respite he gives them by supping warm beer at a Country House which the aristocracy has given to a grateful nation to turn into a 5 star airfield. Or was that "Pearl Harbour" ? :E


Hollywood just can't help itself :p

[MilOps]

Hey DOP,

Saddo's, nah not me! It's a bloke thing........

How many hours have you got on Spits Simon?

On Spits sir? Ten and a half.

Well make it 11 before Jerry has you for breakfast!

Spring chicken to sh1te hawk in one easy lesson

Takatakatakatakataka.................

[wub]

I noticed quite a few yellow blemishes on the print in the some of the dogfight sequences, I wonder if they are (will be) on the DVD.

At least there won't be ads every 12 minutes.

"Good afternoon my ar$e....."

[CrabInCab]

Sir Percy,

Waaaaaaaaaaahhhhhhhhhhhhhhh!

:ok:

Awesome film, had forgotten how good it was.

[A Civilian]

I always hate the bit were Michael Cain dies "blew up, he just blew up" :(

[tharg]

Robert Shaw's Sailor-Malan-by-any-other-name C/o to Ian McShane's dishevelled just-been-pulled-out-of-drink Sgt pilot:

Where have you been?"

Learning to swim!

-----------------------------

And who could forget Miz Y's shakenb reply:

Put that cigarette out!

Don't you shout at ME, MISter Warwick!

------------------------------

Cracking film. Don't understand why the critics always pan it. Ron Goodwin's music is outstanding – although Sir William Walton's score, rejected for being too short at 21 mins, is really quite astonishingly good.

------------------------------

OK, everybody. Home and tea. Well done, everybody. For once you deserve it

[Green Flash]

But, to continue MOTF's "Ive seen it. Its a smelly old shack full of dead flies" I do rather like the
"Hello Hayseed Control, this is Fruitbat Leader,"(yes, I know it wasn't these callsigns)" the engines' overheating and so am I. Either we take off or we blow up", accompanied by much grinning behind oxy masks.
:ok:

[Jobza Guddun]

Always liked Robert Shaw and the Plod:

"What about the Hofficers sah?"

"Give em a bloody shovel!"

Or the crabby techy Flt Sgt and erk:

"Skipper hates Jerries"

"You'll hate me if you don't get that job finished!"

A (British) remake of the film would be well received methinks.

[treadigraph]

If you want to nit pick, 109s - all right, Buchons in the "Oh Gawd Blimey" formation... I didn't notice until some other induhvidual pointed out the tail struts, just always assumed it was Spits making up the understandably limited Hurricane formation... Ignorant git I am...

Cracking film. Remake it? How? LoadsaSpits and Hurris, the odd 109, no Luftwaffe bombers... CGI? PHUQUE off!

[Capt Homesick]

Pr00ne, you're probably right.... but I've always hoped he was a German Jew, there would be a certain balance to that.....

[Navaleye]

Polish pilot:

"Good after-noon"

Farmer with pitchfork

"Good afternoon my arse!"

[Spot 4]

""Cracking film. Remake it? How? LoadsaSpits and Hurris, the odd 109, no Luftwaffe bombers... CGI? PHUQUE off!""

I think that `Pearl Harbour` proves that in this computer age the real aircraft are not required for realism. Would be fantastic to see a 21st Century remake.

[treadigraph]

Sorry Spot, can't agree... the real thing is MUCH better... Say what you like about BoB, the aerial sequences are superb (apart from those dubbed "spot formations" in the odd shot), and the 15th September sequence and music is nothing short of brilliant IMHO. Thank god Sir Larry Luvvie stood his ground on William Walton...

[BEagle]

The movie showed how much better real ac are in such films compared to the crap of computer animation in 'Pearl Harbo(u)r' ! 'Tora tora tora' had far better flying sequences - and the Japanese actors were equally as honest in their portayal as the German actors were in BoB.


"And never, repeat never, for private Polish chit-chat!"

[MilOps]

Much as I am a fan of CGI, it still has some way to go yet to become convincing. However I for one firmly believe that in a few years time we will be able to enjoy the likes of JU88s, BF109
and 110s, HE111s, Wellingtons, Stirlings, Halifaxes.....................I really must stop exciting myself like this.

For now though I entirely agree with the sentiments expressed, you currently can't beat the real thing. And to justify that statement, pop out and get yourself a copy of that little treasure 'Dark Blue World'. Fab little movie although a bit sloppy in places, but the flying sequencies are a mix of new footage and BoB outakes and are bl00dy fantastic.

'who's he trying to kid?'

[Green Flash]

Totally off-thread, but another celluloid Spit that gets my vote is A Bridge Too Far. The young Dutch Resistance lad, pedalling down the track. Out of the haze behind him howls the Spit. A quick roll of Kodak over the Panzers, a 180 and back down the track. Lad waves. You think the driver didn't see him. Then a sudden wing rock ('you're not alone, Son') and the lad waves his arm off as the Spit legs it home. Gets me every time .....:ok:

[Man-on-the-fence]

If memory serves it was Neil Williams (or Possibly Ray Hanna) in MH434 when owned by Adrian Squire hence AC-S codes.

Another cracking film.

[BEagle]

'A Bridge Too Far' was indeed an excellent movie and also in my collection. Interesting to note the squirearchy's reluctance to listen to facts which didn't fit their plan....

BoB was still the better movie,in my opinion.

"Gestern Nacht haben die Englander Bomben auf Berlin geworfen....."

[vintage ATCO]

The camera ship for the BofB film was a B-25 based at Luton for much of the time. It was dayglo green on one side and dayglo pink on the other, or was it orange!? Got a photo somewhere. I think the camera platform at the back was in the open. Didn't a cameraman get swept out when filming over Spain?

I remember organising the ATC clearances for the filming along the Thames estuary. Also went to Bovingdon to see the Heinkels, or was that another film??? :confused:


VA

[treadigraph]

Both the aerial cameramen who filmed BoB, John Jordan and Skeets Kelly were killed in flying accidents after the film - I think it was Kelly who died in a midair between an SE-5A replica and the helicopter he was in whilst filming Darling Lily IIRC, and John Jordan fell out of the back of the B-25 used for filming Catch 22 in Mexico... might have been the other way around...

Also, I seem to recall that the one who fell to his death had lost part of a leg whilst filming the James Bond film with Little Nellie - You Only Live Twice? - I think that was an accident with a helicopter...

[SirPercyWare-Armitag]

Thrilling stuff- I had the honour of taking my DVD copy of the B of B and showing to some Brownjobs in Basra just after the recent dust-up. I expected some "chocks away" banter but it drew a large audience and plenty of admiration. Nothing so evocative as the Spitfires diving into attack....... Funnily enough, all the ME109s used in the film were reengined with Merlins....how apt ;)

And on the subject of films... A Bridge Too Far is another awesome film....."I'm sorry we havent the proper facilities to take you all prisoner".....battered and bloody officer with umbrella to representative of 2 entire SS Panzer Divisions.

Hats off.....

[tharg]

Mr BEagle, sir

Agree wholeheartedly re B o B and Bridge Too Far. If they were released today they would be acclaimed as fantastic "Drama-Docs"

Mr Treadigraph

Glad I am not alone in appreciating the Walton score. Had the priviledge of seeing mixed bunch of Spits and Buchons doing live aerial ballet to Walton's "Battle" played over PA at Biggin on the 50th anniversary of the Battle of Britain. Amazing. BTW, missed the C5 showing but C4 have broadcast a version with Walton's Triumphal March playing over the closing titles.

Get that bowser out of here. We'll go with what we've got

[Jackonicko]

The 'Walton' score? My understanding is that only a tiny snippet (used in the final aerial battle sequence) remained from Walton's score and that the rest (including the March) was by someone else entirely.

[DH98]

Jacko.

You are correct in your assumption. William Walton was contracted to write the origional score , but ultimately it was rejected. Ron Goodwin was then brought on board (he did '633 Sqn' and 'The Trap') and the score you are familair with is his. However one piece from the Walton score was used in the film and that is the September 15 battle sequence.

If anybody is sad enough to be interested, there is a CD available of the film score titled not surprisingly 'The Battle Of Britain' that contains both scores and also includes a DVD of the origional film trailers. My wife hates it!

'I thought it might buck up the civilians sir.'

[tharg]

Jacko and Mr Mossie
You are both right - almost - Walton was commissioned to write the score and delivered nine movements lasting just 22 minutes or so. Director Guy Hamilton, allegedly, rejected the work as too short and too quirky. Ron Goodwin was commissioned to produce a rreplacement. Legend has it that he delivered the finished work - regarded by many as his best - in less than four weeks.
Larry Olivier (Dowding in the film), for whom Walton had scored Henry V, Richard III and Hamlet, in the 1940s, is said to have taken umbrage at the rejection of Walton's score and insisted on the inclusion of, at least, some of it. Hence, you get the striking "Scramble - Battle in the Air" for the 15 Sept climax. As said, C4 shows a print with Walton's march over closing titles.
The rest of the score is not, however, lost. It is on the CD hated by Mrs Mossie (and the Thargette for that matter) and is well worth a listen: some of the dogfight sequences would appear to be scored as pretty little classical dances. One theory to account for the short, truncated nature of some movements was that Walton wanted his music to lead into the harmonies of the Merlins and DB 605s, using the engines as musical instruments. It would be fascinating to see and hear what the Walton would have been like.
In fact, given a powerful enough pooter with Adobe Premiere software, a DVD of the film, and at least three weeks on me own, I might try it myself.

It's Air Vice Marshall Park, sir
Oh good - that's all we need

[Arclite01]

I do believe that the Walton peice of music is called 'Battle in the air'



'Stick to me like glue'

:p

Arc

[tharg]

Seems I was a bit previous with the DIY dubbing of Walton's score on to the film. Announced in the Independent, late September, that Guy Hamilton is going to do just that sometime soon. Could just be a rumour but - hey we live in hope.

Re "Israeli pilot" - it is generally believed that the film's producer Benjamin Fisz inserted the entry for himself. He flew Hurricanes with 303 sqn - but not until October 40. Close enough for me.

Over the wing, plenty of it
Cue 109s to make fench-cutting low pass

[tony draper]

Slightly off topic, didn't we also have a German pilot fighting on our side in the BOB, seem to recal reading that somewhere?

[Gainesy]

I think you are thinking of Klaus "Heinie" Adam. He was not in the BoB but later a Typhoon pilot with numerous Panzer kills and later yet the set (and most of the gadgets) designer for the Bond movies, Chitty-Chitty Bang-Bang and others. Lovely old guy, lives opposite Harrods which he calls the "corner shop". Has two Oscars. Fascinating bloke, could talk to him for hours. When he joined the RAF he changed his name to Ken Adam.

There was a German Jag exchange mate in the 50th anniversary flypast. Some banter at the time about singing "Wir faren gegen England" as we thundered up the Mall.

PS Adam is Jewish, his family came to the UK in the 1930s. I think his younger brother also joined the RAF and flew Spits.

[teeteringhead]

The "Israeli" BoB Pilot

Not an insert or a sly reference to a mate or a relative, but a real person - but obviously he was not an "Israeli" as such a thing did not exist in 1940.

A total of 2927 aircrew (not only pilots!) are officially recognised as qualifying for the "Battle of Britain" clasp to the 1939-45 Star. The qualification was "a minimum of one operational sortie flown with a qualifying unit of the RAF or FAA between 10th July and 31st of October 1940."

Of that 2927, 574 (nearly 20%) were recorded as having a nationality other than "British". One was "Palestinian" (now often quoted as "Israeli"); he was Pilot Officer G E Goodman, who flew with 1 Sqn in the Battle. He survived the Battle (unlike 544 other aircrew), but was among the 791 BoB veterans who were killed in action later in the war.

No more details from me, perhaps a Harrier mate with access to 1 Sqn's records could add some more.........??

[Apollo101]

"Dover?"

"Ya...Dover?"

[PPRuNe Pop]

This is getting tiresome. What with your other thread. We have better things to do than look for stupid posts like yours. If only we knew what your point is! No more please.:mad:

[A Civilian]

Pop knows what to do with the lame ducks :)

[G085H1TE]

Slightly off-topic(ish) but I have to disagree that A Bridge Too Far was an "awesome" film.

Yes, it all looks very nice but as a piece of story-telling is an absolute bl00dy outrage.

My objection is that it deliberately make the British out to be completly incompetant idiots, but the American to be super-heroes. Hollywood seems to particularly like having a go at Monty for some reason - see Saving Private Ryan for more un-called for sniping.

I've always been a bit disgusted that Richard "luvvie" Attenborough sold-out to Hollywood in making this film, presumably for the sake of money.

Plus, of course, the Yanks won't go and see a film that doesn't have them as the super-hero saviours of all mankind.

No wonder so many Op. Market Garden survivors walked out of the screenings when the film was released.:*

[Divergent Phugoid!]

Saw the film last week...... When Sir Michael Caine, was it Cranfield?? Bought it.....

"He blew up... he just blew up!!"

I understand that his last R/T T/X was

"Your'e only supposed to blow the b(oody doors off!"

:p :p :p